My teachers obvious liberal grading bias.

[JakeStarkey]

Told ya.

Teachers are trolling the thread.
Which sort of says something about the veracity of the OP, lol.

You are trolling the thread.

Do you have something on the OP that makes sense.

And if you think poetry is graded only subjectively you are a fool.

 

[JakeStarkey]

I feel that way about most poetry.

I am also highly suspicious of asswads who claim to have some sort of poem-o-meter that allows them to distinguish crap poetry from the good stuff. Like most fine art, poetry is subjective and not something that can really be *taught*. You can teach about poetry, and meter, and form...but poets answer only to themselves.

And anyone who claims otherwise, or sees fit to jeer at another's poetry, doesn't understand poetry at ALL.

Poetry is a form of belles lettres not fine art, kg.

 

[rightwinger]

Poetry is pretentious bull shit

 

[koshergrl]

"Historically, the five main fine arts were painting, sculpture, architecture, music
and poetry.."

from wiki.

 

[Michelle420]

Poetry is pretentious bull shit

 

[koshergrl]

And..fakey, ps..don't talk to me, loser.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyIuEbQ5O2A]Who is this person who speaks to me as though I needed his advice - YouTube[/ame]

 

[JakeStarkey]

Too bad, kg, you don't have a say about it. Put me on ignore, since you are an ignorant person.

Look up belles-let·tres [French bel-le-truh]

Belles lettres - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

What Is a Belles-Lettre?

belles lettres - definition, etymology and usage, examples and related words

 

[Pogo]

Some moron (hes a leftist) in my class wrote a retarded essay that was supposed to be about your feelings about America, but his was about flowers
His was called "blue rose" and went like this

"O mythical island of Ivory,
Where suns of Gilded Gold lie within,
High above the mists of penury,
O In the solemn skies of heaven, mapped,

Vast miasmic vapors strain to wander within,
Voracious, a tireless veil striking the forge, to fasten a key to begin,
Vile hazel clouds lay below, mining gates, endeavoring to get in,

All entombed below the alabaster City of Silver
Wherein lie a hundred, heated, holy, hearts of Gold
Jade, Ruby, Sapphire, Diamond, Opal, and Opulence tenfold
Along with buried hearts of dark, for Gold is cold, and thus neither is far apart"

This got a 20/20, while the essay that I wrote that was actually on topic


"America the Blessed: A Land of Free Enterprise

America is a land where anyone could be what they want to be
America is a land where we can be want we want to be
America is a land of opportunity
America where we were founded by the pilgrims & puritans
America is a good and holy place
America is where you and I can become good people
America, the best place to live in the world.
America, a land where we keep our nation safe from terrorists
America is the land where we used to protect free enterprise
America, the land where it is under attack by far-left radicals
America, land democrats despise
America, land that real Americans love
America, despite it’s setbacks will prevail like it always"

My poem got a 17/20, showing that the teacher is evil.

Yer lucky you got even a 7 with that trite piece of rah-rah fluff, without even counting the Lush Rimjob propaganda.

Not being able to spell its should cost you ten points alone.
Then there's "like it always"...
Face it, your teacher isn't being "liberal", she's being "generous". Subtle difference.

 

[Esmeralda]

Poetry is pretentious bull shit

Actually, poetry is not "pretentious bullshit," not any more than any other art form. If you don't understand it, then it may seem pretentious, and, certainly, bad poetry can be pretentious or BS (as with any other art form), but the art of poetry itself is no more pretentious than any other art form--music, theatre, film, novels, the visual arts, etc. What I glean from this thread is that most people have little understanding of poetry and how it works. That's poor teaching as far as I am concerned. Poetry is very much like music; in fact, poetry is the original basis of what we now know as music, both in lyrics and rhythm: music and theatre originated from the poems and chants of primitive peoples in every culture all over the world. The origin of today's music is the poetry of earlier people. It isn't pretentious and it isn't BS. If you truly understood poetry, you would understand that.

This 'ode' was written in the 5th century BC, (the Golden Age of Greek culture) by Sophocles, in the play Antigone. It is a choral 'ode,' essentially a chant, but it is poetry and is the kind of thing that is the origin of modern music ~ rhythm, sound, and lyrics. Also, as an example, it is similar to the type of topic the OP put in the orignial post: a poem or ode expressing thoughts on the greatness of man as those poems were to express thoughts on the greatness (or lack of) of America.

This is the most famous choral ode in all of Greek tragedy. It is popularly referred to as the "Ode to Man." In this ode the Chorus sings about all the wonderful accomplishments of man. An 'ode' is one of the forms of modern poetry, which includes lyric poetry, narrative poetry, sonnets, eulogies, ballads, etc.

"Many wonders there be, but naught more wondrous than man;
Over the surging sea, with a whitening south wind wan,
Through the foam of the firth, man makes his perilous way;
And the eldest of deities Earth that knows not toil nor decay
Ever he furrows and scores, as his team, year in year out,
With breed of the yoked horse, the ploughshare turneth about.
The light-witted birds of the air, the beasts of the weald and the wood
He traps with his woven snare, and the brood of the briny flood.
Master of cunning he: the savage bull, and the hart
Who roams the mountain free, are tamed by his infinite art;
And the shaggy rough-maned steed is broken to bear the bit.
Speech and the wind-swift speed of counsel and civic wit,
He hath learnt for himself all these; and the arrowy rain to fly
And the nipping airs that freeze, 'neath the open winter sky.
He hath provision for all: fell plague he hath learnt to endure;
Safe whate'er may befall: yet for death he hath found no cure.
Passing the wildest flight thought are the cunning and skill,
That guide man now to the light, but now to counsels of ill.
If he honors the laws of the land, and reveres the Gods of the State
Proudly his city shall stand; but a cityless outcast I rate
Whoso bold in his pride from the path of right doth depart;
Ne'er may I sit by his side, or share the thoughts of his heart."

Does anyone see the difference in poetic quality between this and those poems the OP put forth as 'poetry'?

Take any of the lyrics of the Beatles, Simon & Garfunkel, and any other modern musicians, including rappers, and what you have is poetry set to music. It's all poetry, though generally far simpler than what we consider 'serious' poetry or literature, but not always. Sometimes the lyrics of modern pop musicians are as many layered and intriguing as any modern poet. You may scoff at what you don't understand, but that only makes clear it is your lack of understanding which is the problem.

 

[rightwinger]

Poetry is pretentious bull shit

Actually, poetry is not "pretentious bullshit," not any more than any other art form. If you don't understand it, then it may seem pretentious, and, certainly, bad poetry can be pretentious or BS (as with any other art form), but the art of poetry itself is no more pretentious than any other art form--music, theatre, film, novels, the visual arts, etc. What I glean from this thread is that most people have little understanding of poetry and how it works. That's poor teaching as far as I am concerned. Poetry is very much like music; in fact, poetry is the original basis of what we now know as music, both in lyrics and rhythm: music and theatre originated from the poems and chants of primitive peoples in every culture all over the world. The origin of today's music is the poetry of earlier people. It isn't pretentious and it isn't BS. If you truly understood poetry, you would understand that.

This 'ode' was written in the 5th century BC, (the Golden Age of Greek culture) by Sophocles, in the play Antigone. It is a choral 'ode,' essentially a chant, but it is poetry and is the kind of thing that is the origin of modern music ~ rhythm, sound, and lyrics. Also, as an example, it is similar to the type of topic the OP put in the orignial post: a poem or ode expressing thoughts on the greatness of man as those poems were to express thoughts on the greatness (or lack of) of America.

This is the most famous choral ode in all of Greek tragedy. It is popularly referred to as the "Ode to Man." In this ode the Chorus sings about all the wonderful accomplishments of man. An 'ode' is one of the forms of modern poetry, which includes lyric poetry, narrative poetry, sonnets, eulogies, ballads, etc.

"Many wonders there be, but naught more wondrous than man;
Over the surging sea, with a whitening south wind wan,
Through the foam of the firth, man makes his perilous way;
And the eldest of deities Earth that knows not toil nor decay
Ever he furrows and scores, as his team, year in year out,
With breed of the yoked horse, the ploughshare turneth about.
The light-witted birds of the air, the beasts of the weald and the wood
He traps with his woven snare, and the brood of the briny flood.
Master of cunning he: the savage bull, and the hart
Who roams the mountain free, are tamed by his infinite art;
And the shaggy rough-maned steed is broken to bear the bit.
Speech and the wind-swift speed of counsel and civic wit,
He hath learnt for himself all these; and the arrowy rain to fly
And the nipping airs that freeze, 'neath the open winter sky.
He hath provision for all: fell plague he hath learnt to endure;
Safe whate'er may befall: yet for death he hath found no cure.
Passing the wildest flight thought are the cunning and skill,
That guide man now to the light, but now to counsels of ill.
If he honors the laws of the land, and reveres the Gods of the State
Proudly his city shall stand; but a cityless outcast I rate
Whoso bold in his pride from the path of right doth depart;
Ne'er may I sit by his side, or share the thoughts of his heart."

Does anyone see the difference in poetic quality between this and those poems the OP put forth as 'poetry'?

Take any of the lyrics of the Beatles, Simon & Garfunkel, and any other modern musicians, including rappers, and what you have is poetry set to music. It's all poetry, though generally far simpler than what we consider 'serious' poetry or literature, but not always. Sometimes the lyrics of modern pop musicians are as many layered and intriguing as any modern poet. You may scoff at what you don't understand, but that only makes clear it is your lack of understanding which is the problem.

Why is poetry pretentious?

Because people assign it meaning that it doesn't merit. Much like trying to interpret what a Beatle song means. Sometimes it's just a song. Much of poetry is a waste of time

Want a great poem?
Ode to a pay toilet or any limerick

There once was a man from Nantucket......

 

[Esmeralda]

Actually, poetry is not "pretentious bullshit," not any more than any other art form. If you don't understand it, then it may seem pretentious, and, certainly, bad poetry can be pretentious or BS (as with any other art form), but the art of poetry itself is no more pretentious than any other art form--music, theatre, film, novels, the visual arts, etc. What I glean from this thread is that most people have little understanding of poetry and how it works. That's poor teaching as far as I am concerned. Poetry is very much like music; in fact, poetry is the original basis of what we now know as music, both in lyrics and rhythm: music and theatre originated from the poems and chants of primitive peoples in every culture all over the world. The origin of today's music is the poetry of earlier people. It isn't pretentious and it isn't BS. If you truly understood poetry, you would understand that.

This 'ode' was written in the 5th century BC, (the Golden Age of Greek culture) by Sophocles, in the play Antigone. It is a choral 'ode,' essentially a chant, but it is poetry and is the kind of thing that is the origin of modern music ~ rhythm, sound, and lyrics. Also, as an example, it is similar to the type of topic the OP put in the orignial post: a poem or ode expressing thoughts on the greatness of man as those poems were to express thoughts on the greatness (or lack of) of America.

This is the most famous choral ode in all of Greek tragedy. It is popularly referred to as the "Ode to Man." In this ode the Chorus sings about all the wonderful accomplishments of man. An 'ode' is one of the forms of modern poetry, which includes lyric poetry, narrative poetry, sonnets, eulogies, ballads, etc.

"Many wonders there be, but naught more wondrous than man;
Over the surging sea, with a whitening south wind wan,
Through the foam of the firth, man makes his perilous way;
And the eldest of deities Earth that knows not toil nor decay
Ever he furrows and scores, as his team, year in year out,
With breed of the yoked horse, the ploughshare turneth about.
The light-witted birds of the air, the beasts of the weald and the wood
He traps with his woven snare, and the brood of the briny flood.
Master of cunning he: the savage bull, and the hart
Who roams the mountain free, are tamed by his infinite art;
And the shaggy rough-maned steed is broken to bear the bit.
Speech and the wind-swift speed of counsel and civic wit,
He hath learnt for himself all these; and the arrowy rain to fly
And the nipping airs that freeze, 'neath the open winter sky.
He hath provision for all: fell plague he hath learnt to endure;
Safe whate'er may befall: yet for death he hath found no cure.
Passing the wildest flight thought are the cunning and skill,
That guide man now to the light, but now to counsels of ill.
If he honors the laws of the land, and reveres the Gods of the State
Proudly his city shall stand; but a cityless outcast I rate
Whoso bold in his pride from the path of right doth depart;
Ne'er may I sit by his side, or share the thoughts of his heart."

Does anyone see the difference in poetic quality between this and those poems the OP put forth as 'poetry'?

Take any of the lyrics of the Beatles, Simon & Garfunkel, and any other modern musicians, including rappers, and what you have is poetry set to music. It's all poetry, though generally far simpler than what we consider 'serious' poetry or literature, but not always. Sometimes the lyrics of modern pop musicians are as many layered and intriguing as any modern poet. You may scoff at what you don't understand, but that only makes clear it is your lack of understanding which is the problem.

Why is poetry pretentious?

Because people assign it meaning that it doesn't merit. Much like trying to interpret what a Beatle song means. Sometimes it's just a song. Much of poetry is a waste of time

Want a great poem?
Ode to a pay toilet or any limerick

There once was a man from Nantucket......

If someone is assigning meaning to a poem that isn't there, it is not the poet's fault, it is the reader's fault. The pretentiousness is in the reader, not in the poetry or in the poet. Understand? You don't like poetry, I get that, but not liking something is often the reason people put it down, It's like racism, no different. You don't like or understand it, so you put it down with sweeping generalizations that don't apply.

 

[rightwinger]

Next, can we discus the merits of Haiku?

 

[DGS49]

It is not unusual at all for many different observers to derive different meanings from a work of art, whether it be a song, a painting, a television program, or a poem. And the artist usually has no problem with it.

Consider the Eagles' song, Hotel California. It can relate to a whole spectrum of facts and circumstances, depending on the viewpoint of the listener. If my understanding of it is different from that of the author or the lyrics, so what?