Killing The American Dream

[RodISHI]

Where did it start in your opinion?


I started seeing it in the late 70's when small businesses sole owner enterprises like full service gas stations were being wiped out and corporate quick stops started being the norm.

 

[007]

As soon as the dems took control and obama took office... really... I'm serious.

 

[WillowTree]

As soon as the dems took control and obama took office... really... I'm serious.

go back furthur,, Clinton signed onto NAFTA and Bush looked the other way while the illegals took over all the jobs and bankrupted California.

 

[Modbert]

RodISHI, nice thread attempt before the hacks came around trying to kill it.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acLW1vFO-2Q]YouTube - George Carlin ~ The American Dream[/ame]

The question is, did the American Dream ever be a reality in the first place? Sure, there was the boom after WWII with the whole white picket fence, etc. Except it wasn't even ten years after that we had the Korea War, then the Cold War, Vietnam War (a proxy war of the Cold War along with Korea). Then you have the economy finally going down the drain. Beyond that, well the rest is history.

If there ever was a American Dream in the first place (I would say there was for a very short period of time.) It died with the second half of the 20th century and we continued to decline until we ended up where we are today in the 21th century.

The last thing said in the video is truth at this point in history.

 

[Ringel05]

Where did it start in your opinion?


I started seeing it in the late 70's when small businesses sole owner enterprises like full service gas stations were being wiped out and corporate quick stops started being the norm.

None of you are going back far enough. Even though in some global geographic regions there has always been fluctuations between small business and monopolistic growth it started with the advent of the Industrial Age and has been slowly gaining momentum since with limited continuing ups and downs in small business development.

 

[Annie]

17th C: The younger sons could attempt to make their own fortunes by coming to the New World. Many did, from Spain, France, Netherlands, Portugal, and towards the end, England.

18th C: Many were amassing fortunes here, some within the mother country, some very savvy ones outside the laws, especially Navigation Acts. By this time it was becoming clear, early in the century, that for Englishmen and yes, even women, there was a world available denied in the mother country. Some in England are already beginning to question the mercantile system, though they will not be taken seriously for a few hundred years.

19th C: After the 'Shot heard around the world' and 'The World Turned Upside Down', there was no disputing the possibilities of The United States. Tocqueville would put it in writing, to the amazement of many nearly 200 years later. By the end of the century, the writing of its place in the 'industrial world' would not be denied.

20th C: Opened coming off the most severe recession the new country had ever known. Aviation and automotives were in their infancy. New inventions were being released nearly daily. Not only the world, but Americans themselves were amazed at the publications, new associations, labor unions, sports outlets, and artists that repeatedly caught the attention of the masses. For the elite the symphonies, artists, writers were churning out new venues that even Europe was having difficulties putting down. Architecture here was rising and diversifying in ways never imagined.

Early on, guns started blazing in Europe. The relatively fledgling country was dragged in, for, "The war to end all wars," said the hero of today's left, Woodrow Wilson. He was the epitome of the left's elite, he had a Democratic majority in Congress. Well the war was 'won', with the European powers laughing at Wilson with his League of Nations. He forgot, I guess to realize that even with party majority, he needed to consult with Congress, who laughed at him for the League too.

The war was past and the 'good times rolled', until October of '29. Bad years the thirties, 'good President.' The twenties though brought more Americans that excelled in business, academics, and the arts. Granted many of the arts, including literary were Americans in self-imposed exile. The 30's saw the elite US turn towards political philosophies that were difficult for most to understand, not the least of which would be communism.

Hitler managed to gain the President's attention, though it would take the rest of the country at least 3 years to realize the threat. Most also missed the problems between the US and Japan that had been brewing since Admiral Perry, but heating up since the Meiji Revolution. When the US put up an embargo on aluminum and oil, the die was cast to once again bring the US into a world war.

Another war ended, the Marshall Plan and United Nations somewhat redeeming Wilson's vision, if emphasizing his lack of political acumen.

Once again the US falls into a war for 'good reasons.' However, when it looked like it would be US v. China, stalemate and DMZ was called. We're still there.

Then Sputnik.

Then US responded. Then Vietnam. War 'lost' while not one battle lost. Go figure.

Then moon.

Then Nixon.

Carter.

Iran hostage situation.

Then Japanese overtake both steel and automotive, overturning the late 19th C 'king'.

And here we are.

No American dream? Hardly. Fortunes won and lost and won again.

Today?

 

[JakeStarkey]

The industrial age and technological advancement has led to centralization of power and capital.

The rich will always attempt to shift the working man's product and excess savings into their own ledgers.

Always.

 

[Annie]

The industrial age and technological advancement has led to centralization of power and capital.

The rich will always attempt to shift the working man's product and excess savings into their own ledgers.

Always.

You must have an inside track as it seems the plan is to kill industry and technology. Oh yeah, capitalism too. I'm guessing you're thinking that will help the working man. I mean you are so intelligent and insightful.

 

[Smartt33]

Where did it start in your opinion?


I started seeing it in the late 70's when small businesses sole owner enterprises like full service gas stations were being wiped out and corporate quick stops started being the norm.

Pride and greed are the poison that is "killing" the American dream, and America. I hope the keyword is "killing." That would mean that we are not dead yet!!!!!

I believe there is still life, and somewhere along the way the criminals in office will cause a spark that will ignite a fire under that small amount of life that still exists. That flame will likely be a painful one, but it will put away once and for all the garbage we call our governmemnt, and replace them with what was in the initial plan, "We The People!!!"

I may be talking about civil war, widespread violence (organized or not), or maybe just people who are willing to take a stand and boldly face the enemy (our government) and draw a crowd. This crowd may push their way through the political barriers, and into the place where they will finally regain control for the people.

God bless America

 

[noose4]

Started with Reagan and de regulation, the playing field got shifted even more so for the advantaged few, corporate take overs making near monopolies in some areas of business, its partially our own fault, how many of us would regularly choose to eat at a franchise restaurant rather than seek out a small mom and pop type eatery? or shop at walmart rather than a smaller store?

 

[Annie]

Building off my previous post, I think it started with US recognizing itself as a major power, which happened during WWI. Once that happened, the government and yes, the 'people' believed they needed to help the 'devastated.' Thus the Dawes plan and later the Marshall Plan.

We so thought we were the 'be all and end all' that no one else was responsible for their actions or wrong doings. Indeed, we were so omnipresent that any other country couldn't possibly have any effect. That was the beginning.

I thought Vietnam gave us an idea of the power of the people, I mean how many, if any countries have lost a war without losing a battle? That was due to the people, led by the media. There was no doubt we lost, to the consternation and glee of the 'enemy.'

 

[rightwinger]

Even the newspaper boy is gone

 

[JakeStarkey]

The industrial age and technological advancement has led to centralization of power and capital.

The rich will always attempt to shift the working man's product and excess savings into their own ledgers.

Always.

You must have an inside track as it seems the plan is to kill industry and technology. Oh yeah, capitalism too. I'm guessing you're thinking that will help the working man. I mean you are so intelligent and insightful.

Any bright person can see it, Annie. However, notice I did not say that the rich would be defeated in what they are so good at doing. Ever since Alexander Hamilton loaded the government dice with assumption and funding through the co-option (willingly) of the monied classes before 1800, the rich have done pretty well. I suspect they will continue to do so.

 

[k2skier]

As soon as the dems took control and obama took office... really... I'm serious.

go back furthur,, Clinton signed onto NAFTA and Bush looked the other way while the illegals took over all the jobs and bankrupted California.

still not far enough back, even before raygun...

George Carlin was brilliant...RIP george

 

[Annie]

17th C: The younger sons could attempt to make their own fortunes by coming to the New World. Many did, from Spain, France, Netherlands, Portugal, and towards the end, England.

18th C: Many were amassing fortunes here, some within the mother country, some very savvy ones outside the laws, especially Navigation Acts. By this time it was becoming clear, early in the century, that for Englishmen and yes, even women, there was a world available denied in the mother country. Some in England are already beginning to question the mercantile system, though they will not be taken seriously for a few hundred years.

19th C: After the 'Shot heard around the world' and 'The World Turned Upside Down', there was no disputing the possibilities of The United States. Tocqueville would put it in writing, to the amazement of many nearly 200 years later. By the end of the century, the writing of its place in the 'industrial world' would not be denied.

20th C: Opened coming off the most severe recession the new country had ever known. Aviation and automotives were in their infancy. New inventions were being released nearly daily. Not only the world, but Americans themselves were amazed at the publications, new associations, labor unions, sports outlets, and artists that repeatedly caught the attention of the masses. For the elite the symphonies, artists, writers were churning out new venues that even Europe was having difficulties putting down. Architecture here was rising and diversifying in ways never imagined.

Early on, guns started blazing in Europe. The relatively fledgling country was dragged in, for, "The war to end all wars," said the hero of today's left, Woodrow Wilson. He was the epitome of the left's elite, he had a Democratic majority in Congress. Well the war was 'won', with the European powers laughing at Wilson with his League of Nations. He forgot, I guess to realize that even with party majority, he needed to consult with Congress, who laughed at him for the League too.

The war was past and the 'good times rolled', until October of '29. Bad years the thirties, 'good President.' The twenties though brought more Americans that excelled in business, academics, and the arts. Granted many of the arts, including literary were Americans in self-imposed exile. The 30's saw the elite US turn towards political philosophies that were difficult for most to understand, not the least of which would be communism.

Hitler managed to gain the President's attention, though it would take the rest of the country at least 3 years to realize the threat. Most also missed the problems between the US and Japan that had been brewing since Admiral Perry, but heating up since the Meiji Revolution. When the US put up an embargo on aluminum and oil, the die was cast to once again bring the US into a world war.

Another war ended, the Marshall Plan and United Nations somewhat redeeming Wilson's vision, if emphasizing his lack of political acumen.

Once again the US falls into a war for 'good reasons.' However, when it looked like it would be US v. China, stalemate and DMZ was called. We're still there.

Then Sputnik.

Then US responded. Then Vietnam. War 'lost' while not one battle lost. Go figure.

Then moon.

Then Nixon.

Carter.

Iran hostage situation.

Then Japanese overtake both steel and automotive, overturning the late 19th C 'king'.

And here we are.

No American dream? Hardly. Fortunes won and lost and won again.

Today?

Dogbert chirpping. Yeah, school, right. You get here for your two cents when you wish too. No American Dream? Pffttt.

 

[Ringel05]

17th C: The younger sons could attempt to make their own fortunes by coming to the New World. Many did, from Spain, France, Netherlands, Portugal, and towards the end, England.

18th C: Many were amassing fortunes here, some within the mother country, some very savvy ones outside the laws, especially Navigation Acts. By this time it was becoming clear, early in the century, that for Englishmen and yes, even women, there was a world available denied in the mother country. Some in England are already beginning to question the mercantile system, though they will not be taken seriously for a few hundred years.

19th C: After the 'Shot heard around the world' and 'The World Turned Upside Down', there was no disputing the possibilities of The United States. Tocqueville would put it in writing, to the amazement of many nearly 200 years later. By the end of the century, the writing of its place in the 'industrial world' would not be denied.

20th C: Opened coming off the most severe recession the new country had ever known. Aviation and automotives were in their infancy. New inventions were being released nearly daily. Not only the world, but Americans themselves were amazed at the publications, new associations, labor unions, sports outlets, and artists that repeatedly caught the attention of the masses. For the elite the symphonies, artists, writers were churning out new venues that even Europe was having difficulties putting down. Architecture here was rising and diversifying in ways never imagined.

Early on, guns started blazing in Europe. The relatively fledgling country was dragged in, for, "The war to end all wars," said the hero of today's left, Woodrow Wilson. He was the epitome of the left's elite, he had a Democratic majority in Congress. Well the war was 'won', with the European powers laughing at Wilson with his League of Nations. He forgot, I guess to realize that even with party majority, he needed to consult with Congress, who laughed at him for the League too.

The war was past and the 'good times rolled', until October of '29. Bad years the thirties, 'good President.' The twenties though brought more Americans that excelled in business, academics, and the arts. Granted many of the arts, including literary were Americans in self-imposed exile. The 30's saw the elite US turn towards political philosophies that were difficult for most to understand, not the least of which would be communism.

Hitler managed to gain the President's attention, though it would take the rest of the country at least 3 years to realize the threat. Most also missed the problems between the US and Japan that had been brewing since Admiral Perry, but heating up since the Meiji Revolution. When the US put up an embargo on aluminum and oil, the die was cast to once again bring the US into a world war.

Another war ended, the Marshall Plan and United Nations somewhat redeeming Wilson's vision, if emphasizing his lack of political acumen.

Once again the US falls into a war for 'good reasons.' However, when it looked like it would be US v. China, stalemate and DMZ was called. We're still there.

Then Sputnik.

Then US responded. Then Vietnam. War 'lost' while not one battle lost. Go figure.

Then moon.

Then Nixon.

Carter.

Iran hostage situation.

Then Japanese overtake both steel and automotive, overturning the late 19th C 'king'.

And here we are.

No American dream? Hardly. Fortunes won and lost and won again.

Today?

Dogbert chirpping. Yeah, school, right. You get here for your two cents when you wish too. No American Dream? Pffttt.

Yup, it's still there for those who are willing to go after it. The problem is most are not willing but think they should be entitled to it anyway.

 

[Zander]

Killing the American dream never even started in my opinion. If you want to be successful in America you still can be. Winners do, losers whine..... Success is an inside job.

 

[California Girl]

RodISHI, nice thread attempt before the hacks came around trying to kill it.

YouTube - George Carlin ~ The American Dream

The question is, did the American Dream ever be a reality in the first place? Sure, there was the boom after WWII with the whole white picket fence, etc. Except it wasn't even ten years after that we had the Korea War, then the Cold War, Vietnam War (a proxy war of the Cold War along with Korea). Then you have the economy finally going down the drain. Beyond that, well the rest is history.

If there ever was a American Dream in the first place (I would say there was for a very short period of time.) It died with the second half of the 20th century and we continued to decline until we ended up where we are today in the 21th century.

The last thing said in the video is truth at this point in history.

Love the way you decide to hi-jack this with a totally different question.

 

[007]

As soon as the dems took control and obama took office... really... I'm serious.

go back furthur,, Clinton signed onto NAFTA and Bush looked the other way while the illegals took over all the jobs and bankrupted California.

Those are things we could easily roll back and fix. I'm afraid the TRILLIONS of dollars and HUNDREDS of new government agencies that obama and his communist loving minions have spent and enacted will be permanent. The dems are doing their best to "fundamentally transform America," into a socialist society, and to regulate and dominate us into total control and submission. I don't think that was clinton or bush's agenda. I do think it's obama's and the modern liberals agenda, and if the dems keep it up, there's a fight coming, an armed insurrection. Mark my words. That will be the only way we'll ever get the "American dream" back.

 

[RodISHI]

17th C: The younger sons could attempt to make their own fortunes by coming to the New World. Many did, from Spain, France, Netherlands, Portugal, and towards the end, England.

18th C: Many were amassing fortunes here, some within the mother country, some very savvy ones outside the laws, especially Navigation Acts. By this time it was becoming clear, early in the century, that for Englishmen and yes, even women, there was a world available denied in the mother country. Some in England are already beginning to question the mercantile system, though they will not be taken seriously for a few hundred years.

19th C: After the 'Shot heard around the world' and 'The World Turned Upside Down', there was no disputing the possibilities of The United States. Tocqueville would put it in writing, to the amazement of many nearly 200 years later. By the end of the century, the writing of its place in the 'industrial world' would not be denied.

20th C: Opened coming off the most severe recession the new country had ever known. Aviation and automotives were in their infancy. New inventions were being released nearly daily. Not only the world, but Americans themselves were amazed at the publications, new associations, labor unions, sports outlets, and artists that repeatedly caught the attention of the masses. For the elite the symphonies, artists, writers were churning out new venues that even Europe was having difficulties putting down. Architecture here was rising and diversifying in ways never imagined.

Early on, guns started blazing in Europe. The relatively fledgling country was dragged in, for, "The war to end all wars," said the hero of today's left, Woodrow Wilson. He was the epitome of the left's elite, he had a Democratic majority in Congress. Well the war was 'won', with the European powers laughing at Wilson with his League of Nations. He forgot, I guess to realize that even with party majority, he needed to consult with Congress, who laughed at him for the League too.

The war was past and the 'good times rolled', until October of '29. Bad years the thirties, 'good President.' The twenties though brought more Americans that excelled in business, academics, and the arts. Granted many of the arts, including literary were Americans in self-imposed exile. The 30's saw the elite US turn towards political philosophies that were difficult for most to understand, not the least of which would be communism.

Hitler managed to gain the President's attention, though it would take the rest of the country at least 3 years to realize the threat. Most also missed the problems between the US and Japan that had been brewing since Admiral Perry, but heating up since the Meiji Revolution. When the US put up an embargo on aluminum and oil, the die was cast to once again bring the US into a world war.

Another war ended, the Marshall Plan and United Nations somewhat redeeming Wilson's vision, if emphasizing his lack of political acumen.

Once again the US falls into a war for 'good reasons.' However, when it looked like it would be US v. China, stalemate and DMZ was called. We're still there.

Then Sputnik.

Then US responded. Then Vietnam. War 'lost' while not one battle lost. Go figure.

Then moon.

Then Nixon.

Carter.

Iran hostage situation.

Then Japanese overtake both steel and automotive, overturning the late 19th C 'king'.

And here we are.

No American dream? Hardly. Fortunes won and lost and won again.

Today?

Dogbert chirpping. Yeah, school, right. You get here for your two cents when you wish too. No American Dream? Pffttt.

Yup, it's still there for those who are willing to go after it. The problem is most are not willing but think they should be entitled to it anyway.

In your opinion what does "go after it" entail? Just curious.