Jack N Rakove; If you want to understand the constitution, read his book

[Robert W]

Jack is a professor of history at Stanford, U. His book named Original Meanings clears up a lot of confusion.
Might I kick this off by recalling what the constitution is for? Examine the part prior to the Bill of Rights and it is some detailed instructions to Government. So, given it laid it out correctly and perfectly, what can go wrong?
As to the Bill of Rights, how can we lose rights contained in the 10 rights? Reply, we can't lose them. The Feds do not have the approval or authority to remove our bill of Rights.
So I plan to go through the book I am citing and trying to lay out the case in simple terms.

 

[$ecular#eckler]

Like the Bible, if you need another book to understand the first book, then some things are probably not what they seem.

 

[Moonglow]

I need to read a book about something I already know, I think not...

 

[Robert W]

Like the Bible, if you need another book to understand the first book, then some things are probably not what they seem.

So you have up to today read only the Bible?

 

[Robert W]

I need to read a book about something I already know, I think not...

Would you say the constitution is wrong on the 2nd amendment?

 

[$ecular#eckler]

Examine the part prior to the Bill of Rights and it is some detailed instructions to Government.

The primary problem is that the three-branch government only prevents any one person from ascending to a dictatorship, it does not prevent oligarchy; which is a conspired leader of a crony corporate board and management team instead of a box of rocks military to enforce the civil laws. It is better than a dictatorship, but still not what we want, otherwise our civics lessons would describe the approach to oligarchy, and the pundits would not be comparing the presidents to infamous dictators.

So, given it laid it out correctly and perfectly, what can go wrong?

“The American Experiment” is not just a rhetorical euphemism for the difficulty in self-governing a free society. We live in a generational experiment for evaluating the control systems for such a government. In general, the margin of error has been tolerable, and the subsequent production of the nation has been tremendously beneficial for the modern world. However, the increasingly cantankerous political discourse and persistent social disorderliness that we are enduring should be the noticeable reciprocating symptoms of the over-run of systemic errors in the basic design of the government. The generational experiment is practical, but it is inefficient for long-term economic stability, the better progression of the states, communities, private organizations, families, and individuals that comprise the union and society.

 

[surada]

Would you say the constitution is wrong on the 2nd amendment?

Trump has never read the US Constitution. He said it was too hard like a foreign language.

Yet he took an oath to defend and uphold the constitution.

 

[Robert W]

Trump has never read the US Constitution. He said it was too hard like a foreign language.

Yet he took an oath to defend and uphold the constitution.

Check for the correct thread. This has nothing to do with Trump.

 

[Robert W]

The primary problem is that the three-branch government only prevents any one person from ascending to a dictatorship, it does not prevent oligarchy; which is a conspired leader of a crony corporate board and management team instead of a box of rocks military to enforce the civil laws. It is better than a dictatorship, but still not what we want, otherwise our civics lessons would describe the approach to oligarchy, and the pundits would not be comparing the presidents to infamous dictators.




“The American Experiment” is not just a rhetorical euphemism for the difficulty in self-governing a free society. We live in a generational experiment for evaluating the control systems for such a government. In general, the margin of error has been tolerable, and the subsequent production of the nation has been tremendously beneficial for the modern world. However, the increasingly cantankerous political discourse and persistent social disorderliness that we are enduring should be the noticeable reciprocating symptoms of the over-run of systemic errors in the basic design of the government. The generational experiment is practical, but it is inefficient for long-term economic stability, the better progression of the states, communities, private organizations, families, and individuals that comprise the union and society.

Two major issues, nothing at all to do with the actual topic.
First the actual topic. It is not about corporations, or dictators nor even self government.

The idea of the first important part of the constitution is completely setting up a functioning government. Adding in the part that is the amendments was part due to protecting the public from Government.
Notice that Government as seen by Democrats is supposed to remove your arms and determine for you how to use them. Seen by Republicans it means what it says, rights to be armed are not to be infringed.

 

[Robert W]

The primary problem is that the three-branch government only prevents any one person from ascending to a dictatorship, it does not prevent oligarchy; which is a conspired leader of a crony corporate board and management team instead of a box of rocks military to enforce the civil laws. It is better than a dictatorship, but still not what we want, otherwise our civics lessons would describe the approach to oligarchy, and the pundits would not be comparing the presidents to infamous dictators.




“The American Experiment” is not just a rhetorical euphemism for the difficulty in self-governing a free society. We live in a generational experiment for evaluating the control systems for such a government. In general, the margin of error has been tolerable, and the subsequent production of the nation has been tremendously beneficial for the modern world. However, the increasingly cantankerous political discourse and persistent social disorderliness that we are enduring should be the noticeable reciprocating symptoms of the over-run of systemic errors in the basic design of the government. The generational experiment is practical, but it is inefficient for long-term economic stability, the better progression of the states, communities, private organizations, families, and individuals that comprise the union and society.

This should be said in some topic dealing with philosophy.

The USA does not self govern.

When states laws are created by citizens and voted into effect by citizens, in that case can it be said the state is self governed. But the Feds do not operate that way.

 

[Robert W]

oligarchy: This is the major problem for the USA. It is run by an oligarchy and the citizens are shut out.

 

[$ecular#eckler]

Two major issues, nothing at all to do with the actual topic.
First the actual topic. It is not about corporations, or dictators nor even self government.

The idea of the first important part of the constitution is completely setting up a functioning government.

The Constitution does not completely set up a functioning government. It just seems that way to you and everyone else, because it is up and running. But like a jalopy automobile it only "works" for the owner familiar with the custom parts and performance. You don't see any other country organizing their government like the United States. You don't see the State Department setting up the governments for the countries that all the illegals are abandoning. It cannot be replicated - it is not a "scientific" reliable formulation for government.

The checks and balances do not work which our modern sophisticated expectations for reliable technologies lead us to expect.

Adding in the part that is the amendments was part due to protecting the public from Government.
Notice that Government as seen by Democrats is supposed to remove your arms and determine for you how to use them. Seen by Republicans it means what it says, rights to be armed are not to be infringed.

The proclamation that the people would be able to defend themselves from the encroachment of the federal government is losing ground fast. They are able to do it other ways, because the checks and balances do not do what it is you need the checks and balances to do. You are not going to be able to put together a militia that is going to intimidate your municipal government, state government, or the federal government.

The only solution is a complete reordering of the government charters to implement a better separation with the subsequent better checks and balances.

 

[Robert W]

The Constitution does not completely set up a functioning government. It just seems that way to you and everyone else, because it is up and running. But like a jalopy automobile it only "works" for the owner familiar with the custom parts and performance. You don't see any other country organizing their government like the United States. You don't see the State Department setting up the governments for the countries that all the illegals are abandoning. It cannot be replicated - it is not a "scientific" reliable formulation for government.

The checks and balances do not work which our modern sophisticated expectations for reliable technologies lead us to expect.

View attachment 828889



The proclamation that the people would be able to defend themselves from the encroachment of the federal government is losing ground fast. They are able to do it other ways, because the checks and balances do not do what it is you need the checks and balances to do. You are not going to be able to put together a militia that is going to intimidate your municipal government, state government, or the federal government.

The only solution is a complete reordering of the government charters to implement a better separation with the subsequent better checks and balances.

View attachment 828893

Two times the Citizens of America fought Government ruling over them. The War with England and then later the war with the Lincoln brand of Government.

I was thinking as I woke up today that it might be impossible for the citizens to set up a new government given the massive support for jailing citizens when they so much as simply get that idea. The man with a 22 year sentence and the other with the 20 year sentence come to mind.

Rhodes and Tarrio come to mind. America is currently jailing those who operate in ways mimicked by George Washington.

Tarrio in fact was many miles from DC that day yet he got sentenced as were he in DC.

 

[$ecular#eckler]

Robert W, well, you might not be capable, but I, obviously, am able.

Amazon product ASIN B0CH3QHSH5

 

[Dante]

Jack is a professor of history at Stanford, U. His book named Original Meanings clears up a lot of confusion.

edited after you posted a few follow ups.

 

[Dante]

Two major issues, nothing at all to do with the actual topic.
First the actual topic. It is not about corporations, or dictators nor even self government.

The idea of the first important part of the constitution is completely setting up a functioning government. Adding in the part that is the amendments was part due to protecting the public from Government.
Notice that Government as seen by Democrats is supposed to remove your arms and determine for you how to use them. Seen by Republicans it means what it says, rights to be armed are not to be infringed.

You definately will not grasp Rakove's scholarship, or like what he has to say.

 

[Robert W]

You definately will not grasp Rakove's scholarship, or like what he has to say.

Who made you the expert? How can you possibly know what I like?