Israeli Settlers: Are They ‘Civilians’ or Legitimate Military Targets?

[louie888]

Are you proposing that international law accept the killing of non-combatants (including children!) as LEGAL because they are living on the wrong side of a non-border?

NO! Can you read? [/quote

I can. Hence the response I made.

What ARE you proposing, then? What is the point of the OP?

If we all agree that killing civilians is wrong (and for the love of G-d, we SHOULD all agree that killing civilians is wrong!), then what is the point of the post?

The point of the post could only be to formulate some sort of justification for when it is legally and morally permissible to kill civilians. So if no one is going to argue for such a justification, we can just let this stupid thread die the quick, merciful death it deserves.

Anyone who wants to justify the murder of civilians should feel free to do so.

You keep running instead of answering simple questions.

How would you handle it? How would the IDF terrorists handle it if the shoe were on the other foot? You would just let foreigners bulldoze your home? You would just do nothing? You would not defend yourself with whatever means you had available? You would prefer your children to be homeless or dead?

WHY?

 

[rylah]

When a Jew has a Gentile in his clutches, another Jew may go to the same Gentile, lend him money and in turn deceive him, so that the Gentile shall be ruined. For the property of a Gentile, according to our law, belongs to no one, and the first Jew that passes has full right to seize it.

Is this supposed to be a justification for why it is morally acceptable to murder Jews?

Why can you not respond to simple questions?

How would you handle it? How would the IDF terrorists handle it if the shoe were on the other foot? You would just let foreigners bulldoze your home? You would just do nothing? You would not defend yourself with whatever means you had available? You would prefer your children to be homeless or dead?

May I answer that? Thank You.

I would not let any 'freedom fighter' get anywhere near my family or home, especially since the outcome is clear. I, I a am responsible for them. If their power is greater and the house got infected I'd look for anyone or anything to get us out of the situation. This is called defending.
I would prefer my children to be homeless rather than DEAD - simple.

I would surely teach my kids to defend themselves, but never to attack soldiers or stab civilians.
Surely not to sacrifice themselves in the name of pride and ideologies - this is moloch worship.

 

[rylah]

What would You do when a Hamas fighter comes do dig a tunnel in Your basement?

 

[Indeependent]

Baruch Hashem, the IDF is doing just fine and Israel is doing just fine also.

They torture children and kill themselves far more often than Hamas and Fatah put together.

If that is "doing just fine," then I wouldn't want to see them doing poorly lol.

I have relatives and friend in Israel; I know of what I speak.
In terms of commerce also, Israel is doing quite well.

 

[Indeependent]

...this is a sacrifice to moloch.

HAHAHA... idiot.

Rylah is correct.

 

[Shusha]

When a Jew has a Gentile in his clutches, another Jew may go to the same Gentile, lend him money and in turn deceive him, so that the Gentile shall be ruined. For the property of a Gentile, according to our law, belongs to no one, and the first Jew that passes has full right to seize it.

Is this supposed to be a justification for why it is morally acceptable to murder Jews?

Why can you not respond to simple questions?

How would you handle it? How would the IDF terrorists handle it if the shoe were on the other foot? You would just let foreigners bulldoze your home? You would just do nothing? You would not defend yourself with whatever means you had available? You would prefer your children to be homeless or dead?

How would I handle what? The conflict? The conflict could be solved in fifteen minutes by two reasonable people wanting to actually solve the problem.

Moshe: How about you take the territories where there is mostly Arab people and I'll take the territories where there is mostly Jewish people? And we treat the ones who end up on the other side with dignity, respect and full equality?

Mohammed: Sounds good. Why don't we share the holy places? And we can help you re-build your Temple.

Moshe: I think G-d would like that. Shall we also make arrangements to share water, and natural resources?

Mohammed: Of course. And should we make some cool trade agreements that would be mutually beneficial? Maybe have some universities help each other out? Or some joint research projects?

Moshe: That sounds awesome! Is there anything else then?

Mohammed: Nope. I think it sounds good. Shall we go out for coffee or tea to celebrate?



Or do you mean how would I handle the loss of my home, my livelihood, my property, all my worldly goods? Well, I'd probably handle it the same way the million Jewish people forced from their homes in the ME actually handled it. The way the Jewish people have always handled it. We build. This time we were lucky enough to build in our actual homeland.

 

[louie888]

When a Jew has a Gentile in his clutches, another Jew may go to the same Gentile, lend him money and in turn deceive him, so that the Gentile shall be ruined. For the property of a Gentile, according to our law, belongs to no one, and the first Jew that passes has full right to seize it.

Is this supposed to be a justification for why it is morally acceptable to murder Jews?

Why can you not respond to simple questions?

How would you handle it? How would the IDF terrorists handle it if the shoe were on the other foot? You would just let foreigners bulldoze your home? You would just do nothing? You would not defend yourself with whatever means you had available? You would prefer your children to be homeless or dead?

How would I handle what? The conflict? The conflict could be solved in fifteen minutes by two reasonable people wanting to actually solve the problem.

Moshe: How about you take the territories where there is mostly Arab people and I'll take the territories where there is mostly Jewish people? And we treat the ones who end up on the other side with dignity, respect and full equality?

Mohammed: Sounds good. Why don't we share the holy places? And we can help you re-build your Temple.

Moshe: I think G-d would like that. Shall we also make arrangements to share water, and natural resources?

Mohammed: Of course. And should we make some cool trade agreements that would be mutually beneficial? Maybe have some universities help each other out? Or some joint research projects?

Moshe: That sounds awesome! Is there anything else then?

Mohammed: Nope. I think it sounds good. Shall we go out for coffee or tea to celebrate?



Or do you mean how would I handle the loss of my home, my livelihood, my property, all my worldly goods? Well, I'd probably handle it the same way the million Jewish people forced from their homes in the ME actually handled it. The way the Jewish people have always handled it. We build. This time we were lucky enough to build in our actual homeland.

Don't pretend to not understand simple questions; it's dishonest.

And you wouldn't have the power to bulldoze homes and steal land in your pretend homeland if you understood the question. The "Jewish" way indeed.

 

[fanger]

When a Jew has a Gentile in his clutches, another Jew may go to the same Gentile, lend him money and in turn deceive him, so that the Gentile shall be ruined. For the property of a Gentile, according to our law, belongs to no one, and the first Jew that passes has full right to seize it.

Is this supposed to be a justification for why it is morally acceptable to murder Jews?

Do you see it as a justification?

 

[fanger]

When a Jew has a Gentile in his clutches, another Jew may go to the same Gentile, lend him money and in turn deceive him, so that the Gentile shall be ruined. For the property of a Gentile, according to our law, belongs to no one, and the first Jew that passes has full right to seize it.

Is this supposed to be a justification for why it is morally acceptable to murder Jews?

Why can you not respond to simple questions?

How would you handle it? How would the IDF terrorists handle it if the shoe were on the other foot? You would just let foreigners bulldoze your home? You would just do nothing? You would not defend yourself with whatever means you had available? You would prefer your children to be homeless or dead?

How would I handle what? The conflict? The conflict could be solved in fifteen minutes by two reasonable people wanting to actually solve the problem.

Moshe: How about you take the territories where there is mostly Arab people and I'll take the territories where there is mostly Jewish people? And we treat the ones who end up on the other side with dignity, respect and full equality?

Mohammed: Sounds good. Why don't we share the holy places? And we can help you re-build your Temple.

Moshe: I think G-d would like that. Shall we also make arrangements to share water, and natural resources?

Mohammed: Of course. And should we make some cool trade agreements that would be mutually beneficial? Maybe have some universities help each other out? Or some joint research projects?

Moshe: That sounds awesome! Is there anything else then?

Mohammed: Nope. I think it sounds good. Shall we go out for coffee or tea to celebrate?



Or do you mean how would I handle the loss of my home, my livelihood, my property, all my worldly goods? Well, I'd probably handle it the same way the million Jewish people forced from their homes in the ME actually handled it. The way the Jewish people have always handled it. We build. This time we were lucky enough to build in our actual homeland.

The Palestinians Got Jewed off their Land

 

[Shusha]

When a Jew has a Gentile in his clutches, another Jew may go to the same Gentile, lend him money and in turn deceive him, so that the Gentile shall be ruined. For the property of a Gentile, according to our law, belongs to no one, and the first Jew that passes has full right to seize it.

Is this supposed to be a justification for why it is morally acceptable to murder Jews?

Do you see it as a justification?

Do you not need a justification to kill Jews?

 

[fanger]

You interpret it how you wish, it seems some jews are scared of their own shadow, like

my Tailor

 

[louie888]

It really is the Jewish mentality, from the OP...

Maybe the Old Testament can shed some light on that: Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”
–I Samuel 15:3

 

[Hollie]

It really is the Jewish mentality, from the OP...

Maybe the Old Testament can shed some light on that: Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”
–I Samuel 15:3

How about some loveliness from the Hamas charter?

Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it" (The Martyr, Imam Hassan al-Banna, of blessed memory)

 

[louie888]

It really is the Jewish mentality, from the OP...

Maybe the Old Testament can shed some light on that: Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”
–I Samuel 15:3

How about some loveliness from the Hamas charter?

Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it" (The Martyr, Imam Hassan al-Banna, of blessed memory)

Not sure how that is relevant to the OP, but the Jews own bible seems to point out, that yes, the settlers are fair military targets.

Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”
–I Samuel 15:3

The above is pretty clear here, no?

 

[fanger]

if Palestinians shoot, stab, or otherwise commit acts of violence against settlers, even if the settlers are unarmed at the time of the attack, are they to be condemned for it? Or are the settlers legitimate military targets?

These are not easy questions to answer. Many of the settlers, men as well as women, are toting machine guns and are convinced that Jewish blood is sacred while holding the view that Gentiles are subhuman. Most of us probably would not shed too many tears upon learning that such people had met with a violent end. But what if, in the process, settler children are killed?

Most morally decent people would agree that deaths of children should be avoided at all costs. Yet in Israel there are people who seem to have no qualms whatsoever about killing children. Five hundred in Gaza last summer alone were slaughtered, and just within the past few days people have been shocked by release of a video showing a critically injured Palestinian boy lying in a pool of blood as shouts ring out calling for his death.
Israeli Settlers: Are They ‘Civilians’ or Legitimate Military Targets?

 

[Hollie]

It really is the Jewish mentality, from the OP...

Maybe the Old Testament can shed some light on that: Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”
–I Samuel 15:3

How about some loveliness from the Hamas charter?

Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it" (The Martyr, Imam Hassan al-Banna, of blessed memory)

Not sure how that is relevant to the OP, but the Jews own bible seems to point out, that yes, the settlers are fair military targets.

Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”
–I Samuel 15:3

The above is pretty clear here, no?

Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it" (The Martyr, Imam Hassan al-Banna, of blessed memory


The above leaves you befuddled, yes?

 

[louie888]

...Many of the settlers, men as well as women, are toting machine guns and are convinced that Jewish blood is sacred while holding the view that Gentiles are subhuman....

This really gets to the crux of the issue.

It are the sick and twisted teachings within Judaism itself that leads to this insane hatred we see from our hasbarabots daily. And while they just live on the internet, let's not forget that the kids in the IDF are brainwashed with these same sick teachings from birth.

 

[P F Tinmore]

The main question was about the settlers: Are they civilians or not? According to the Geneva Accord they are not. Even according to the Israelis they are not.

Ariel Sharon sent Efraim Halevi, who was the head of Shin Bet at the time. The Egyptians, who were the mediators, negotiated with Halevi. When we reached the definition of civilians, we accepted the definition put forward by the Geneva Accord. The Israelis were surprised, as they did not expect that. We said that the settlers are not civilians and the answer was, yes, they are not.

A Dialogue with Hamas - Part 1 - Worldpress.org

 

[Shusha]

It really is the Jewish mentality, from the OP...

Maybe the Old Testament can shed some light on that: Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”
–I Samuel 15:3

How about some loveliness from the Hamas charter?

Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it" (The Martyr, Imam Hassan al-Banna, of blessed memory)

Not sure how that is relevant to the OP, but the Jews own bible seems to point out, that yes, the settlers are fair military targets.

Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”
–I Samuel 15:3

The above is pretty clear here, no?

You have us mixed up with the Muslims. See, the Jewish people don't actually cherry pick phrases from thousands years old ancient scripture and use it to justify the murder of innocents.

 

[Hollie]

...Many of the settlers, men as well as women, are toting machine guns and are convinced that Jewish blood is sacred while holding the view that Gentiles are subhuman....

This really gets to the crux of the issue.

It are the sick and twisted teachings within Judaism itself that leads to this insane hatred we see from our hasbarabots daily. And while they just live on the internet, let's not forget that the kids in the IDF are brainwashed with these same sick teachings from birth.

2/5 for hand-wringing melodrama, Mo'.

But all seriousness aside, it is your islamic Death Cult heroes who have not been able to claw their way out of the 7th century and still hold an Arab warlord as the perfect example for humanity.

If we examine the societal ills that afflict the Islamic Middle east we can point to people like you as examples of what the disease of Islamist ideology does to people .