Israeli Jew telling the truth.

[montelatici]

As usual Rocco, you demonstrate your lack of historical knowledge.

The British were the first to establish and coin the word "concentration camp". They were use to "concentrate" Boer non-combatants into controllable areas during the Boer war.

The Germans used the term, but in fact, they were death camps, not concentration camps.

 

[Fenton Lum]

Fenton Lum, Phoenall, montelatici, MaryL, et al,

I'm looking at this stretch of the discussion and conclude that [with exception of "montelatici" contribution on concentration camps (derived from the meaning of "Konzentrationslager") established by Nazi Germany] everyone seems to make a valid comment, at least in part.

I watched part of that video. One thing about it that isn't addressed about Palestinians, why all the violence? Nobody is putting them in concentration camps, all this violence can end NOW if Palestinians learn to co-exist. No rocket attacks, no suicide bombers, no stabbing, learn to get along with you Jewish non Muslim non Arab neighbor. Imagine that.

What do you call Gaza and the West Bank? They are concentration camps, in the original meaning of the word. The Palestinians are concentrated into walled or fenced areas controlled by the Israeli army. Why did the non-whites violently resist the Apartheid regime in South Africa? Why did they bomb shopping centers? Why do you expect the Palestinians to behave any differently than the Algerians, the non-whites in South Africa or the IRA?

This issue has bothered me for years, Why can't Arab Muslims accept Israel? Israel has been heavy handed militarily, particularly with Palestinians. I can understand their anger, but they too have to understand violence is counter productive.

First off, the Palestinian Arabs are Muslim and Christian. Why should the Muslims and Christians accept their dispossession on the part of Europeans that invaded from another continent? I don't get your point.

BECAUSE THE LAND WAS NEVER THEIRS IN THE FIRST PLACE. IT WAS JEWISH, ROMAN EMPIRE, ROMAN CATHOLIC, OTTOMAN AND NOW JEWISH. WHEN WAS IT ARAB MUSLIM LAND IN THE LAST 5000 YEARS ?

Given your / our / america's "connection" to that land over the past 5000 years, how in the world do you / we / america think we have anything to say about it at all?

(COMMENT)

But there are two things that should not be lost on the conversation. Societies, people and foreign relations tend to evolve over time and change the face of what comes next (except maybe for the Arab Palestinians). Even Nazi Concentration Camps evolved from the type where all newly detained captives were custodial care was facilitated, to work camps, then to camps that were captives were simply killed.

Politically motivated action organizations like the aforementioned Irish Republican Army (IRA) that slowly transformed itself several times.

There is the tendency for pro-Palestinians to compare itself with organizations and cause of that similar to the IRA, the uMkhonto we Sizwe (MK) (terrorist wing of the African National Congress), or the National Liberation Front (FLN Algeria) --- (for nearl daily) positive affirmation with empowers Arab Palestinians and strengthens their self-esteem. This is necessary because after (almost) seven decades since the Independence of Israel, the Palestinians have no real legacy of their success and have still failed to achieve a government that can stand alone (Article 22 Criteria).

Going back more than two previous governments, relative to the territorial integrity of the territory formerly under the Mandate for Palestine, is a futile exercise. Just as the legacy of the IRA, MK, or the FLN cannot justify Hostile Palestinian activity merely by making a shaky link association by similarity, does not truly establish 'justification" for their actions. Just because the US favorable adjudicated the decision to dropped a couple Plutonium Bombs (fission) seven decades ago, doesn't mean it is a justifiable action today.

Most Respectfully,
R

That's nice, but it doesn't really have anything to do with anything, and both the US and Israel have worked and bombed very hard to insure "no real legacy of their success and have still failed to achieve a government that can stand alone".

 

[montelatici]

Fenton Lum, Phoenall, montelatici, MaryL, et al,

I'm looking at this stretch of the discussion and conclude that [with exception of "montelatici" contribution on concentration camps (derived from the meaning of "Konzentrationslager") established by Nazi Germany] everyone seems to make a valid comment, at least in part.

I watched part of that video. One thing about it that isn't addressed about Palestinians, why all the violence? Nobody is putting them in concentration camps, all this violence can end NOW if Palestinians learn to co-exist. No rocket attacks, no suicide bombers, no stabbing, learn to get along with you Jewish non Muslim non Arab neighbor. Imagine that.

What do you call Gaza and the West Bank? They are concentration camps, in the original meaning of the word. The Palestinians are concentrated into walled or fenced areas controlled by the Israeli army. Why did the non-whites violently resist the Apartheid regime in South Africa? Why did they bomb shopping centers? Why do you expect the Palestinians to behave any differently than the Algerians, the non-whites in South Africa or the IRA?

This issue has bothered me for years, Why can't Arab Muslims accept Israel? Israel has been heavy handed militarily, particularly with Palestinians. I can understand their anger, but they too have to understand violence is counter productive.

First off, the Palestinian Arabs are Muslim and Christian. Why should the Muslims and Christians accept their dispossession on the part of Europeans that invaded from another continent? I don't get your point.

BECAUSE THE LAND WAS NEVER THEIRS IN THE FIRST PLACE. IT WAS JEWISH, ROMAN EMPIRE, ROMAN CATHOLIC, OTTOMAN AND NOW JEWISH. WHEN WAS IT ARAB MUSLIM LAND IN THE LAST 5000 YEARS ?

Given your / our / america's "connection" to that land over the past 5000 years, how in the world do you / we / america think we have anything to say about it at all?

(COMMENT)

But there are two things that should not be lost on the conversation. Societies, people and foreign relations tend to evolve over time and change the face of what comes next (except maybe for the Arab Palestinians). Even Nazi Concentration Camps evolved from the type where all newly detained captives were custodial care was facilitated, to work camps, then to camps that were captives were simply killed.

Politically motivated action organizations like the aforementioned Irish Republican Army (IRA) that slowly transformed itself several times.

There is the tendency for pro-Palestinians to compare itself with organizations and cause of that similar to the IRA, the uMkhonto we Sizwe (MK) (terrorist wing of the African National Congress), or the National Liberation Front (FLN Algeria) --- (for nearl daily) positive affirmation with empowers Arab Palestinians and strengthens their self-esteem. This is necessary because after (almost) seven decades since the Independence of Israel, the Palestinians have no real legacy of their success and have still failed to achieve a government that can stand alone (Article 22 Criteria).

Going back more than two previous governments, relative to the territorial integrity of the territory formerly under the Mandate for Palestine, is a futile exercise. Just as the legacy of the IRA, MK, or the FLN cannot justify Hostile Palestinian activity merely by making a shaky link association by similarity, does not truly establish 'justification" for their actions. Just because the US favorable adjudicated the decision to dropped a couple Plutonium Bombs (fission) seven decades ago, doesn't mean it is a justifiable action today.

Most Respectfully,
R

The Palestinians have done remarkably well considering that they are resisting a far greater force than the IRA, the MK or the FLN ever did. They are resisting occupation and oppression by a U.S. funded and supported Israel. The U.S. is the world's super power.

The link between the Palestinians and other national liberation movements is only "shaky" to morons that believe that Jews have a greater right to oppress people of other faiths than others.

There is a direct link between the Palestinians and every other national liberation or resistance movement. The differences in power between the occupier and the occupied is more analogous to the Germans/Vichy versus the French resistance than the other movements mentioned which had a more favorable power factor, but there is a direct link.

 

[Hossfly]

As usual Rocco, you demonstrate your lack of historical knowledge.

The British were the first to establish and coin the word "concentration camp". They were use to "concentrate" Boer non-combatants into controllable areas during the Boer war.

The Germans used the term, but in fact, they were death camps, not concentration camps.

Check this out:

The Polish historian Władysław Konopczyński used the term concentration camps when describing events inPoland during the Bar Confederation rebellion (1768–1772), when the Russian Empire established three prison camps for Polish captives awaiting deportation to Siberia.[7]

The English term originated in the reconcentrados (reconcentration camps) set up by the Spanish military inCuba during the Ten Years' War (1868–1878), Cuban War for Independence (1895–1898), and by the United States during the Philippine–American War (1899–1902).[8]

The term concentration camp saw wider use during the Second Boer War (1899–1902), when the British operated such camps in South Africa for interning Boers.[8][9] They built 45 tented camps for Boer internees and 64 for black Africans. Of the 28,000 Boer men captured as prisoners of war, the British sent 25,630 overseas. The vast majority of Boers remaining in the local camps were women and children,[10] over 26,000 of whom died there.[10][11]

Internment - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[RoccoR]

montelatici, et al,

You don't read very well.

As usual Rocco, you demonstrate your lack of historical knowledge.

The British were the first to establish and coin the word "concentration camp". They were use to "concentrate" Boer non-combatants into controllable areas during the Boer war.

The Germans used the term, but in fact, they were death camps, not concentration camps.

(COMMENT)

I think that if you go back and read it, it says that the "[with exception of "montelatici" contribution on concentration camps (derived from the meaning of "Konzentrationslager") established by Nazi Germany] " ---- the phrase "derived from" means obtain something from a specified source. Or, if you prefer, a translation of, the German Phrase. Thats is only important from the standpoint that a distinction is being made as to who (Germans or Allies) first titled the camps. If it was the "Allies" describing the "camps" as "concentration camps, then is is a comparison. However, if the Germans

However, the origin of the concept or idea of a "concentration camp" dates back to a time well before the 1800 and the American Indian Wars.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Fenton Lum]

Meanwhile, on Pine Ridge, at any given time 60% of that population is without electricity and running water, while it enjoys the lowest adult male life expectancy (48 years) of any other area in the western hemisphere except for Haiti.

 

[montelatici]

montelatici, et al,

You don't read very well.

As usual Rocco, you demonstrate your lack of historical knowledge.

The British were the first to establish and coin the word "concentration camp". They were use to "concentrate" Boer non-combatants into controllable areas during the Boer war.

The Germans used the term, but in fact, they were death camps, not concentration camps.

(COMMENT)

I think that if you go back and read it, it says that the "[with exception of "montelatici" contribution on concentration camps (derived from the meaning of "Konzentrationslager") established by Nazi Germany] " ---- the phrase "derived from" means obtain something from a specified source. Or, if you prefer, a translation of, the German Phrase. Thats is only important from the standpoint that a distinction is being made as to who (Germans or Allies) first titled the camps. If it was the "Allies" describing the "camps" as "concentration camps, then is is a comparison. However, if the Germans

However, the origin of the concept or idea of a "concentration camp" dates back to a time well before the 1800 and the American Indian Wars.

Most Respectfully,
R

No, then you need to improve your articulation of the English language.

You said:

(derived from the meaning of "Konzentrationslager")

in fact, "Konzentrationslager" was derived from the meaning of Concentration Camp.

 

[RoccoR]

montelatici, et al,

This is your subjective opinion.

The Palestinians have done remarkably well considering that they are resisting a far greater force than the IRA, the MK or the FLN ever did. They are resisting occupation and oppression by a U.S. funded and supported Israel. The U.S. is the world's super power.

The link between the Palestinians and other national liberation movements is only "shaky" to morons that believe that Jews have a greater right to oppress people of other faiths than others.

There is a direct link between the Palestinians and every other national liberation or resistance movement. The differences in power between the occupier and the occupied is more analogous to the Germans/Vichy versus the French resistance than the other movements mentioned which had a more favorable power factor, but there is a direct link.

(COMMENT)

Force comparisons are not the best or even the most important means of evaluating the comparative advantage any one particular asymmetric opponent have over a second or third warfare generational force structure.

Other than being asymmetric warfare element that is descriptively "occupied" in an environment that could otherwise be very productive and economically sound, there is very little the Hostile Arab Palestinian Terrorist (HoAP) have in common with the Maquis (MQ-F) and the Free-French Resistance (FFR/FFI). Even the general composition of the MQ-F and FFR is remarkably different.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[montelatici]

The Palestinians have everything in common with the French resistance. They were labeled terrorists by both the Nazis and the Vichy. They were considered hostile by the Nazis, much like you consider them hostile. Just like the Palestinians, the French Resistance resisted occupation of an invader from abroad.

 

[Roudy]

The Palestinians have everything in common with the French resistance. They were labeled terrorists by both the Nazis and the Vichy. They were considered hostile by the Nazis, much like you consider them hostile. Just like the Palestinians, the French Resistance resisted occupation of an invader from abroad.

Actually the Jews have more in common with the French resistance.

 

[Fenton Lum]

The Palestinians have everything in common with the French resistance. They were labeled terrorists by both the Nazis and the Vichy. They were considered hostile by the Nazis, much like you consider them hostile. Just like the Palestinians, the French Resistance resisted occupation of an invader from abroad.

Actually the Jews have more in common with the French resistance.

You spouting horseshit as if it were reality doesn't render it anything other than horseshit.

 

[Roudy]

The Palestinians have everything in common with the French resistance. They were labeled terrorists by both the Nazis and the Vichy. They were considered hostile by the Nazis, much like you consider them hostile. Just like the Palestinians, the French Resistance resisted occupation of an invader from abroad.

Actually the Jews have more in common with the French resistance.

You spouting horseshit as if it were reality doesn't render it anything other than horseshit.

Yes of course, it all started when Arab Muslim animals committed genocide and ethnic cleansing of the ancient Jews of Hebron. Until then the Jews were not armed, but afterwards, they formed militias such as the Irgun and Haganah to protect themselves from genocidal Muslim savages. A civil war erupted, the Jews won, the state of Israel was established, and from there on a series or royal ass kickings by Jews who were severely outnumbered by the hoards of neighboring Muslim savages.

 

[Coyote]

Thread has been cleaned of a significant derailment - the posts have been moved here into a new thread: Error | US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum

Posts in IP must include material related to the topic - for those who are confused, the topic is in Post #1.

 

[Fenton Lum]

The Palestinians have everything in common with the French resistance. They were labeled terrorists by both the Nazis and the Vichy. They were considered hostile by the Nazis, much like you consider them hostile. Just like the Palestinians, the French Resistance resisted occupation of an invader from abroad.

Actually the Jews have more in common with the French resistance.

You spouting horseshit as if it were reality doesn't render it anything other than horseshit.

Yes of course, it all started when Arab Muslim animals committed genocide and ethnic cleansing of the ancient Jews of Hebron. Until then the Jews were not armed, but afterwards, they formed militias such as the Irgun and Haganah to protect themselves from genocidal Muslim savages. A civil war erupted, the Jews won, the state of Israel was established, and from there on a series or royal ass kickings by Jews who were severely outnumbered by the hoards of neighboring Muslim savages.

I think it's pretty intuitively obvious to even the most casual of observers that when anyone constantly refers to a group of people as animals and savages they hope for no solution. Additionally, when you on the one hand lament "genocide and ethnic cleansing" while simultaneously advocating it in a different direction you reveal yourself as a monumental hypocrite and frothy mouthed zealot incapable of any semblance of discussion.

 

[gt1085]

The Palestinians have everything in common with the French resistance. They were labeled terrorists by both the Nazis and the Vichy. They were considered hostile by the Nazis, much like you consider them hostile. Just like the Palestinians, the French Resistance resisted occupation of an invader from abroad.

Actually the Jews have more in common with the French resistance.

You spouting horseshit as if it were reality doesn't render it anything other than horseshit.

Yes of course, it all started when Arab Muslim animals committed genocide and ethnic cleansing of the ancient Jews of Hebron. Until then the Jews were not armed, but afterwards, they formed militias such as the Irgun and Haganah to protect themselves from genocidal Muslim savages. A civil war erupted, the Jews won, the state of Israel was established, and from there on a series or royal ass kickings by Jews who were severely outnumbered by the hoards of neighboring Muslim savages.

I think it's pretty intuitively obvious to even the most casual of observers that when anyone constantly refers to a group of people as animals and savages they hope for no solution. Additionally, when you on the one hand lament "genocide and ethnic cleansing" while simultaneously advocating it in a different direction you reveal yourself as a monumental hypocrite and frothy mouthed zealot incapable of any semblance of discussion.

Pfft who are to be making dumb accusations the what`s wrong with you people no every thing and can`t prove it just speculation mess with me you`ll get facts whether you gonna like or not ,you will learn something here.So lets just drop it here.

 

[gt1085]

The Palestinians have everything in common with the French resistance. They were labeled terrorists by both the Nazis and the Vichy. They were considered hostile by the Nazis, much like you consider them hostile. Just like the Palestinians, the French Resistance resisted occupation of an invader from abroad.

Actually the Jews have more in common with the French resistance.

You spouting horseshit as if it were reality doesn't render it anything other than horseshit.

Yes of course, it all started when Arab Muslim animals committed genocide and ethnic cleansing of the ancient Jews of Hebron. Until then the Jews were not armed, but afterwards, they formed militias such as the Irgun and Haganah to protect themselves from genocidal Muslim savages. A civil war erupted, the Jews won, the state of Israel was established, and from there on a series or royal ass kickings by Jews who were severely outnumbered by the hoards of neighboring Muslim savages.

I think it's pretty intuitively obvious to even the most casual of observers that when anyone constantly refers to a group of people as animals and savages they hope for no solution. Additionally, when you on the one hand lament "genocide and ethnic cleansing" while simultaneously advocating it in a different direction you reveal yourself as a monumental hypocrite and frothy mouthed zealot incapable of any semblance of discussion.

You Can`t Handle The Truth,By The Way.

 

[Fenton Lum]

The Palestinians have everything in common with the French resistance. They were labeled terrorists by both the Nazis and the Vichy. They were considered hostile by the Nazis, much like you consider them hostile. Just like the Palestinians, the French Resistance resisted occupation of an invader from abroad.

Actually the Jews have more in common with the French resistance.

You spouting horseshit as if it were reality doesn't render it anything other than horseshit.

Yes of course, it all started when Arab Muslim animals committed genocide and ethnic cleansing of the ancient Jews of Hebron. Until then the Jews were not armed, but afterwards, they formed militias such as the Irgun and Haganah to protect themselves from genocidal Muslim savages. A civil war erupted, the Jews won, the state of Israel was established, and from there on a series or royal ass kickings by Jews who were severely outnumbered by the hoards of neighboring Muslim savages.

I think it's pretty intuitively obvious to even the most casual of observers that when anyone constantly refers to a group of people as animals and savages they hope for no solution. Additionally, when you on the one hand lament "genocide and ethnic cleansing" while simultaneously advocating it in a different direction you reveal yourself as a monumental hypocrite and frothy mouthed zealot incapable of any semblance of discussion.

Pfft who are to be making dumb accusations the what`s wrong with you people no every thing and can`t prove it just speculation mess with me you`ll get facts whether you gonna like or not ,you will learn something here.So lets just drop it here.

Nah, I don't "no" everything.

 

[Fenton Lum]

The Palestinians have everything in common with the French resistance. They were labeled terrorists by both the Nazis and the Vichy. They were considered hostile by the Nazis, much like you consider them hostile. Just like the Palestinians, the French Resistance resisted occupation of an invader from abroad.

Actually the Jews have more in common with the French resistance.

You spouting horseshit as if it were reality doesn't render it anything other than horseshit.

Yes of course, it all started when Arab Muslim animals committed genocide and ethnic cleansing of the ancient Jews of Hebron. Until then the Jews were not armed, but afterwards, they formed militias such as the Irgun and Haganah to protect themselves from genocidal Muslim savages. A civil war erupted, the Jews won, the state of Israel was established, and from there on a series or royal ass kickings by Jews who were severely outnumbered by the hoards of neighboring Muslim savages.

I think it's pretty intuitively obvious to even the most casual of observers that when anyone constantly refers to a group of people as animals and savages they hope for no solution. Additionally, when you on the one hand lament "genocide and ethnic cleansing" while simultaneously advocating it in a different direction you reveal yourself as a monumental hypocrite and frothy mouthed zealot incapable of any semblance of discussion.

You Can`t Handle The Truth,By The Way.

Please let me know when you locate it?

 

[gt1085]

Actually the Jews have more in common with the French resistance.

You spouting horseshit as if it were reality doesn't render it anything other than horseshit.

Yes of course, it all started when Arab Muslim animals committed genocide and ethnic cleansing of the ancient Jews of Hebron. Until then the Jews were not armed, but afterwards, they formed militias such as the Irgun and Haganah to protect themselves from genocidal Muslim savages. A civil war erupted, the Jews won, the state of Israel was established, and from there on a series or royal ass kickings by Jews who were severely outnumbered by the hoards of neighboring Muslim savages.

I think it's pretty intuitively obvious to even the most casual of observers that when anyone constantly refers to a group of people as animals and savages they hope for no solution. Additionally, when you on the one hand lament "genocide and ethnic cleansing" while simultaneously advocating it in a different direction you reveal yourself as a monumental hypocrite and frothy mouthed zealot incapable of any semblance of discussion.

You Can`t Handle The Truth,By The Way.

Please let me know when you locate it?

i have all i need and getting more,im not stuck in lies like most,and believe me you are not ready for the truth,your history is by no means pretty.This you Know Already.So what the use in discussing anything.Facts is what i live by.

 

[Fenton Lum]

You spouting horseshit as if it were reality doesn't render it anything other than horseshit.

Yes of course, it all started when Arab Muslim animals committed genocide and ethnic cleansing of the ancient Jews of Hebron. Until then the Jews were not armed, but afterwards, they formed militias such as the Irgun and Haganah to protect themselves from genocidal Muslim savages. A civil war erupted, the Jews won, the state of Israel was established, and from there on a series or royal ass kickings by Jews who were severely outnumbered by the hoards of neighboring Muslim savages.

I think it's pretty intuitively obvious to even the most casual of observers that when anyone constantly refers to a group of people as animals and savages they hope for no solution. Additionally, when you on the one hand lament "genocide and ethnic cleansing" while simultaneously advocating it in a different direction you reveal yourself as a monumental hypocrite and frothy mouthed zealot incapable of any semblance of discussion.

You Can`t Handle The Truth,By The Way.

Please let me know when you locate it?

i have all i need and getting more,im not stuck in lies like most,and believe me you are not ready for the truth,your history is by no means pretty.This you Know Already.So what the use in discussing anything.Facts is what i live by.

That is the single most commonass claim you will see made by all on here, everyone clinging to his/her own reality in the midst of everyone else not clued into your truth.