Israel steps up home demolitions to punish Palestinian attackers

[Billo_Really]

Point out where collective punishment is a war crime.

The fact you even ask that question, shows how disgusting you really are. It's the same thing as Hitler saying, "Show me where I can't murder 6 million Jews!"

Convention (IV) relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War. Geneva, 12 August 1949.
Individual responsibility, collective penalties, pillage, reprisals

• ARTICLE 33
  No protected person may be punished for an offence he or she has not personally committed.

• Collective penalties and likewise all measures of intimidation or of terrorism are prohibited.

• Pillage is prohibited.

• Reprisals against protected persons and their property are prohibited.

I'm very curious to see if you can rationally justify within the geneva conventions where the Israeli's have committed a war crime

Gaza blockade.

Should be easy for you since you are constantly spouting off about this one. Surely you must have some justification.

I do and there's a lot of it.

I'd like you to show me one place (other than Nazi Germany), where it is allowed.

Although I'm glad we have agreed that its a war.

I didn't agree to that. I've stated the opposite on many occasions. Show me where I did.

 

[Roudy]

Notice there is no proof whatsoever that Israel attacks civilians intentionally despite the rambling.

Hamas is an Islamic terrorist organization with zero respect for international law, which rules Gaza with an Iron fist dufus.

 

[ogibillm]

The litany of false accusations is astounding.

I enjoy a good historical debate wherever I can find it. But the level of pure bullshit is always highest when discussing the Israeli palestinian conflict.

The Boston Finagler is living proof of the distortions by the pro-Israel nut-cakes on these boards.

The best one by you dolts is: Jordan is Palestine is Jordan is Palestine.

Its more than obvious that you've failed completely to refute a single element of my argument.

Palestinians are an invention of the mandate period. Prior to that the area was considered southern Ottoman Syria and divided into three provinces, none of which were called palestine.

Jordan was invented in the mandate period and likewise also just another part of southern Ottoman Syria.

So maybe you can explain the linguistic, religious, customary and cultural differences between the Arab Muslims living on the east side of the Jordan River vs the Arab Muslims living on the west side.

There are no discernible differences between these people. All fell under the British citizenship order and by definition were palestinian. They have zero distinctive qualities, they are inarguably the same people.

Yet for political gains against Israel you insist somehow beyond all reason that the Arab Muslim colonists one inch this side of the river are somehow a distinct people from Arab Muslim colonists one inch that side of the river.

Your argument is ludicrous in the extreme, Jordan is the Arab Muslim colonists state.

why do you think any of that matters?

were they displaced by the creation of israel or weren't they?

 

[Roudy]

The object of war is not to die in equal numbers

An Army warring on a civilian population like the Nazis warred on the Jews? Was it fair and Just?

Wasn't aware that Jews were shooting rockets at Germans and bombing German school buses filled with children. Which history book are you reading...The Hamas Charter of genocide upon the Jews?

Like America, you can be occupied by money. Too much money concentrated into a few is a recipe for revolutions Historically in Man-Kind.

What are you taking about now?! You compared the Israelis to the Nazis, and I asked you to show me evidence of German Jews shooting rockets at German civilians and blowing up German school buses, and your response is "they are occupied by money"? Seriously, is that all your got? Perhaps if the Pali animals stopped trying to commit genocide in the Jews their homes would be left intact....whadaya think, little Peeballs?

 

[ogibillm]

Notice there is no proof whatsoever that Israel attacks civilians intentionally despite the rambling.

Hamas is an Islamic terrorist organization with zero respect for international law, which rules Gaza with an Iron fist dufus.

so they accidentally kill civilians by the hundreds?

 

[Roudy]

The litany of false accusations is astounding.

I enjoy a good historical debate wherever I can find it. But the level of pure bullshit is always highest when discussing the Israeli palestinian conflict.

The Boston Finagler is living proof of the distortions by the pro-Israel nut-cakes on these boards.

The best one by you dolts is: Jordan is Palestine is Jordan is Palestine.

Its more than obvious that you've failed completely to refute a single element of my argument.

Palestinians are an invention of the mandate period. Prior to that the area was considered southern Ottoman Syria and divided into three provinces, none of which were called palestine.

Jordan was invented in the mandate period and likewise also just another part of southern Ottoman Syria.

So maybe you can explain the linguistic, religious, customary and cultural differences between the Arab Muslims living on the east side of the Jordan River vs the Arab Muslims living on the west side.

There are no discernible differences between these people. All fell under the British citizenship order and by definition were palestinian. They have zero distinctive qualities, they are inarguably the same people.

Yet for political gains against Israel you insist somehow beyond all reason that the Arab Muslim colonists one inch this side of the river are somehow a distinct people from Arab Muslim colonists one inch that side of the river.

Your argument is ludicrous in the extreme, Jordan is the Arab Muslim colonists state.

why do you think any of that matters?

were they displaced by the creation of israel or weren't they?

They were displaced when the neighboring Arabs attacked Israel.

 

[Roudy]

Notice there is no proof whatsoever that Israel attacks civilians intentionally despite the rambling.

Hamas is an Islamic terrorist organization with zero respect for international law, which rules Gaza with an Iron fist dufus.

so they accidentally kill civilians by the hundreds?

Israel is protecting its civilians and it's national security. It goes out of its way, more than the US and most nations not to harm civilians.

Unfortunately, civilians do get killed in all wars, however Israel never targets civilians intentionally, unlike Palestinians who do it all the time. In fact the Palestinian terrorist leadership goes out of its way to put its civilians in harms way by shooting rockets from schools, apartment buildings, and hospitals. Their depravity is astounding.

 

[ogibillm]

The litany of false accusations is astounding.

I enjoy a good historical debate wherever I can find it. But the level of pure bullshit is always highest when discussing the Israeli palestinian conflict.

The Boston Finagler is living proof of the distortions by the pro-Israel nut-cakes on these boards.

The best one by you dolts is: Jordan is Palestine is Jordan is Palestine.

Its more than obvious that you've failed completely to refute a single element of my argument.

Palestinians are an invention of the mandate period. Prior to that the area was considered southern Ottoman Syria and divided into three provinces, none of which were called palestine.

Jordan was invented in the mandate period and likewise also just another part of southern Ottoman Syria.

So maybe you can explain the linguistic, religious, customary and cultural differences between the Arab Muslims living on the east side of the Jordan River vs the Arab Muslims living on the west side.

There are no discernible differences between these people. All fell under the British citizenship order and by definition were palestinian. They have zero distinctive qualities, they are inarguably the same people.

Yet for political gains against Israel you insist somehow beyond all reason that the Arab Muslim colonists one inch this side of the river are somehow a distinct people from Arab Muslim colonists one inch that side of the river.

Your argument is ludicrous in the extreme, Jordan is the Arab Muslim colonists state.

why do you think any of that matters?

were they displaced by the creation of israel or weren't they?

They were displaced when the neighboring Arabs attacked Israel.

so 'yes'

 

[ogibillm]

Notice there is no proof whatsoever that Israel attacks civilians intentionally despite the rambling.

Hamas is an Islamic terrorist organization with zero respect for international law, which rules Gaza with an Iron fist dufus.

so they accidentally kill civilians by the hundreds?

Israel is protecting its civilians and it's national security. It goes out of its way, more than the US and most nations not to harm civilians.

Unfortunately, civilians do get killed in all wars, however Israel never targets civilians intentionally, .

you cannot possibly believe this

 

[Roudy]

The litany of false accusations is astounding.

I enjoy a good historical debate wherever I can find it. But the level of pure bullshit is always highest when discussing the Israeli palestinian conflict.

The Boston Finagler is living proof of the distortions by the pro-Israel nut-cakes on these boards.

The best one by you dolts is: Jordan is Palestine is Jordan is Palestine.

Its more than obvious that you've failed completely to refute a single element of my argument.

Palestinians are an invention of the mandate period. Prior to that the area was considered southern Ottoman Syria and divided into three provinces, none of which were called palestine.

Jordan was invented in the mandate period and likewise also just another part of southern Ottoman Syria.

So maybe you can explain the linguistic, religious, customary and cultural differences between the Arab Muslims living on the east side of the Jordan River vs the Arab Muslims living on the west side.

There are no discernible differences between these people. All fell under the British citizenship order and by definition were palestinian. They have zero distinctive qualities, they are inarguably the same people.

Yet for political gains against Israel you insist somehow beyond all reason that the Arab Muslim colonists one inch this side of the river are somehow a distinct people from Arab Muslim colonists one inch that side of the river.

Your argument is ludicrous in the extreme, Jordan is the Arab Muslim colonists state.

why do you think any of that matters?

were they displaced by the creation of israel or weren't they?

They were displaced when the neighboring Arabs attacked Israel.

so 'yes'

Yes what? the Arabs attacked Israel and caused the refugee crisis. Then they put the Palestinians in camps in the West Bank and Gaza for 20 years. How come no mention of this mythical Palestine or Palestinians for those 20 years?

It's really not that complicated Achmed, you don't want your home to be bulldozed? Don't shoot rockets or commit terrorism against Israelis.

 

[ogibillm]

if destroying homes is such a deterrent why doesn't israel destroy the homes of israelis that attack palestinians?

 

[Roudy]

Notice there is no proof whatsoever that Israel attacks civilians intentionally despite the rambling.

Hamas is an Islamic terrorist organization with zero respect for international law, which rules Gaza with an Iron fist dufus.

so they accidentally kill civilians by the hundreds?

Israel is protecting its civilians and it's national security. It goes out of its way, more than the US and most nations not to harm civilians.

Unfortunately, civilians do get killed in all wars, however Israel never targets civilians intentionally, .

you cannot possibly believe this

You cannot possibly not believe this. If Israel wanted to attack civilians there would not be a single Palestinian left standing.

So let's review your logic, it's okay for Palestinians to constantly target Iaraeli civilians, but you guys constantly whine about Palestinian civilians dying or the terrorist homes bulldozed, when Israel goes after the attackers? Run that by me again?!

 

[Boston1]

Point out where collective punishment is a war crime.

The fact you even ask that question, shows how disgusting you really are. It's the same thing as Hitler saying, "Show me where I can't murder 6 million Jews!"

Convention (IV) relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War. Geneva, 12 August 1949.
Individual responsibility, collective penalties, pillage, reprisals

• ARTICLE 33
  No protected person may be punished for an offence he or she has not personally committed.

• Collective penalties and likewise all measures of intimidation or of terrorism are prohibited.

• Pillage is prohibited.

• Reprisals against protected persons and their property are prohibited.

I'm very curious to see if you can rationally justify within the geneva conventions where the Israeli's have committed a war crime

Gaza blockade.

Should be easy for you since you are constantly spouting off about this one. Surely you must have some justification.

I do and there's a lot of it.

I'd like you to show me one place (other than Nazi Germany), where it is allowed.

Although I'm glad we have agreed that its a war.

I didn't agree to that. I've stated the opposite on many occasions. Show me where I did.

LOL

You are funny, over emotional, but funny. So lets review.

You conveniently forgot the part about persons who participate in the conflict losing their protected status.

Lets take a look at article 5 IV Geneva convention

Quote

Art. 5 Where in the territory of a Party to the conflict, the latter is satisfied that an individual protected person is definitely suspected of or engaged in activities hostile to the security of the State, such individual person shall not be entitled to claim such rights and privileges under the present Convention as would, if exercised in the favour of such individual person, be prejudicial to the security of such State.
Where in occupied territory an individual protected person is detained as a spy or saboteur, or as a person under definite suspicion of activity hostile to the security of the Occupying Power, such person shall, in those cases where absolute military security so requires, be regarded as having forfeited rights of communication under the present Convention.

End quote
KInda screws up your whole theory now doesn’t it. Those even suspected of acts against the state lose their protected status until a judicial determination can be made.


Your next complaint is about something you call the
Gaza blockade
But its not a blockade, its an arms embargo. Israel and Egypt ( something else you oh so conveniently forgot ) is allowing humanitarian aid to flow into the war zone.

There is no blockade. Its an embargo. Its also a war, so Israel is well within its rights to prevent arms from flowing to an enemy combatant.

And lastly my friend you claimed Israel was guilty of war crimes. Are you now denying there is a war ? You seem very confused

You also appear to be a very selective reader. Maybe you’d consider actually reading the Geneva conventions before making further comment

Quote

Art. 2. In addition to the provisions which shall be implemented in peace-time, the present Convention shall apply to all cases of declared war or of any other armed conflict which may arise between two or more of the High Contracting Parties, even if the state of war is not recognized by one of them.
The Convention shall also apply to all cases of partial or total occupation of the territory of a High Contracting Party, even if the said occupation meets with no armed resistance.
Although one of the Powers in conflict may not be a party to the present Convention, the Powers who are parties thereto shall remain bound by it in their mutual relations. They shall furthermore be bound by the Convention in relation to the said Power, if the latter accepts and applies the provisions thereof.

End Quote

A little history might also go a long way


https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...qWh57li0YbcYe0y2ClgBLQ&bvm=bv.112064104,d.amc

quote

Fighting began with attacks by irregular bands of Palestinian Arabs attached to local units of the Arab Liberation Army composed of volunteers from Palestine and neighboring Arab countries. These groups launched their attacks against Jewish cities, settlements, and armed forces. The Jewish forces were composed of the Haganah, the underground militia of the Jewish community in Palestine, and two small irregular groups, the Irgun, and LEHI. The goal of the Arabs was initially to block the Partition Resolution and to prevent the establishment of the Jewish state. The Jews, on the other hand, hoped to gain control over the territory allotted to them under the Partition Plan.
After Israel declared its independence on May 14, 1948, the fighting intensified with other Arab forces joining the Palestinian Arabs in attacking territory in the former Palestinian mandate. On the eve of May 14, the Arabs launched an air attack on Tel Aviv, which the Israelis resisted. This action was followed by the invasion of the former Palestinian mandate by Arab armies from Lebanon, Syria, Iraq, and Egypt. Saudi Arabia sent a formation that fought under the Egyptian command. British trained forces from Transjordan eventually intervened in the conflict, but only in areas that had been designated as part of the Arab state under the United Nations Partition Plan and the corpus separatum of Jerusalem. After tense early fighting, Israeli forces, now under joint command, were able to gain the offensive.

End quote

 

[Boston1]

The litany of false accusations is astounding.

I enjoy a good historical debate wherever I can find it. But the level of pure bullshit is always highest when discussing the Israeli palestinian conflict.

The Boston Finagler is living proof of the distortions by the pro-Israel nut-cakes on these boards.

The best one by you dolts is: Jordan is Palestine is Jordan is Palestine.

Its more than obvious that you've failed completely to refute a single element of my argument.

Palestinians are an invention of the mandate period. Prior to that the area was considered southern Ottoman Syria and divided into three provinces, none of which were called palestine.

Jordan was invented in the mandate period and likewise also just another part of southern Ottoman Syria.

So maybe you can explain the linguistic, religious, customary and cultural differences between the Arab Muslims living on the east side of the Jordan River vs the Arab Muslims living on the west side.

There are no discernible differences between these people. All fell under the British citizenship order and by definition were palestinian. They have zero distinctive qualities, they are inarguably the same people.

Yet for political gains against Israel you insist somehow beyond all reason that the Arab Muslim colonists one inch this side of the river are somehow a distinct people from Arab Muslim colonists one inch that side of the river.

Your argument is ludicrous in the extreme, Jordan is the Arab Muslim colonists state.

why do you think any of that matters?

were they displaced by the creation of israel or weren't they?

Everyone was displaced at some point or another, get over it.

And no, Israel wasn't created, it was won after the native people were attacked by the local Arab Muslims. See previous link to the US Office of the Historian.

Also the Israeli's were happy to purchase land, no one was displaced until the Arab Muslims declared war and invaded.

 

[RoccoR]

Challenger, et al,

OH, you are too funny.

Your cause has been lost for 68 years... it's over...

Did you know it took 123 years before Poland regained it's independance? "Lost causes" have a bad habit of being "found" again. Oh, and it's not over till the fat lady sings...

(COMMENT)

The Independence of Poland --- was a by-product of the Allied Powers success in the Great War (WWI). It was the defeat of the three Occupying Empires (Prussian, Habsburg, Russian) that permitted the (second) Polish Republic to reemerge. And it was the defeat of the Ottoman Empire that set the initial conditions for the establishment of the Jewish footprint in the Middle East.

The Treaty of Lausanne with the Allied Powers led to the international recognition of the sovereignty of the newly formed "Republic of Turkey" as the successor state to the Ottoman Empire.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Roudy]

It's Arabs / Muslims constantly failing to be responsible for the consequences of their own aggression and bad behavior. It's still happening today, as we can see.

 

[Lipush]

There is no difference between what a court might impose as a punitive measure in the US than in Israel.

Yes there is. In this country, the punitive measures are decided after the criminal trial has taken place and the person is convicted.

Fines and other penalties are to be expected when criminals are punished.

Criminals, yes; families of criminals, no.

However in the case of this conflict its also a measure of whats covered by the Geneva conventions.

And it says you cannot demolish the home of a protected person. Families of a person "convicted" of a crime, are still protected persons, as long as they don't become a party to the conflict.

In which case combatants, suspected combatants civilian or otherwise enjoy no rights as protected persons.

So you only have to accuse someone to prove they're guilty of a crime? You call that due process?

Israel is well within its rights to deport the families of terrorists to a neutral or agreed upon third party and demolish their homes.

No its not. First of all, resisting the occupation, is not terrorism, asshole. And going after people who've committed no crime, shows just how sick Israel is.

how do the Palestinians resist occupation nowdays?

Stabbing mothers infront of their children in their houses?

spilling the blood of pregnant women reaching to embrace them?

 

[ogibillm]

There is no difference between what a court might impose as a punitive measure in the US than in Israel.

Yes there is. In this country, the punitive measures are decided after the criminal trial has taken place and the person is convicted.

Fines and other penalties are to be expected when criminals are punished.

Criminals, yes; families of criminals, no.

However in the case of this conflict its also a measure of whats covered by the Geneva conventions.

And it says you cannot demolish the home of a protected person. Families of a person "convicted" of a crime, are still protected persons, as long as they don't become a party to the conflict.

In which case combatants, suspected combatants civilian or otherwise enjoy no rights as protected persons.

So you only have to accuse someone to prove they're guilty of a crime? You call that due process?

Israel is well within its rights to deport the families of terrorists to a neutral or agreed upon third party and demolish their homes.

No its not. First of all, resisting the occupation, is not terrorism, asshole. And going after people who've committed no crime, shows just how sick Israel is.

how do the Palestinians resist occupation nowdays?

Stabbing mothers infront of their children in their houses?

spilling the blood of pregnant women reaching to embrace them?

That's horrific.

how many pregnant Palestinians has israel killed?

how about children and babies?

 

[pbel]

The litany of false accusations is astounding.

I enjoy a good historical debate wherever I can find it. But the level of pure bullshit is always highest when discussing the Israeli palestinian conflict.

The Boston Finagler is living proof of the distortions by the pro-Israel nut-cakes on these boards.

The best one by you dolts is: Jordan is Palestine is Jordan is Palestine.

Its more than obvious that you've failed completely to refute a single element of my argument.

Palestinians are an invention of the mandate period. Prior to that the area was considered southern Ottoman Syria and divided into three provinces, none of which were called palestine.

Jordan was invented in the mandate period and likewise also just another part of southern Ottoman Syria.

So maybe you can explain the linguistic, religious, customary and cultural differences between the Arab Muslims living on the east side of the Jordan River vs the Arab Muslims living on the west side.

There are no discernible differences between these people. All fell under the British citizenship order and by definition were palestinian. They have zero distinctive qualities, they are inarguably the same people.

Yet for political gains against Israel you insist somehow beyond all reason that the Arab Muslim colonists one inch this side of the river are somehow a distinct people from Arab Muslim colonists one inch that side of the river.

Your argument is ludicrous in the extreme, Jordan is the Arab Muslim colonists state.

you're a complete AH if you think you've fooled the world with your Finagling. No one in Planet Earth has recognized any Israeli annexations and only the money occupied West recognizes Israel's thievery of the land.

 

[Roudy]

There is no difference between what a court might impose as a punitive measure in the US than in Israel.

Yes there is. In this country, the punitive measures are decided after the criminal trial has taken place and the person is convicted.

Fines and other penalties are to be expected when criminals are punished.

Criminals, yes; families of criminals, no.

However in the case of this conflict its also a measure of whats covered by the Geneva conventions.

And it says you cannot demolish the home of a protected person. Families of a person "convicted" of a crime, are still protected persons, as long as they don't become a party to the conflict.

In which case combatants, suspected combatants civilian or otherwise enjoy no rights as protected persons.

So you only have to accuse someone to prove they're guilty of a crime? You call that due process?

Israel is well within its rights to deport the families of terrorists to a neutral or agreed upon third party and demolish their homes.

No its not. First of all, resisting the occupation, is not terrorism, asshole. And going after people who've committed no crime, shows just how sick Israel is.

how do the Palestinians resist occupation nowdays?

Stabbing mothers infront of their children in their houses?

spilling the blood of pregnant women reaching to embrace them?

That's horrific.

how many pregnant Palestinians has israel killed?

how about children and babies?

You seem to be asking Israel to care more for the Palestinians than the Palestinians themselves. What do you expect when they use their own women and children as human shields and ammo?