Original post by Bry
up to your old polemics ajwps? Still trying to convince the world that the arabs want to kill them?
Old polemics you say? Like truth and lies admixed, truth always rises to the top. I am not trying to convince any of those on this site of facts already well known and admitted by the Muslims.
Since you stepped out of your Mustafa clownsuit, you've made many very interesting points, even in the Iraq war forum where I still disagree, but especially with your little Christian bashing that you started in the Muslim section.
You say I indulge in Christian bashing while you abdicate your basic belief tenets in favor of using the older Jewish belief in heavenly retribution and avoiding the verses of the New Testament. It is hardly a wonder that you choose to side with the Iraqi dictator and his thugs who murdered and tortured his people. Typical of the tolerance and name calling when it comes to the lives and freedom of fellow human beings. Very nice indeed
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You make some very interesting points there, but you also lead one to the conclusion that you have made yourself a very adept defender of Zionism. You're a one trick pony, and your consistent resort to pure propaganda and mythologizing of the "evil" Muslims (not to mention your demonizing of anyone who puts forth an argument conflicting with your own) is the clearest evidence.
You are a perfect example of intolerance while you equate Zionism with Judaism. I do not consider myself a trick pony when I use logic and you respond with illogical and untrue statements.
What the League of Nations mandated, under significant pressure from the US, who was under significant pressure from the already powerful Zionist constituency, was a gross violation of human rights. The plan was to encourage jewish emigration to a land already inhabited by a thorough majority of Arabs and maintain international oversight until such time as the Jews arrived at a majority and could thus institute self-rule by virtue of their majority population. Such a majority population was never achieved.
For your information, the League of Nations was not mandated by the United States, in fact, the Congress apposed its creation as proposed by Woodrow Wilson. Your statement clearly underlines your bias and confabulation of the always potent blame game against of the Jewish people (you call Zionist constituency) as the always evil people who killed your god. The Zionist (Jews) are Deity killers ergo they are cursed throughout their generations. The fact that they survive the deadly persecution of so many peoples and civilizations raises your ire even more.
Your imagination runs wild with your fictional scenario of a Jewish plot to take over the Arab land of Israel (there was no Palestine in history) and reference some sort of majority population and land grab by those demon Jews under a defunct Christian presidents League of Nations. You should be a propagandist for the world of Islam. I think you may have missed your calling.
That "Israel", the establishment of which was a violation of the UNs own charter, was "attacked" by it's Arab neighbors is a matter of historical question, as the "state of Israel" was a fiction from the beginning. Of course, even the Jews were not confused as to the illusiary status of their long dreamed of state, as they had prepared an army: the only way Israel could be established FROM THE BEGINNING was by forcibly removing the majority Arab inhabitants from their homes, which of course is exactly what they did.
If your fiction wasnt so ridiculous I would laugh but when you revise history in favor murderers, you show your true Christian tolerance of hate and the using of innocents to maintain your ancient Roman Mithraism Christian origins for your personal salvation. You claim that Israel was illusionary and a long dreamed of state created an army to remove the Arabs from their land. A perfect example of revisionist history altered and manufactured by lies and deceit as instructed by St. Paul of New Testament fame.
"Being crafty, I caught you with guile" ...
For if the truth of God hath more abounded through my LIE unto his glory; why yet am I also adjudged a sinner?"
St. Paul.
"What profit has not that fable of Christ brought us!
Pope Leo X.
The origins of Christianity from the ancient Roman religion of Mithraism.
http://www.ukans.edu/history/index...s/Religion/Mithraism/David_Fingrut**.html#int
" The Arab league hastily called for its member countries to send regular army troops into Palestine. They were ordered to secure only the sections of Palestine given to the Arabs under the partition plan. But these regular armies were ill-equipped and lacked any central command to coordinate their efforts
[Jordans King Abdullah] promised [the Israelis and the British] that his troops, the Arab Legion, the only real fighting force among the Arab armies, would avoids fighting with Jewish settlements
Yet Western historians record this as the moment when the young state of Israel fought off the overwhelming hordes of five Arab countries. In reality, the Israeli offensive against the Palestinians intensified." "Our Roots are Still Alive" by the Peoples Press Palestine Book Project.
The above fable is not even worth refuting for the actual events were well recorded by many non-Jewish witnesses and actual film footage made of the actual events of a few thousand Jews that fought off by some of the best trained and equipped armies of that day. Evidence refutes your fabrications.
"Menachem Begin, the Leader of the Irgun, tells how in Jerusalem, as elsewhere, we were the first to pass from the defensive to the offensive
Arabs began to flee in terror
Hagana was carrying out successful attacks on other fronts, while other Jewish forces proceeded to advance through Haifa like a knife through butter
The Israelis now allege that the Palestine war began with the entry of the Arab armies into Palestine after 15 May 1948.But that was the second phase of the war; they overlook the massacres, expulsions and dispossessions which took place prior to that date and which necessitated Arab states intervention." Sami Hadawi,"Bitter Harvest."
Your use of an Islamic propagandists twisting and turning of facts is similar to the Holocaust deniers who will also suffer for their sins against their Creator. There will be no saving grace of Christ to save you from your intolerance, hatred and envy of the Jewish people and the Creator of the universe.
Oslo was nothing more than a "declaration of purpose", which promised much, but delivered little (perhaps in part do to the sort-lived government of Rabin.) Barak's subsequent offers were a joke and an insult, offering apartheid. I supplied a site with the actual map of what was being proposed by Barak, and it clearly shows the impossibility of an Arab state that is infact broken into several isolated and easily controlable ghettos without communication and crisscrossed by Israeli checkpoints, highways, and overppasses. The fact is, Israel stepped up its colonization of Palestenian territory in the years following Oslo, as always hoping for a defacto victory rather than negotiations based on some concept of justice.
Again you find it necessary to use the deceit of St. Paul to change the OSLO war against the Jewish people as some kind of declaration of purpose which was rejected as a step toward a state for the Arabs in the land given to the Jewish people by G-d and for which the Jewish people paid for many times over with the blood of their young. I doubt that anyone but Muslims believe one word of your plagiarized statement of lies.
Any self-respecting people would jump at the chance to have self government under any assinine conditions? I think not. The Arabs agreeing to the partition in '48 would have been ridiculous. They constituted a majority of the population in both sides of the partition, and should have been given self-rule of the entire region. Anything else was nothing more than the insulting machinations of the Zionist's attempts to create a nation where there was no possible argument in its favor, beyond half-baked references to the ancient covenant. It would be comparable to native Americans saying "this land is historically ours, and making the inticing offer of splitting the US in half, one part to be governed by the native Americans, even though their population in that section only would ammount to a fraction. The Arabs were only interested in driving the jews into the sea? Give me a break. They correctly recognized the zionist threat for what it was. Here are some quotes from your founding fathers to illustrate my point.
Any self-respecting people would know that the conditions of OSLO were signed and agreed to by the Arab Arafat. But in typical style, ignored his signature and word and reverted to the Intifada which put his people into poverty, continued ignorance, pain, suffering and death. But facts appears to be way above your head.
" While the Yishuv`s leadership formally accepted the 1947 Partition Resolution, large sections of Israeli society- including
Ben Gurion- were opposed to or extremely unhappy with the partition and from early on viewed the war as an ideal opportunity to expand the new states borders beyond the UN-earmarked partition boundaries and at the expense of the Palestinians. "Israeli Historian, Benny Morris, in "Tikun", March/April 1998.
Tikkun is much like Norways WW2 Quisling traitor to his people and nation. Self hating and deprecating evil is found in all nations of the world.
In internal discussion in 1938,[David Ben-Gurion] stated that after we become a strong force, as a result of the creation of a state, we shall abolish partition and expand to the whole of Palestine
The state will only be a stage in the realization of Zionism and its task is to prepare the ground for our expansion into the whole of Palestine
In 1948, Menahem Begin declared that: The partition of the Homeland is illegal. It will never be recognized. The signature of institutions and individuals of the partition agreement is invalid. It will not bind the Jewish people. Jerusalem was and will forever be our capital. Eretz Israel (the Land of Israel) will be restored to the people of Israel. All of it. And forever. " Noam Chomsky, " The Fateful Triangle"
Same as above Tikkun Quisling Jewish Benedict Arnold.
"Even if nobody lost their land, the [Zionist] program was unjust in principle because it denied majority political rights
Zionism, in principle, could not allow the natives to exercise their political rights because it would mean the end of the Zionist enterprise."
Benjamin Beit-Hallahmi, " Original Sins"
Same as above Tikkun Quisling Jewish Benedict Arnold.
"The Zionists made no secret of their intentions, for as early as 1921,Dr. Eder, a member of the Zionist Commission, boldly told the Court of Inquiry, there can be only one National Home in Palestine, and that a Jewish one, and no equality in the partnership between Jews and Arabs, but Jewish preponderance as soon as the numbers of the race are sufficiently increased. He then asked that only Jews should be allowed to bear arms." Sami Hadawi,"Bitter Harvest."
Famous Arab propagandist quoted by Bry
As for your more polemical statements such as that I should learn to read, or that I am somehow "lying through my teeth", they are as absurd as your contention that Israel is oppressed by the Palestinians, and not vice versa. But then, it's typical of your style, as well as the overbearing style of the Zionist PACs who are always quick to cry "anti-semitism" whenever anyone makes the slightest objection to Israeli and pro-Israeli US policy. Obviously, reasonable discussion of the issues and history is not to be expected from the Zionists like yourself. Nor am I interested in your religious justifications (it turns out, the only arguments in your favor, as pathetic as that is), nor your scare-tactic hyperbolic interpretations of the Islamic text.
Your own absurd and fabricated statements prove you to be true to your NT writer, the infamous Tarsian Saul.
"Palestine belongs to the Arabs in the same sense that England belongs to the English or France to the French
What is going on in Palestine today cannot be justified by any moral code of conduct
If they [the Jews] must look to the Palestine of geography as their national home, it is wrong to enter it under the shadow of the British gun. A religious act cannot be performed with the aid of the bayonet or the bomb. They can settle in Palestine only by the goodwill of the Arabs
As it is, they are co-sharers with the British in despoiling a people who have done no wrong to them. I am not defending the Arab excesses. I wish they had chosen the way of non-violence in resisting what they rightly regard as an unacceptable encroachment upon their country. But according to the accepted canons of right and wrong, nothing can be said against the Arab resistance in the face of overwhelming odds."
Israel belongs to the current occupants of the land. The Arabs have never had a government or constitution nor do they desire the land now owned outright by the world recognized democracy of Israel. No amount of historical revisionism changes the fact that Israel is a Jewish state in a sea of Arab lands.
Mahatma Gandhi quoted in "A Land of Two Peoples" ed. Mendes-Flohr
"Albert Einstein- I should much rather see reasonable agreement with the Arabs on the basis of living together in peace than the creation of a Jewish State. Apart from practical considerations, my awareness of the essential nature of Judaism resists the idea of a Jewish state, with borders, an army, and a measure of temporal power, no matter how modest. I am afraid of the inner damage Judaism will sustain
I guess Gandhi and Einstein didn't know how to read either. Lol
The Mahatma and Albert Einstein were always right says Bry. Ignorance can be found even among the pacificists of the world. The hopes of these two men proved to be in ERROR
. History always exposes stupidity and intolerance up to the light of TRUTH.
