Israel Has Gone To The UN

[SAYIT]

Toomuchtime, I don't care what Hamas says in their banner at all.

How convenient for you. Unfortunately Israelis can only hope for the best but plan for the worst. Your sense that Hamas and for that matter, the PLO, doesn't really mean what they say and do is just your sense and, I might add, a bit of self-serving camel crap.

 

[BecauseIKnow]

Silly stuff. The single cause of all the problems is Hamas' fanatical commitment to the destruction of Israel which it calls "resistance": resistance to the existence of the Jewish state of Israel. Without this fanaticism, there would have been no "siege" and no need for a tunnel economy. All of Hamas' actions have been in support of this commitment to try to destroy Israel, "resistance" in Hamas-speak, and all of the troubles of the people of Gaza have been the result of this fanatical commitment to an unattainable goal. That makes the Hamas leadership both fanatical and incompetent.

Not at all. That destruction stuff is bs. Like I said they believe in fighting against Israeli occupation specifically when they were in Gaza and that's reasonable. They don't recognize Israel but that doesn't matter. Israel doesn't define it's borders. No Hamas hasn't been a failure, they have done a lot of hard work and Israel try's to ruin it like always. It's Israel who started the war.

You mean according to you that destruction stuff is just BS. According to the "Palestinians" and their Arab/Muslim brethren it is quite real.
The rest of your screed is just BS.

No it isn't. You just said palestinaisn are hated by their "brethren" yesterday and know you claim they actually want Israel destroyed. It's bullshit hypocrisy by you and you change your stance whenever it's fits into your argument.

 

[BecauseIKnow]

SAYIT I already explained Hamas interests currently and it's to do what's best for their people. Even Israel sees it in Hamas

 

[SAYIT]

SAYIT no one gives a **** about your repetitive spamming. I'm not saying Israel should listen to the UN. I'm saying they shouldn't cry to the UN

Of course you been screaming that Israel must listen to the UN. What do you suppose your "Israel must let the UN investigate comment meant?
As a full member of the UN, Israel is not only right to file legit complaints, it is their duty.
BTW, I'll stop posting the truth about the UN when you admit the UN is incapable of rendering justice in this conflict, and you surely speak only for yourself here, Princess..

 

[BecauseIKnow]

I already said Israel shouldn't listen to the UN nor shall they cry to them

 

[SAYIT]

from: BecauseIKnowJackshit
Abbas is a moron.

From: Sayit

You referring to anyone as "a moron" is truly the joke of the day (and one you won't get).
Congrats.

Look how many smilies this coward put out. Haha he lost the debate. Anyone that's new when SAYIT does that he is saying to himself he's full of shit and tries to divert his embarrassment

As predicted, you didn't get the joke.
Here's a clue ... you are the joke, Princess.

 

[BecauseIKnow]

Anyone can tell you posted no facts. You really aren't an Israeli. Israelis know this kind of stuff. If you don't know how to respond let others do it. I am sure there are many other intelligent and respectful people who can have a discussion like Toomuchtime...he made some good points about Abbas that I agreed with him

 

[SAYIT]

Not at all. That destruction stuff is bs. Like I said they believe in fighting against Israeli occupation specifically when they were in Gaza and that's reasonable. They don't recognize Israel but that doesn't matter. Israel doesn't define it's borders. No Hamas hasn't been a failure, they have done a lot of hard work and Israel try's to ruin it like always. It's Israel who started the war.

You mean according to you that destruction stuff is just BS. According to the "Palestinians" and their Arab/Muslim brethren it is quite real.
The rest of your screed is just BS.

No it isn't. You just said palestinaisn are hated by their "brethren" yesterday and know you claim they actually want Israel destroyed. It's bullshit hypocrisy by you and you change your stance whenever it's fits into your argument.

Yeah, when it comes to love for their "Palestinian" brethren the rest of the Arab World comes up a bit short. How else would a rational person explain those tightly constricted borders with Egypt and Jordan?
However, when it comes to hating Jews the Arab/Muslim World stands as one.
What part of the following do you not understand?
"Initiatives, and so-called peaceful solutions ... are in contradiction to the principles of the Islamic Resistance Movement...
There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad."
source: Hamas Covenant

 

[toomuchtime_]

Toomuchtime, I don't care what Hamas says in their banner at all. They do so to separate themselves from Fatah. But we all know it's bs. Hamas does nothing at all to destruct Israel. And they mean it in a diplomatic way as well. They believe in a state for two peoples as they have stated multiple times. I've seen many Hamas people as well and asked them this question and they simply stated they want rights for their people and an end to the siege. They don't want any other war. They do what's best for their people.

I have no idea what banner you are talking about. The Hamas Covenant is the founding document of the Hamas movement, much as our Declaration of Independence is the founding document of the US, and it states the beliefs and goals of the Hamas leadership in unequivocal terms.

It is a ferociously anti semitic document that states clearly Hamas' intention to capture "every inch of Palestine".

The Avalon Project : Hamas Covenant 1988

No Hamas leader has ever repudiated or modified any of its statements.

 

[SAYIT]

SAYIT I already explained Hamas interests currently and it's to do what's best for their people. Even Israel sees it in Hamas

And Hamas sees their best interests served by trying to live up to their Covenant.
What Israel sees is a terror-rat organization that the Gazans chose for their duly elected gov't.
"Initiatives, and so-called peaceful solutions ... are in contradiction to the principles of the Islamic Resistance Movement. There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad."
source: Hamas Covenant

 

[SAYIT]

I already said Israel shouldn't listen to the UN nor shall they cry to them

No you didn't. You said because Israel doesn't listen to the UN she has no right to cry to them.

 

[SAYIT]

Anyone can tell you posted no facts. You really aren't an Israeli. Israelis know this kind of stuff. If you don't know how to respond let others do it. I am sure there are many other intelligent and respectful people who can have a discussion like Toomuchtime...he made some good points about Abbas that I agreed with him

"Anyone," you pompous jackass? You can't deal with me on your own and must enlist the aid of those little munchkins dancing around in your head?
You are forced to dismiss my conclusions and the facts I post in support of them specifically because you have no facts and nothing to support your opinions.

 

[Hossfly]

SAYIT I already explained Hamas interests currently and it's to do what's best for their people. Even Israel sees it in Hamas

Since BecauseIknow "knows" everything that is happening in Gaza, could you tell us why this is happening. Is it really such a big problem that Christians live in Gaza and want to follow their beliefs without being harassed?
Persecution in Gaza

Christians face forced conversion in Gaza
By:
John Black
Posted on:
Tue, 21 Aug 2012 +0200

The small Christian community in Gaza is living in fear not because of Israeli security measures, but because of radical Islamists. In the latest episode of Muslim intimidation and abuse, recent reports out of the Hamas-run Gaza Strip indicate several Arab Christians have been abducted and forced to convert to Islam.

The Christian population in Gaza has dwindled today to somewhere between 1500-to-3000 believers, who live among an estimated 1.7 million Muslims in a crowded strip of land governed by the militant Islamic faction Hamas. Their desperate plight has hit the headlines before.

In June 2007, the Gaza Baptist Church was literally caught in the middle of the factional fighting between Hamas and Fatah when Fatah police seized the church for ‘security’ purposes and placed snipers on its roof.

In October 2007, the Palestinian Bible Society bookstore was bombed twice and its Christian manager, Rami Ayyad, was murdered in the street. Hamas authorities have yet to search for and prosecute his assailants.

Thus, Gaza’s tiny Christian flock is in danger of evaporating through emigration and forced conversions.


Converting to another faith is a very sensitive issue in the Middle East, which has a tragic history of mass forced conversions. Religion is intimately tied to one’s identity and tribal affiliation. To convert usually results in ostracism by one’s family and community. Under Hamas rule, Christians in Gaza have been oppressed and increasingly pressured to become Muslims.

“If things remain like this, there’ll be no Christians left in Gaza,” said Huda Al-Amash, mother of Ramez, 25, who was recently abducted and forced to convert to Islam.

According to sources in the Greek Orthodox Church in Gaza, Ramez Al-Amash was one of five from their congregation forced to convert in July. Ramez was kidnapped from his home and prevented from familial contact. An Islamic group released a video of Ramez declaring he had voluntarily become a Muslim.

This led to a public protest where Christians stood in the square of the ancient Church of Saint Porphyrius and angrily chanted, “Bring back Ramez!” He was united with his family the next day.

Hiba Abu Daoud and her three daughters simply disappeared one day in July. Her husband later received a mobile phone message informing him that she and her daughters had converted to Islam.


The wife and daughters soon appeared in a video, posted on a pro-Hamas website, wearing full Muslim dress. They stated: “We are living with a [Muslim] family. They bring us all we need. They teach us how to pray and everything. I love you all, I hope no one feels upset with me. It was my decision which I made months ago.”

Her husband noted that at the university she experienced intense pressure from her Muslim co-workers to convert. Family members insisted she was acting under duress.

“My daughter lived in a struggle with them. She did not do this of her own choice,” said Hiba’s mother.

“If those people joined Islam of their own will, it would not have been a problem. But they were under pressure,” added her aunt, Fain Ayyad.

Gazan Christians accuse the Hamas-affiliated Palestine Scholars Association and its chairman Salem Salama for the abductions and forced conversions of Ramez, Hiba and her daughters.

Salama responded that Christians do not face pressure to convert and that only 11 Christians have visited him to announce their conversion to Islam in the past five months.

“No one is forced to change his religion. This is the instruction of our holy book [the Quran],” Salama insisted.

Hamas also rejected the notion that anyone was being forced to convert, claiming they turned to Islam on their own free will.

Archbishop Alexios, head of the Greek Church in Gaza, is demanding the end to forced conversions and calling on the international community to intervene.

Despite the threat of reprisal attacks, his congregants staged a rare public protest in July against the recent abductions and the general persecution of Christians. Gathered in front of the Greek Orthodox Church of St. Perfidious in Gaza City, protesters rang a church bell and chanted, “With our spirit, with our blood we will sacrifice ourselves for you, Jesus.”

 

[BecauseIKnow]

You mean according to you that destruction stuff is just BS. According to the "Palestinians" and their Arab/Muslim brethren it is quite real.
The rest of your screed is just BS.

No it isn't. You just said palestinaisn are hated by their "brethren" yesterday and know you claim they actually want Israel destroyed. It's bullshit hypocrisy by you and you change your stance whenever it's fits into your argument.

Yeah, when it comes to love for their "Palestinian" brethren the rest of the Arab World comes up a bit short. How else would a rational person explain those tightly constricted borders with Egypt and Jordan?
However, when it comes to hating Jews the Arab/Muslim World stands as one.
What part of the following do you not understand?
"Initiatives, and so-called peaceful solutions ... are in contradiction to the principles of the Islamic Resistance Movement...
There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad."
source: Hamas Covenant

I never claimed that Jordan or Egypt support Palestinians. You must be speaking about another poster. Israel won the war and took land fair an square. And they will never give up the land unless someone goes and captures it back. Hamas is completely right Israel will never make land concessions unless they capture it during a war

 

[BecauseIKnow]

Hossfly my best friend in Gaza is a Christian. They aren't bothered at all with Hamas. I speak with many Christians there. They have some of the best successful businesses in Gaza. And he wasn't under pressure. You seem to have so much of a problem with people who convert to Islam. If he had converted to Judaism would you complain he was forced? Not at all

 

[BecauseIKnow]

Toomuchtime, I don't care what Hamas says in their banner at all. They do so to separate themselves from Fatah. But we all know it's bs. Hamas does nothing at all to destruct Israel. And they mean it in a diplomatic way as well. They believe in a state for two peoples as they have stated multiple times. I've seen many Hamas people as well and asked them this question and they simply stated they want rights for their people and an end to the siege. They don't want any other war. They do what's best for their people.

I have no idea what banner you are talking about. The Hamas Covenant is the founding document of the Hamas movement, much as our Declaration of Independence is the founding document of the US, and it states the beliefs and goals of the Hamas leadership in unequivocal terms.

It is a ferociously anti semitic document that states clearly Hamas' intention to capture "every inch of Palestine".

The Avalon Project : Hamas Covenant 1988

No Hamas leader has ever repudiated or modified any of its statements.

Dude Yale? They are so pro Israel and the Avalon project? Hamas doesn't need to change their statements at all. They always have to worry about a possible Israeli invasion. Hamas has stated many times its willing to go to a two state solution and willing to make a travel road from West Bank and Gaza. But netanyhau doesn't want that

 

[SAYIT]

No it isn't. You just said palestinaisn are hated by their "brethren" yesterday and know you claim they actually want Israel destroyed. It's bullshit hypocrisy by you and you change your stance whenever it's fits into your argument.

Yeah, when it comes to love for their "Palestinian" brethren the rest of the Arab World comes up a bit short. How else would a rational person explain those tightly constricted borders with Egypt and Jordan?
However, when it comes to hating Jews the Arab/Muslim World stands as one.
What part of the following do you not understand?
"Initiatives, and so-called peaceful solutions ... are in contradiction to the principles of the Islamic Resistance Movement...
There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad."
source: Hamas Covenant

I never claimed that Jordan or Egypt support Palestinians. You must be speaking about another poster. Israel won the war and took land fair an square. And they will never give up the land unless someone goes and captures it back. Hamas is completely right Israel will never make land concessions unless they capture it during a war

You just made a valid argument for Israel's case, Princess. Thank you. Armed with the knowledge that Hamas intends eternal war with Israel, wouldn't it be prudent for Israel to destroy them? Thanks again.

 

[BecauseIKnow]

Yeah, when it comes to love for their "Palestinian" brethren the rest of the Arab World comes up a bit short. How else would a rational person explain those tightly constricted borders with Egypt and Jordan?
However, when it comes to hating Jews the Arab/Muslim World stands as one.
What part of the following do you not understand?
"Initiatives, and so-called peaceful solutions ... are in contradiction to the principles of the Islamic Resistance Movement...
There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad."
source: Hamas Covenant

I never claimed that Jordan or Egypt support Palestinians. You must be speaking about another poster. Israel won the war and took land fair an square. And they will never give up the land unless someone goes and captures it back. Hamas is completely right Israel will never make land concessions unless they capture it during a war

You just made a valid argument for Israel's case, Princess. Thank you. Armed with the knowledge that Hamas intends eternal war with Israel, wouldn't it be prudent for Israel to destroy them? Thanks again.

Nope, they have no case as Israel has already bombed Hamas many times and killed many civilians. In the future the militants are gonna be capable of taking land. When Hezbollah recapture the Golan heights, you can't cry about it

It's not Hamas stance either. Doesn't matter what they wrote decades ago. They are cracking down on other militant groups. So if Israel ever decides to invade it will be aggression

 

[SAYIT]

Christians face forced conversion in Gaza
By:
John Black
Posted on:
Tue, 21 Aug 2012 +0200

The small Christian community in Gaza is living in fear not because of Israeli security measures, but because of radical Islamists. In the latest episode of Muslim intimidation and abuse, recent reports out of the Hamas-run Gaza Strip indicate several Arab Christians have been abducted and forced to convert to Islam.

The Christian population in Gaza has dwindled today to somewhere between 1500-to-3000 believers, who live among an estimated 1.7 million Muslims in a crowded strip of land governed by the militant Islamic faction Hamas. Their desperate plight has hit the headlines before.

Hossfly my best friend in Gaza is a Christian. They aren't bothered at all with Hamas. I speak with many Christians there. They have some of the best successful businesses in Gaza. And he wasn't under pressure. You seem to have so much of a problem with people who convert to Islam. If he had converted to Judaism would you complain he was forced? Not at all

That's it? That's how you explain away the conditions under which Arab/Christians are forced to live by their "peaceful" Arab/Muslim brothers?
You are a patheic dickhead, Princess. No surprise there.

 

[BecauseIKnow]

I was speaking about Gaza SAYIT. They love Gaza.