CDZ Is it Time to Break Up the FBI and CIA?

[candycorn]

Time to move the entire DOJ out from under the Executive Branch. Trump has demonstrated what a corrupt President could and can do when the investigators are under the thumb of the person they are investigating.

And place it where?

Independent federal office. We elect congressmen every 2 years. Why not put the AG and DOJ under their purview on the same short leash. If we do that, the President can’t reward the AG with favorable treatment.

So you want a DOJ outside of control of elected officials? Based upon the theory that you can't have a corrupt AG?

No. Based on the AG owing their job to the person they may have to investigate.

 

[diver52]

Time to move the entire DOJ out from under the Executive Branch. Trump has demonstrated what a corrupt President could and can do when the investigators are under the thumb of the person they are investigating.

And place it where?

Independent federal office. We elect congressmen every 2 years. Why not put the AG and DOJ under their purview on the same short leash. If we do that, the President can’t reward the AG with favorable treatment.

So you want a DOJ outside of control of elected officials? Based upon the theory that you can't have a corrupt AG?

No. Based on the AG owing their job to the person they may have to investigate.

Luckily, it's a non-issue.

 

[task0778]

The FBI has been corrupt to the core for decades....Just ask Howie Carr, who has covered a slew of its corruption in the New England area.

Should be abolished altogether, along with the DEA and BATF.

And replace them with what? Does any reasonable person believe this country can get along without an investigative agency for federal crimes? Or an Intelligence agency that tries to get information about what our enemies are up to? No DEA? Really? How about ICE? Get rid of that too?

The problem with these agencies is not within them but without: the oversight and executive control is lacking, and today's judicial branch doesn't have the authority or maybe it's the balls to rein in the various Executive agencies. Some of that is due to the irresponsible and cowardly inaction on the part of the Legislative Branch who obviously isn't doing their job, and has virtually surrendered much of their power to the President. But the answer is not to abolish those agencies but rather to make sure they are run properly.

 

[Oddball]

The FBI has been corrupt to the core for decades....Just ask Howie Carr, who has covered a slew of its corruption in the New England area.

Should be abolished altogether, along with the DEA and BATF.

And replace them with what? Does any reasonable person believe this country can get along without an investigative agency for federal crimes? Or an Intelligence agency that tries to get information about what our enemies are up to? No DEA? Really? How about ICE? Get rid of that too?

The problem with these agencies is not within them but without: the oversight and executive control is lacking, and today's judicial branch doesn't have the authority or maybe it's the balls to rein in the various Executive agencies. Some of that is due to the irresponsible and cowardly inaction on the part of the Legislative Branch who obviously isn't doing their job, and has virtually surrendered much of their power to the President. But the answer is not to abolish those agencies but rather to make sure they are run properly.

What do you replace a malignant tumor with?

 

[task0778]

The FBI has been corrupt to the core for decades....Just ask Howie Carr, who has covered a slew of its corruption in the New England area.

Should be abolished altogether, along with the DEA and BATF.

And replace them with what? Does any reasonable person believe this country can get along without an investigative agency for federal crimes? Or an Intelligence agency that tries to get information about what our enemies are up to? No DEA? Really? How about ICE? Get rid of that too?

The problem with these agencies is not within them but without: the oversight and executive control is lacking, and today's judicial branch doesn't have the authority or maybe it's the balls to rein in the various Executive agencies. Some of that is due to the irresponsible and cowardly inaction on the part of the Legislative Branch who obviously isn't doing their job, and has virtually surrendered much of their power to the President. But the answer is not to abolish those agencies but rather to make sure they are run properly.

What do you replace a malignant tumor with?

You don't, you surgically remove it and you don't replace it. You can't do that with the above named agencies.

You dodged the question. The functions that these and other federal executive branch agencies must be performed. So, how do you plan on doing that, or do you really think those functions are unnecessary?

 

[Oddball]

The FBI has been corrupt to the core for decades....Just ask Howie Carr, who has covered a slew of its corruption in the New England area.

Should be abolished altogether, along with the DEA and BATF.

And replace them with what? Does any reasonable person believe this country can get along without an investigative agency for federal crimes? Or an Intelligence agency that tries to get information about what our enemies are up to? No DEA? Really? How about ICE? Get rid of that too?

The problem with these agencies is not within them but without: the oversight and executive control is lacking, and today's judicial branch doesn't have the authority or maybe it's the balls to rein in the various Executive agencies. Some of that is due to the irresponsible and cowardly inaction on the part of the Legislative Branch who obviously isn't doing their job, and has virtually surrendered much of their power to the President. But the answer is not to abolish those agencies but rather to make sure they are run properly.

What do you replace a malignant tumor with?

You don't, you surgically remove it and you don't replace it. You can't do that with the above named agencies.

You dodged the question. The functions that these and other federal executive branch agencies must be performed. So, how do you plan on doing that, or do you really think those functions are unnecessary?

Devolve those functions to state agencies....Y'know, the "conservative" (whatever the hell that's supposed to mean anymore) thing to do.

 

[Natural Citizen]

Abolish them. We have justice departments within our states.

 

[Natural Citizen]

Devolve those functions to state agencies....Y'know, the "conservative" (whatever the hell that's supposed to mean anymore) thing to do.

Ha. You beat me to it.

 

[MarathonMike]

Agreed, there is nothing mystical about the FBI and the CIA that must be handled at the Federal level. And now that it is clear they are both compromised, they are doing a disservice to the country.

They really MUST be dissolved because you cannot have partisan intelligence. You just can't. The temptation to use the power of the intelligence agencies for political gain is too great. As we have seen these last 3 years.

 

[task0778]

The FBI has been corrupt to the core for decades....Just ask Howie Carr, who has covered a slew of its corruption in the New England area.

Should be abolished altogether, along with the DEA and BATF.

And replace them with what? Does any reasonable person believe this country can get along without an investigative agency for federal crimes? Or an Intelligence agency that tries to get information about what our enemies are up to? No DEA? Really? How about ICE? Get rid of that too?

The problem with these agencies is not within them but without: the oversight and executive control is lacking, and today's judicial branch doesn't have the authority or maybe it's the balls to rein in the various Executive agencies. Some of that is due to the irresponsible and cowardly inaction on the part of the Legislative Branch who obviously isn't doing their job, and has virtually surrendered much of their power to the President. But the answer is not to abolish those agencies but rather to make sure they are run properly.

What do you replace a malignant tumor with?

You don't, you surgically remove it and you don't replace it. You can't do that with the above named agencies.

You dodged the question. The functions that these and other federal executive branch agencies must be performed. So, how do you plan on doing that, or do you really think those functions are unnecessary?

Devolve those functions to state agencies....Y'know, the "conservative" (whatever the hell that's supposed to mean anymore) thing to do.

Have you guys thought this through? You want 50 different state agencies determining who broke what federal laws? We got federal laws, right? That apply to every America citizen regardless of where they live. What are you going to do, abolish all federal laws too? Might as well, since you won't have an FBI, US Marshal's Office and every other federal law enforcement agency in existence.

So tell me, what are you going to do when a neighboring state with different laws and lacking enough enforcement resources has gangs coming into your state, doing whatever they want, and the returning to their state? You gonna have your state militia gear up and start a war?

You want 50 state agencies guarding the southern border and processing immigrants into the US? You want 50 different state agencies doing what the DEA, ICE, and BATF does? Yeah, I can see that working out, with 50 different interpretations and enforcement of various laws regarding interstate commerce. We wouldn't have a United States any more, we'd have 50 sovereign states doing their own thing.

 

[Oddball]

The FBI has been corrupt to the core for decades....Just ask Howie Carr, who has covered a slew of its corruption in the New England area.

Should be abolished altogether, along with the DEA and BATF.

And replace them with what? Does any reasonable person believe this country can get along without an investigative agency for federal crimes? Or an Intelligence agency that tries to get information about what our enemies are up to? No DEA? Really? How about ICE? Get rid of that too?

The problem with these agencies is not within them but without: the oversight and executive control is lacking, and today's judicial branch doesn't have the authority or maybe it's the balls to rein in the various Executive agencies. Some of that is due to the irresponsible and cowardly inaction on the part of the Legislative Branch who obviously isn't doing their job, and has virtually surrendered much of their power to the President. But the answer is not to abolish those agencies but rather to make sure they are run properly.

What do you replace a malignant tumor with?

You don't, you surgically remove it and you don't replace it. You can't do that with the above named agencies.

You dodged the question. The functions that these and other federal executive branch agencies must be performed. So, how do you plan on doing that, or do you really think those functions are unnecessary?

Devolve those functions to state agencies....Y'know, the "conservative" (whatever the hell that's supposed to mean anymore) thing to do.

Have you guys thought this through? You want 50 different state agencies determining who broke what federal laws? We got federal laws, right? That apply to every America citizen regardless of where they live. What are you going to do, abolish all federal laws too? Might as well, since you won't have an FBI, US Marshal's Office and every other federal law enforcement agency in existence.

So tell me, what are you going to do when a neighboring state with different laws and lacking enough enforcement resources has gangs coming into your state, doing whatever they want, and the returning to their state? You gonna have your state militia gear up and start a war?

You want 50 state agencies guarding the southern border and processing immigrants into the US? You want 50 different state agencies doing what the DEA, ICE, and BATF does? Yeah, I can see that working out, with 50 different interpretations and enforcement of various laws regarding interstate commerce. We wouldn't have a United States any more, we'd have 50 sovereign states doing their own thing.

That's a level of hysteria and hyperbole I'm used to from the libs.

 

[task0778]

And replace them with what? Does any reasonable person believe this country can get along without an investigative agency for federal crimes? Or an Intelligence agency that tries to get information about what our enemies are up to? No DEA? Really? How about ICE? Get rid of that too?

The problem with these agencies is not within them but without: the oversight and executive control is lacking, and today's judicial branch doesn't have the authority or maybe it's the balls to rein in the various Executive agencies. Some of that is due to the irresponsible and cowardly inaction on the part of the Legislative Branch who obviously isn't doing their job, and has virtually surrendered much of their power to the President. But the answer is not to abolish those agencies but rather to make sure they are run properly.

What do you replace a malignant tumor with?

You don't, you surgically remove it and you don't replace it. You can't do that with the above named agencies.

You dodged the question. The functions that these and other federal executive branch agencies must be performed. So, how do you plan on doing that, or do you really think those functions are unnecessary?

Devolve those functions to state agencies....Y'know, the "conservative" (whatever the hell that's supposed to mean anymore) thing to do.

Have you guys thought this through? You want 50 different state agencies determining who broke what federal laws? We got federal laws, right? That apply to every America citizen regardless of where they live. What are you going to do, abolish all federal laws too? Might as well, since you won't have an FBI, US Marshal's Office and every other federal law enforcement agency in existence.

So tell me, what are you going to do when a neighboring state with different laws and lacking enough enforcement resources has gangs coming into your state, doing whatever they want, and the returning to their state? You gonna have your state militia gear up and start a war?

You want 50 state agencies guarding the southern border and processing immigrants into the US? You want 50 different state agencies doing what the DEA, ICE, and BATF does? Yeah, I can see that working out, with 50 different interpretations and enforcement of various laws regarding interstate commerce. We wouldn't have a United States any more, we'd have 50 sovereign states doing their own thing.

That's a level of hysteria and hyperbole I'm used to from the libs.

Ok, now get serious and tell me how you envision the FBI, DEA, ICE, and rest of them working at the state level. Cuz I'm not seeing it. How are they managed? How are they funded? State level, doesn't that mean under the control of the state governor? You said 'devolve them into state agencies', right? Tell me how that works.

 

[JimBowie1958]

What these folks need is to be supported in a very difficult job and listened to. Not automatically attacked because they are saying something we don't want to hear.

No.

When they leak highly classified phone calls between the President and foreign leaders they damage American relations and the ability of future Presidents to conduct foreign policy.

Who wants to talk in confidence to an American President that might publish the transcript?

This is TREASON, Period. End of Story and this asshat should be put up against a wall and shot, if you ask me.

He is a traitor to his government and the American people who entrusted him..

 

[diver52]

What these folks need is to be supported in a very difficult job and listened to. Not automatically attacked because they are saying something we don't want to hear.

No.

When they leak highly classified phone calls between the President and foreign leaders they damage American relations and the ability of future Presidents to conduct foreign policy.

Who wants to talk in confidence to an American President that might publish the transcript?

This is TREASON, Period. End of Story and this asshat should be put up against a wall and shot, if you ask me.

He is a traitor to his government and the American people who entrusted him..

It isn't treason and the individual followed the law to the letter. He did exactly what he was supposed to do.

And you are assuming the leaks came from the intelligence people when there were quite a few others aware of those calls. Most of them with their own agendas and the president doesn't hold integrity as a big issue when he hires. The current WH has always leaked like a seive. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if Trump leaked the calls.

 

[JimBowie1958]

It isn't treason and the individual followed the law to the letter. He did exactly what he was supposed to do.

He had third hand information about a legal phone call with a foreign head of state about completely legal things.

He is supposed to protect classified information and not blab it to the intel committee simply to give political advantage to his favorite candidate.

but that is the mindset of Praetorians to ignore their primary duty to the head of state and engage in king maker activity instead. The treasonous jerk should be shot.

And you are assuming the leaks came from the intelligence people when there were quite a few others aware of those calls. Most of them with their own agendas and the president doesn't hold integrity as a big issue when he hires.

The people who told him the classified information are as guilty as he is of leaking information.

The current WH has always leaked like a seive. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if Trump leaked the calls.

Well, we agree there. Trump is a very cagey person and has been known to leak such things to manipulate his opponents. But the president has the inherent right as the top classifier of information to do this. He may have made some outrageous statement to Party A, who then told Group B at the WH and then the WB picked it up from them.

Trump may have done this trying to cross index leakers or to distract the Woke Left to go in a direction away from what he does not want discussed.

 

[sartre play]

Maybe a little overkill? Improvements needed yes, as long everything is about winning instead of working together finding the best solutions, ones that work for the many & not the few with the big bucks & the powerful connections things will not improve.

 

[diver52]

It isn't treason and the individual followed the law to the letter. He did exactly what he was supposed to do.

He had third hand information about a legal phone call with a foreign head of state about completely legal things.

He is supposed to protect classified information and not blab it to the intel committee simply to give political advantage to his favorite candidate.

but that is the mindset of Praetorians to ignore their primary duty to the head of state and engage in king maker activity instead. The treasonous jerk should be shot.
QUOTE]

He followed the letter of the law. He didn't blab it, he reported what he deemed a problem to the IG - in accordance with the law. The IG investigated it and determined it was a problem that needed to be reported to Congress - in accordance with the law.

These people don't have a primary duty to the head of state. This is not Russia. The oath of office is to the Constitution.

 

[koshergrl]

Since Trumps taking the oath of office, we have had three leaks of Presidential phone conversation between Trump and the heads of state of Australia, Mexico, and now a conversation with the President of the Ukraine, a critical ally along the border with Russia.

This is treason, to betray this confidence and it is coming out of the CIA. Period.

The CIA is privy to the Presidents phone calls and the heads of the CIA know that some of their staffers are hostile to this President and they assign them to the WH to get them to betray the US President for the purposes of getting 'actionable' dirt on him.

The CIA and the FBI for similar reasons, have become a modern version of the old Roman Empire's Praetorian Guard.

Many have called for the dismantling of the CIA, from JFK, to Truman, to former Reagan staffers, and even Bernie Sanders who one would think would one day plan to use it, lol.

There are many problems with running career elite central government 'protectors'. Like the Roman Praetorians, after a while you have to figure out who protects you from your protectors.

Now, I do not think that the functions of the CIA are to be completely abolished, I just think they should be broken up into about 12 different agencies. They should cover one different agency for each continent, one for space, one for economic interests, one for satellite analysis, one for corporate entanglements, one for human rights, and one to give briefings to the President and report back to an umbrella group that pools data, and the last one being a group who oversees intelligence related to Presidential foreign trips to provide security, logistics, etc. Not that exact number is necessary, but just the general idea of breaking the CIA into multiple rival agencies that wont be so cooperative or as dominant as the CIA is today.

We don't need an intel agency that a Senate Majority Leader would feel a need to warn his political rivals about 'being careful around'.

The CIA is too Big to Let Run Loose.

I have said for years that we need to eliminate all the agencies, including the usda, the dept. of the interior etc. They were all, every one of them, created to sidestep the constitution on behalf of corrupt politicians.

I also said, years ago, that the democrats were going to arm and use the usfs to prevent us from being able to move around easily and in fact to gun us down if need be.

And that is exactly what they will do.

They have a lot more faith in the agency idiots than they should

 

[JimBowie1958]

Geraldo Rivera: "This Poor President," His Whole Tenure In Office Defined By "Snitches And Rats And Backstabbers"

GERALDO RIVERA (FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT): After listening to the Democrats, they believe that they have it now.

That everything else, Russia collusion, Stormy Daniels, taxes, making money on hotels, and all that. They are going to put everything away and they are going to laser focus on this. This is gonna be what the impeachment is all about, maybe one or two little other things fall in.

So it’s going to be the president of the United States in a conversation that was intercepted by a rotten snitch -- I’d love to wap him, but that’s another story.

Imagine this poor president, his whole tenure in office has been marked by snitches, and rats, and backstabbers, it’s amazing how he functions at all.​

 

[diver52]

Geraldo Rivera: "This Poor President," His Whole Tenure In Office Defined By "Snitches And Rats And Backstabbers"

GERALDO RIVERA (FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT): After listening to the Democrats, they believe that they have it now.

That everything else, Russia collusion, Stormy Daniels, taxes, making money on hotels, and all that. They are going to put everything away and they are going to laser focus on this. This is gonna be what the impeachment is all about, maybe one or two little other things fall in.

So it’s going to be the president of the United States in a conversation that was intercepted by a rotten snitch -- I’d love to wap him, but that’s another story.

Imagine this poor president, his whole tenure in office has been marked by snitches, and rats, and backstabbers, it’s amazing how he functions at all.​

Yep. The man really knows how to hire the best people.