Is Israel the Same as South Africa?

[ForeverYoung436]

Yeah but God took it back because they wouldn't behave.

They're behaving now so all is forgiven And that's a fact, Jack.

I thought the Messiah was to call his people back to the promised land not a bunch of criminals out of Europe.

By the Messiah, are you talking about the Jewish one or the Christian one? If you're talking about the Jewish one, the Jewish people have to lay the groundwork and come back to the Promised Land, before the Messiah comes, according to most Rabbinic opinions.

 

[georgephillip]

Right of Conquest, with the covert, tacit approval of The West, allowing it to stand, because we like them better than you. No further explanation is necessary.

The right of conquest expired with your pal Hitler.
Maybe you should tell Bibi?

Does anyone think that Georgie Boy is brave enough to tell China to get out of Tibet or to Turkey to stop occupying part of Cyprus. Maybe he can get Calypso Louis Farrakhan to help him.

I'm brave enough to condemn China's occupation of Tibet and Turkey's genocide against Armenians while holding my country to the same standards in Afghanistan and Korea. What's Hossie afraid of?

 

[MHunterB]

Rocco, I find a basic dishonesty in virtually ALL 'pro-Palestinian' arguments is that what they are really arguing is not 'Israel is behaving poorly' - but "Israel should not exist at all".

While that remains their basic sentiment, I truly don't see any point in 'discussion' or 'negotiation' with them (HAMAS, PLO, etc) than there'd have been with the Nazis - OR with the Christians who piously herded our ancestors into church to hear the 'Good Friday' calumny against themselves for deicide, and the concomitant demands to convert.......

 

[Hossfly]

The right of conquest expired with your pal Hitler.
Maybe you should tell Bibi?

Does anyone think that Georgie Boy is brave enough to tell China to get out of Tibet or to Turkey to stop occupying part of Cyprus. Maybe he can get Calypso Louis Farrakhan to help him.

I'm brave enough to condemn China's occupation of Tibet and Turkey's genocide against Armenians while holding my country to the same standards in Afghanistan and Korea. What's Hossie afraid of?

Truthfully, Hossfly is deathly afraid of the scourge of Islam and Sharia.

 

[Hossfly]

I'm thinking that the whole reason for this thread is that Georgie boy want to fantasize about himself being like Nelson Mandela.....

I understand that G-boy is a male of African ancestry: I think that's as far as it goes, isn't it????

I think it goes deeper than this, Marg. I believe that Georgie Boy needs scapegoats in his life and is just using the Arabs as pawns. Do you really think he cares about the Arabs except to use them in his fight against the Jews? You probably realize how Calypso Louis Farakhan goes on and on about the Jews. Georgie Boy is really no different.

 

[georgephillip]

georgephillip, et al,

So as I understand it, the allegation is that the UK used the Balfour Declaration as a tool to introduce British Colonial power (English imperial ambitions) to the Middle East. And you are using a single comment by Sir Ronald Storrs ("a little loyal Jewish Ulster") as the foundation for that allegation.

georgephillip, et al,

This sounds really special, but I still don't know what it means.


(COMMENT)

So make it clear for an old man. What is your theory and allegation?

Most Respectfully,
R

This old man remembers how the daily violence between Catholics and Protestants in Northern Ireland in 1969 sometimes trumped the daily body count in South Vietnam; the Irish mayhem began in 1609 when an English king evicted two large Catholic clans from north Ireland and replaced them with 20,000 Protestants from England and Scotland, founding the Plantation of Ulster.

My allegation is confirmed by the first British Governor of Jerusalem:

"Sir Ronald Storrs, the first Governor of Jerusalem, certainly had no illusions about what a 'Jewish homeland' in Palestine meant for the British Empire: 'It will form for England,' he said, 'a little loyal Jewish Ulster in a sea of potentially hostile Arabism.'”

British Capitalists used the power of the state to pit one religion against another in Ireland and Palestine. I don't know that I would call it "special" or not, Rocco, but it's certainly obvious to this old man how the English invented the tactic of using foreign settlers to drive a wedge between colonial rulers and an indigenous population, be it Arab or Irish.

Divide and Conquer as Imperial Rules - FPIF

(COMMENT)

I'm not sure I see any evidence for Post WWII "English imperial ambitions."

But you are sure getting your monies worth from of this one comment out of Sir Ronald.

Most Respectfully,
R

Post WWII the English chose Democracy over Empire and stood aside for the greatest purveyor of violence in the world to take control of western imperial ambitions, particularly in the Middle East:

"To review briefly some of the relevant history: During World War II, US planners recognized that the US would emerge from the war in a position of overwhelming power.

"It is quite clear from the documentary record that 'President Roosevelt was aiming at United States hegemony in the postwar world,' to quote the assessment of diplomatic historian Geoffrey Warner.

"Plans were developed to control what was called a Grand Area, a region encompassing the Western Hemisphere, the Far East, the former British empire -- including the crucial Middle East oil reserves -- and as much of Eurasia as possible, or at the very least its core industrial regions in Western Europe and the southern European states.

"The latter were regarded as essential for ensuring control of Middle East energy resources. Within these expansive domains, the US was to maintain 'unquestioned power' with 'military and economic supremacy,' while ensuring the 'limitation of any exercise of sovereignty' by states that might interfere with its global designs.

"The doctrines still prevail, though their reach has declined."

American Decline: Causes and Consequences

 

[georgephillip]

You, folks, drivel, of course, the magnificient me talk.

Talk of what, genocide or ethnic cleansing? What do you have to say about this?
"The Peel Commission of 1937 was the first to propose a two-state solution to the conflict, whereby Palestine would be divided into two states: one Arab state and one Jewish state.
"The Jewish state would include the coastal plain, Jezreel Valley, Beit She'an and the Galilee, while the Arab state would include Transjordan, Judea and Samaria, the Jordan Valley, and the Negev.
"The 2 main Jewish leaders, Chaim Weizmann and David Ben-Gurion had convinced the Zionist Congress to approve equivocally the Peel recommendations as a basis for more negotiation. [20] [21] [22]
"The Arab leadership in Palestine rejected the conclusions and refused to share any land in Palestine with the Jewish population.
"The rejection of the Peel Commission's proposal by The Arabs led to the establishment of the Woodhead Commission, which rejected the proposal of the Peel Commission as non-applicable.
"In May 1939 the British government released a new policy paper which sought to implement a one-state solution in Palestine, significantly reduced the number of Jewish immigrants allowed to enter Palestine by establishing a quota for Jewish immigration which was set by the British government in the short-term and which would be set by the Arab leadership in the long-term.

Arab fault, indeed! But they didn't forget to drop in on jewish development, of course, and with appetites growing decided to redistribute jewish stuff.

...History of the Israeli?Palestinian conflict - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

That leftista-mccarthyista Sternhell et.al..

What "historic goal" are Jews seeking in Palestine, Drivel, the same one Nazis sought in Poland?

Drivelaggio.

Maybe Herr Drivel seeks the same goals in Palestine that Winnie sought in Ireland?

"It was 'divide and conquer' that made it possible for an insignificant island in the north of Europe to rule the world. Division and chaos, tribal, religious and ethnic hatred, were the secret to empire. Guns and artillery were always in the background in case things went awry, but in fact, it rarely came to that.

"It would appear the Israelis have paid close attention to English colonial policy because their policies in the Occupied Territories bear a distressing resemblance to Ireland under the Penal Laws.

"The Israeli Knesset recently prevented Palestinians married to Arab Israelis from acquiring citizenship, a page lifted almost directly from the 1692 laws.

"Israeli human rights activist Yael Stein called the action 'racist,' and Knesset member Zeeva Galon said it denied 'the fundamental right of Arab Israelis to start families.'

"Even the U.S. is uncomfortable with the legislation. 'The new law,' said U.S. State Department spokesman Phillip Reeker, 'singles out one group for different treatment than others.'”

"Which, of course, was the whole point."

Divide and Conquer as Imperial Rules - FPIF

 

[docmauser1]

Talk of what, genocide or ethnic cleansing? What do you have to say about this?
"The Peel Commission of 1937 was the first to propose a two-state solution to the conflict, whereby Palestine would be divided into two states: one Arab state and one Jewish state.
"The Jewish state would include the coastal plain, Jezreel Valley, Beit She'an and the Galilee, while the Arab state would include Transjordan, Judea and Samaria, the Jordan Valley, and the Negev.
"The 2 main Jewish leaders, Chaim Weizmann and David Ben-Gurion had convinced the Zionist Congress to approve equivocally the Peel recommendations as a basis for more negotiation. [20] [21] [22]
"The Arab leadership in Palestine rejected the conclusions and refused to share any land in Palestine with the Jewish population.
"The rejection of the Peel Commission's proposal by The Arabs led to the establishment of the Woodhead Commission, which rejected the proposal of the Peel Commission as non-applicable.
"In May 1939 the British government released a new policy paper which sought to implement a one-state solution in Palestine, significantly reduced the number of Jewish immigrants allowed to enter Palestine by establishing a quota for Jewish immigration which was set by the British government in the short-term and which would be set by the Arab leadership in the long-term.

Arab fault, indeed! But they didn't forget to drop in on jewish development, of course, and with appetites growing decided to redistribute jewish stuff.That leftista-mccarthyista Sternhell et.al..

What "historic goal" are Jews seeking in Palestine, Drivel, the same one Nazis sought in Poland?

Drivelaggio.

Maybe Herr Drivel seeks the same goals in Palestine that Winnie sought in Ireland?

Drivellaggio.

... "It would appear the Israelis have paid close attention to English colonial policy because their policies in the Occupied Territories bear a distressing resemblance to Ireland under the Penal Laws....
fpif.org FPIF

"Foreign Policy in Focus", a project of the "Institute For Policy Studies" - a leftozaurus prancing in between the extreme civil rights movements to the feminist and gay rights movements . Why would our honorable georgephillip pick one the gayest dumps to fish garbage from?

 

[Kondor3]

"...Post WWII the English chose Democracy over Empire..."

Correction...

Post-WWII, the English had bled themselves white during two world wars within 25 years of each other, and become bankrupt, and their cities lay largely in shambles, and they needed to rebuild, and could no longer afford an empire, which they had tapped deeply in order to stay alive during those two world wars. They had reached their limit on their credit cards.

So they walked away from their Empire; not by choice, but forced to do so by circumstances.

Chose? Nonsense.

 

[RoccoR]

Kondor3, georgephillip, et al,

At the end of WWII, there was this phase of "neo-colonialism, the last stage of "imperialism;" or as some would say, "Post-Colonialism."

"...Post WWII the English chose Democracy over Empire..."

Correction...

Post-WWII, the English had bled themselves white during two world wars within 25 years of each other, and become bankrupt, and their cities lay largely in shambles, and they needed to rebuild, and could no longer afford an empire, which they had tapped deeply in order to stay alive during those two world wars. They had reached their limit on their credit cards.

So they walked away from their Empire; not by choice, but forced to do so by circumstances.

Chose? Nonsense.

(COMMENT)

Clearly, colonial holdings had to pay for themselves. Yes, --- the was a strong economic component as our friend "Kondor3" suggests. While the major colonial powers were willing to pay a certain amount in the maintenance and upkeep of their individual realms, there was this emerging concept of "self-determination" and the move to divest holdings. The replacement to colonial outposts was the movement of the Allied Powers towards small, regional hegemonies. Which is not the same thing as a colony. The US and Soviet Union were the first to establish a network of regional hegemonies; which many saw as the latent framework behind the "Cold War."

Today, while there are still a few protectorates and unincorporated territories (the US having a half dozen or so), most of the vestiges of colonialism are gone. The Allied Powers and World Associate Powers have either political-military hegemonies, political-economic hegemonies, or regional defense pacts alliances. There are a few cartels (which mimic political-economic mechanisms), but by and large, they are single economic commodity based; not with the capacity to align defensively against an aggressor. Kuwait was an example of a cartel member that was exceptionally strong economically, but unable to defend itself regionally.

France tried to maintain some of its colonial holdings after WWII, but found it beyond their capability; most notably was Indochina.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[georgephillip]

"...Post WWII the English chose Democracy over Empire..."

Correction...

Post-WWII, the English had bled themselves white during two world wars within 25 years of each other, and become bankrupt, and their cities lay largely in shambles, and they needed to rebuild, and could no longer afford an empire, which they had tapped deeply in order to stay alive during those two world wars. They had reached their limit on their credit cards.

So they walked away from their Empire; not by choice, but forced to do so by circumstances.

Chose? Nonsense.

It was Empire which bled England into two world wars and it was Empire the English chose to walk away from in 1945, not that the greatest purveyor of violence in the world would have tolerated any "Nonsense" to the contrary. (Ask the Greeks)

 

[Hossfly]

"...Post WWII the English chose Democracy over Empire..."

Correction...

Post-WWII, the English had bled themselves white during two world wars within 25 years of each other, and become bankrupt, and their cities lay largely in shambles, and they needed to rebuild, and could no longer afford an empire, which they had tapped deeply in order to stay alive during those two world wars. They had reached their limit on their credit cards.

So they walked away from their Empire; not by choice, but forced to do so by circumstances.

Chose? Nonsense.

It was Empire which bled England into two world wars and it was Empire the English chose to walk away from in 1945, not that the greatest purveyor of violence in the world would have tolerated any "Nonsense" to the contrary. (Ask the Greeks)

Are you still here, Georgie Boy? How can you stand to live in a country that you consider "the greatest purveyor of violence in the world" when you can take your measly social security check and go live in some backwards country where you would be able to live like a king. Say, since Georgie Boy has Commie ideas, maybe he can ask that kid who runs North Korea if he can be his valet and then perhaps be able to partake some of the perks that kid gets. If Georgie Boy can pull this off, he will finally experience some of the finer things in life that it appears he missed out on.

Kim Jong Un's Luxurious 'Seven-Star' Lifestyle Of Yachts, Booze And Food

 

[toastman]

I stopped reading his posts while ago. I can't stand them anymore. All he does is copy pastes paragraphs from articles, and follows it up with a snarky remark.....

George, we want to hear YOUR opinion ! Do you have any ?!!?!!?!?

 

[georgephillip]

I stopped reading his posts while ago. I can't stand them anymore. All he does is copy pastes paragraphs from articles, and follows it up with a snarky remark.....

George, we want to hear YOUR opinion ! Do you have any ?!!?!!?!?

USA!
USA!!
USA!!!

Sufficiently snarky?

 

[toastman]

I stopped reading his posts while ago. I can't stand them anymore. All he does is copy pastes paragraphs from articles, and follows it up with a snarky remark.....

George, we want to hear YOUR opinion ! Do you have any ?!!?!!?!?

USA!
USA!!
USA!!!

Sufficiently snarky?

I mean, the occasional copy/paste is fine, but I'm interested in your opinion !
So give it to use more often.

I don't mind if you continue with the snarky remarks though

 

[georgephillip]

There was no shortage of proud white racists who felt entitled to be racists in the US or South Africa during the middle of the 20th century; those private sentiments were reflected in the public statements of elected leaders, city mayors, for example:

"The recent brouhaha over comments made by Upper Nazareth mayor Shimon Gapso has intensified with a tongue-in-cheek op-ed Gapso published yesterday in Haaretz. Of course, anti-Zionists—for an array of reasons (moral, ethical, hateful or ignorant)—have long charged Israel’s governing ideology with being racist at its core. So is Gapso any more racist than Zionism would predict from a holder of public office in Israel?"

"In some ways, it’s a blogger’s dream when a public figure doesn’t deny a label thrust on him (on charges of racism, Gapso may be all the wiser thanks to the musical Avenue Q), but instead cuts right to the chase: if he’s a racist, so is the entire Zionist project."

Israeli Mayor: If I'm Racist, So Is Israel - The Daily Beast

If the entire Zionist project is racist to its core, why should the US continue funding a violent, vindictive ethnocracy in the Middle East without any O-I-L?

 

[Kondor3]

Ummmmm... because we like Jews better than we like Muslims?

It's not about race - it's about religion - and symmetry - and the lack thereof.

 

[georgephillip]

Ummmmm... because we like Jews better than we like Muslims?

It's not about race - it's about religion - and symmetry - and the lack thereof.

Actually, it's about the settler-colonialist mentality and the (war) profits that flow from ethnic transfers of indigenous populations.

"Symmetry (from Greek συμμετρεῖν symmetreín 'to measure together') has two meanings. The first is a vague sense of harmonious and beautiful proportion and balance.[1][2] The second is an exact mathematical "patterned self-similarity" that can be demonstrated with the rules of a formal system, such as geometry or physics."

???

 

[Kondor3]

Ummmmm... because we like Jews better than we like Muslims?

It's not about race - it's about religion - and symmetry - and the lack thereof.

"Actually, it's about the settler-colonialist mentality and the (war) profits that flow from ethnic transfers of indigenous populations..."

That too... sounds like fun...

 

[georgephillip]

Ummmmm... because we like Jews better than we like Muslims?

It's not about race - it's about religion - and symmetry - and the lack thereof.

"Actually, it's about the settler-colonialist mentality and the (war) profits that flow from ethnic transfers of indigenous populations..."

That too... sounds like fun...

How does "symmetry" factor into your fun?