Internet sales tax? yea or nay?

[Dot Com]

That's the law. If you don't remit the tax, you're breaking the rules. Just because you choose to engage in criminal activity doesn't mean you get to call ignoring the law a 'loophole'. It's not, it's a crime. But you try telling the IRS you only took advantage of a 'loophole'...see how that works out...



From businesses in other states. Pass.



Incorrect. It's a tremendous burden. Dealing with one state is bad enough, but 50...plus the differences in county and city taxes? It will kill small internet businesses ensuring more too-big-to-fail companies dominate. Wonderful. But frankly, even if it were not a burden, state A has no damn business demanding anything from businesses in state B.

Again, pass.

It will be software driven, remember we are talking about internet sales. Every online retailer already uses marketing software that drives the web pages, identifies the items to be ordered, calculates the sum, determines if the shipping address is in the same state and if so calculates the sales tax (if out of state no sales tax). The transaction is passed to the accounting ledger where the transaction is processed for payment (or billing as the case may be).

Amazon already has Tax Collection Services available right now for it's websellers. You will see more of that and someone enterprising programers will implement a "clearinghouse" type of service that integrates with the Marketing/Accounting software packages used by online retailers. Every night the sellers computers will dump a file to the clearinghouse, the clearing house will then format the date and report it electronically to the required state and will remit the required tax via EFT. The original seller will would have very little burden except to sign-up and pay for the clearing houses services. Same type of thing that businesses are already doing with accountants, temp agencies, payroll agencies, ISP's, etc.

Remember, truly small businesses aren't going to have to worry about it unless their total sales for the preceding year exceeded a million dollars.



>>>>

Thereby ensuring no one competes with Amazon. My goodness, you guys that always seem to hate giant corporations sure do advocate for laws that protect the big guys from competition.

Again, pass.

I have also already indicated that smaller businesses will be exempt as well WITH CITATIONS & that amazon already pays tax because it has many distribution centers but some people don't want to listen

For the record: How many citations/links have the detractors like eflatminor & skullpilot provided thus far?

 

[WorldWatcher]

That's the law. If you don't remit the tax, you're breaking the rules. Just because you choose to engage in criminal activity doesn't mean you get to call ignoring the law a 'loophole'. It's not, it's a crime. But you try telling the IRS you only took advantage of a 'loophole'...see how that works out...



From businesses in other states. Pass.



Incorrect. It's a tremendous burden. Dealing with one state is bad enough, but 50...plus the differences in county and city taxes? It will kill small internet businesses ensuring more too-big-to-fail companies dominate. Wonderful. But frankly, even if it were not a burden, state A has no damn business demanding anything from businesses in state B.

Again, pass.

It will be software driven, remember we are talking about internet sales. Every online retailer already uses marketing software that drives the web pages, identifies the items to be ordered, calculates the sum, determines if the shipping address is in the same state and if so calculates the sales tax (if out of state no sales tax). The transaction is passed to the accounting ledger where the transaction is processed for payment (or billing as the case may be).

Amazon already has Tax Collection Services available right now for it's websellers. You will see more of that and some enterprising programers and future internet guru's will implement a "clearinghouse" type of service that integrates with the Marketing/Accounting software packages used by online retailers. Similar to what Vertax already does in the payroll tax area. Every night the sellers computers will dump a file to the clearinghouse, the clearing house will then format the data and report it electronically to the required state and will remit the required tax via EFT. The original seller will would have very little burden except to sign-up and pay for the clearing houses services. Same type of thing that businesses are already doing with accountants, temp agencies, payroll agencies, ISP's, etc.

Remember, truly small businesses aren't going to have to worry about it unless their total sales for the preceding year exceeded a million dollars.

If an on-line retailer can have software that per-calculates the exact shipping charges needed for every address in the United States depending on which shipper is chosen and which method of shipment (1-day air, 2-day air, ground, slow-boat-to-China) is used, then calculating the sales tax applicable to that address will be a piece of cake based on tables that each state will be required to supply and that will be integrated into the look-up values. The same way an address is looked up for calculating the shipping charges, then also the tax rate for that address can be easily determined.




>>>>

Thereby ensuring no one competes with Amazon. My goodness, you guys that always seem to hate giant corporations sure do advocate for laws that protect the big guys from competition.

I see you may have missed the part about clearing houses other than Amazon. It will be a competitive market, Amazon will compete for services, banks and other financial services will compete for services, credit card companies will compete for services, and even new internet startup companies (which can normally adapt and code faster then the big boys) will compete for services.

I'm not sure how a competitive market is "protecting the big guys from competition".

Again, pass.

If you choose not to order stuff on-line in a market place where sale tax is collected at the point-of-sale, then fell free not to purchase things online. I respect your right to do that.



>>>>

 

[Dot Com]

for clarification

Business' w/ < 1MILLION sales/yr would be exempt:

Tax-free Internet shopping jeopardized by bill

Businesses with less than $1 million a year in online sales would be exempt.

software would be provided for free:

Tax-free Internet shopping jeopardized by bill

But Sen. Dick Durbin, D-Ill., said the bill requires participating states to make it relatively easy for Internet retailers to comply. States must provide free computer software to help retailers calculate sales taxes, based on where shoppers live. States must also establish a single entity to receive Internet sales tax revenue, so retailers don't have to send them to individual counties or cities.

"We're way beyond the quill pen and ledger days," Durbin said. "Thanks to computers and thanks to software it is not that complex."

 

[Skull Pilot]

Incorrect, you wouldn't be paying sales tax to a state you don't live in. The sales tax is remitted to the state you do live in.


This has nothing to do with foreign countries.



>>>>

Then what do we do with people who physically cross the state border to buy something?

For example I buy a lot of stuff in MA but I live in CT so I should not pay the MA state sales tax and instead the retailer in MA should charge me the CT sales tax and then send it to CT?

That is what is being suggested for internet sales so why exclude brick and mortar stores from all the fun?

No it's not what is being suggested. When you travel to MA you are physically present in that state and are purchasing goods or services in MA and pay their 6.25% Sales Tax. When you are a resident of CT, you are physically present in that state and are purchasing goods or services in CT and pay their 6.35% Sales Tax.

However, because of the loophole in internet sales, when you are a resident of CT and make a purchase over the internet and it is delivered to your CT address from a seller that does not have a physical presence in CT - then you pay 0% sales tax.

The two situations are not similar (i.e. a fallacious analogy) since in one case you pay sales tax and in another you pay no sales tax.


MA Tax Rate
CT Tax Rate


>>>>

If the internet retailer is in say CT then no matter what state you purchase from you should pay the CT tax just as if you were in that store.

You cannot hold a CT resident responsible for tax collection for another state government.

WTF is so hard to understand about that?

 

[Dot Com]

SOME Republicans understand that governments need revenue to operate (build roads, repair bridges, etc...) :

Internet sales tax embraced by no-tax Republicans

 

[Skull Pilot]

SOME Republicans understand that governments need revenue:

Internet sales tax embraced by no-tax Republicans

Sale tax is a state not a federal issue.

It matters not where a customer is if the retailer is in a particular state then that is the only sales tax that should be paid and it should be remitted to whatever state the retailer is located.

If an internet retailer is located in a no sales tax state then there would be no tax paid. Period.

 

[eflatminor]

SOME Republicans understand that governments need revenue to operate (build roads, repair bridges, etc...) :

Internet sales tax embraced by no-tax Republicans

ALL the central planners think that. So what?

 

[WorldWatcher]

Then what do we do with people who physically cross the state border to buy something?

For example I buy a lot of stuff in MA but I live in CT so I should not pay the MA state sales tax and instead the retailer in MA should charge me the CT sales tax and then send it to CT?

That is what is being suggested for internet sales so why exclude brick and mortar stores from all the fun?

No it's not what is being suggested. When you travel to MA you are physically present in that state and are purchasing goods or services in MA and pay their 6.25% Sales Tax. When you are a resident of CT, you are physically present in that state and are purchasing goods or services in CT and pay their 6.35% Sales Tax.

However, because of the loophole in internet sales, when you are a resident of CT and make a purchase over the internet and it is delivered to your CT address from a seller that does not have a physical presence in CT - then you pay 0% sales tax.

The two situations are not similar (i.e. a fallacious analogy) since in one case you pay sales tax and in another you pay no sales tax.


MA Tax Rate
CT Tax Rate


>>>>

If the internet retailer is in say CT then no matter what state you purchase from you should pay the CT tax just as if you were in that store.

You cannot hold a CT resident responsible for tax collection for another state government.

WTF is so hard to understand about that?

Currently state imposes a sales tax on items purchased. In a B&M store it is done at the point of sale (POS). For internet purchases outside that state there is no mechanism in place to allow for POS, the only method is for individual to self report after the fact - a process that fails miserably. Therefore the move is to change to charging sales tax at the POS for internet purchases on the front end (just like a B&M store). A B&M store charges sales tax based on a location in a state, internet sellers will be charging sales tax based on a location in a state.

It's not hard to understand that the way you want it to work. But that is not reality.


>>>>

 

[eflatminor]

It will be software driven, remember we are talking about internet sales. Every online retailer already uses marketing software that drives the web pages, identifies the items to be ordered, calculates the sum, determines if the shipping address is in the same state and if so calculates the sales tax (if out of state no sales tax). The transaction is passed to the accounting ledger where the transaction is processed for payment (or billing as the case may be).

Amazon already has Tax Collection Services available right now for it's websellers. You will see more of that and some enterprising programers and future internet guru's will implement a "clearinghouse" type of service that integrates with the Marketing/Accounting software packages used by online retailers. Similar to what Vertax already does in the payroll tax area. Every night the sellers computers will dump a file to the clearinghouse, the clearing house will then format the data and report it electronically to the required state and will remit the required tax via EFT. The original seller will would have very little burden except to sign-up and pay for the clearing houses services. Same type of thing that businesses are already doing with accountants, temp agencies, payroll agencies, ISP's, etc.

Remember, truly small businesses aren't going to have to worry about it unless their total sales for the preceding year exceeded a million dollars.

If an on-line retailer can have software that per-calculates the exact shipping charges needed for every address in the United States depending on which shipper is chosen and which method of shipment (1-day air, 2-day air, ground, slow-boat-to-China) is used, then calculating the sales tax applicable to that address will be a piece of cake based on tables that each state will be required to supply and that will be integrated into the look-up values. The same way an address is looked up for calculating the shipping charges, then also the tax rate for that address can be easily determined.




>>>>

Thereby ensuring no one competes with Amazon. My goodness, you guys that always seem to hate giant corporations sure do advocate for laws that protect the big guys from competition.

I see you may have missed the part about clearing houses other than Amazon. It will be a competitive market, Amazon will compete for services, banks and other financial services will compete for services, credit card companies will compete for services, and even new internet startup companies (which can normally adapt and code faster then the big boys) will compete for services.

I'm not sure how a competitive market is "protecting the big guys from competition".

Again, pass.

If you choose not to order stuff on-line in a market place where sale tax is collected at the point-of-sale, then fell free not to purchase things online. I respect your right to do that.



>>>>

More government picking and choosing which laws apply to which companies? Haven't we had enough of that crap?

Bottom line, state A has no business forcing a business in state B to do their work tax collection work for them.

Pass.

 

[eflatminor]

SOME Republicans understand that governments need revenue:

Internet sales tax embraced by no-tax Republicans

Sale tax is a state not a federal issue.

It matters not where a customer is if the retailer is in a particular state then that is the only sales tax that should be paid and it should be remitted to whatever state the retailer is located.

If an internet retailer is located in a no sales tax state then there would be no tax paid. Period.

 

[WorldWatcher]

SOME Republicans understand that governments need revenue to operate (build roads, repair bridges, etc...) :

Internet sales tax embraced by no-tax Republicans

That was what we said to do during the last election cycle. That a part of any balancing of the budgets in this country must include cuts without raising tax rates, but that it would be possible to increase revenues by closing loopholes.

People not paying (and I'm one also) sales tax to States because internet purchasers (often) aren't paying any sales tax hitting cash strapped states. Charging for online sales just like B&M sales is closing a loophole, raising revenue, but not changing tax rates.



>>>>

 

[hortysir]

I'm undecided right now because on the one hand you can get some good deals but on the other, I'm short-changing mom & pop. brick & mortar stores & not contributing to the public purse for firemen, police, state's rainy day funds, etc...

Some states have internet sales taxes tacked onto one's purchases but the majority of states do not recieve any sales tax for internet sales right?

Give me your position & the reason you support it other than the standard response of "its cheaper"

No opinion either way, really.

Just a couple questions.
Does the tax rate belong to the seller's area or the buyer's?

Then there's S&H.
If S&H is free, then yes to the tax.
If not, the S&H should be enough to cover the tax rate

 

[WorldWatcher]

Thereby ensuring no one competes with Amazon. My goodness, you guys that always seem to hate giant corporations sure do advocate for laws that protect the big guys from competition.

I see you may have missed the part about clearing houses other than Amazon. It will be a competitive market, Amazon will compete for services, banks and other financial services will compete for services, credit card companies will compete for services, and even new internet startup companies (which can normally adapt and code faster then the big boys) will compete for services.

I'm not sure how a competitive market is "protecting the big guys from competition".

Again, pass.

If you choose not to order stuff on-line in a market place where sale tax is collected at the point-of-sale, then fell free not to purchase things online. I respect your right to do that.



>>>>

More government picking and choosing which laws apply to which companies? Haven't we had enough of that crap?

Bottom line, state A has no business forcing a business in state B to do their work tax collection work for them.

State A isn't forcing State B to do jack.

State A is choosing to participate in the program or not. If State A chooses not to participate in having it's out of state sales tax collected by other states, then it doesn't have to collect the sales tax for them either.

Pass.

Don't worry, no one will require you to make online purchases.

>>>>

 

[Skull Pilot]

No it's not what is being suggested. When you travel to MA you are physically present in that state and are purchasing goods or services in MA and pay their 6.25% Sales Tax. When you are a resident of CT, you are physically present in that state and are purchasing goods or services in CT and pay their 6.35% Sales Tax.

However, because of the loophole in internet sales, when you are a resident of CT and make a purchase over the internet and it is delivered to your CT address from a seller that does not have a physical presence in CT - then you pay 0% sales tax.

The two situations are not similar (i.e. a fallacious analogy) since in one case you pay sales tax and in another you pay no sales tax.


MA Tax Rate
CT Tax Rate


>>>>

If the internet retailer is in say CT then no matter what state you purchase from you should pay the CT tax just as if you were in that store.

You cannot hold a CT resident responsible for tax collection for another state government.

WTF is so hard to understand about that?

Currently state imposes a sales tax on items purchased. In a B&M store it is done at the point of sale (POS). For internet purchases outside that state there is no mechanism in place to allow for POS, the only method is for individual to self report after the fact - a process that fails miserably. Therefore the move is to change to charging sales tax at the POS for internet purchases on the front end (just like a B&M store). A B&M store charges sales tax based on a location in a state, internet sellers will be charging sales tax based on a location in a state.

It's not hard to understand that the way you want it to work. But that is not reality.


>>>>

It already is the reality.

If I take a telephone order from a guy in another state my POS system assesses CT sales tax on taxable purchases. I tell him the price including tax and he gives me a credit card number. Then at the end of the month I have to print a report of all my sales (not just the taxable ones then that list is separated into taxable and non taxable sales from which the sales tax due is calculated. I then remit payment on the thirtieth of every month for the previous month sales taxes.

It's the same fucking thing as an internet order.

So don't tell me the system doesn't already exist.

 

[WorldWatcher]

I'm undecided right now because on the one hand you can get some good deals but on the other, I'm short-changing mom & pop. brick & mortar stores & not contributing to the public purse for firemen, police, state's rainy day funds, etc...

Some states have internet sales taxes tacked onto one's purchases but the majority of states do not recieve any sales tax for internet sales right?

Give me your position & the reason you support it other than the standard response of "its cheaper"

No opinion either way, really.

Just a couple questions.
Does the tax rate belong to the seller's area or the buyer's?

Then there's S&H.
If S&H is free, then yes to the tax.
If not, the S&H should be enough to cover the tax rate

Typically the Sales Tax will be charged based on the deliver address (i.e. buyers area).

S&H and tax are two different things. S&H covers the cost of moving the item from the seller to the buyer, it has nothing to do with the Sales Tax owed.

But OK, I guess if it could work. The seller has their price for the item and a markup representing a small profit. Now the reseller can either (a) keep the price low and charge for shipping, or (b) raise the price and then offer "free" shipping. Bad thing is that if the items priced is raise for the "Free" shipping, then the item costs more meaning more in sales tax.



>>>>

 

[Skull Pilot]

I'm undecided right now because on the one hand you can get some good deals but on the other, I'm short-changing mom & pop. brick & mortar stores & not contributing to the public purse for firemen, police, state's rainy day funds, etc...

Some states have internet sales taxes tacked onto one's purchases but the majority of states do not recieve any sales tax for internet sales right?

Give me your position & the reason you support it other than the standard response of "its cheaper"

No opinion either way, really.

Just a couple questions.
Does the tax rate belong to the seller's area or the buyer's?

Then there's S&H.
If S&H is free, then yes to the tax.
If not, the S&H should be enough to cover the tax rate

Typically the Sales Tax will be charged based on the deliver address (i.e. buyers area).

S&H and tax are two different things. S&H covers the cost of moving the item from the seller to the buyer, it has nothing to do with the Sales Tax owed.

But OK, I guess if it could work. The seller has their price for the item and a markup representing a small profit. Now the reseller can either (a) keep the price low and charge for shipping, or (b) raise the price and then offer "free" shipping. Bad thing is that if the items priced is raise for the "Free" shipping, then the item costs more meaning more in sales tax.



>>>>

Sales tax is imposed at the point of sale not the destination of a product.

 

[WorldWatcher]

If the internet retailer is in say CT then no matter what state you purchase from you should pay the CT tax just as if you were in that store.

You cannot hold a CT resident responsible for tax collection for another state government.

WTF is so hard to understand about that?

Currently state imposes a sales tax on items purchased. In a B&M store it is done at the point of sale (POS). For internet purchases outside that state there is no mechanism in place to allow for POS, the only method is for individual to self report after the fact - a process that fails miserably. Therefore the move is to change to charging sales tax at the POS for internet purchases on the front end (just like a B&M store). A B&M store charges sales tax based on a location in a state, internet sellers will be charging sales tax based on a location in a state.

It's not hard to understand that the way you want it to work. But that is not reality.


>>>>

It already is the reality.

If I take a telephone order from a guy in another state my POS system assesses CT sales tax on taxable purchases. I tell him the price including tax and he gives me a credit card number. Then at the end of the month I have to print a report of all my sales (not just the taxable ones then that list is separated into taxable and non taxable sales from which the sales tax due is calculated. I then remit payment on the thirtieth of every month for the previous month sales taxes.

It's the same fucking thing as an internet order.

So don't tell me the system doesn't already exist.

I didn't say it couldn't be done based on the state of sale, I said that reality is that most state charge tax based on state of use. I'm sorry to tell you something but I really don't care they way that CT does it. (But your description seems to imply that your are charging CT sales tax on all transactions, then separating out taxable and non-taxable, and remitting only the taxable sales. Does that mean you company just keeps the extra tax charged for the non-taxable sales?

The reality is that most states charge sales tax on out-of-state purchases and the system is moving to a POS collection method instead of the "honor" system where citizens are expected to just send a check to their State.

I'm sure that you through have been sending checks to CT for all those trips to MA and providing CT their sales tax for cumulative items over $25.


>>>>

 

[WorldWatcher]

No opinion either way, really.

Just a couple questions.
Does the tax rate belong to the seller's area or the buyer's?

Then there's S&H.
If S&H is free, then yes to the tax.
If not, the S&H should be enough to cover the tax rate

Typically the Sales Tax will be charged based on the deliver address (i.e. buyers area).

S&H and tax are two different things. S&H covers the cost of moving the item from the seller to the buyer, it has nothing to do with the Sales Tax owed.

But OK, I guess if it could work. The seller has their price for the item and a markup representing a small profit. Now the reseller can either (a) keep the price low and charge for shipping, or (b) raise the price and then offer "free" shipping. Bad thing is that if the items priced is raise for the "Free" shipping, then the item costs more meaning more in sales tax.



>>>>

Sales tax is imposed at the point of sale not the destination of a product.

Most state charge a sales (or use) tax based on use of the product in the state. The tax (in the past has been leaved at the POS) with B&M stores, however with internet sales the trend is to charge on-line sellers based on the destination.

Your own state (CT) for example charges Sales Tax for items over $25 purchased outside the state and brought into the state. You've talked before about going to MA to make purchases and bringing it back to CT. The POS of the product was MA, but your own state charges you sales tax (for purchases over $25) based on your residence in the state, not the POS.

Use tax on goods purchased out-of-state and brought back to CT
Question
Q. Do I owe Connecticut use tax on all my out-of-state purchases of taxable goods and services?
Answer
A. No. If all the items purchased and brought into Connecticut at one time total $25 or less, you do not have to pay Connecticut use tax. The $25 exemption does not apply to items shipped or mailed to you.​

$25 is the exception level, which of course means you do owe tax on purchases over $25.

http://askdrs.ct.gov/Scripts/drsrig...?p_faqid=419&p_created=1153840234&p_topview=1



>>>>

 

[Skull Pilot]

Currently state imposes a sales tax on items purchased. In a B&M store it is done at the point of sale (POS). For internet purchases outside that state there is no mechanism in place to allow for POS, the only method is for individual to self report after the fact - a process that fails miserably. Therefore the move is to change to charging sales tax at the POS for internet purchases on the front end (just like a B&M store). A B&M store charges sales tax based on a location in a state, internet sellers will be charging sales tax based on a location in a state.

It's not hard to understand that the way you want it to work. But that is not reality.


>>>>

It already is the reality.

If I take a telephone order from a guy in another state my POS system assesses CT sales tax on taxable purchases. I tell him the price including tax and he gives me a credit card number. Then at the end of the month I have to print a report of all my sales (not just the taxable ones then that list is separated into taxable and non taxable sales from which the sales tax due is calculated. I then remit payment on the thirtieth of every month for the previous month sales taxes.

It's the same fucking thing as an internet order.

So don't tell me the system doesn't already exist.

I didn't say it couldn't be done based on the state of sale, I said that reality is that most state charge tax based on state of use.

Sales tax is not charged on the destination of a product it is charged where the product is sold. How many times have you been asked if the product you're buying is going to be used in the state in which you are buying it? If you say you're going to use the item in another state then do you get a pass on sales tax?

I'm sorry to tell you something but I really don't care they way that CT does it. (But your description seems to imply that your are charging CT sales tax on all transactions, then separating out taxable and non-taxable, and remitting only the taxable sales. Does that mean you company just keeps the extra tax charged for the non-taxable sales?

No I charge CT sales tax on taxable transactions. My POS system is programmed with taxable and nontaxable items and services as are most every business's POS systems. The only tax I worry about is the CT sales tax. It matters not if the customer lives in CT, MA, RI, TX CA or East Ass Fuck I charge CT sales tax on taxable items and remit that tax to the state of CT.

The reality is that most states charge sales tax on out-of-state purchases and the system is moving to a POS collection method instead of the "honor" system where citizens are expected to just send a check to their State.

Technically it's called a use tax.

The state of MA or any other state has no right to ask me to collect tax for them at my expense and I have no obligation to do so.

 

[Skull Pilot]

I'm undecided right now because on the one hand you can get some good deals but on the other, I'm short-changing mom & pop. brick & mortar stores & not contributing to the public purse for firemen, police, state's rainy day funds, etc...

Some states have internet sales taxes tacked onto one's purchases but the majority of states do not recieve any sales tax for internet sales right?

Give me your position & the reason you support it other than the standard response of "its cheaper"

No opinion either way, really.

Just a couple questions.
Does the tax rate belong to the seller's area or the buyer's?

Then there's S&H.
If S&H is free, then yes to the tax.
If not, the S&H should be enough to cover the tax rate

Shipping and handling covers the cost of shipping and handling it has nothing whatsoever to do with taxes.

If fact shipping and handling can be subject to sales taxes as a taxable service.