Intellectual Dishonesty

[ClosedCaption]

So - in another thread - one of the hardline left-wingers here stated the following:

Obviously not. Libertarianism, at least in theory, has more liberty, therefore it's further left, by definition. More liberty is always more liberal, more authoritarianism is always more conservative.

So the question for the forum is - why do you suppose that the left engages in such absurd propaganda? It would be like trying to convince the people of USMB that George Washington was never President of the United States or that the automobile has never been invented. What would drive someone to make a statement that is so obviously false?

I think it's on you to provide why this is absurd but since you are unable to do so, you seem to believe that just saying it's absurd is proof of its absurdity.

 

[ricechickie]

Hell, no! The left-right model is insufficient. To define every ideological position on a simple straight line is silly.

"Hell no"? So the Sovereign Citizen is not to the right of the libertarian in your mind?

So basically, you saw the road that logic and reason were leading you down and you immediately jumped off the cliff. Can't have logic and reason getting in the way of a good false narrative - uh?

Reading is Fundamental.

Go back and sound it all out.

 

[The Original Tree]

People are whack and completely out of touch with reality.

Oppression, Tyranny and Big Goverment is Left.

Liberty and even too much Freedom "Anarchy" is to the Right.

Between the two is Moderation and our Republic. Though admittedly The Fascist Liberals have dragged us pretty far to the Left.

Check my sigline.

So - in another thread - one of the hardline left-wingers here stated the following:

Obviously not. Libertarianism, at least in theory, has more liberty, therefore it's further left, by definition. More liberty is always more liberal, more authoritarianism is always more conservative.

So the question for the forum is - why do you suppose that the left engages in such absurd propaganda? It would be like trying to convince the people of USMB that George Washington was never President of the United States or that the automobile has never been invented. What would drive someone to make a statement that is so obviously false?

 

[JakeStarkey]

The Fake and Alt Facts continue.

Go take the politicalcompass.com quiz to find out where you are on the scale.

 

[The Original Tree]

Conservative means to Conserve The Original Interpretation of The Constitution and Liberalism means to Liberally Interpret it.

An Originalist or a Textualist Is a Conservative. Gorsuch Is A Conservative. Thomas Is A Conservative.

When one Liberally interprets your rights, it is only for the purpose of restricting your rights and making exceptions to your rights and claiming that "The Founding Fathers Didn't Really Mean That". They declare such nonsense So That They May "Bend The Rules" To Their Will & Agendas.

It is always Liberalism and Liberal Activism and a belief that we can interpret The Constitution Liberally that is a threat to our Liberties.

Ginsberg is a Liberal. Obama Is A Liberal. They seek to undermine and minimize The Constitution and twist The Original Intent and mold it to suit their agendas which always favors Collectivism at the expense of Individualism and Individual Liberties.

When someone says they believe in a living breathing Constitution they make this statement because they want to Change The Meaning Of The Original Text and Intent.

Fer Heaven's Sake you Knobs don't even know the definitions of the very concepts you are trying to discuss!

Poor P@triot. Even though he didn't call me out by name, this still counts as a callout thread. And by the rules, anyone making a callout thread admits to being a butthurt loser.

The backstory: P@triot keeps "proving" the Nazis were leftists by unilaterally declaring that all freedom is by definition conservative, and that all authoritarianism is by definition liberal. He simply defines his own side as virtuous, and the other side as demonic. Easy to "win" when you just define yourself as the winner.

I mocked his dishonesty by flipping it on its head. Instead of addressing his own dishonesty, he squealed that my satire of him was "lying".

P@triot, me ripping apart your lies with satire is not lying. Instead of crying at me more, how about you address the point I made?

That point would be that your "More liberty means more conservative" line is a big steaming pile, one that you haven't even attempted to back up. Every time I ask, you just repeat the same mantra again, and then fail to back it up again. I get it. You can't back it up. By now everyone sees that.

 

[Tehon]

To suggest that libertarians are left of center is ridiculous. The Left wants bigger gov't that has more control over just about every aspect of your life, and that includes more infringement on your liberties and rights. To suggest otherwise displays a significant degree of ignorance.

Thank you! That's how insanely idiotic both mamooth and Tehon are. To proclaim that libertarianism is left of conservatism is absurd. And I'm certain neither one of them believe thee bullshit they are shoveling (in fact - Mammaries admitted to "playing games" in the other thread when he claimed that libertarianism is left of conservatism on the political spectrum).

To proclaim that libertarianism is left of conservatism is absurd

Abortion, drug laws and LGBTQ issues. Left of conservatism.

 

[ThoughtCrimes]

Hell, no! The left-right model is insufficient. To define every ideological position on a simple straight line is silly.

"Hell no"? So the Sovereign Citizen is not to the right of the libertarian in your mind?

So basically, you saw the road that logic and reason were leading you down and you immediately jumped off the cliff. Can't have logic and reason getting in the way of a good false narrative - uh?

You so called "Sovereign Citizens" are nothing more than anarchists of a century or so ago, retread for this era. The rule of law, to your demented perceptions, are what you, as an individual, make them to be and to HELL with all else! You're not convincing anyone Rottweiler.

Reason and logic are foreign to you, fool, and the false narrative is yours!

 

[The Original Tree]

 

[P@triot]

Abortion, drug laws and LGBTQ issues. Left of conservatism.

Those are all right of conservatism as libertarians believe government has no business being involved. Those just happened to the the three items in the world that the left-wingers don't want government preventing.

Here you go you vintage example of intellectual dishonesty:

As Libertarians, we seek a world of liberty; a world in which all individuals are sovereign over their own lives and no one is forced to sacrifice his or her values for the benefit of others.

We believe that respect for individual rights is the essential precondition for a free and prosperous world, that force and fraud must be banished from human relationships, and that only through freedom can peace and prosperity be realized.

2016 Platform | Libertarian Party

 

[mamooth]

ncidentally - I can't believe you lack the shame to admit you were dumb enough to attempt to make the case that libertarianism is left of conservatism.

I can't believe you didn't grasp it was satire, mocking your idiot "because I say so!" logic, even though I explicitly said I was mocking your idiot logic. You're a profoundly stupid and dishonest human being on every level, not to mention a particularly delicate snowflake. And no, I am not sorry that I keep triggering you.

So, are you ever going to find your balls and address the issue I brought up? Check your groin area, and use magnification. Be persistent. You'll locate 'em someday.

You keep saying authoritarianism is always liberal and liberty is always conservative, but you've never backed that claim in any way, and you've actively handwaved away all the counter-examples. You and Tree both seem to believe that simply repeating your crazy claims over and over counts as evidence.

Why not just admit your claim was some rancid bullshit that you yanked out of your ass? It's not like everyone doesn't already see that. At this point, you're just digging down deeper into the stupid liar hole.

 

[P@triot]

ncidentally - I can't believe you lack the shame to admit you were dumb enough to attempt to make the case that libertarianism is left of conservatism.

I can't believe you didn't grasp it was satire

Bwahahahahaha!!! Mammy here suddenly wants to backtrack and proclaim "I was only kidding" after being humiliated. Too late snowflake....

 

[P@triot]

You keep saying authoritarianism is always liberal and liberty is always conservative, but you've never backed that claim in any way

I've backed it up dozens of times now with indisputable fact. So indisputable that you haven't even attempted to dispute it. You run from it every time. Which is why I'll keep posting it. Let me know when you think you have the faintest argument to dispute this indisputable reality:

Right-wing:
Since we know that the right believes in limited government and maximum freedom for the individual, it's very easy to understand that the further right you go, government continues to get smaller and less powerful. As you start to go further right, you reach the libertarian. As you continue, you start to hit the radical fringe - the Sovereign Citizen. This is a person who believes they are "sovereign" unto themselves. They answer to nobody, under any circumstances. They do not recognize the U.S. government or even the U.S. Constitution. They believe they do not have to pay taxes, they do not have to obey traffic laws, etc. The farthest fringe and the very end is the Anarchist. The anarchist believes in no government and no laws at all.

Left-wing:
Since we know that the left believes in unlimited government with maximum power, it's very easy to understand that the further left you go, government continues to get larger and more powerful. As you start to go further left, you reach the socialist. As you continue, you start to hit the radical fringe - the Marxists. Finally, the farthest fringe and the very end is the Communist, Fascist, or Totalitarianism . These groups believes in in total government control. A person has no freedoms or rights - they do as instructed by the government for the "good" of the entire nation.

Fascism is authoritarian. Authoritarianism is the polar opposite in every way from the right-wing ideology. Saying "right-wing authoritarianism" is as idiotic and immature as saying "he is a heterosexual homosexual" or "that scolding hot water is freezing". It is that stupid. The further right you go - the smaller government gets until it ceases to exist at all (anarchy).

 

[P@triot]

So basic and obvious - only a left-winger is confused by it.

 

[Tehon]

Abortion, drug laws and LGBTQ issues. Left of conservatism.

Those are all right of conservatism as libertarians believe government has no business being involved. Those just happened to the the three items in the world that the left-wingers don't want government preventing.

Here you go you vintage example of intellectual dishonesty:

As Libertarians, we seek a world of liberty; a world in which all individuals are sovereign over their own lives and no one is forced to sacrifice his or her values for the benefit of others.

We believe that respect for individual rights is the essential precondition for a free and prosperous world, that force and fraud must be banished from human relationships, and that only through freedom can peace and prosperity be realized.

2016 Platform | Libertarian Party

Well you are wrong, but the liberal in me doesn't care. You are free to believe whatever you want. Your mind is obviously made up.

I will agree with you to an extent. Liberals today have been neutered. They don't fill the classic role of the left in resisting oppressive power structures, which is clearly present in the U.S. today in the form of corporate tyranny.

 

[mamooth]

I've backed it up dozens of times now with indisputable fact.

You misspelled "I've given you my unsupported opinion dozens of times." For reasons nobody can fathom, you're convinced that something is a fact solely because you say it is.

Right-wing:
Since we know that the right believes in limited government and maximum freedom for the individual

We know no such thing. Well informed and intelligent people know the opposite is true.

In the USA, government grows under conservatives, shrinks under liberals. Liberty declines under conservatives, grows under liberals. The liberals aren't the one implementing new Jim Crow laws to restrict voting. The liberals aren't pushing the drug war. The liberals aren't trying to ban a certain religion, or restricting the population on a multitude of social issues.

Most importantly, liberals create economic freedom. Adam Smith, the man who wrote the book on Capitalism, pointed out that regulation of capitalism is necessary, and that progressive taxation is necessary, otherwise capitalism devolves into cronyism and monopolism. And that's exactly what Republicans have helped happen. Conservatives essentially create corporate socialism, where a few corporations become the new state. Liberals, we push true capitalism.

Left-wing:
Since we know that the left believes in unlimited government with maximum power,

No, nobody knows that. It's a kook fantasy lie you made up, becaise you're too cowardly to debate what any liberal actually says.

If you're not lying, little snowflake, name a single leftist in the USA who ever said such a thing.

We'll wait.

it's very easy to understand that the further left you go, government continues to get larger and more powerful.

Anarchists are clearly leftists. Bush bloated the government to record levels, and Obama shrank it. Hence, your statement is clearly bullshit.

Fascism is authoritarian.

Which is why it's obviously right-wing, as authoritarianism is right-wing. That's why conservatives back the prison state, and why conservatives are enthusiastic fans of both governments and corporations breaching everyone's privacy. It wasn't the liberals who just voted to let ISP's sell your browsing data to anyone they want.

 

[P@triot]

Right-wing:
Since we know that the right believes in limited government and maximum freedom for the individual

We know no such thing. Well informed and intelligent people know the opposite is true.

Here we go again. After everyone starts laughing at her over this absurd lie, she will backtrack with "I was only kidding".

The entire world knows that the right stands for limited government and maximum freedom. Mammy wants everyone to believe that right-wing is communism and left-wing is Sovereign Citizen.

She hasn't figured out that what she wants is irrelevant. Reality is what it is and her desires won't change it.

 

[P@triot]

Bush bloated the government to record levels, and Obama shrank it.

Bwahahahahaha! Obama "shrank" government...

Let me guess....Obama also "shrank" the national debt?

 

[P@triot]

Fascism is authoritarian.

Which is why it's obviously right-wing, as authoritarianism is right-wing.

Yeah....you know all of those damn "authoritarian" libertarians, Sovereign Citizens, and anarchists! I can't stand how all of them are always advocating for more government, more oppression of the people, and more power for those in charge.

And then there are all of those communists/marxists/socialists who advocate for smaller, more limited government!

 

[jillian]

So - in another thread - one of the hardline left-wingers here stated the following:

Obviously not. Libertarianism, at least in theory, has more liberty, therefore it's further left, by definition. More liberty is always more liberal, more authoritarianism is always more conservative.

So the question for the forum is - why do you suppose that the left engages in such absurd propaganda? It would be like trying to convince the people of USMB that George Washington was never President of the United States or that the automobile has never been invented. What would drive someone to make a statement that is so obviously false?

ah...sweet irony.

 

[jillian]

Bush bloated the government to record levels, and Obama shrank it.

Bwahahahahaha! Obama "shrank" government...

Let me guess....Obama also "shrank" the national debt?

come now, wackadoodle, it's not like any trump loons are concerned with the deficit.