“I’ll go to jail” – Florida Veteran told to remove military flags from restaurant pro

[Quantum Windbag]

If I claim the banner of my sports team is sacred, is flying it protected free speech, even if it violates zoning laws?

That is, is every single zoning law unconstitutional? Good luck getting the courts to agree with that.

Legally, the city is stuck. If they let this guy's sacred banners fly, they have to let everyone's sacred banners fly.

I am willing to flat out bet you right now that the law does not apply to sports teams.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Why not just apply for the permit and avoid all the drama? I doubt it's all that hard.

I lived in a subdivision that prohibited 'signs.' There was a family that had a son in the military who were told to remove the signs from their lawn. They did. And painted them on their cars. This guy just needs a little imagination. Have the flags painted on the building or his car or something.

Sadly, they can prohibit him from doing this, and the landmark case is one out of Arizona regarding the American flag.

If I lived in a place that told someone to remove signs about their sons serving in the military I would print up a bunch of copies of the signs and give them to everyone in the entire community to display as a protest against the stupid regulations. Care to bet how many people would join in versus how many people would complain about the signs? The minority of haters does not run this country, despite the fact that you think they do.

 

[Luissa]

Why would a city pass such a dumb law?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Why would a city pass such a dumb law?

Because that is why government exists, to protect its power. Government is not a power for good.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Why would a city pass such a dumb law?

The tin-plated wanna-be dictators in charge wanted to flex their muscles, or this guy pissed off one of them and they want to make him pay. It often is that simple.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Especially in liberal strongholds like Hollly Hiil, FL.

 

[Dot Com]

Why not just apply for the permit and avoid all the drama? I doubt it's all that hard.

because then it wouldn't be reported by "The Right Scoop" whatever that is

 

[emilynghiem]

If the law is declared unconstitutional......you are correct. If not? Tough nuts.

Nope. I am correct; period -- and without qualification.

If a law is UnConstitutional, it is UnConstitutional even BEFORE it is "declared" to be so by a Court.

And any law that is in derogation of the Constitution is a legal nullity. Void ab initio.

THAT's all there is to it.

Dear IM I have the same problem you do with this system set up to make work for more lawyers.

there is unconstitutional by the "spirit of the laws," like the ACA health care bill
there is unconstitutional by the "letter of the law," like the AZ immigration bill

and then this system of proving/establishing what is or is not unconstitutional
relying on judges/courts to decide, which to me, already violates equal protections
for the people who have to go through this to defend their position against
the people of the other view who already have their law in place, this is not equal

if there is such a dispute, ideally it should be resolved *before* passing a law or ruling
(otherwise the two sides are not equal represented or protected but one is favored over the other)

not wait until after and go through a process
why not go through that process in advance?
using Congress or legislatures as a testing ground
to pass laws and reform them after is an abuse of democratic process
it is not equal where people take sides and bully over the other
putting their own views or beliefs above constitutional equal protections of both sides.

 

[asaratis]

Why would a city pass such a dumb law?

The tin-plated wanna-be dictators in charge wanted to flex their muscles, or this guy pissed off one of them and they want to make him pay. It often is that simple.

Egg Zachery!!!

This thread is replete with well worded comments. As I was reading chronologically from the top down, I clicked on the multiple-quotes button...intending to reply to each. Then I got to this one. Succinct is too weak a word to describe it.

It is the exerting of power that drives imbeciles in all sorts of governmental and organizational positions. From the community home owner's associations, the church committee, school boards, city councils, ...we are subject to being controlled (mostly via restrictions or requirements to pay for permits to do certain things) by OTHER HUMANS who have no immunity to bias.

 

[emilynghiem]

If I claim the banner of my sports team is sacred, is flying it protected free speech, even if it violates zoning laws?

That is, is every single zoning law unconstitutional? Good luck getting the courts to agree with that.

Legally, the city is stuck. If they let this guy's sacred banners fly, they have to let everyone's sacred banners fly.

I am willing to flat out bet you right now that the law does not apply to sports teams.

you bring up a good point about flyering everyone to join in protesting this poorly
written and vaguely enforced law. I once had a lawyer friend beat a fine on "loose materials" in the bed of a truck because it was too vague and broad what loose was.

What if everyone joined in protest by either
* flying flags of all kinds, all states and colleges, and like you said, sports teams
* registering for permits for each and every flag even if it takes asking to waive
the cost of the permits (or asking sports team to sponsor this protest as advertising)
and thus overburdening city officials with bureaucratic paperwork to match

what kind of message would that send?

 

[Connery]

We'll have to wait two weeks for the city's special hearing.
In the meantime, the guy will amass over $7,000 in fines.

He will amass these fines because he is obstinate. Should the law be unconstitutional the fines should be waived. He should take the flags down and fight the law.

Dumb law, dumb man.

That law is dumb.

There is nothing dumb about that man.

WTF makes you imagine that it's "dumb" to protest against an idiotic and facially UnConstitutional "law?"

He should absolutely leave those flags flying. That's what brings it to a head. I applaud his character and his balls.

It is no surprise to me that Zona, that flaming rodent ****, would applaud your dumbass commentary.

I am against that law as well. Put your money where your mouth is and contribute your dollars to his fine or cause. I have already stated I would help him have the law overturned.

 

[IlarMeilyr]

He will amass these fines because he is obstinate. Should the law be unconstitutional the fines should be waived. He should take the flags down and fight the law.

Dumb law, dumb man.

That law is dumb.

There is nothing dumb about that man.

WTF makes you imagine that it's "dumb" to protest against an idiotic and facially UnConstitutional "law?"

He should absolutely leave those flags flying. That's what brings it to a head. I applaud his character and his balls.

It is no surprise to me that Zona, that flaming rodent ****, would applaud your dumbass commentary.

I am against that law as well. Put your money where your mouth is and contribute your dollars to his fine or cause. I have already stated I would help him have the law overturned.

What I do or don't do is not your concern.

I was responding only to your silly contention that he was dumb.

You are wrong in that. He was not dumb. He was very stand-up.

 

[konradv]

What goes around comes around. The radical left was once supported by the ACLU in it's 1st Amendment right to burn Old Glory in the streets. I guess the radical left thought the Constitution only applied to them. Maybe they were right.

That's Mitt Romney country. When did they become "radical leftists"?

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

I think the law itself is rather silly.

Heck!~ it even sounds unconstitutional to me

It is, however, a LOCAL ORDINANCE and therefore may not be subject to the constitution's 1st Amendment protections.

SCOTUS has ruled that the Bill of Rights applies to all governments.

 

[Connery]

That law is dumb.

There is nothing dumb about that man.

WTF makes you imagine that it's "dumb" to protest against an idiotic and facially UnConstitutional "law?"

He should absolutely leave those flags flying. That's what brings it to a head. I applaud his character and his balls.

It is no surprise to me that Zona, that flaming rodent ****, would applaud your dumbass commentary.

I am against that law as well. Put your money where your mouth is and contribute your dollars to his fine or cause. I have already stated I would help him have the law overturned.

What I do or don't do is not your concern.

I was responding only to your silly contention that he was dumb.

You are wrong in that. He was not dumb. He was very stand-up.

That is not stand up. That is asinine. He is using an emotional platform because he is pissed, if he meant business he would fight this in a more appropriate forum where he could actually make a difference instead of a little stink.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I am against that law as well. Put your money where your mouth is and contribute your dollars to his fine or cause. I have already stated I would help him have the law overturned.

What I do or don't do is not your concern.

I was responding only to your silly contention that he was dumb.

You are wrong in that. He was not dumb. He was very stand-up.

That is not stand up. That is asinine. He is using an emotional platform because he is pissed, if he meant business he would fight this in a more appropriate forum where he could actually make a difference instead of a little stink.

Damn, that was stupid.

He is fighting it the right way. He has asked for a hearing before the city, declared that he will refuse to follow the law, and stated that he is willing to go to jail, which will get him a hearing in front of a judge.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

He will amass these fines because he is obstinate. Should the law be unconstitutional the fines should be waived. He should take the flags down and fight the law.

Dumb law, dumb man.

That law is dumb.

There is nothing dumb about that man.

WTF makes you imagine that it's "dumb" to protest against an idiotic and facially UnConstitutional "law?"

He should absolutely leave those flags flying. That's what brings it to a head. I applaud his character and his balls.

It is no surprise to me that Zona, that flaming rodent ****, would applaud your dumbass commentary.

I am against that law as well. Put your money where your mouth is and contribute your dollars to his fine or cause. I have already stated I would help him have the law overturned.

How can anyone be against a law he’s never read.

And if you’ve read the law, cite it so others can make an informed decision.

 

[Connery]

That law is dumb.

There is nothing dumb about that man.

WTF makes you imagine that it's "dumb" to protest against an idiotic and facially UnConstitutional "law?"

He should absolutely leave those flags flying. That's what brings it to a head. I applaud his character and his balls.

It is no surprise to me that Zona, that flaming rodent ****, would applaud your dumbass commentary.

I am against that law as well. Put your money where your mouth is and contribute your dollars to his fine or cause. I have already stated I would help him have the law overturned.

How can anyone be against a law he’s never read.

And if you’ve read the law, cite it so others can make an informed decision.

Do your own research bud.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

I am against that law as well. Put your money where your mouth is and contribute your dollars to his fine or cause. I have already stated I would help him have the law overturned.

How can anyone be against a law he’s never read.

And if you’ve read the law, cite it so others can make an informed decision.

Do your own research bud.

So you have no idea as to the text of the ordinance and oppose something you know nothing about. How are you going to get a 'law' overturned you're completely ignorant of.

 

[Esmeralda]

What goes around comes around. The radical left was once supported by the ACLU in it's 1st Amendment right to burn Old Glory in the streets. I guess the radical left thought the Constitution only applied to them. Maybe they were right.

That's Mitt Romney country. When did they become "radical leftists"?

Any thing or person they disagree with is 'left.'