"I can't trust the aguments leading to Atheism, and therefore have no reason to be an Atheist"

[Dante]

Interesting. Watch the dif between the postings of the atheists and the anti-Godists.

View attachment 52843

This fails as an appeal to ignorance fallacy, in addition to being a confirmation bias fallacy.

That one 'can't imagine' a world without order or purpose doesn't mean a 'god' must exist; belief in a 'god' is not 'evidence,' just as faith is not 'proof' a 'god' exists.

The OP is claiming that the very act of 'believing' shows how we are not random compositions.

Can you show otherwise?

really? You give the OP much too much credit.

You are an honorably, generous man hortysir

 

[Dante]

Those free from faith are just that: free from faith; they don't seek to 'disprove' anything, or 'do away' with religion – the notion in nonsense.

And being free from faith is not a 'belief system' or 'religion,' that's a ridiculous lie contrived by theists.

again, thank you sir

 

[Dante]

"Not believing in these things does not prove they don't exist; unicorns, the spaghetti monster, Martians, Zeus, the Kraken...

Excellent: "not believing . . . does not prove they don't exist" is exactly correct.

And believing that things don't exist is not conclusive either.

Yes, evidence is necessary, and neither the empirical data nor the faith of the atheist prove that God does not exist.

That's why being agnostic is the only logical position to have.

logic fail

 

[Dante]

Interesting. Watch the dif between the postings of the atheists and the anti-Godists.

View attachment 52843

This fails as an appeal to ignorance fallacy, in addition to being a confirmation bias fallacy.

That one 'can't imagine' a world without order or purpose doesn't mean a 'god' must exist; belief in a 'god' is not 'evidence,' just as faith is not 'proof' a 'god' exists.

Your are guilty of a fallacy of mischaracterization. The OP was about how thought works, and that atheistic thinking leads to false conclusions unsupported by the thinking. Jones has demonstrated excellently how this fallacy operates.

Stop being disingenuous. Your OP is about baiting people with a false choice. You can put lipstick on your set-up, but it's still oinking at the world

"Interesting. Watch the dif between the postings of the atheists and the anti-Godists."

 

[Dante]

evidence is necessary, and neither the empirical data nor the faith of the atheist prove that God does not exist.

Who claims god exists?

Seriously JakeStarkey , WHO claims god exists?

 

[sealybobo]

Interesting. Watch the dif between the postings of the atheists and the anti-Godists.

View attachment 52843

Dumbest thinking I have ever read. So dumb I don't even know how to comment. It certainly doesn't make me believe in a god.

 

[sealybobo]

Are anti-Godists clinically mental, and are atheists only slightly less?

If I told you god impregnated my virgin wife, would you think I was mental or would you believe it?

 

[the_human_being]

Sounds like C.J. really IS a thinking man.

Jesus! You again?

Was NOT is. cs Lewis has been dead for quite some time

The little twit is pissed because I pointed out that the father of modern rocketry was a Christian and totally destroyed his self-flattering opinion that he alone was the most intelligent nut in the world.

 

[Taz]

"Not believing in these things does not prove they don't exist; unicorns, the spaghetti monster, Martians, Zeus, the Kraken...

Excellent: "not believing . . . does not prove they don't exist" is exactly correct.

And believing that things don't exist is not conclusive either.

Yes, evidence is necessary, and neither the empirical data nor the faith of the atheist prove that God does not exist.

That's why being agnostic is the only logical position to have.

logic fail

Can you prove that God exists? Or that God doesn't exist? No, so stfu.

 

[Dante]

Interesting. Watch the dif between the postings of the atheists and the anti-Godists.

View attachment 52843

Aside from the OP attempting to set-up...

what is Lewis saying? Forget the OP's fruity frustrations. What is Lewis saying? Without a god he cannot trust his own thoughts? Imagine a leader who had religious faith having a crisis of faith? What would entail? Self destruction of him/herself? Destruction of everything they had power over? Religious leaders can be very dangerous if their lives meaning is propped up by faith. There has to be more to a man or a woman than faith. One has to believe in thought and one's own thoughts before one can interact with the world outside of one's own mind.

Like many of us Lewis searched for a meaning in myths. HE may have made the error of mistaking myth for reality as opposed to what it truly is -- a collection of metaphors that reference that which is transcendent. I like what Joseph Campbell once said to Bill Moyers

"People say that what we’re all seeking is a meaning for life. I don’t think that’s what we’re really seeking. I think what we’re seeking is an experience of being alive, so that the life experiences that we have on the purely physical plane will have resonances within that are those of our own innermost being and reality. And so that we actually feel the rapture of being alive, that’s what it’s all finally about, and that’s what these clues help us to find within ourselves."
​

Not all non believers are atheistic or agnostic. That is what people like Jake believe. But then again we know many of their beliefs are just that -- beliefs alone. Something that springs out of their thoughts . Something that cannot be tested or proven\. One can use and study myths and believe they are a necessary part of civilization at this point in time, without mistaking the use of myth for a reality of existence and the cosmos... (rambling on some more....)

 

[Dante]

"Not believing in these things does not prove they don't exist; unicorns, the spaghetti monster, Martians, Zeus, the Kraken...

Excellent: "not believing . . . does not prove they don't exist" is exactly correct.

And believing that things don't exist is not conclusive either.

Yes, evidence is necessary, and neither the empirical data nor the faith of the atheist prove that God does not exist.

That's why being agnostic is the only logical position to have.

logic fail

Can you prove that God exists? Or that God doesn't exist? No, so stfu.

Two logic fails is a row? Impressive.

Why would I personally want to prove that some god, any god exists or doesn't exist?

 

[Dante]

Gotta luv Joe Campbell

What’s the meaning of the universe? What’s the meaning of a flea? It’s just there, that’s it, and your own meaning is that you’re there. Now we are so engaged in doing things, to achieve purposes of outer value, that we forget that the inner value, the rapture that is associated with being alive, is what it’s all about.

Now, we want to think about God. God is a thought, God is a name, God is an idea, but its reference is to something that transcends all thinking. The ultimate mystery of being is beyond all categories of thought. My friend Heinrich Zimmer of years ago used to say, “The best things can’t be told.” Because they transcend thought. The second best are misunderstood, because those are the thoughts that are supposed to refer to that which can’t be thought about, you know. And one gets stuck with the thoughts. The third best are what we talk about, you see. And myth is that field of reference, metaphors referring to what is absolutely transcendent.
Transcript: Joseph Campbell and the Power of Myth -- 'The Message of the Myth' | BillMoyers.com​

 

[IsaacNewton]

"Not believing in these things does not prove they don't exist; unicorns, the spaghetti monster, Martians, Zeus, the Kraken...

Excellent: "not believing . . . does not prove they don't exist" is exactly correct.

And believing that things don't exist is not conclusive either.

Yes, evidence is necessary, and neither the empirical data nor the faith of the atheist prove that God does not exist.

You can't get anywhere with people who's mind is a roller coaster that always comes back to the starting point and is terrified of leaving the tracks. Your is a world of a circular loop and new thoughts are rejected as dangerous.

I leave you to your ever repeating ride.

 

[IsaacNewton]

C.S. Lewis, like almost all people that need a 'god', thinks like a child. This is common among those who need to believe in something supernatural, they need a daddy figure that will make it all better and make them feel safe. Give them a whole picture of existence because uncertainty above all else is so terrifying. The uncertainty of death being the top of this pyramid.

You're pathetically wrong here. You like the OP have set up a caricature of the religious.

cs Lewis sought out comforting myths more than he did a daddy figure

LOL An invisible daddy is created specifically as a comforting myth. Let's keep up.

 

[OnePercenter]

Those free from faith are just that: free from faith; they don't seek to 'disprove' anything, or 'do away' with religion – the notion in nonsense.

And being free from faith is not a 'belief system' or 'religion,' that's a ridiculous lie contrived by theists.

It's all about the money.....

 

[Dante]

C.S. Lewis, like almost all people that need a 'god', thinks like a child. This is common among those who need to believe in something supernatural, they need a daddy figure that will make it all better and make them feel safe. Give them a whole picture of existence because uncertainty above all else is so terrifying. The uncertainty of death being the top of this pyramid.

You're pathetically wrong here. You like the OP have set up a caricature of the religious.

cs Lewis sought out comforting myths more than he did a daddy figure

LOL An invisible daddy is created specifically as a comforting myth. Let's keep up.

Lewis is not about an invisible daddy. Instead of trying to keep up, why don't you just do the boards a favor and

 

[OnePercenter]

Good for you. I agree with you if you understand that the Constitution does not permit organized religion to cross the line but fully protects the atheist and believer's values equally to affect elections, legislation, and policy making in the public sphere.

Organized religion is an EXTREMELY profitable business.

You don't get rich writing science fiction. If you want to get rich, you start a religion. L. Ron Hubbard

 

[Taz]

"Not believing in these things does not prove they don't exist; unicorns, the spaghetti monster, Martians, Zeus, the Kraken...

Excellent: "not believing . . . does not prove they don't exist" is exactly correct.

And believing that things don't exist is not conclusive either.

Yes, evidence is necessary, and neither the empirical data nor the faith of the atheist prove that God does not exist.

That's why being agnostic is the only logical position to have.

logic fail

Can you prove that God exists? Or that God doesn't exist? No, so stfu.

Two logic fails is a row? Impressive.

Why would I personally want to prove that some god, any god exists or doesn't exist?

That's it, you can't answer, so stfu.

 

[hortysir]

Those free from faith are just that: free from faith; they don't seek to 'disprove' anything, or 'do away' with religion – the notion in nonsense.

And being free from faith is not a 'belief system' or 'religion,' that's a ridiculous lie contrived by theists.

This is one of the dodges they have learned to use the last 15 years or so, calling the absence of religion a 'religion'. Because they can't defend their own beliefs.

Whether you care to admit it or not, it IS a belief system.
You live your life according to the BELIEF that there is no one to answer to

 

[Dante]

Those free from faith are just that: free from faith; they don't seek to 'disprove' anything, or 'do away' with religion – the notion in nonsense.

And being free from faith is not a 'belief system' or 'religion,' that's a ridiculous lie contrived by theists.

This is one of the dodges they have learned to use the last 15 years or so, calling the absence of religion a 'religion'. Because they can't defend their own beliefs.

Whether you care to admit it or not, it IS a belief system.
You live your life according to the BELIEF that there is no one to answer to

non belief is NOT a belief system. It is an absence of belief. Premising that 'there is no one to answer to' implies ahead of time there is someone to answer to, who is being denied their existence.

Believing something is not part of a belief system. I believe I have some milk in my fridge. I'm not sure how much. I'm not even sure I ran out and forgot. There is NO belief system there.

If Dante walks through life not deny a god exists, what does that make him, a believer? Silly. Dante can walk through life never giving the possibility or notion of a god a second thought. That would be a non belief, but NOT a non belief system.