How Long Before Reacting To Pirates?

[Gunny]

Can you help me out here?

Why did they attack us.

Bin Laden declared jihad against the US because we are on Arab soil. We are on Arab soil at the invitation of several Arab governments. It's none of his business.

He doesn't speak for all Arabs. He doesn't speak for any Arab nation. He speaks only for radical, militant Islamic fundamentalists who wish to destroy anything that doesn't think like they do.

You can't reason nor bargain with a snake. You kill them.

 

[DiveCon]

Bin Laden declared jihad against the US because we are on Arab soil. We are on Arab soil at the invitation of several Arab governments. It's none of his business.

He doesn't speak for all Arabs. He doesn't speak for any Arab nation. He speaks only for radical, militant Islamic fundamentalists who wish to destroy anything that doesn't think like they do.

You can't reason nor bargain with a snake. You kill them.

oh, he had a huge long list of reasons
that was but one of many
he also included the immorality of Hollywood, and the infidelity of Bill Clinton, and many other things


i dont believe he was justified with ANY of them, but they are what he said

 

[RodISHI]

The Unites States can't wipe it's ass without someone bitching. Let another country step up and handle it.

Good point. Regardless if we do or don't someone will have a ***** with the US and blame the US for all of the world's woes.

 

[Gunny]

and if not for the gorelick wall, they might have been able to piece some of the parts of the puzzle together
why bush didn't boot every last one of those morons out when he took office was his biggest mistake
but he was such a divider ya know

The pieces didn't come together because of the bureaucracy that stinks up DC, and the petty jealousies that exist intra-agency. I see people on here commenting on intelligence gathering and dissemination all the time and they just really have NO idea what they're talking about.

Each agency has its own agenda, and those intel messages end up on some admin clerk's desk and he/she goes through and decides what the boss sees and doesn't.

I would in fact be amazed if our government actually today, after 9/11, managed to be proactive enough to stop the next attack. It's going to happen and people are going to ask the same questions and someone will make the same superficial, shell-game changes to appease the public and eveyone will stick their heads back in the sand until "next time."

 

[Anguille]

Give your milk money to a bully one time and he'll be back every day for it. You can either fight for it, or not get any milk, and every bully that sees this will come along for and hit you up for what they want too. Why he wants it is irrelevant.

Now the rag tag fisherman/pirates are bullies, that's TF.

I suppose the Boston Tea Party was just a bunch of bullies too. Along with every colonial who led British ships to shipwreck along the East Coast.
It all depends on from what vantage point you take.

 

[Gunny]

Now the rag tag fisherman/pirates are bullies, that's TF.

I suppose the Boston Tea Party was just a bunch of bullies too. Along with every colonial who led British ships to shipwreck along the East Coast.
It all depends on from what vantage point you take.

How dishonest do you want to go? These "ragtag fishermen" are not jumping freighters tied up alongside their coast illegally dumping. They're committing piracy in open water. So your analogy doesn't make it in any way, shape nor form.

And yeah ... shaking people down for money is bullying.

And no, it doesn't depend on my vantage point because I'm neither an apologist nor a relativist. From the point of right and wrong, the pirates are committing crimes. That simple.

 

[dilloduck]

Now the rag tag fisherman/pirates are bullies, that's TF.

I suppose the Boston Tea Party was just a bunch of bullies too. Along with every colonial who led British ships to shipwreck along the East Coast.
It all depends on from what vantage point you take.

let me guess--and whatever viewpoint I take you will take the opposite.

Rebel without a cause

 

[Gunny]

let me guess--and whatever viewpoint I take you will take the opposite.

Rebel without a cause

You guessed?

 

[Anguille]

let me guess--and whatever viewpoint I take you will take the opposite.

Rebel without a cause

Such a narcissist.

I know for a fact you take opinions based on what position you expect me to take.

 

[dilloduck]

Such a narcissist.

I know for a fact you take opinions based on what position you expect me to take.

Well shit-- I'd rather be correct instead of look like an idiot.

 

[Anguille]

How dishonest do you want to go? These "ragtag fishermen" are not jumping freighters tied up alongside their coast illegally dumping. They're committing piracy in open water. So your analogy doesn't make it in any way, shape nor form.

And yeah ... shaking people down for money is bullying.

And no, it doesn't depend on my vantage point because I'm neither an apologist nor a relativist. From the point of right and wrong, the pirates are committing crimes. That simple.

The owners of the freighters, in their minds, may not consider their dumping and trespassing in the fisherman's ancestral waters to be illegal. But they are committing crimes in the fishermen's books.
Might does not always make right. In this case, ingenuity is making right.

 

[Anguille]

You guessed?

( For ECHO )

So who asked you to barge in?

 

[Anguille]

Well shit-- I'd rather be correct instead of look like an idiot.

You've gone off course.

( Be patient, just warming up the puns. My ultimate weapon.)

 

[DiveCon]

The owners of the freighters, in their minds, may not consider their dumping and trespassing in the fisherman's ancestral waters to be illegal. But they are committing crimes in the fishermen's books.
Might does not always make right. In this case, ingenuity is making right.

are they doing it in recognized international waters? or in Solmali teritorial waters?
and yes, it makes a difference

 

[dilloduck]

You've gone off course.

( Be patient, just warming up the puns. My ultimate weapon.)

disagree---when you start channeling through Ravi you're hyper inasanity is
beyond anyone.

 

[Gunny]

The owners of the freighters, in their minds, may not consider their dumping and trespassing in the fisherman's ancestral waters to be illegal. But they are committing crimes in the fishermen's books.
Might does not always make right. In this case, ingenuity is making right.

In your case, cherrypicking facts STILL doesn't make you right. The fact is, they're pirates and they're committing crimes. You can't get from the Red Sea to the Arabia Sea without passing the coast of Somalia.

These are pirates attacking freighters that use the Suez Canal to travel to and from The Med to the Arabian Sea, Arabian Gulf, Indian Ocean or other points east or vice versa. They hold the ships and their crews captive for ransom.

There is nothing noble about them, nor do they have some noble cause. They are criminals, period.

 

[Anguille]

are they doing it in recognized international waters? or in Solmali teritorial waters?
and yes, it makes a difference

DiveClown, it doesn't matter. Everyone involved has a justification for what they are doing and what they believe they have a right to do. In the end, the biggest army wins.

I like these guys because they have spunk, like David against Goliath, Luxembourg against the Third Reich, like a little water creature, a fresh water eel against a bloated water sucking WillowTree.

 

[Anguille]

disagree---when you start channeling through Ravi you're hyper inasanity is
beyond anyone.

I've been the one and the same also with he whose name must not be pronounced. Not here though. I could be made to walk the plank here for that sort of stuff.
You think you've seen hyper-insanity in this place? You've lived a sheltered message board life.

 

[DiveCon]

DiveClown, it doesn't matter. Everyone involved has a justification for what they are doing and what they believe they have a right to do. In the end, the biggest army wins.

I like these guys because they have spunk, like David against Goliath, Luxembourg against the Third Reich, like a little water creature, a fresh water eel against a bloated water sucking WillowTree.

of course it matters
and you called ME the clown?
nice going, moron

 

[Gunny]

Profile

Puntland area in SomaliaMost pirates are aged 20-35 years old and come from the region of Puntland, a region in northeastern Somalia. The East African Seafarers' Association estimates that there are at least five pirate gangs and a total of 1,000 armed men.[45] According to a BBC report, the pirates can be divided into three main categories:

Local fishermen, considered the brains of the pirates' operations due to their skill and knowledge of the sea.
Ex-militiamen who used to fight for the local clan warlords, used as the muscle.
Technical experts who operate high-tech equipment such as the GPS systems.[46]

[edit] Background to piracy
Precise data on the economic situation in Somalia is scarce but with an estimated per capita GDP of $600/year, it remains one of the world's poorest countries.[47] Millions of Somalis depend on food aid and in 2008, according to the World Bank, as much as 73% of the population lived on a daily income below $2.[48][49] These factors and the lucrative success of many hijacking operations have drawn a number of young men toward gangs of pirates whose wealth and strength often make them part of the local social and economic elite. A resident of Garoowe quoted by the BBC said "They have money; they have power and they are getting stronger by the day. [...] They wed the most beautiful girls; they are building big houses; they have new cars; new guns.""[46]


[edit] Effects and perceptions
There have been both positive and negative effects of the pirates' economic success. Local residents have complained that the presence of so many armed men makes them feel insecure, and that their freespending ways cause wild fluctuations in the local exchange rate. Others fault them for excessive consumption of alcoholic beverages and khat.[46]

On the other hand, many other residents appreciate the rejuvenating effect that the pirates' on-shore spending and re-stocking has had on their impoverished towns, a presence which has oftentimes provided jobs and opportunity when there were none. Entire hamlets have in the process been transformed into veritable boomtowns, with local shop owners and other residents using their gains to purchase items such as generators -- allowing full days of electricity, once an unimaginable luxury.[19]


[edit] Weaponry and funding
The pirates get most of their weapons from Yemen, but a significant amount comes from Mogadishu, Somalia's capital. Weapons dealers in the capital receive a deposit from a hawala dealer on behalf of the pirates and the weapons are then driven to Puntland where the pirates pay the balance.[46] Various photographs of pirates in situ indicate that their weapons are predominantly AK47 assault rifles, RPG-7 rocket launchers and semi-automatic pistols. Additionally, given the particular origin of their weaponry, they are likely to have handgrenades such as the RGD-5.

Pirates say ransom money, when paid, arrives in burlap sacks that are sometimes dropped from helicopters or cased in waterproof suitcases loaded onto tiny skiffs in the rumbling, shark-infested waters. To authenticate the money, the pirates use currency-counting machines, the same technology used at foreign exchange bureaus worldwide. According to one pirate, these machines are, in turn, purchased from business connections in Dubai, Djibouti, and other areas.[19]

Piracy in Somalia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Yeah, some "ragtag fishermen."