How Learning Died in America

[daveman]

"Generalization does not make a good argument but if it fits your small world, keep running with it."

I love it.


Dunces like you should remember not to open your mouths except to change feet.


Question:
Where are your SPECIFIC objections to the OP?

You have none!

You just provided a GENERALIZATION, you fool!

Yeah, but it's different...somehow...it just is, dammit!! when he does it.

It's the petulant foot-stamping that really proves you wrong.

 

[boilermaker55]

Just remember you have no real idea of what you read. Comprehension , one more time , eludes you greatly.
The only way to show those that have that trouble like you is to allow you to generalize and think you are correct.
To refute generalization is easy. Just by posting that what you have posted is someones IDEA. Not facts.
Thanks but no thanks.
Your ideology and hatred and bigotry has you blinded severely.
keep up the insults that is all you are good for.

Another junk post from a junk collector.
Generalization does not make a good argument but if it fits your small world, keep running with it.

Progressive Education did it. It is the reason why American students fail in international competition.

Education writer Sol Stern explains the reason: 'Progressive Education,' the style inappropriately categorized as education, yet the dominant style in government schools.
It is no wonder that America is faring poorly in educating children, but it is a wonder that the public allows it!





1. " ... PS 87, the famous New York City public school my sons attended from 1987 to 1997.... on Manhattan’s Upper West Side. My wife and I were delighted when our older son was admitted to the school. It had just been ranked byParents magazine as one of the country’s ten best elementary schools—public or private—and the New York Times profiled it as one of the few city schools that middle-class parents still clamored to get their kids into. PS 87 had a reputation for adhering to the “progressive education” ...

a. ... instead of sitting in rows facing the teacher, as I did when I attended the New York City public schools, the children in the early grades sat in circles on a rug and often worked together in groups. I was told that this was the “open classroom” reform, introduced in the 1970s.... I soon received a crash course in educational progressivism.

2. ... the school’s teachers were trained at such citadels of progressive education as Columbia University’s Teachers College and the Bank Street College of Education, where they learned to repeat pleasant-sounding slogans like “teach the child, not the text” and were told that all children are “natural learners.”






3. PS 87 had no coherent, grade-by-grade curriculum. Thus, my son’s third-grade teacher decided on his own to devote months of classroom time to a project on Japanese culture, which included building a Japanese garden. Each day, when my son came home from school, I asked him what he had learned in math. Each day, he happily said the same thing: “We are building the Japanese garden.”

4. .... expressed our concern to the teacher about the lack of direct instruction of mathematical procedures, but he reassured us that constructing the Japanese garden required “real-life” math skills and that there was nothing to worry about. But I worried a lot, and even more so when my son moved up to fourth grade.
His new teacher assigned even more “real-life” math problems, including one that asked students to calculate how many Arawaks were killed by Christopher Columbus in 1492 during his conquest of Hispaniola.







5. PS 87’s children were taught almost nothing about such foundational subjects as the American Revolution, the framing of the Constitution, and the Civil War. I can still vividly recall a conversation with my younger son and several of his classmates when they were in the fourth grade. ... asked what, if anything, they knew about the famous Union commander for whom their school was named. They gave me blank stares.

6. More disturbing was what PS 87’s principal said when I informed him of my conversation with my son and his classmates. “It’s important to learn about the Civil War,” he granted, “but it’s more important to learn how to learn about the Civil War. The state of knowledge is constantly changing, so we have to give children the tools to be able to research these things and, of course, to think critically.”

a. [Progressive educrats] had abandoned common sense in favor of progressive education fads, backed by no evidence, which did more harm than good.


[One can see the results daily in the posts of Leftist members: they believe what they have been told to believe whether there is any evidence for said beliefs, or even when evidence to the contrary is provided. Very progressive!]





7. “The unacceptable failure of our schools has occurred not because our teachers are inept but chiefly because they are compelled to teach a fragmented curriculum based on faulty education theories.”
This didn’t happen by chance or because of professional incompetence, according to Hirsch. Rather it was intended, quite deliberately, by the schools of education. It wasn’t that professors of education favored the wrong curriculum, but that they stood for no curriculum at all. Citing romantic theories of child development going back to Rousseau, the progressives argued that, with just a little assistance from teachers, children would figure it out as they went along. That’s because students were capable of “constructing their own knowledge.”
The Redemption of E. D. Hirsch by Sol Stern - City Journal



The icon of Progressive Education is communist John Dewey.....some coincidence, huh?


With the evidence available, and it continues to pile up year after year, concerned citizens cannot believe that the dismal result is accidental.

Progressives are determined to doom this nation.

"Generalization does not make a good argument but if it fits your small world, keep running with it."

I love it.


Dunces like you should remember not to open your mouths except to change feet.


Question:
Where are your SPECIFIC objections to the OP?

You have none!

You just provided a GENERALIZATION, you fool!

 

[boilermaker55]

See above dave.

Another junk post from a junk collector.
Generalization does not make a good argument but if it fits your small world, keep running with it.

And another participation trophy collector chimes in illustrating his utter inability to refute anything in the OP.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Just remember you have no real idea of what you read. Comprehension , one more time , eludes you greatly.
The only way to show those that have that trouble like you is to allow you to generalize and think you are correct.
To refute generalization is easy. Just by posting that what you have posted is someones IDEA. Not facts.
Thanks but no thanks.
Your ideology and hatred and bigotry has you blinded severely.
keep up the insults that is all you are good for.

Another junk post from a junk collector.
Generalization does not make a good argument but if it fits your small world, keep running with it.

"Generalization does not make a good argument but if it fits your small world, keep running with it."

I love it.


Dunces like you should remember not to open your mouths except to change feet.


Question:
Where are your SPECIFIC objections to the OP?

You have none!

You just provided a GENERALIZATION, you fool!

1. Your comment belongs below the post to which you were ostensibly referring.

Like this:
"Just remember you have no real idea of what you read. Comprehension , one more time , eludes you greatly.
The only way to show those that have that trouble like you is to allow you to generalize and think you are correct.
To refute generalization is easy. Just by posting that what you have posted is someones IDEA. Not facts.
Thanks but no thanks.
Your ideology and hatred and bigotry has you blinded severely.
keep up the insults that is all you are good for."


2. Did you really feel you had to prove that you haven't a brain in your head???

Really?

What kind of moron complains that an OP is all generalization....and then offers a general complaint???

Raise your paw.



3. "...keep up the insults that is all you are good for."

Literate folks begin their sentences with a capital letter.
Did you attend government school?

We're a great team: I'm 'good for' insults....and you're good for being the
target of insults!
A win-win!




4. Ready?

You not only sound like an imbecile, but I'll hazard a guess you look exactly like one too.



5. And....I want to thank you for including your IQ in your avi.

 

[daveman]

See above dave.

Yes, I noticed your admission that you cannot refute what she said.

Makes me wonder why you're in this thread in the first place if you know you're outclassed. Did you lose a bet?

 

[initforme]

Learning died in America when parents quit holding their kids accountable. That happened about the time where it required both parents to go to work just to survive. About 1980. Whoever was in charge then well I'll tie it to him somewhat.
Parents now are so busy that there is no family time anymore. They eat fast food once every two weeks(way way too much considering the terrible health affects fast food has on our country and this cannot ever be refuted nor argued so if you want to try go ahead but you know you cant). Parents want the schools to feed their kids breakfast, teach them their morals, and babysit them after school so they can go to their jobs day in and day out to grind out a living. Sounds like a great place to have a family doesn't it?

 

[PoliticalChic]

In post #5, a problem with Common Core was mentioned.....that Liberal educrats are in charge and see to it that their agenda is imposed on children.

There will be a battle over Common Core....


"A new documentary film about Common Core promises to expose the faulty logic and pro-government agenda underlining the controversial national education standards.

The filmmaker, Ian Reid, interviewed dozens of Common Core’s supporters and opponents, but seems to come out heavily against the standards in the trailer for his film, “Building the Machine: A Film About the Common Core.” The trailer features interviews with notable critics of the standards, including education experts Sandra Stotsky, E.D. Hirsch and Joy Pullmann."
Watch this trailer for a new film that exposes Common Core | The Daily Caller

 

[PoliticalChic]

Learning died in America when parents quit holding their kids accountable. That happened about the time where it required both parents to go to work just to survive. About 1980. Whoever was in charge then well I'll tie it to him somewhat.
Parents now are so busy that there is no family time anymore. They eat fast food once every two weeks(way way too much considering the terrible health affects fast food has on our country and this cannot ever be refuted nor argued so if you want to try go ahead but you know you cant). Parents want the schools to feed their kids breakfast, teach them their morals, and babysit them after school so they can go to their jobs day in and day out to grind out a living. Sounds like a great place to have a family doesn't it?

1. "Learning died in America when parents quit holding their kids accountable."
In large measure, I agree with that statement.

Or....one could say "Learning died in America when parents quit holding the schools accountable."

Homeschooling is the answer to both problems.



2. "That happened about the time where it required both parents to go to work just to survive."
Well...first of all, 'survive' is excessive.
Rather, when materialism became the driving force in many lives.
Did you know that Marxism is based on materialism....and that is why it attacks religion at every opportunity?


a. And....taxation is both what stands between many folks getting ahead, and the reason may feel that both parents must work, and leave the children to government schools.



3. " Parents want the schools to feed their kids breakfast, teach them their morals, and babysit them after school so they can go to their jobs day in and day out to grind out a living. Sounds like a great place to have a family doesn't it?"

I get your drift.

But it certainly isn't true of all of us.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Given the garbage you post, PC, it is obvious that learning was never alive for you.

Rocks: what a perfect example of progressive education!!!


Just as I said, evidence is there that American students do poorly in international comparisons....(care to argue that?)....

...yet the only answer to that.....from what I assume is a government school grad- that would be you, Rocks- ...is to pretend that " learning was never alive for you."
My egregious error was....what?... pointing out the truth???




Now.....I do love posts that are entirely about me.....
...but, I don't believe you'd actually want to compare your education with mine....



So..…work hard to free up the congealed gears of your mind…
....cast off the shackles of your progressive education....
...and actually respond to the OP!

Las Vegas oddsmakers have you down as 50 to 1 against your being able to do it!
I'm puttin' a nickel on ya'!!

Could someone please explain to me what "learning is alive" even fucking MEANS?! What sort of meaningless leftist drivel is that?

 

[Cecilie1200]

Given the garbage you post, PC, it is obvious that learning was never alive for you.

indeed. She makes up her own formatting Just look at her posts.

\end thread.

Whereas you have yet to master capitalization and periods.

 

[daveman]

Given the garbage you post, PC, it is obvious that learning was never alive for you.

Rocks: what a perfect example of progressive education!!!


Just as I said, evidence is there that American students do poorly in international comparisons....(care to argue that?)....

...yet the only answer to that.....from what I assume is a government school grad- that would be you, Rocks- ...is to pretend that " learning was never alive for you."
My egregious error was....what?... pointing out the truth???




Now.....I do love posts that are entirely about me.....
...but, I don't believe you'd actually want to compare your education with mine....



So..…work hard to free up the congealed gears of your mind…
....cast off the shackles of your progressive education....
...and actually respond to the OP!

Las Vegas oddsmakers have you down as 50 to 1 against your being able to do it!
I'm puttin' a nickel on ya'!!

Could someone please explain to me what "learning is alive" even fucking MEANS?! What sort of meaningless leftist drivel is that?

Why I Am a Democrat

I am a Democrat because I recognize that education is important. Very, very, extremely very important. We must increase spending on education and enact important education reforms, such as eliminating standardized tests. Because we can never hope to measure this beautiful, elusive, important thing we call education.​

 

[Luddly Neddite]

National Science Teachers Association

2012 PISA Scores Released

Results from the 2012 Program for International Student Assessment, or PISA, were released last week and the focus of widespread media coverage. Highlights:

In science, the United States' mean score (497) trailed the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) average (501);
The United States ranks twenty-seventh out of thirty-four OECD countries in math performance with a mean score of 481; and
In reading, the United States' mean score (498) was higher than the OECD average of 496.

Seems pretty dumb to blame the progressives since its the right that is so dead set against all that "snobbish" and "elitist" education stuff.

What makes sense to me is to stop blaming each other and work together to FIX our country. But, that would mean getting the right to actually work for the US and that ain't gonna happen any time soon.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Rocks: what a perfect example of progressive education!!!


Just as I said, evidence is there that American students do poorly in international comparisons....(care to argue that?)....

...yet the only answer to that.....from what I assume is a government school grad- that would be you, Rocks- ...is to pretend that " learning was never alive for you."
My egregious error was....what?... pointing out the truth???




Now.....I do love posts that are entirely about me.....
...but, I don't believe you'd actually want to compare your education with mine....



So..…work hard to free up the congealed gears of your mind…
....cast off the shackles of your progressive education....
...and actually respond to the OP!

Las Vegas oddsmakers have you down as 50 to 1 against your being able to do it!
I'm puttin' a nickel on ya'!!

Could someone please explain to me what "learning is alive" even fucking MEANS?! What sort of meaningless leftist drivel is that?

Why I Am a Democrat

I am a Democrat because I recognize that education is important. Very, very, extremely very important. We must increase spending on education and enact important education reforms, such as eliminating standardized tests. Because we can never hope to measure this beautiful, elusive, important thing we call education.​

And just think, one USED to have to graduate law school to be able to use that many words to say nothing whatsoever. Isn't modern liberal education GRAND?

 

[FA_Q2]

Learning died in America when parents quit holding their kids accountable. That happened about the time where it required both parents to go to work just to survive. About 1980. Whoever was in charge then well I'll tie it to him somewhat.
Parents now are so busy that there is no family time anymore. They eat fast food once every two weeks(way way too much considering the terrible health affects fast food has on our country and this cannot ever be refuted nor argued so if you want to try go ahead but you know you cant). Parents want the schools to feed their kids breakfast, teach them their morals, and babysit them after school so they can go to their jobs day in and day out to grind out a living. Sounds like a great place to have a family doesn't it?

It does not require 2 parents working to survive. We have never had a 2 working family and we have survived the worst jobs to relatively decent ones. The idea that you NEED 2 incomes is a complete and total myth. It stems from the fact that people are no longer willing to pass on that 60 inch TV and second car. Dual income families are a choice and one that is becoming the norm not because of requirement but because people continually want more.


The continually passing of parental duties to the government has only exasperated this issue. Parents failing to educate their children about sex – don’t worry, school now takes care of that. Don’t want to feed them? We have a program for that as well. Can’t be bothered to take care of them after school? We have programs for that too! All that and the parent is NEVER held accountable for it. It is rather silly if you think about it but one of the vices of ‘free’ anything. Soon it grows and people believe they are entitled to it.

 

[RKMBrown]

Progressive Education did it. It is the reason why American students fail in international competition.

Education writer Sol Stern explains the reason: 'Progressive Education,' the style inappropriately categorized as education, yet the dominant style in government schools.
It is no wonder that America is faring poorly in educating children, but it is a wonder that the public allows it!





1. " ... PS 87, the famous New York City public school my sons attended from 1987 to 1997.... on Manhattan’s Upper West Side. My wife and I were delighted when our older son was admitted to the school. It had just been ranked byParents magazine as one of the country’s ten best elementary schools—public or private—and the New York Times profiled it as one of the few city schools that middle-class parents still clamored to get their kids into. PS 87 had a reputation for adhering to the “progressive education” ...

a. ... instead of sitting in rows facing the teacher, as I did when I attended the New York City public schools, the children in the early grades sat in circles on a rug and often worked together in groups. I was told that this was the “open classroom” reform, introduced in the 1970s.... I soon received a crash course in educational progressivism.

2. ... the school’s teachers were trained at such citadels of progressive education as Columbia University’s Teachers College and the Bank Street College of Education, where they learned to repeat pleasant-sounding slogans like “teach the child, not the text” and were told that all children are “natural learners.”






3. PS 87 had no coherent, grade-by-grade curriculum. Thus, my son’s third-grade teacher decided on his own to devote months of classroom time to a project on Japanese culture, which included building a Japanese garden. Each day, when my son came home from school, I asked him what he had learned in math. Each day, he happily said the same thing: “We are building the Japanese garden.”

4. .... expressed our concern to the teacher about the lack of direct instruction of mathematical procedures, but he reassured us that constructing the Japanese garden required “real-life” math skills and that there was nothing to worry about. But I worried a lot, and even more so when my son moved up to fourth grade.
His new teacher assigned even more “real-life” math problems, including one that asked students to calculate how many Arawaks were killed by Christopher Columbus in 1492 during his conquest of Hispaniola.







5. PS 87’s children were taught almost nothing about such foundational subjects as the American Revolution, the framing of the Constitution, and the Civil War. I can still vividly recall a conversation with my younger son and several of his classmates when they were in the fourth grade. ... asked what, if anything, they knew about the famous Union commander for whom their school was named. They gave me blank stares.

6. More disturbing was what PS 87’s principal said when I informed him of my conversation with my son and his classmates. “It’s important to learn about the Civil War,” he granted, “but it’s more important to learn how to learn about the Civil War. The state of knowledge is constantly changing, so we have to give children the tools to be able to research these things and, of course, to think critically.”

a. [Progressive educrats] had abandoned common sense in favor of progressive education fads, backed by no evidence, which did more harm than good.


[One can see the results daily in the posts of Leftist members: they believe what they have been told to believe whether there is any evidence for said beliefs, or even when evidence to the contrary is provided. Very progressive!]





7. “The unacceptable failure of our schools has occurred not because our teachers are inept but chiefly because they are compelled to teach a fragmented curriculum based on faulty education theories.”
This didn’t happen by chance or because of professional incompetence, according to Hirsch. Rather it was intended, quite deliberately, by the schools of education. It wasn’t that professors of education favored the wrong curriculum, but that they stood for no curriculum at all. Citing romantic theories of child development going back to Rousseau, the progressives argued that, with just a little assistance from teachers, children would figure it out as they went along. That’s because students were capable of “constructing their own knowledge.”
The Redemption of E. D. Hirsch by Sol Stern - City Journal



The icon of Progressive Education is communist John Dewey.....some coincidence, huh?


With the evidence available, and it continues to pile up year after year, concerned citizens cannot believe that the dismal result is accidental.

Progressives are determined to doom this nation.

I have to agree with PC, it is stunning how bad her education was.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Progressive Education did it. It is the reason why American students fail in international competition.

.

Since education in this country is mostly run at the state level, your theory should be supported by ample evidence that the most conservative states in this country are doing a better job educating their children than are the most liberal states.

Is that supported by any evidence? ,

I'll be explicit. Is that supported by any evidence that is not anecdotal and/or cherry picked?

 

[daveman]

Could someone please explain to me what "learning is alive" even fucking MEANS?! What sort of meaningless leftist drivel is that?

Why I Am a Democrat

I am a Democrat because I recognize that education is important. Very, very, extremely very important. We must increase spending on education and enact important education reforms, such as eliminating standardized tests. Because we can never hope to measure this beautiful, elusive, important thing we call education.​

And just think, one USED to have to graduate law school to be able to use that many words to say nothing whatsoever. Isn't modern liberal education GRAND?

Iowahawk nailed Democrats with that article.

 

[jasonnfree]

Learning died in America when parents quit holding their kids accountable. That happened about the time where it required both parents to go to work just to survive. About 1980. Whoever was in charge then well I'll tie it to him somewhat.
Parents now are so busy that there is no family time anymore. They eat fast food once every two weeks(way way too much considering the terrible health affects fast food has on our country and this cannot ever be refuted nor argued so if you want to try go ahead but you know you cant). Parents want the schools to feed their kids breakfast, teach them their morals, and babysit them after school so they can go to their jobs day in and day out to grind out a living. Sounds like a great place to have a family doesn't it?

Sounds like a republican dream come true. No pay raises for the middle class for decades so all the gains can go to the 1%.

 

[Old Rocks]

State Education Rankings: The Best And Worst For Math And Science

Looks like the ignoramouses are mostly in red states.

 

[RKMBrown]

State Education Rankings: The Best And Worst For Math And Science

Looks like the ignoramouses are mostly in red states.

How many different ways can we show that the bulk of legal and illegal immigration from poverty stricken countries occurs in the southern states? And how many times are we gonna bring out these old stats?