How do the non-spiritual explain it?

[edthecynic]

As you can see, if you plug in the speed of light, γ becomes infinite ergo....

Ergo, you have a physics paradox which cannot exist in our physical universe.

Ergo, we have a mathematically proven physics fact that makes a fool out of YOU!

 

[edthecynic]

I think the reason we cannot see beyond the event horizon is because time stops. There is no time space for the light to exist in, therefore nothing is seen.

My theory all along has been that it does not matter if matter's mass is infinite or anything else because at the speed of light, time stops. It can't physically exist without a time space in which to exist... doesn't matter what way you calculate it's potential weight.

Again we see the scientific ignorance of someone toooooo stupid to know the scientific difference between mass and weight, let alone that mass/matter/energy is conserved and can't suddenly stop existing as it crosses the event horizon of a black hole because it has reached the speed of light and thus time has stopped.

 

[BreezeWood]

For that you need human spiritual awareness, which you have but you're committed to suppressing. In fact ...

.
... human spiritual awareness

speaking of suppression, maybe that is why bossy is unable to recognize Spirituality and sees only the self interest of past ( Suppressors ) of true Spirituality and recognizes only what the anti-Spiritualist were trying to accomplish ... and became one of their converts.

indeed, one can not prove what one does not understand.

.

 

[Boss]

As you can see, if you plug in the speed of light, γ becomes infinite ergo....

Ergo, you have a physics paradox which cannot exist in our physical universe.

Ergo, we have a mathematically proven physics fact that makes a fool out of YOU!

No sir, you do not have anything physically proven until it happens, which it can't.

You have a mathematical formula which is nothing more than characters scribbled on a page. I can write "Elvis is not dead!" on some paper, it does not make Elvis not dead!

Now.. You and I have spent two fucking days arguing this irrelevant point that doesn't matter. Whether matter can't travel speed of light because it's mass is "infinite" or because time stops at speed of light-- either way, it's not physically possible according to actual physics. But you now have two days invested in an irrelevant argument you don't intend to lose, no matter how utterly stupid you look defending your pointless point!

If I go by past experience with you, this is about the time when you up and decide to switch the argument around, usurp MY opinion and start claiming I've been arguing yours.

 

[Boss]

I think the reason we cannot see beyond the event horizon is because time stops. There is no time space for the light to exist in, therefore nothing is seen.

My theory all along has been that it does not matter if matter's mass is infinite or anything else because at the speed of light, time stops. It can't physically exist without a time space in which to exist... doesn't matter what way you calculate it's potential weight.

Again we see the scientific ignorance of someone toooooo stupid to know the scientific difference between mass and weight, let alone that mass/matter/energy is conserved and can't suddenly stop existing as it crosses the event horizon of a black hole because it has reached the speed of light and thus time has stopped.

I didn't say it stopped existing, I said it can't physically exist with no time space. More clearly, it can't appear to exist. In order for us to observe and perceive it, there has to be a time space where it can physically exist and at the speed of light, time has stopped. You can't physically express anything when time has stopped because there is no time for physics to operate. Now perhaps matter crosses into another dimension when it hits the cosmic speed limit? Theoretically, that's a possibility. We don't know because we can only perceive things in a physical universe with time and space as a dimension.

What is not a physical possibility is the concept of infinity. Whenever a physics calculation results in a value which is infinite, it's a serious problem for physics. It means the principles of physics, including your calculation, has broken down and is unresolvable. This means, whenever we make statements about matter at speed of light, it is merely a speculation and not physically supportable.

Because your calculations say mass becomes infinite, doesn't mean anything because we know mass cannot be infinite. It doesn't matter if your calculations predict it, your calculations must be wrong.

 

[Hollie]

I think the reason we cannot see beyond the event horizon is because time stops. There is no time space for the light to exist in, therefore nothing is seen.

My theory all along has been that it does not matter if matter's mass is infinite or anything else because at the speed of light, time stops. It can't physically exist without a time space in which to exist... doesn't matter what way you calculate it's potential weight.

Again we see the scientific ignorance of someone toooooo stupid to know the scientific difference between mass and weight, let alone that mass/matter/energy is conserved and can't suddenly stop existing as it crosses the event horizon of a black hole because it has reached the speed of light and thus time has stopped.

I didn't say it stopped existing, I said it can't physically exist with no time space. More clearly, it can't appear to exist. In order for us to observe and perceive it, there has to be a time space where it can physically exist and at the speed of light, time has stopped. You can't physically express anything when time has stopped because there is no time for physics to operate. Now perhaps matter crosses into another dimension when it hits the cosmic speed limit? Theoretically, that's a possibility. We don't know because we can only perceive things in a physical universe with time and space as a dimension.

What is not a physical possibility is the concept of infinity. Whenever a physics calculation results in a value which is infinite, it's a serious problem for physics. It means the principles of physics, including your calculation, has broken down and is unresolvable. This means, whenever we make statements about matter at speed of light, it is merely a speculation and not physically supportable.

Because your calculations say mass becomes infinite, doesn't mean anything because we know mass cannot be infinite. It doesn't matter if your calculations predict it, your calculations must be wrong.

Boss'ism Alert!

".....your calculations must be wrong...... "because I say so."

Classic Boss'ism. He understands only that nothing can challenge his gawds and spirit worlds yet he's left to defend his supernaturalism with nothing more than the ranting of Henry Morris at the ICR.

 

[Boss]

I think the reason we cannot see beyond the event horizon is because time stops. There is no time space for the light to exist in, therefore nothing is seen.

My theory all along has been that it does not matter if matter's mass is infinite or anything else because at the speed of light, time stops. It can't physically exist without a time space in which to exist... doesn't matter what way you calculate it's potential weight.

Again we see the scientific ignorance of someone toooooo stupid to know the scientific difference between mass and weight, let alone that mass/matter/energy is conserved and can't suddenly stop existing as it crosses the event horizon of a black hole because it has reached the speed of light and thus time has stopped.

I didn't say it stopped existing, I said it can't physically exist with no time space. More clearly, it can't appear to exist. In order for us to observe and perceive it, there has to be a time space where it can physically exist and at the speed of light, time has stopped. You can't physically express anything when time has stopped because there is no time for physics to operate. Now perhaps matter crosses into another dimension when it hits the cosmic speed limit? Theoretically, that's a possibility. We don't know because we can only perceive things in a physical universe with time and space as a dimension.

What is not a physical possibility is the concept of infinity. Whenever a physics calculation results in a value which is infinite, it's a serious problem for physics. It means the principles of physics, including your calculation, has broken down and is unresolvable. This means, whenever we make statements about matter at speed of light, it is merely a speculation and not physically supportable.

Because your calculations say mass becomes infinite, doesn't mean anything because we know mass cannot be infinite. It doesn't matter if your calculations predict it, your calculations must be wrong.

Boss'ism Alert!

".....your calculations must be wrong...... "because I say so."

Not because I say so but because it isn't possible. Mass cannot equal infinity. If you have physical evidence to suggest it can, your physical evidence is wrong, it has to be... doesn't matter what I say.

You are in WAY over your head, toots. This conversation left your atmosphere a long time ago. Ed is arguing what he believes happens to matter at speed of light while also admitting his calculations for inertial mass prohibit matter from reaching speed of light. I am okay with Eddy's faith, it's just the presenting it as "science fact" that I have problems with. He cannot prove his formula true because it's not a physical possibility. He is assuming it would be true because the formula says so, but physics doesn't care about what you wrote on a piece of paper or what grunting sounds you created to describe it.

 

[Hollie]

I think the reason we cannot see beyond the event horizon is because time stops. There is no time space for the light to exist in, therefore nothing is seen.

My theory all along has been that it does not matter if matter's mass is infinite or anything else because at the speed of light, time stops. It can't physically exist without a time space in which to exist... doesn't matter what way you calculate it's potential weight.

Again we see the scientific ignorance of someone toooooo stupid to know the scientific difference between mass and weight, let alone that mass/matter/energy is conserved and can't suddenly stop existing as it crosses the event horizon of a black hole because it has reached the speed of light and thus time has stopped.

I didn't say it stopped existing, I said it can't physically exist with no time space. More clearly, it can't appear to exist. In order for us to observe and perceive it, there has to be a time space where it can physically exist and at the speed of light, time has stopped. You can't physically express anything when time has stopped because there is no time for physics to operate. Now perhaps matter crosses into another dimension when it hits the cosmic speed limit? Theoretically, that's a possibility. We don't know because we can only perceive things in a physical universe with time and space as a dimension.

What is not a physical possibility is the concept of infinity. Whenever a physics calculation results in a value which is infinite, it's a serious problem for physics. It means the principles of physics, including your calculation, has broken down and is unresolvable. This means, whenever we make statements about matter at speed of light, it is merely a speculation and not physically supportable.

Because your calculations say mass becomes infinite, doesn't mean anything because we know mass cannot be infinite. It doesn't matter if your calculations predict it, your calculations must be wrong.

Boss'ism Alert!

".....your calculations must be wrong...... "because I say so."

Not because I say so but because it isn't possible. Mass cannot equal infinity. If you have physical evidence to suggest it can, your physical evidence is wrong, it has to be... doesn't matter what I say.

You are in WAY over your head, toots. This conversation left your atmosphere a long time ago. Ed is arguing what he believes happens to matter at speed of light while also admitting his calculations for inertial mass prohibit matter from reaching speed of light. I am okay with Eddy's faith, it's just the presenting it as "science fact" that I have problems with. He cannot prove his formula true because it's not a physical possibility. He is assuming it would be true because the formula says so, but physics doesn't care about what you wrote on a piece of paper or what grunting sounds you created to describe it.

I do find some comedic relief in your statements of absolutes regarding subject matter you browse at the ICR and suggesting your religious dogma passes for a reasonable critique of science matters.

Discussion of science left your spirit worlds long ago as your sole source of argumentation is intended to support your spirit realms, gawds and appeals to supernaturalism.

This is why you're left to sniping as you're arguments are reduced to "..... because I say so".

 

[edthecynic]

I didn't say it stopped existing, I said it can't physically exist

March 01, 2012

RUSH: To put it bluntly, dumb people are too dumb to know it." It's a blessing! You know, the worst thing would be to be dumb and to know it -- and there's evidence all over that the dumb do not know they're dumb.

 

[edthecynic]

Now perhaps matter crosses into another dimension when it hits the cosmic speed limit? Theoretically, that's a possibility.

Idiot, matter cannot "hit the cosmic speed limit." It is not a theoretical possibility because it has been mathematically shown by Einstein to be impossible, you fool.

 

[Boss]

Now perhaps matter crosses into another dimension when it hits the cosmic speed limit? Theoretically, that's a possibility.

Idiot, matter cannot "hit the cosmic speed limit." It is not a theoretical possibility because it has been mathematically shown by Einstein to be impossible, you fool.

This is where your brain has things flip-flopped. Nothing in physics has ever happened because someone mathematically expressed it. Mathematically, it is impossible for a single electron to be in two places at the same time but it happens all the time. The electrons apparently aren't concerned with your 'flawed' mathematics.

You are saying matter cannot reach speed of light because Einstein wrote a formula which says that's not possible. The thing is, nature doesn't have any respect for Einstein or formulas, and more importantly, you're concepts of what is or isn't possible.. To complicate things further, you also seem to think that "infinity" is a resolved value and it's not... it's a physicists worst nightmare. When something calculates to infinity it means physics has no resolution and can present no valid answer as a result.

How much is two times infinity? What is the value of infinity plus one? How much is 10% of infinity? As you can see, infinity poses an impossible problem for mathematical evaluation. It is as totally useless to formulas as a question mark. .

 

[edthecynic]

Earlier, I posted the formula in physics for the gravitational constant. Now, either the formula is correct or it isn't, math doesn't produce uncertain results.

Boss V Boss

This is where your brain has things flip-flopped. Nothing in physics has ever happened because someone mathematically expressed it.

 

[Boss]

There is no contradiction of those two separate points.

 

[edthecynic]

There is no contradiction of those two separate points.

And there is no truth to that statement!

 

[Bonita Louise]

the same laws still work the same way.

But we know this is not true in physical nature.

For instance, at the speed of light, time stands still. This defies reality, but it's what happens. That's why a black hole is black, even the light particles have no timespace to exist. As objects reach the event horizon on the outer walls of a black hole, they begin to reach the speed of light and time slows down until 'poof' it stops.

At the atomic level, the famous double-slit experiment seemingly defies laws of physics.Light is a particle and a wave at the same time. It's protons can go through either slit or both slits at the same time, depending on if they are observed. There is no scientific explanation of the observer effect, it defies what should be. Subatomic particles can be connected to other subatomic particles billions of light years away and communicate instantly. Why? How can information travel billions of light years instantly?

For 2000 years, the physics laws of gravity and levity presented by Aristotle, are the "same laws still work the same way". Newton turned that on it's ear and gave us the laws of motion. Later, Einstein and Plank would challenge those laws. So our laws are ever-changing.

Yes man's laws are changing
but that doesn't mean universal laws aren't just what they are
and we just can't pin them down. I know some physicists who know all these same
things and just see it as the Universe and don't personify God as a being, so what?

You can still believe in universal laws of energy and how all these
things do this or that or whatever,
and that doesn't suddenly leap to a "personal God who interacts with man"

You can still believe the universe has its own laws
and we don't know how all they work exactly.
this doesn't have to mean there is a personal God.

Boss I've studied the patterns in why people can or cannot reconcile
their views. the number one reason is unforgiveness and fear, or whatever you call
the bias that makes people REJECT what someone else is trying to say.

get rid of that bias, and it doesn't matter if you call the universe personal or impersonal.
people will come to peace about this business and it doesn't matter if they are theist or nontheist
there won't be this mutual rejection going on caused by fear or unforgiveness or distrust of other people/groups

curiously enough, once these biases of fear/unforgiveness are removed,
yes, people DO open up and quit rejecting what is meant by God.
it is not caused by not understanding all these phenomena

it is caused by rejection from unforgiven conflicts with other people or groups
or by fear they are trying to impose their ways. it creates this weird barrier,
so remove that and people go back to their default state where they are open to truth
and don't fight over who is imposing which bias and trying to convert the other person...

Well said dear..

 

[emilynghiem]

What supernatural laws can you define for us that will explain the natural world?

Dear Hollie
You may not consider this supernatural
but the process of FORGIVING things in the past, or things collectively,
has been shown to IMPACT the individual's perception or relations with others.

Where does this change come from?
Where does the energy come from that allows a person to FORGIVE and CHANGE
perception. Does it come from within that person? So thoughts and energy we are
already generating affect themselves?

If CHANGE involves energy OUTSIDE a system, is this coming from inside or outside?
How does THAT work, can you explain emotional changes that people go through
as something internal or "externally injected" from collective society?

Is that an EQUAL exchange of energy?

If so, where did the force come from to INSTIGATE this mutual exchange?

Can you explain the relationship and perception/emotional changes
people have on each other WITHOUT referring to some collective
process that requires a "super-" or external energy coming from "outside the given system or fields of energy/waves/mass"