Heating and AC , You're screwed

[Andylusion]

Yeah, they're not making them like that anymore.

If/when mine dies, I'm looking for an old one. Last one lasted 20+ years.

I am still using my old Kenmore...if it finally dies, I will probably get a HE front-loader. My mother has one, and it is superb.

Those front load he washers are pretty cool. The only reason I don't like 'em is because they don't get my clothes clean.

Operator error, pretty much 100% of the time.

Nope. They use lukewarm water with no agitation. Garbage.

Ditched my he LG front loader last year (had for 7 years) for a Speed Queen (made in USA) top loader and magically, my clothes are clean! In half the time.

Yeah, I stand by Speed Queens. Extremely durable. Not to many bells and whistles... which is likely why they worked so well. Had washer and dryier for 13 years. Never had a problem. And I didn't buy them either. Came with the place. I have no idea how long they were there.

 

[OnePercenter]

I didn't even realize...

I guess this January the government , with their "efficiency" BS , made 14 SEER heating and air conditioning the minimum which can be sold in the U.S.

One of the manufacturers told us they are barley scraping by making 14 SEER equipment, if the government raises the minimum to 15 SEER (which I think they are already planning to do) then we're talking about high efficiency motors. In my area high efficiency motors average $1500.

The high efficiency equipment designers have a habit of placing several circuit boards into one system. circuit boards are $400 to $800. Many go out without any reason.

Like everything else, the government is going to save you 5 bucks on your monthly bill , but send the money back to the economy with high repair costs.





By-the-way, I heard something about a new refrigerant for cars, R1234 , currently selling for $1000 per jug

They don't care about costs as long as it serves their purpose.

Nobody knows this more than us in the transportation field.

During the Bush years, they forced the transportation industry to use low-sulfur fuel. Prior to that, diesel fuel was always cheaper than gasoline. After the regulation went into effect, diesel fuel surpassed the cost of gasoline; sometimes more than a dollar per gallon. But that wasn't enough.....

They also forced truck manufacturers to install thousands of dollars of "green" technologies into their vehicles. One in particular is Diesel Emission Fluid, or DEF for short. All trucks manufactured after 2010 had to have DEF systems on them. Makes you wonder how many EPA heads and Congress critters had investments in DEF companies?

But the costs of DEF and multiple computers in new trucks was just the beginning of new costs. Now, trucks breakdown ten times more often than they used to, 80% of the problems are associated with some pollution gadget going haywire.

Yes, we pay these costs up front, but who ultimately pays these costs in the end? That's right, we increase the cost of doing business to our customers who manufacture products we buy every day. From sofas to televisions, from computers to carpeting, from grapes in the grocery store to paint at your hardware store. Everything we buy today has these additional environmental costs that the transportation companies have to pass on to the rest of us.

I operate a fleet (300) Ford and International trucks. I have yet to see any issues.

I own an equipment leasing company (6000 units) and the only issues are with Freightliners which have had issues for decades.

Fuel costs which are determined by the commodities market cost you much more than any environmental costs.

 

[OnePercenter]

Kinda like the Govt logic in Mandating low flow toilets that you have to flush twice. Or outlawing incandescents that actually were 100% efficient in the seasons where your HVAC was on Heat cycles. Because the "waste heat" from the bulbs reduced the demand on the HVAC..

I know. it's all BS

No, it's the Reagan toilet.

 

[OnePercenter]

I didn't even realize...

I guess this January the government , with their "efficiency" BS , made 14 SEER heating and air conditioning the minimum which can be sold in the U.S.

One of the manufacturers told us they are barley scraping by making 14 SEER equipment, if the government raises the minimum to 15 SEER (which I think they are already planning to do) then we're talking about high efficiency motors. In my area high efficiency motors average $1500.

The high efficiency equipment designers have a habit of placing several circuit boards into one system. circuit boards are $400 to $800. Many go out without any reason.

Like everything else, the government is going to save you 5 bucks on your monthly bill , but send the money back to the economy with high repair costs.





By-the-way, I heard something about a new refrigerant for cars, R1234 , currently selling for $1000 per jug

All the 14-SEER units have too many electronics and circuit boards in them that fail long before mechanical parts do.

If the wrong one fails, the whole unit can be toast.

AC guys are not fans of 14-16 SEER units. A lot of times they have to call the manufacturer.

If you hire A/C guys that have to call the manufacturer, perhaps you're hiring the wrong A/C guys.

 

[Andylusion]

I didn't even realize...

I guess this January the government , with their "efficiency" BS , made 14 SEER heating and air conditioning the minimum which can be sold in the U.S.

One of the manufacturers told us they are barley scraping by making 14 SEER equipment, if the government raises the minimum to 15 SEER (which I think they are already planning to do) then we're talking about high efficiency motors. In my area high efficiency motors average $1500.

The high efficiency equipment designers have a habit of placing several circuit boards into one system. circuit boards are $400 to $800. Many go out without any reason.

Like everything else, the government is going to save you 5 bucks on your monthly bill , but send the money back to the economy with high repair costs.





By-the-way, I heard something about a new refrigerant for cars, R1234 , currently selling for $1000 per jug

They don't care about costs as long as it serves their purpose.

Nobody knows this more than us in the transportation field.

During the Bush years, they forced the transportation industry to use low-sulfur fuel. Prior to that, diesel fuel was always cheaper than gasoline. After the regulation went into effect, diesel fuel surpassed the cost of gasoline; sometimes more than a dollar per gallon. But that wasn't enough.....

They also forced truck manufacturers to install thousands of dollars of "green" technologies into their vehicles. One in particular is Diesel Emission Fluid, or DEF for short. All trucks manufactured after 2010 had to have DEF systems on them. Makes you wonder how many EPA heads and Congress critters had investments in DEF companies?

But the costs of DEF and multiple computers in new trucks was just the beginning of new costs. Now, trucks breakdown ten times more often than they used to, 80% of the problems are associated with some pollution gadget going haywire.

Yes, we pay these costs up front, but who ultimately pays these costs in the end? That's right, we increase the cost of doing business to our customers who manufacture products we buy every day. From sofas to televisions, from computers to carpeting, from grapes in the grocery store to paint at your hardware store. Everything we buy today has these additional environmental costs that the transportation companies have to pass on to the rest of us.

I operate a fleet (300) Ford and International trucks. I have yet to see any issues.

I own an equipment leasing company (6000 units) and the only issues are with Freightliners which have had issues for decades.

Fuel costs which are determined by the commodities market cost you much more than any environmental costs.

I don't think you realize just how much of the cost of a new vehicle, is tied directly to environmental requirement costs.

 

[Markle]

You can get an 850W solar system for about $10K. And there are many utility companies that will subsidize your install costs up to 50%. Payback time is about 8 years.

An 850 W solar system is little more than a novelty. Most panels produce a maximum of 200 watts which means this is only four panels. For a small house, you will need at least 45 to 50 panels. That cost, for the panels alone is $18,000 to $22,000 plus all the other parts and installation.

Home Solar System Price List - Compare Wholesale Discount Prices

Plus, in my experience to date, the house is harder to sell and sells for less than the price the house would bring without the solar. They are unattractive, if they are on the roof they can prevent firefighters from getting water in through the roof.

Perhaps someday they will be realistic, but certainly not today.

 

[Markle]

DDT would be an example of attempted conservative butchery in the third world.

Because of mass agricultural spraying, mosquitoes were becoming resistant to DDT. Liberals stopped that. Mosquitoes thus did not become resistant, DDT still worked against them for malaria control, and that's how liberals stopped millions of malaria deaths.

Butchers like Owebo have never forgiven us for that. Most conservatives feel the same. Most of them will proudly announce how they despise the liberal DDT policies that prevented those millions of malaria deaths. TheParty commands them to hate all liberal policies, especially the most successful ones.

Conservative PC ignorance of science and the environment is not harmless. It would kill millions, if given the chance. Given the choice between admitting they were wrong and killing millions, most conservatives would choose to kill millions.

Owebo, just how many millions dead would it take to slake your bloodlust?

Genetic mutations also cause immunity to pyrethroid's. DDT is not used for mosquito control so why do you say that killing hundreds of millions over all these years is a good thing?

 

[mamooth]

Genetic mutations also cause immunity to pyrethroid's.

Well, yes, genetic mutations combined with mass agricultural spraying. The genetic mutations don't confer any survival advantage unless the non-mutants have been killed by DDT. And the mass agricultural spraying is what the environmentalists stopped, hence the resistance was stopped, hence DDT remained useful for mosquito control, hence millions of lives were saved. We liberals are very proud of that.

DDT is not used for mosquito control

Of course it is. That's the point. It's still useful for malaria control because of environmentalists. If your policies had been followed, it wouldn't be useful, and millions would have died.

so why do you say that killing hundreds of millions over all these years is a good thing?

This isn't a discussion. You're just wrong, because all the facts and science say you're wrong. You reading something on a crank political blog doesn't change reality. Flat earthers don't become right just because they devoutly believe they're right, and neither do you.

 

[HaShev]

OH....government mandated safety gas cans...ever try filling up your damn lawn mower or weed whacker with one of those spring loaded retarded things? Yeah guaranteed to spill gas all over the place.

That's up there with the r22 cans with no screw top nipple, so it requires a tap that leaks the environmental unfriendly refrigerant and with no shut off any left over in a can has nowhere to go but out into the environment.

 

[Markle]

Why wait? The sooner we get off fossil fuel, the better.

Not in the next 100 years.

 

[Markle]

Them things suck. When My washer dies, I'll go down to the used appliance store and pick out the oldest one in the best shape I can find. My clothes get clean. I also have 2 taken-apart clothespins jammed into the ratchet system of the agitator.

Works great!

I would do that!

 

[Jarlaxle]

My 1972 Maytag washer/dryer set is chugging along fine. I've replaced the heating element in the dryer once, that's all.

Yeah, they're not making them like that anymore.

If/when mine dies, I'm looking for an old one. Last one lasted 20+ years.

I am still using my old Kenmore...if it finally dies, I will probably get a HE front-loader. My mother has one, and it is superb.

Those front load he washers are pretty cool. The only reason I don't like 'em is because they don't get my clothes clean.

Operator error, pretty much 100% of the time.

Nope. They use lukewarm water with no agitation. Garbage.

Factually incorrect. They use whatever water you set them to use-from cold to right from the water heater-and yes, they do agitate.

Compared to my top loader, my mother's front loader does a better job washing a larger load of clothes, with half the water and one-eighth the soap. There is a reason that commercial washers are front-loaders!

 

[Jarlaxle]

Naah, not for decades. Modern engines will start unaided at -25 or colder.

You're funny, just like modern anti-lock brakes work fine on icy roads.
Or that six pack of beer you forgot to bring in won't freeze.

Or that "hot water" self serve car wash won't freeze on contact with the surface of your car.

Modern ABS works well, though many older systems did not. Good beer will not freeze until below 15 degrees. Nobody mentioned a car wash. Are you in the right thread?

You were talking 25 below zero. Sorry but you have no clue.

Nobody mentioned beer. ABS was never mentioned. Only you mentioned a self-serve car wash. I repeat: are you in the right thread?

You set the table at 25 below zero. I was just telling you what it's like at that temperature. Knowledge you are clearly lacking in.

Actually (sound of hanging curve being launched into the Monster Seats) I have started engines at that temperature. Several cars, no block heaters used: turn the key. They started. Old pickup with a Holley carb: pump once, push in clutch, crank engine, pump again while cranking. It started, sputtered a few times, then stayed running. Diesel pickup: cycle glow plugs three times, push clutch, turn key. It started after about ten seconds of cranking...sputtered & smoked for maybe 30 seconds, but stayed running. I fired up an old Detroit Diesel at 13 below zero about ten years ago...half-second shot of ether, press the starter button...it cranked over a few times, and fired.

Modern vehicles will start unaided at -25 with no drama. (Indeed, most will start colder than that...I recall GM tests to -45.) If yours will not, something is wrong with it!

 

[Jarlaxle]

All of which lack either power, reliability, or cost effectiveness.

Solar is very expensive and you depend on nice sunny days to get enough power to run your home. It's a bad investment that will never pay off. Same with wind. It's a very expensive investment and offers no real return. By the time you create enough electricity to break even on the investment, the thing breaks down and it's very costly to repair. And again, unreliable since it only works when it's windy, and if you have too much wind, it shuts down in effort to protect it from being damaged.

Electric cars? What's the point? It takes fossil fuels tho create the electricity to run it. If you need a charge overnight, and the power goes off, you are going to piss off your boss trying to explain why you can't get to work. If your car is low on electricity, and you end up sitting in a traffic jam for a couple of hours with the AC or heat blowing, your car is just going to stop working and you're going to need a tow.

You can get an 850W solar system for about $10K. And there are many utility companies that will subsidize your install costs up to 50%. Payback time is about 8 years.

Wind turbine set ups start at 2KW and cost anywhere from $10 - $70K. The approximate payback time is about 6 years.

Granted, the systems are still a little pricey, but once they reach their payback dates, you don't pay anymore utility bills, ever. Or your bills are very small, if the systems periodically go down from time to time. If you reduce your carbon footprint, that should be enough to meet your energy needs.

As far as cars, you can plan your route ahead of time and I doubt you would run out of power over night, unless there was a blackout, which don't happen all that often.

None of those work for BASE LOAD.

 

[Jarlaxle]

I'm curious, what prevents you from turning down the shower valve?

I never use full force when taking a shower. 90% of good clean water just goes down the drain. I keep the shower as low as possible and only turn it up when I rinse my hair. Water is expensive here, and I was telling my nephew how I would like to design a shower head that has an on/off chain. You don't need water running while you're soaping up or washing your hair, you only need it for rinsing.

That's been done.

Here you go: Shower Head,Water-Saver by LDR INDUSTRIES, INC | eBay

You push the tab back and forth to turn water on/off.

THAT'S THE ONE! That is the showerhead I use!

 

[Jarlaxle]

I didn't even realize...

I guess this January the government , with their "efficiency" BS , made 14 SEER heating and air conditioning the minimum which can be sold in the U.S.

One of the manufacturers told us they are barley scraping by making 14 SEER equipment, if the government raises the minimum to 15 SEER (which I think they are already planning to do) then we're talking about high efficiency motors. In my area high efficiency motors average $1500.

The high efficiency equipment designers have a habit of placing several circuit boards into one system. circuit boards are $400 to $800. Many go out without any reason.

Like everything else, the government is going to save you 5 bucks on your monthly bill , but send the money back to the economy with high repair costs.

By-the-way, I heard something about a new refrigerant for cars, R1234 , currently selling for $1000 per jug

They don't care about costs as long as it serves their purpose.

Nobody knows this more than us in the transportation field.

During the Bush years, they forced the transportation industry to use low-sulfur fuel. Prior to that, diesel fuel was always cheaper than gasoline. After the regulation went into effect, diesel fuel surpassed the cost of gasoline; sometimes more than a dollar per gallon. But that wasn't enough.....

They also forced truck manufacturers to install thousands of dollars of "green" technologies into their vehicles. One in particular is Diesel Emission Fluid, or DEF for short. All trucks manufactured after 2010 had to have DEF systems on them. Makes you wonder how many EPA heads and Congress critters had investments in DEF companies?

But the costs of DEF and multiple computers in new trucks was just the beginning of new costs. Now, trucks breakdown ten times more often than they used to, 80% of the problems are associated with some pollution gadget going haywire.

Yes, we pay these costs up front, but who ultimately pays these costs in the end? That's right, we increase the cost of doing business to our customers who manufacture products we buy every day. From sofas to televisions, from computers to carpeting, from grapes in the grocery store to paint at your hardware store. Everything we buy today has these additional environmental costs that the transportation companies have to pass on to the rest of us.

I operate a fleet (300) Ford and International trucks. I have yet to see any issues.

I own an equipment leasing company (6000 units) and the only issues are with Freightliners which have had issues for decades.

Fuel costs which are determined by the commodities market cost you much more than any environmental costs.

Bullshit. Anyone running a fleet-ESPECIALLY anyone running Internationals-will know about the problems with 2007+ diesel emission systems.

Ford hasn't sold a decent diesel pickup since 2003.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I didn't even realize...

I guess this January the government , with their "efficiency" BS , made 14 SEER heating and air conditioning the minimum which can be sold in the U.S.

One of the manufacturers told us they are barley scraping by making 14 SEER equipment, if the government raises the minimum to 15 SEER (which I think they are already planning to do) then we're talking about high efficiency motors. In my area high efficiency motors average $1500.

The high efficiency equipment designers have a habit of placing several circuit boards into one system. circuit boards are $400 to $800. Many go out without any reason.

Like everything else, the government is going to save you 5 bucks on your monthly bill , but send the money back to the economy with high repair costs.





By-the-way, I heard something about a new refrigerant for cars, R1234 , currently selling for $1000 per jug

They don't care about costs as long as it serves their purpose.

Nobody knows this more than us in the transportation field.

During the Bush years, they forced the transportation industry to use low-sulfur fuel. Prior to that, diesel fuel was always cheaper than gasoline. After the regulation went into effect, diesel fuel surpassed the cost of gasoline; sometimes more than a dollar per gallon. But that wasn't enough.....

They also forced truck manufacturers to install thousands of dollars of "green" technologies into their vehicles. One in particular is Diesel Emission Fluid, or DEF for short. All trucks manufactured after 2010 had to have DEF systems on them. Makes you wonder how many EPA heads and Congress critters had investments in DEF companies?

But the costs of DEF and multiple computers in new trucks was just the beginning of new costs. Now, trucks breakdown ten times more often than they used to, 80% of the problems are associated with some pollution gadget going haywire.

Yes, we pay these costs up front, but who ultimately pays these costs in the end? That's right, we increase the cost of doing business to our customers who manufacture products we buy every day. From sofas to televisions, from computers to carpeting, from grapes in the grocery store to paint at your hardware store. Everything we buy today has these additional environmental costs that the transportation companies have to pass on to the rest of us.

I operate a fleet (300) Ford and International trucks. I have yet to see any issues.

I own an equipment leasing company (6000 units) and the only issues are with Freightliners which have had issues for decades.

Fuel costs which are determined by the commodities market cost you much more than any environmental costs.

This is how you display you are so FOS. You are not a one-percent of anything. International trucks have the most problems staying away from tow trucks. They always were garbage, but much worse after they were forced to put in all this pollution BS. Freightliners stayed on the road forever before they had to put all the pollution stuff on theirs. Not only do they break down constantly, but over 80% of the time, it's because of some pollution gadget going haywire. To offset the thousands of dollars in additional environmental costs, they began installing cheaper parts in the truck. You can't sit in your mom's basement pretending you are wealthy and know something about this industry, you have to actually be in it.

Oh, and another thing you know nothing about. The commodity market has always set the price of fuel. Do you think this all started a few years ago? The commodities market doesn't "cost" you anything. The commodities market was created (and is used for) price stabilization.

You can't bring a knife to a gun fight. I've been driving trucks for nearly 30 years now and my current company uses Freightliner and International trucks. I also traded commodities for several years as well.

 

[Jarlaxle]

I didn't even realize...

I guess this January the government , with their "efficiency" BS , made 14 SEER heating and air conditioning the minimum which can be sold in the U.S.

One of the manufacturers told us they are barley scraping by making 14 SEER equipment, if the government raises the minimum to 15 SEER (which I think they are already planning to do) then we're talking about high efficiency motors. In my area high efficiency motors average $1500.

The high efficiency equipment designers have a habit of placing several circuit boards into one system. circuit boards are $400 to $800. Many go out without any reason.

Like everything else, the government is going to save you 5 bucks on your monthly bill , but send the money back to the economy with high repair costs.





By-the-way, I heard something about a new refrigerant for cars, R1234 , currently selling for $1000 per jug

They don't care about costs as long as it serves their purpose.

Nobody knows this more than us in the transportation field.

During the Bush years, they forced the transportation industry to use low-sulfur fuel. Prior to that, diesel fuel was always cheaper than gasoline. After the regulation went into effect, diesel fuel surpassed the cost of gasoline; sometimes more than a dollar per gallon. But that wasn't enough.....

They also forced truck manufacturers to install thousands of dollars of "green" technologies into their vehicles. One in particular is Diesel Emission Fluid, or DEF for short. All trucks manufactured after 2010 had to have DEF systems on them. Makes you wonder how many EPA heads and Congress critters had investments in DEF companies?

But the costs of DEF and multiple computers in new trucks was just the beginning of new costs. Now, trucks breakdown ten times more often than they used to, 80% of the problems are associated with some pollution gadget going haywire.

Yes, we pay these costs up front, but who ultimately pays these costs in the end? That's right, we increase the cost of doing business to our customers who manufacture products we buy every day. From sofas to televisions, from computers to carpeting, from grapes in the grocery store to paint at your hardware store. Everything we buy today has these additional environmental costs that the transportation companies have to pass on to the rest of us.

I operate a fleet (300) Ford and International trucks. I have yet to see any issues.

I own an equipment leasing company (6000 units) and the only issues are with Freightliners which have had issues for decades.

Fuel costs which are determined by the commodities market cost you much more than any environmental costs.

I don't think you realize just how much of the cost of a new vehicle, is tied directly to environmental requirement costs.

The list of things our resident trust-fund child does not understand is quite long.

 

[Jarlaxle]

This is how you display you are so FOS. You are not a one-percent of anything. International trucks have the most problems staying away from tow trucks. They always were garbage, but much worse after they were forced to put in all this pollution BS. Freightliners stayed on the road forever before they had to put all the pollution stuff on theirs. Not only do they break down constantly, but over 80% of the time, it's because of some pollution gadget going haywire. To offset the thousands of dollars in additional environmental costs, they began installing cheaper parts in the truck. You can't sit in your mom's basement pretending you are wealthy and know something about this industry, you have to actually be in it.

Oh, and another thing you know nothing about. The commodity market has always set the price of fuel. Do you think this all started a few years ago? The commodities market doesn't "cost" you anything. The commodities market was created (and is used for) price stabilization.

You can't bring a knife to a gun fight. I've been driving trucks for nearly 30 years now and my current company uses Freightliner and International trucks. I also traded commodities for several years as well.

Freightliner sucks. Their day-cab trucks are low-bid garbage and make no effort to hide the fact. They are noisy, poorly-built penalty boxes.

 

[pwjohn]

You're funny, just like modern anti-lock brakes work fine on icy roads.
Or that six pack of beer you forgot to bring in won't freeze.

Or that "hot water" self serve car wash won't freeze on contact with the surface of your car.

Modern ABS works well, though many older systems did not. Good beer will not freeze until below 15 degrees. Nobody mentioned a car wash. Are you in the right thread?

You were talking 25 below zero. Sorry but you have no clue.

Nobody mentioned beer. ABS was never mentioned. Only you mentioned a self-serve car wash. I repeat: are you in the right thread?

You set the table at 25 below zero. I was just telling you what it's like at that temperature. Knowledge you are clearly lacking in.

Actually (sound of hanging curve being launched into the Monster Seats) I have started engines at that temperature. Several cars, no block heaters used: turn the key. They started. Old pickup with a Holley carb: pump once, push in clutch, crank engine, pump again while cranking. It started, sputtered a few times, then stayed running. Diesel pickup: cycle glow plugs three times, push clutch, turn key. It started after about ten seconds of cranking...sputtered & smoked for maybe 30 seconds, but stayed running. I fired up an old Detroit Diesel at 13 below zero about ten years ago...half-second shot of ether, press the starter button...it cranked over a few times, and fired.

Modern vehicles will start unaided at -25 with no drama. (Indeed, most will start colder than that...I recall GM tests to -45.) If yours will not, something is wrong with it!