Zone1 Gun Violence in Democratic cities

[LOIE]

On a recent thread I saw someone once again make claims that Democrats are at fault for gun violence and homicides. They also frequently say that Democratic run cities, which are majority black, are at greater fault and that they don't care about blacks but just use them to get votes.

I just read this very interesting article by The Trace (Reporting on Guns and Violence in America):

Days after 11 worshippers were gunned down by an anti-Semite wielding an AR-15 at a synagogue in Pittsburgh, Mayor Bill Peduto urged the City Council to pass new laws regulating access to high-powered weapons. This week, Peduto followed up his plea with emails to dozens of mayors across the country urging them to do the same — even though it would probably result in lawsuits.

That’s because Pennsylvania, like 44 other states, has a “preemption” law prohibiting local governments from enacting gun regulations that are stricter than those passed by state legislatures.

This way of restricting local law-making was pioneered by tobacco companies looking to head off regulation in the 1960s and ‘70s. But in the last few decades, the National Rifle Association, through its supporters in state legislatures, has repeatedly used preemption to successfully block gun reform efforts. And the threat of lawsuits against cities that run afoul of the legislation has had a chilling effect on local lawmakers across the country, even in deep blue states like California.

What exactly is preemption?

Preemption, in the constitutional context, refers to the pecking order of legislation: Federal trumps state, and, in much of the United States, states trump municipalities when it comes to gun regulation. A typical preemption law says that the state legislature occupies “the whole field” of firearms regulation, and declares municipal ordinances, like bans on assaults weapons or mandatory reporting of stolen guns, “null and void.”

How many states have preemption statutes for firearms?

Currently 44 states preempt localities from enacting their own gun laws. That includes such gun reform strongholds as Washington State and Maryland. California has a law that preempts local governments from handling gun permitting and registration, but allows cities and towns to broadly regulate guns.

The five states that allow cities to enact their own gun laws without restriction — Connecticut, Hawaii, Massachusetts, New Jersey, and New York — are also the states with the lowest rates of gun death.

Some preemption laws go so far as to punish individual lawmakers for spearheading gun laws. In Arizona and Florida, local officials can be subjected to fines, and in five states — Florida, Iowa, Kentucky, Minnesota, and Mississippi — they can be personally sued and ordered to pay damages and attorneys’ fees to the winning side. In most cases, that’s the NRA or its local affiliates.

This paragraph comes from "The Second," by Carol Anderson and addresses the same issue:

“African Americans in Chicago and Washington, D.C. had faced staggering gun violence and record homicides, and responded with statues to reduce the number of firearms in their cities. But they soon ran head-long into the NRA-backed Supreme Court decisions that interpreted gun control as violating the individual’s right to bear arms. Guns would once again legally flood those cities. Similarly, state laws that banned firearms in public housing in order to provide for the security and safety of the residents have also been overturned. “

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

On a recent thread I saw someone once again make claims that Democrats are at fault for gun violence and homicides. They also frequently say that Democratic run cities, which are majority black, are at greater fault and that they don't care about blacks but just use them to get votes.

I just read this very interesting article by The Trace (Reporting on Guns and Violence in America):

Days after 11 worshippers were gunned down by an anti-Semite wielding an AR-15 at a synagogue in Pittsburgh, Mayor Bill Peduto urged the City Council to pass new laws regulating access to high-powered weapons. This week, Peduto followed up his plea with emails to dozens of mayors across the country urging them to do the same — even though it would probably result in lawsuits.

That’s because Pennsylvania, like 44 other states, has a “preemption” law prohibiting local governments from enacting gun regulations that are stricter than those passed by state legislatures.

This way of restricting local law-making was pioneered by tobacco companies looking to head off regulation in the 1960s and ‘70s. But in the last few decades, the National Rifle Association, through its supporters in state legislatures, has repeatedly used preemption to successfully block gun reform efforts. And the threat of lawsuits against cities that run afoul of the legislation has had a chilling effect on local lawmakers across the country, even in deep blue states like California.

What exactly is preemption?

Preemption, in the constitutional context, refers to the pecking order of legislation: Federal trumps state, and, in much of the United States, states trump municipalities when it comes to gun regulation. A typical preemption law says that the state legislature occupies “the whole field” of firearms regulation, and declares municipal ordinances, like bans on assaults weapons or mandatory reporting of stolen guns, “null and void.”

How many states have preemption statutes for firearms?

Currently 44 states preempt localities from enacting their own gun laws. That includes such gun reform strongholds as Washington State and Maryland. California has a law that preempts local governments from handling gun permitting and registration, but allows cities and towns to broadly regulate guns.

The five states that allow cities to enact their own gun laws without restriction — Connecticut, Hawaii, Massachusetts, New Jersey, and New York — are also the states with the lowest rates of gun death.

Some preemption laws go so far as to punish individual lawmakers for spearheading gun laws. In Arizona and Florida, local officials can be subjected to fines, and in five states — Florida, Iowa, Kentucky, Minnesota, and Mississippi — they can be personally sued and ordered to pay damages and attorneys’ fees to the winning side. In most cases, that’s the NRA or its local affiliates.

This paragraph comes from "The Second," by Carol Anderson and addresses the same issue:

“African Americans in Chicago and Washington, D.C. had faced staggering gun violence and record homicides, and responded with statues to reduce the number of firearms in their cities. But they soon ran head-long into the NRA-backed Supreme Court decisions that interpreted gun control as violating the individual’s right to bear arms. Guns would once again legally flood those cities. Similarly, state laws that banned firearms in public housing in order to provide for the security and safety of the residents have also been overturned. “

Do you think criminals will follow the law and not get weapons that can be purchased illegally? Criminals will find any means necessary to commit a crime.

US authorities do not publish figures for the number of weapons believed to be trafficked, but between 2014 and 2019 the ATF traced more than 70,000 guns from Mexico back to the United States.

American guns are a key driver in the migration crisis. When will ... - CNN​

www.cnn.com/2021/06/07/americas/kamala-harris-central-america-gun-intl/ind

 

[$ecular#eckler]

Okay, so what did you learn from the article that I am supposed to review?

Do you want me to analyze the article, and suggest the solution to the violence in America problem?

I see we are in the Racism Board. So, I see that the Democrats are inclined to exploit the white-dominated mass killings to implement their control on the black-dominated gangster shoot-outs, rather than trying to reason with them to act like the community of love and equality that they describe themselves to be.

 

[task0778]

Link?

On a recent thread I saw someone once again make claims that Democrats are at fault for gun violence and homicides. They also frequently say that Democratic run cities, which are majority black, are at greater fault and that they don't care about blacks but just use them to get votes.

Ask yourself why so many democratic run cities have so much gun violence and homicides. Ask yourself what happens when social justice judges and DAs do not prosecute or sentence to the fullest extentof the law those who commit crimes with a gun. Ask yourself why BLM doesn't give a damn about black lives unless a cop is involved. Ask yourself so many mayor and city councils told their police depts to stand down when nightly riots were going on and people were being killed.

 

[LOIE]

Do you think criminals will follow the law and not get weapons that can be purchased illegally? Criminals will find any means necessary to commit a crime.

US authorities do not publish figures for the number of weapons believed to be trafficked, but between 2014 and 2019 the ATF traced more than 70,000 guns from Mexico back to the United States.

American guns are a key driver in the migration crisis. When will ... - CNN​

www.cnn.com/2021/06/07/americas/kamala-harris-central-america-gun-intl/ind

Places like the U.K. and Australia enacted very strict gun laws and bans after mass shootings. I am sure that they still have criminals who will, as you say, find a way to commit a crime, but they have pretty much eliminated mass shootings.

I just feel badly for the cities and states who try so hard, but are overrun with illegal weapons from out of their jurisdiction. And I do not believe that blacks, who are so often blamed for the majority of gun violence, are the traffickers either. I don't know if they have the money, the connections, the planes, etc. to bring guns into the country.

 

[miketx]

On a recent thread I saw someone once again make claims that Democrats are at fault for gun violence and homicides. They also frequently say that Democratic run cities, which are majority black, are at greater fault and that they don't care about blacks but just use them to get votes.

I just read this very interesting article by The Trace (Reporting on Guns and Violence in America):

Days after 11 worshippers were gunned down by an anti-Semite wielding an AR-15 at a synagogue in Pittsburgh, Mayor Bill Peduto urged the City Council to pass new laws regulating access to high-powered weapons. This week, Peduto followed up his plea with emails to dozens of mayors across the country urging them to do the same — even though it would probably result in lawsuits.

That’s because Pennsylvania, like 44 other states, has a “preemption” law prohibiting local governments from enacting gun regulations that are stricter than those passed by state legislatures.

This way of restricting local law-making was pioneered by tobacco companies looking to head off regulation in the 1960s and ‘70s. But in the last few decades, the National Rifle Association, through its supporters in state legislatures, has repeatedly used preemption to successfully block gun reform efforts. And the threat of lawsuits against cities that run afoul of the legislation has had a chilling effect on local lawmakers across the country, even in deep blue states like California.

What exactly is preemption?

Preemption, in the constitutional context, refers to the pecking order of legislation: Federal trumps state, and, in much of the United States, states trump municipalities when it comes to gun regulation. A typical preemption law says that the state legislature occupies “the whole field” of firearms regulation, and declares municipal ordinances, like bans on assaults weapons or mandatory reporting of stolen guns, “null and void.”

How many states have preemption statutes for firearms?

Currently 44 states preempt localities from enacting their own gun laws. That includes such gun reform strongholds as Washington State and Maryland. California has a law that preempts local governments from handling gun permitting and registration, but allows cities and towns to broadly regulate guns.

The five states that allow cities to enact their own gun laws without restriction — Connecticut, Hawaii, Massachusetts, New Jersey, and New York — are also the states with the lowest rates of gun death.

Some preemption laws go so far as to punish individual lawmakers for spearheading gun laws. In Arizona and Florida, local officials can be subjected to fines, and in five states — Florida, Iowa, Kentucky, Minnesota, and Mississippi — they can be personally sued and ordered to pay damages and attorneys’ fees to the winning side. In most cases, that’s the NRA or its local affiliates.

This paragraph comes from "The Second," by Carol Anderson and addresses the same issue:

“African Americans in Chicago and Washington, D.C. had faced staggering gun violence and record homicides, and responded with statues to reduce the number of firearms in their cities. But they soon ran head-long into the NRA-backed Supreme Court decisions that interpreted gun control as violating the individual’s right to bear arms. Guns would once again legally flood those cities. Similarly, state laws that banned firearms in public housing in order to provide for the security and safety of the residents have also been overturned. “

Just for the record, guns aren't violent.

 

[task0778]

I just feel badly for the cities and states who try so hard, but are overrun with illegal weapons from out of their jurisdiction.

I have a problem feeling bad for those cities and states because they do not prosecute and sentence crimes where guns are involved as severely as they should. There's this thing called deterrence, which doesn't exist if you're soft on gun crime.

And I do not believe that blacks, who are so often blamed for the majority of gun violence, are the traffickers either.

Based on what evidence or data? Not that it really matters, if you shoot somebody with an illegal gun then what's the difference who gave him the gun in the 1st place?


Interestingly, deaths by firearms in 2020 per 100,000 population by race shows the overall number in the US at 13.6. Whites are 11.6 and Blacks are 31.8.

Causes of death attributable to firearm mortality include Accidental discharge of firearm, Intentional self-harm by firearm, Assault by firearm, Firearm discharge, undetermined intent; and Legal intervention involving firearm discharge. Deaths from injury by firearms exclude deaths due to explosives and other causes indirectly related to firearms.

Deaths Due to Firearms per 100,000 Population by Race/Ethnicity

www.kff.org

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

Places like the U.K. and Australia enacted very strict gun laws and bans after mass shootings. I am sure that they still have criminals who will, as you say, find a way to commit a crime, but they have pretty much eliminated mass shootings.

I just feel badly for the cities and states who try so hard, but are overrun with illegal weapons from out of their jurisdiction. And I do not believe that blacks, who are so often blamed for the majority of gun violence, are the traffickers either. I don't know if they have the money, the connections, the planes, etc. to bring guns into the country.

Of course both of those areas that you talk about, are surrounded by water, making very hard for illegals to cross into those countries. Why is it so easy for guns, drugs and diseased people to cross into our country? Oh yeah, Joe Biteme and Camel Toe Harris doing nothing to stop the flow.

 

[Failzero]

I wish there was a pipeline into the US of Firearms & parts ( Cuban AK / AKM kits ) ( African FAL kits & barrels ) ( South American FAL rifles & parts kits ...

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

I wish there was a pipeline into the US of Firearms & parts ( Cuban AK / AKM kits ) ( African FAL kits & barrels ) ( South American FAL rifles & parts kits ...

There is, it is called the Democrat Party....

 

[Failzero]

There is, it is called the Democrat Party....

No they are pushin bans and confiscations of such hardware

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

No they are pushin bans and confiscations of such hardware

For law abiding citizens, not criminals.

 

[LOIE]

Of course both of those areas that you talk about, are surrounded by water, making very hard for illegals to cross into those countries. Why is it so easy for guns, drugs and diseased people to cross into our country? Oh yeah, Joe Biteme and Camel Toe Harris doing nothing to stop the flow.

Actually, I have read a few articles that say the US gun manufacturers are trafficking guns INTO Mexico, Central America, El Salvador and Honduras. Mexico has even sued some of them to keep the guns out.

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

Actually, I have read a few articles that say the US gun manufacturers are trafficking guns INTO Mexico, Central America, El Salvador and Honduras. Mexico has even sued some of them to keep the guns out.

Actually, I have read a few articles that say the US gun manufacturers are trafficking guns INTO Mexico,

Holder Suggests 'Fast and Furious' Guns Will Be Used in Crimes for 'Years to Come'

"Although the department has taken steps to ensure that such tactics are never used again, it is an unfortunate reality that we will continue to feel the effects of this flawed operation for years to come," he said. "Guns lost during this operation will continue to show up at crime scenes on both sides of the border."

10,000 Mexicans and 1 border agent were murdered by Obama's Eric Holder who allowed guns to be purchased by drug cartels and used against Mexican citizens, and the murder of a US citizen. Progressives dont give a shit about little people and will do what ever it takes to disarm you, because you are a little person.

 

[LOIE]

Based on what evidence or data?

That's why I said it the way I did. It's an individual belief and feeling I have. I did just watch Rev. Al Sharpton on his show. He was talking about the many things he has done to combat inner city violence, the marches, the programs, the outreach, etc. through his many, many years of activism. He mentioned that he, as a democrat was barely every supported in any way by republicans in his efforts. He said that the republican senators making the most noise right now are more interested in fueling the culture wars than they are in actually working together with him and others to solve the gun violence problem.

 

[task0778]

That's why I said it the way I did. It's an individual belief and feeling I have. I did just watch Rev. Al Sharpton on his show. He was talking about the many things he has done to combat inner city violence, the marches, the programs, the outreach, etc. through his many, many years of activism. He mentioned that he, as a democrat was barely every supported in any way by republicans in his efforts. He said that the republican senators making the most noise right now are more interested in fueling the culture wars than they are in actually working together with him and others to solve the gun violence problem.

Some would say the reverse of that is true, that Sharpton is a huckster interested in fueling the culture wars to make as much money as possible, not unlike the BLM founders. But everyone is entitled to their own beliefs and opinions. And to be frank, I don't think the democrat policies have worked out very well for the black community, so maybe the GOP was right not to funnel more money into bad ideas.

 

[miketx]

Actually, I have read a few articles that say the US gun manufacturers are trafficking guns INTO Mexico, Central America, El Salvador and Honduras. Mexico has even sued some of them to keep the guns out.

media fed all the way, aren't you?

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

That's why I said it the way I did. It's an individual belief and feeling I have. I did just watch Rev. Al Sharpton on his show. He was talking about the many things he has done to combat inner city violence, the marches, the programs, the outreach, etc. through his many, many years of activism. He mentioned that he, as a democrat was barely every supported in any way by republicans in his efforts. He said that the republican senators making the most noise right now are more interested in fueling the culture wars than they are in actually working together with him and others to solve the gun violence problem.

He was talking about the many things he has done to combat inner city violence, the marches, the programs, the outreach, etc. through his many, many years of activism.

Al Sharlatin is a media whore, and always seeking the lime light, never once thinking about actually doing something to stop black on black crime. Jessie "love child" Jackson also was a whore.

16 Facts About Al Sharpton the Media Won't Tell You

The Rev. Al Sharpton has been praised as a civil rights icon, and "60 Minutes" reported that he has become President Obama's "go-to black leader."

www.newsmax.com

 

[Failzero]

Actually, I have read a few articles that say the US gun manufacturers are trafficking guns INTO Mexico, Central America, El Salvador and Honduras. Mexico has even sued some of them to keep the guns out.

Fast & Furious 2.0 ??

 

[Abatis]

. . . Pennsylvania, like 44 other states, has a “preemption” law prohibiting local governments from enacting gun regulations that are stricter than those passed by state legislatures.

This way of restricting local law-making was pioneered by tobacco companies

No, it was "pioneered" by the constitution of Pennsylvania.

PA's constitution, like many states has a peculiar structure in that the rights of the citizens are declared in Article I, before a single power is granted to the government. This makes it crystal clear that those rights are being excepted out of the powers being conferred to government, not being granted by the government being created.

Article I, §21 of the PA constitution declares:

The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the State shall not be questioned.​

Article I, §25 of the PA constitution declares:

To guard against transgressions of the high powers which we have delegated, we declare that everything in this article is excepted out of the general powers of government and shall forever remain inviolate.​

Article I, §26 of the PA constitution declares:

Neither the Commonwealth nor any political subdivision thereof shall deny to any person the enjoyment of any civil right, nor discriminate against any person in the exercise of any civil right.​

So . . . Because the citizen's right to bear arms in their own defense shall not be questioned, and that right is excepted out of the powers being granted and shall forever remain inviolate, and no political subdivision shall deny or discriminate against any right or its exercise, is why preemption exists.

What exactly is preemption?

In Pennsylvania, state law enforces the above constitutional provisions:

§6120. Limitation on Municipal Regulation of Firearms​

(a) General rule. No county, municipality or township may in any manner regulate the lawful ownership, possession or transportation of firearms when carried or transported for purposes not prohibited by the laws of this commonwealth.​

The state supreme court interpreted the constitutional provisions and §6120(a) and ruled and defined it like this:

"Because the ownership of firearms is constitutionally protected, its regulation is a matter of statewide concern. The constitution does not provide that the right to bear arms shall not be questioned in any part of the commonwealth except Philadelphia and Pittsburgh, where it may be abridged at will, but that it shall not be questioned in any part of the commonwealth. Thus, regulation of firearms is a matter of concern in all of Pennsylvania, not merely in Philadelphia and Pittsburgh, and the General Assembly, not city councils, is the proper forum for the imposition of such regulation."​

The five states that allow cities to enact their own gun laws without restriction — Connecticut, Hawaii, Massachusetts, New Jersey, and New York — are also the states with the lowest rates of gun death.

They also share either no right to arms provision in their state constitution, or a weakly enforced one.

SCOTUS is going to remedy that BS shortly . . .

Some preemption laws go so far as to punish individual lawmakers for spearheading gun laws.

Why shouldn't lawmakers who disobey their oaths of office and use their sworn powers to violate their state's constitution and the rights of the state's citizens, face severe penalties?

.