Gods Own Party Can’t Get Over Same Sex Marriage

[TheProgressivePatriot]

And it still works to heal these conditions in SOME cases. Not all are like that, but because some ARE, that shows that SOME can change. If they are caused by internal spiritual conflicts that can be resolved, then it is possible in SOME cases for both the internal and the outward results and behavior to change as well.

Some people are shamed and coerced into living a lie until the day that it all comes crashing down . Look up the tragic case of James E. McGreevy, former governor of New Jersey. Most often those internal conflicts are cased by external forced that instill guilt, fear, and a negative self immage

 

[Correll]

Pervs are going to perv. In the USA we have the freedom to perv.

Thank you for that brilliant and well thought out commentary on an important topic concerning the well being of children
and human rights

It apparent that you are very intelligent and sensitive to the plight of minorities and those who cannot fend for themselves. You are more than a credit to the USMB and consistently raise the level of intellectual discourse

Strange that you seem to be conflating homosexuality with being unable to fend for yourself.


That strikes me as somewhat homophobic.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

You can't change someone's genetic RACE, so orientation is not the same as race.

You need to really do some reading on this. Yes , race is different than sexual orientation, but that does not mean that sexuality can be changed and that there is no biological aspect to it.

 

[emilynghiem]

The idea that being LGBT is a "belief" is stupid beyond all imagining. People don't choose it. It's not a "side" in any ideological battle. People, do, however, choose their religions, some very poorly. If the people who make these poor choices "believe" as they do, why can't they change instead of trying to force LGBTs to?

1. Dear Lysistrata and also TheProgressivePatriot
I said the BELIEFS about LGBT are faith based.
Yes there are some who cannot change, just like you cannot change all atheists to Christians or all Christians to atheists.
You cannot cure all cases of cancer, some can be healed, some the symptoms can be changed but the cancer remains in remission, some completely change with no signs left.

2. But not ALL cases are that type!!!!

Some can change, some cannot.
Some are born that way (I see this as spiritually caused by generational karma)
Some become that way by unnatural abuses (whether their unnatural reactions manifest as homosexual or even heterosexual sex addicts or even pedophiles in extreme cases that can be either homo or hetero and it's still not natural but abusive)

What causes the most conflict is some that are born that way can change later,
and some that become that way cannot change. So there is no set rule for all cases.

3. Do you agree that not all people BELIEVE the same?

Some people believe NONE can change and it's all inborn (whether genetic or spiritual both or neither, it could be caused in the womb and that's inborn but not genetic)

Some people believe ALL can change and NONE of it is natural.

Some people like me have heard of cases of ALL these types where ALL were unique and there was no way to capture them all (and that's why I say it's spiritual first
and then any physical causes or changes stem from the spiritual process being manifested in the physical people and world second)

Do you agree that people do not believe the same things about LGBT status and conditions?

Heck, I also count political BELIEFS as whether Govt needs to declare equal rights for people to be equal or if Rights are independent of govt and naturally existing (that's why I use the First Amendment which cites inalienable natural laws beyond Govt authority)
and it actually WEAKENS these rights to depend on govt for them when they come from NATURE.

I see we have at least two levels of BELIEFS going on.
1. beliefs about LGBT as a focus
2. beliefs about the role of govt and whether rights depend on this or not
for all people to be equal

This is ANOTHER reason why I approach it as equal respect and protection for all BELIEFS, because there is more than one layer going on at the same time.
(Same with abortion politics BTW, so we have to address BOTH levels of conflicting beliefs in order to solve that problem as well. both the beliefs about abortion itself, and beliefs about the role or authority of govt to defend people's beliefs on both sides. Two different layers stacked on top of each other. We can't solve this by forcing any belief on any other; people don't work that way and need equal protection of their beliefs by choice)

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

As for treating people's BELIEFS about orientation as faith based,
the point is to PROTECT these by law. You won't find Christians Constitutionalist or Conservatives willing to go against the First Amendment free exercise of religion.
So that would AUTOMATICALLY include and protect anyone's BELIEFS and freedom of exercise and expression. This does NOT require scientific proof, so it's an infalliable argument based on inalienable rights that even the right will not argue with.

Except it would be a lie. And I have to wonder how religious people would respond to that sort of trickery. No thanks, Gays have the 14th Amendment

 

[Pete7469]

You need to really do some reading on this. Yes , race is different than sexual orientation, but that does not mean that sexuality can be changed and that there is no biological aspect to it.

LOL...

RegressiveParasite is someone who believes you can change genders, but apparently because he likes sucking cock it's simply something he can't change so the rest of us have to applaud everyone who makes that choice.

Then if you disagree well then you "need to read more" liberal psychobabble propaganda.

Thank God he can't reproduce.

BTW...

I thought bed wetters believed it's possible to be transracial now also....

Derp...

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

The idea that being LGBT is a "belief" is stupid beyond all imagining. People don't choose it. It's not a "side" in any ideological battle. People, do, however, choose their religions, some very poorly. If the people who make these poor choices "believe" as they do, why can't they change instead of trying to force LGBTs to?

1. Dear Lysistrata and also TheProgressivePatriot
I said the BELIEFS about LGBT are faith based.
Yes there are some who cannot change, just like you cannot change all atheists to Christians or all Christians to atheists.
You cannot cure all cases of cancer, some can be healed, some the symptoms can be changed but the cancer remains in remission, some completely change with no signs left.

2. But not ALL cases are that type!!!!

Some can change, some cannot.
Some are born that way (I see this as spiritually caused by generational karma)
Some become that way by unnatural abuses (whether their unnatural reactions manifest as homosexual or even heterosexual sex addicts or even pedophiles in extreme cases that can be either homo or hetero and it's still not natural but abusive)

What causes the most conflict is some that are born that way can change later,
and some that become that way cannot change. So there is no set rule for all cases.

3. Do you agree that not all people BELIEVE the same?

Some people believe NONE can change and it's all inborn (whether genetic or spiritual both or neither, it could be caused in the womb and that's inborn but not genetic)

Some people believe ALL can change and NONE of it is natural.

Some people like me have heard of cases of ALL these types where ALL were unique and there was no way to capture them all (and that's why I say it's spiritual first
and then any physical causes or changes stem from the spiritual process being manifested in the physical people and world second)

Do you agree that people do not believe the same things about LGBT status and conditions?

Heck, I also count political BELIEFS as whether Govt needs to declare equal rights for people to be equal or if Rights are independent of govt and naturally existing (that's why I use the First Amendment which cites inalienable natural laws beyond Govt authority)
and it actually WEAKENS these rights to depend on govt for them when they come from NATURE.

I see we have at least two levels of BELIEFS going on.
1. beliefs about LGBT as a focus
2. beliefs about the role of govt and whether rights depend on this or not
for all people to be equal

This is ANOTHER reason why I approach it as equal respect and protection for all BELIEFS, because there is more than one layer going on at the same time.
(Same with abortion politics BTW, so we have to address BOTH levels of conflicting beliefs in order to solve that problem as well. both the beliefs about abortion itself, and beliefs about the role or authority of govt to defend people's beliefs on both sides. Two different layers stacked on top of each other. We can't solve this by forcing any belief on any other; people don't work that way and need equal protection of their beliefs by choice)

Are you reading and comprehending ANYTHING that is being said to you here? You just prattle on with the same old clap trap that never changes or acknowledges any other point of view .

 

[emilynghiem]

You can't change someone's genetic RACE, so orientation is not the same as race.

You need to really do some reading on this. Yes , race is different than sexual orientation, but that does not mean that sexuality can be changed and that there is no biological aspect to it.

Dear TheProgressivePatriot and @Lysistrate
Yes people can change their orientation where there were unnatural causes
and conditions involved that can be healed.

How To Defeat Homosexual Activists 101 A Real Education

See also the wife of NY Mayor Blasio
who published her experiences as a Lesbian, but
is happily married to the love of her life in a healthy heterosexual partnership as soul mates:
De Blasio’s wife Chirlane McCray talks about lesbian past

This is highly controversial.
The most I can reach agreement with some people is that
these people "were never homosexual to begin with"
Well, that is what the exgay and Christians believe too!

The point is whatever is your NATURAL default state,
that is what you ultimately come out as and stick to and cannot change.

So whatever you call this, when people "used to have
homosexual attractions but came out straight" or
used to be hetero or cisgender but came out trans or homo or bi,
this is what is meant by changing orientation.

The common factor is healing any condition that skews this
and coerces people unnaturally where they aren't their true selves.

The healing process gets rid of those conflicts and pressures
causing unnatural distortion, and allows people to reconcile
and make peace with whatever they are naturally.
Whether they are gay or straight, transgender or cisgender,
they are at peace and no longer in conflict.

The healing process that allows change does not dictate
by force, fear guilt or pressure, it only works by natural
and voluntary will of the person to bring out their natural state.
The false fraudulent methods of forcing people out of fear
FAIL and damage people. the effective therapy works
by forgiveness and free choice, so all those false conditions
and fears are removed and people can return to who they are naturally.

See link above to Judith and Francis MacNutt
who offer free spiritual healing and training, which
has different results for different people, none are the same.
Some people with inborn conditions may change,
and some may not. Some with conditions brought on by
social abuse or other external factors can heal and change,
and some cannot. So it depends on the person and their
spiritual path and process. The common factor is forgiveness
and free choice. When everyone heals we don't suffer these conflicts
and stress that we see now from people trying to force each other to change.
Doesn't work that way. The only change I've ever encountered came
from freely choosing to forgive past conflicts so these could be resolved by free choice.

 

[emilynghiem]

You need to really do some reading on this. Yes , race is different than sexual orientation, but that does not mean that sexuality can be changed and that there is no biological aspect to it.

LOL...

RegressiveParasite is someone who believes you can change genders, but apparently because he likes sucking cock it's simply something he can't change so the rest of us have to applaud everyone who makes that choice.

Then if you disagree well then you "need to read more" liberal psychobabble propaganda.

Thank God he can't reproduce.

BTW...

I thought bed wetters believed it's possible to be transracial now also....

Derp...

View attachment 181716

Dear Pete7469
May I request and suggest we do not attack TheProgressivePatriot for any sexual preferences he may have.

He makes strong enough points and arguments based on content alone.
There is no need for distracting attacks on person.

We should reward and encourage more people like TPP and Lysistrata
who are at least approaching this intellectually and Explaining their views!

You yell when liberals don't do this but cut and run.
Why punish members here by personal attacks
when they are well capable of discussing defending and debating
this issue in full context and content without any personal hits?

We NEED more posters on this board who can at least
defend their positions. Please do not bully when these are good posters
and members of USMB.

This thread is going well and we need to continue,
encourage and REWARD anyone who makes this degree of effort and attempt.

Thanks TheProgressivePatriot and Lysistrata
this isn't easy and most people do cut and run.
Thanks for not taking the shortcuts out, and
sticking to your points so we can reach a fuller understanding

 

[emilynghiem]

Don't forget to include cases where SOME people have successfully changed orientation after going through deep spiritual healing. Such healing has also been used to change INBORN conditions such as people BORN with cancer "in some cases" or with hereditary tendencies to alcohol or other abuse addictions

Case in point:

You can't seem to get your head around that fact that gay/ bi/ trans people do not need healing and to equate those people with those who have cancer or addictions is hateful. They not need" healing" They need to insulate themselves for the bigots and the morons who think that they need healing and surround themselves with positive life forces and people whop will support and accept them and help them to find their way wherever it leads. It is one thing for them to decide that they need healing. It is another thing for someone else to decide for them which is quite arrogant

Read the link I posted to both you and Lysistrata
Yes there are some homosexual people who ask and seek healing and receive it.
Some change, some do not but they are healed either way.

There was a lesbian Christian theological grad student who spoke on campus
about how she prayed for healing, and when she got her answer and made peace with God it wasn't about her changing her orientation but accepting it. She was in conflict before the healing prayer, and after she was at peace, regardless of orientation.

You want us to read your research well read the cases where people did change.
Don't leave those cases out of your research and be expected to be complete and taken seriously.

I posted one reference for you, to Judith MacNutt who has successfully counseled people through spiritual therapy where they healed of unwanted homosexual attractions that WEREN'T natural for them.

TheProgressivePatriot
if it's okay for people to heal from pressures to be hetero and come out homo,
why isn't it okay if people come out the other way?

ALL people benefit from healing!

Why do you find this so offensive or insulting.
I know personally of a person who came out TRANSGENDER
after going through spiritual healing.

Are you going to say it was insulting that he needed healing
of guilty and pressure to be male, before she could come out female.
this worked for other people I know to come out gay and be at peace with that.
Another man I know went through healing prayer and got rid of his feelings of being transsexual like his father who had changed to female. Everyone is different,
the point is to be at peace regardless.

What is wrong with healing when it applies to all people???

 

[Pete7469]

Dear Pete7469
May I request and suggest we do not attack TheProgressivePatriot for any sexual preferences he may have.

He makes strong enough points and arguments based on content alone.
There is no need for distracting attacks on person.

We should reward and encourage more people like TPP and Lysistrata
who are at least approaching this intellectually and Explaining their views!

You yell when liberals don't do this but cut and run.
Why punish members here by personal attacks
when they are well capable of discussing defending and debating
this issue in full context and content without any personal hits?

We NEED more posters on this board who can at least
defend their positions. Please do not bully when these are good posters
and members of USMB.

This thread is going well and we need to continue,
encourage and REWARD anyone who makes this degree of effort and attempt.

Thanks TheProgressivePatriot and Lysistrata
this isn't easy and most people do cut and run.
Thanks for not taking the shortcuts out, and
sticking to your points so we can reach a fuller understanding

RegressiveParasite is a diseased worm riddled piece of shit who cut/pastes leftist propaganda on a regular basis and everyone knows it. He contributes NOTHING to the forum or society for that matter. In fact I would say that his agitprop is detrimental to society. Malignant oxygen thieves like him who attack other people's morality and faith should be bullied and ridiculed. That's all this thread is about, is his own bigotry and hatred of Christian morality and those who have faith in in God.

I applaud your determination to engage with it but you're arguing with a creature less cognizant than a parrot. If there was a single synapse of an independent thought in that dense skull of his he would have committed suicide years ago.

 

[emilynghiem]

Are you reading and comprehending ANYTHING that is being said to you here? You just prattle on with the same old clap trap that never changes or acknowledges any other point of view .

Dear TheProgressivePatriot
I INCLUDE your viewpoints and beliefs as valid
and ADD ON to them to include those of others as equally valid.

My approach includes yours.
But yours depends on excluding mine and others.

Is that what you can't handle?

That my approach explains and covers all others equally and universally.
Including both yours and others who disagree with both you and with me!
So it is more inclusive of diversity.

You are obviously of good conscience if you find this disturbing.
If you didn't care about the truth, you wouldn't question
and try to change and resolve the conflict here.

Thanks for that TPP
You keep defending and demanding the truth.
I totally support you and cheer you on!
You are one of the few progressive posters on
here I respect for that. I don't have to agree
with all you present in order to defend your equal right
to exercise and express your beliefs and defend them from infringement.

You go!!!

 

[emilynghiem]

Dear Pete7469
May I request and suggest we do not attack TheProgressivePatriot for any sexual preferences he may have.

He makes strong enough points and arguments based on content alone.
There is no need for distracting attacks on person.

We should reward and encourage more people like TPP and Lysistrata
who are at least approaching this intellectually and Explaining their views!

You yell when liberals don't do this but cut and run.
Why punish members here by personal attacks
when they are well capable of discussing defending and debating
this issue in full context and content without any personal hits?

We NEED more posters on this board who can at least
defend their positions. Please do not bully when these are good posters
and members of USMB.

This thread is going well and we need to continue,
encourage and REWARD anyone who makes this degree of effort and attempt.

Thanks TheProgressivePatriot and Lysistrata
this isn't easy and most people do cut and run.
Thanks for not taking the shortcuts out, and
sticking to your points so we can reach a fuller understanding

RegressiveParasite is a diseased worm riddled piece of shit who cut/pastes leftist propaganda on a regular basis and everyone knows it. He contributes NOTHING to the forum or society for that matter. In fact I would say that his agitprop is detrimental to society. Malignant oxygen thieves like him who attack other people's morality and faith should be bullied and ridiculed. That's all this thread is about, is his own bigotry and hatred of Christian morality and those who have faith in in God.

I applaud your determination to engage with it but you're arguing with a creature less cognizant than a parrot. If there was a single synapse of an independent thought in that dense skull of his he would have committed suicide years ago.

Lysistrata may be more intellectually flexible and open to inclusion and expansion.

With attacks like yours Pete7469
it's no wonder TheProgressivePatriot responds so defensively

But as determined and principled as TPP is,
a mind and conscience that strong willed will not stop
until truth is established that resolves all conflicts to the contrary.

TPP may not realize the process of change takes "mutual give and take"
No energy is created or destroyed but converted from one form to another.
For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

So for things to change, both sides have to expand to include the points
that the other provides, and we all grow toward a more comprehensive
understanding of the bigger truth we all contribute to. We need
each other's information and experience to fill out the entire spectrum
none of us cover by ourselves. The more diverse we are, the more ground we cover.

Lysistrata may work toward that more openly
while TPP may play a more defensive role.
The Defense line does not play quarterback, which is a different role.

We are still a team, no matter what roles we play best.
Just because TheProgressivePatriot is not free to run the field
as the Quarterback doesn't mean he doesn't play a key role on the team.
Just the way he is and works, if that's his role, he needs to stick to it.

 

[Pete7469]

Are you reading and comprehending ANYTHING that is being said to you here? You just prattle on with the same old clap trap that never changes or acknowledges any other point of view .

 

[Pete7469]

They really are this stupid.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Gays have the 14th Amendment

The Fourteenth Amendment does not say anything about homosexuality, nor about any other vile, immoral sexual perversion. Nothing in it compels us to treat perversion, immorality, madness, and evil as if it is in any way normal, proper, or acceptable. That is only your own madness and evil making you think that it does.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Lysistrata may be more intellectually flexible and open to inclusion and expansion.

In context, that comes across as a clever euphemism for “batsh•• crazy”.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

They really are this stupid.

Not stupid, so much as a combination of sociopathy, insanity, and outright evil. Merely stupid would be much more benign.

 

[emilynghiem]

Are you reading and comprehending ANYTHING that is being said to you here? You just prattle on with the same old clap trap that never changes or acknowledges any other point of view .

 

[Lysistrata]

Being LGBT is a state of being that doesn't involve whatever faith an LGBT person, or a straight person, has chosen. Having a religion of any sort is a conscious choice. I think that people who have chosen an aggressive "faith" that "believes" in attacking a demographic group on the basis of the state of being of its members, a free choice among all beliefs and deciding not to have beliefs, need to rethink this because they are treading on other people's toes and liberties, which they have no right to do. Meanwhile, our civil law guarantees the attacked group the right to equal protection of the law.

If some leader of some religious group rides up to me on a big, high horse and tells me that I shouldn't do this, that, or the other thing because I have blue eyes, I'm going to point to the nearest lake that he can jump into.