God... Is Time.

[edthecynic]

your contention that there is no present time

I never contended any such thing, you need to read again.

You are completely in the dark!

 

[theword]

When you body dies, you will instantly wake up in two new bodies

What do you mean by "you" and what is "wake up" to the subject of your 'youness'? Your physical body is dead, it doesn't live on. Why would this "you" need another body...OR TWO? Kinda creepy sounding to me.

We can get into all kinds of wild speculations about afterlife, but this thread isn't really about opinions on what you think happens after you die. I don't know the answer and no one does. Even those who believe in God and think they are going to heaven, don't know... they're not going to know until they die. They have faith and it's okay for humans to have faith, we rely on faith in order to perceive reality.

Did you know that many of the prophecies of the Old Testament contains bits of information about how we'll experience life in the New Heaven and Earth?

Did you know that God has one last saint in this world that He is using to testify to His knowledge about the past, present and future?

 

[edthecynic]

All we will ever observe is one picture at a time being processed at a rate that makes objects appear to move. This means we can never observe the future or the past at the same moment we're observing the present picture. This doesn't mean that God can't give us pictures of the future or the past but while He's having us observe pictures of the future or past, we cannot observe the present.

You are still missing the point. We're not observing the present picture... ever. We can't. It's not physically possible for us to observe what happens in the present. All our perceptions are reliant upon our senses which rely upon time passing. Everything you perceive has already happened and is in the past. We have all kinds of memories of the past, and we can even speculate about the future... we can't see the future and we can't see the present. Only the past.

Again, it is moronic to require "SEEING" the present for the present to exist. The present exists for the blind, like you, as well as the sighted. The blind do not need faith or sight to be aware of the present.

 

[theword]

What makes you believe physicists are correct in their theories about light?

I am someone who understands science is the study and examination of possibilities. It doesn't draw conclusions. That is something done by man. The greatest scientists we know were people who challenged what physics and science collectively assumed to be correct. Science marches on, it doesn't satisfy a need to 'prove' something. Again, man does that.

Science has measured the speed of light. This isn't a theory, it's a physical fact that light travels at 186,282 miles per second. It's a biological fact that our eyes perceive the reflection of light which has traveled there. These are unquestionable facts that haven't been challenged. The thing about light is... do we mean a particle, photon, wave, frequency, energy? What exactly IS light?

You could say God is Light as well as Time. Light, Time and Matter (96% of the dark variety we can't comprehend) are what comprise our entire reality. What IS the present? We cannot observe it... we cannot test or evaluate it. Our senses rely on time passing for us to perceive anything. We rely on faith that the present happened because the past seems to indicate this.

Science isn't the study and examination of possibilities. It wasn't until physicists discovered that particles act as waves that gave them the idea that possibilities exist. Most physicists believed that everything was determined before they learned that particles couldn't be determined to be where they thought they thought should be in their double slit tests.

 

[Boss]

All we will ever observe is one picture at a time being processed at a rate that makes objects appear to move. This means we can never observe the future or the past at the same moment we're observing the present picture. This doesn't mean that God can't give us pictures of the future or the past but while He's having us observe pictures of the future or past, we cannot observe the present.

You are still missing the point. We're not observing the present picture... ever. We can't. It's not physically possible for us to observe what happens in the present. All our perceptions are reliant upon our senses which rely upon time passing. Everything you perceive has already happened and is in the past. We have all kinds of memories of the past, and we can even speculate about the future... we can't see the future and we can't see the present. Only the past.

Again, it is moronic to require "SEEING" the present for the present to exist. The present exists for the blind, like you, as well as the sighted. The blind do not need faith or sight to be aware of the present.

Eddy boy, please stop trying to twist my words around on me. I am not going to ever let you get away with doing it and it's really annoying. I have NEVER EVER said that the present does not exist. I have said that we cannot observe the present. Proving that things CAN exist that we can't observe. Like God.

 

[Boss]

What makes you believe physicists are correct in their theories about light?

I am someone who understands science is the study and examination of possibilities. It doesn't draw conclusions. That is something done by man. The greatest scientists we know were people who challenged what physics and science collectively assumed to be correct. Science marches on, it doesn't satisfy a need to 'prove' something. Again, man does that.

Science has measured the speed of light. This isn't a theory, it's a physical fact that light travels at 186,282 miles per second. It's a biological fact that our eyes perceive the reflection of light which has traveled there. These are unquestionable facts that haven't been challenged. The thing about light is... do we mean a particle, photon, wave, frequency, energy? What exactly IS light?

You could say God is Light as well as Time. Light, Time and Matter (96% of the dark variety we can't comprehend) are what comprise our entire reality. What IS the present? We cannot observe it... we cannot test or evaluate it. Our senses rely on time passing for us to perceive anything. We rely on faith that the present happened because the past seems to indicate this.

Science isn't the study and examination of possibilities. It wasn't until physicists discovered that particles act as waves that gave them the idea that possibilities exist. Most physicists believed that everything was determined before they learned that particles couldn't be determined to be where they thought they thought should be in their double slit tests.

I am very familiar with the double slit experiment, that's why I posited the question of what we mean by "light" ..a particle, photon, wave? What IS light? What IS gravity? None of this really relates to my argument about human perception of the present and the fact that we don't observe the present, only the past.

 

[Boss]

Science isn't the study and examination of possibilities.

Well that's exactly what Science is and if you can't comprehend that, we can't have a discussion in Science because you're not literate in Science or the Scientific Method.

Science is a never-ending quest for answers to questions. It does not draw conclusions, that is left to man and once you've drawn a conclusion, the work of science is done, you've abandoned science for a faith in your conclusion. Science can do nothing with a conclusion.

 

[edthecynic]

[I have NEVER EVER said that the present does not exist. I have said that we cannot observe the present. Proving that things CAN exist that we can't observe. Like God.

But it is not necessary to observe the present to prove it exists.On the other hand, unlike the present, there is no proof that a God or Gods exist.
And time is not a "thing." It is a duration or interval.

 

[there4eyeM]

Consciousness is now.

Nothing perceptible by humans is now. You can get as hippy-dippy as you like, but humans can't see the present. It defies physics.

Even accepted that the present cannot be seen (i.e.; the stimulus comes from a past event (although how would the perceiver know that and how could it be proved?)), that occurrence, the image arriving in the brain, arrives 'now'.
'Dippy' seems to me to maintain as fact something that is not established anywhere else, but is merely a matter of contention.

 

[Boss]

[I have NEVER EVER said that the present does not exist. I have said that we cannot observe the present. Proving that things CAN exist that we can't observe. Like God.

But it is not necessary to observe the present to prove it exists.On the other hand, unlike the present, there is no proof that a God or Gods exist.
And time is not a "thing." It is a duration or interval.

Duration and interval are simply other words describing time.

How can you prove the present exists without observing it? How do you know the present isn't created by God? Unless you can test and observe the present you can't scientifically establish anything. You have evidence to support your faith in the present, and I have evidence to support my faith in God.

 

[Boss]

Consciousness is now.

Nothing perceptible by humans is now. You can get as hippy-dippy as you like, but humans can't see the present. It defies physics.

Even accepted that the present cannot be seen (i.e.; the stimulus comes from a past event (although how would the perceiver know that and how could it be proved?)), that occurrence, the image arriving in the brain, arrives 'now'.
'Dippy' seems to me to maintain as fact something that is not established anywhere else, but is merely a matter of contention.

Well the 'perceiver' has to first understand physics. Then they understand the light which has created an image in their mind has traveled there over the duration of time, their optic nerve has sent signals to the brain, also taking time, and the brain cells recognize the signals as something being visualized and determine what to perceive, which also takes time. What you are perceiving as "now" happened already and is in the past before your brain can even register it. Our perception is only of the past, we cannot observe the present, it's a matter of physics.

 

[theword]

All we will ever observe is one picture at a time being processed at a rate that makes objects appear to move. This means we can never observe the future or the past at the same moment we're observing the present picture. This doesn't mean that God can't give us pictures of the future or the past but while He's having us observe pictures of the future or past, we cannot observe the present.

You are still missing the point. We're not observing the present picture... ever. We can't. It's not physically possible for us to observe what happens in the present. All our perceptions are reliant upon our senses which rely upon time passing. Everything you perceive has already happened and is in the past. We have all kinds of memories of the past, and we can even speculate about the future... we can't see the future and we can't see the present. Only the past.

Again, it is moronic to require "SEEING" the present for the present to exist. The present exists for the blind, like you, as well as the sighted. The blind do not need faith or sight to be aware of the present.

Blind people have other senses to experience life with so of course they know what the "present" means. We can only observe the present picture. Each picture we observe comes to us at a rate so fast that it's impossible to know we're only observing once picture at a time. Camera's are able to stop that present picture for us but we will never be able to see that one picture again unless our Creator has given you a picture of the future to observe. As you're observing that future picture that our Creator is having you observe, you cannot observe the present picture or past pictures.

 

[theword]

What makes you believe physicists are correct in their theories about light?

I am someone who understands science is the study and examination of possibilities. It doesn't draw conclusions. That is something done by man. The greatest scientists we know were people who challenged what physics and science collectively assumed to be correct. Science marches on, it doesn't satisfy a need to 'prove' something. Again, man does that.

Science has measured the speed of light. This isn't a theory, it's a physical fact that light travels at 186,282 miles per second. It's a biological fact that our eyes perceive the reflection of light which has traveled there. These are unquestionable facts that haven't been challenged. The thing about light is... do we mean a particle, photon, wave, frequency, energy? What exactly IS light?

You could say God is Light as well as Time. Light, Time and Matter (96% of the dark variety we can't comprehend) are what comprise our entire reality. What IS the present? We cannot observe it... we cannot test or evaluate it. Our senses rely on time passing for us to perceive anything. We rely on faith that the present happened because the past seems to indicate this.

Science isn't the study and examination of possibilities. It wasn't until physicists discovered that particles act as waves that gave them the idea that possibilities exist. Most physicists believed that everything was determined before they learned that particles couldn't be determined to be where they thought they thought should be in their double slit tests.

I am very familiar with the double slit experiment, that's why I posited the question of what we mean by "light" ..a particle, photon, wave? What IS light? What IS gravity? None of this really relates to my argument about human perception of the present and the fact that we don't observe the present, only the past.

We can only observe the present unless our Creator gives us a picture of the past or future to observe, which I have experienced many times. I know what you're trying to say but if you can't observe the present picture, than it's impossible to see anything. Motion and time only exists as we observe the present picture but at a fast enough rate to make objects look like there in motion. Each picture we observe is nothing more than a processed batch of waves that form into particles as we observe them. Once we're not observing those particles, they are nothing but waves. This means these particles collapse into waves. This is how God created everything visible and invisible but only as waves that turn into visible objects when observed.

 

[theword]

Science isn't the study and examination of possibilities.

Well that's exactly what Science is and if you can't comprehend that, we can't have a discussion in Science because you're not literate in Science or the Scientific Method.

Science is a never-ending quest for answers to questions. It does not draw conclusions, that is left to man and once you've drawn a conclusion, the work of science is done, you've abandoned science for a faith in your conclusion. Science can do nothing with a conclusion.

Science came about because of questions that are formed in a man's mind according to our Creator's program called Eternal Life. Our Creator is the one who has taught man everything he needs to know to move about in this world. Mathematics was given to man to measure the visible objects to not only build objects with their hands but also to end up learning that these objects are not real at all. So our Creator has led scientists to His mind ( thoughts converted into invisible waves ), which is a computing language where everything visible and invisible is processed from to give man a world to experience.

Now scientists can understand the infinite possible objects that can be formed from this computing language. So before this awareness of infinity ( possibilities ) man was only looking for determined objects that could explain what they were observing. Now we know that these visible objects are illusive, meaning they aren't real objects made of determined hard physical evidence such as real particles.

 

[theword]

Consciousness is now.

Nothing perceptible by humans is now. You can get as hippy-dippy as you like, but humans can't see the present. It defies physics.

Even accepted that the present cannot be seen (i.e.; the stimulus comes from a past event (although how would the perceiver know that and how could it be proved?)), that occurrence, the image arriving in the brain, arrives 'now'.
'Dippy' seems to me to maintain as fact something that is not established anywhere else, but is merely a matter of contention.

Well the 'perceiver' has to first understand physics. Then they understand the light which has created an image in their mind has traveled there over the duration of time, their optic nerve has sent signals to the brain, also taking time, and the brain cells recognize the signals as something being visualized and determine what to perceive, which also takes time. What you are perceiving as "now" happened already and is in the past before your brain can even register it. Our perception is only of the past, we cannot observe the present, it's a matter of physics.

God doesn't need physics to explain that everything we observe are only illusions. He can use visions and analogies like He used to teach me that particles are only illusions.

 

[jon_berzerk]

time will always be in the present for the observer

however it may be anothers past present or future

even weirder is that can work both ways

--LOL

 

[edthecynic]

How can you prove the present exists without observing it?

Something you will never understand, "logic." Even YOU can't deny that the present exists!

 

[edthecynic]

the light which has created an image in their mind has traveled there over the duration of time,

You are still completely in the dark.
The present exists even in the dark, that's physics.

 

[theword]

time will always be in the present for the observer

however it may be anothers past present or future

even weirder is that can work both ways

--LOL

That's because time isn't something real. It can only be observed such as the dream I experienced as a five year old kid about the future killing of my body. I have no idea when that moment will occur but I do know it will happen according to God's plan.

God has also given me visions of how He created the earth in the past and destroys it in the future. He taught me that everything we observe is only an illusion so it's not hard to believe these visions.

It's the future experiences in the New Heaven and Earth that our Creator has revealed to me that gets me excited. He has shown me the infinite possibilities of illusions that we will observe that will keep us from being bored. In fact, we will experience life in many different kinds of bodies so it will be impossible for us to get bored.

 

[theword]

the light which has created an image in their mind has traveled there over the duration of time,

You are still completely in the dark.
The present exists even in the dark, that's physics.

The past, present and future are always in the dark until light information co-exists with the rest of the observable information that's processed into what we perceive to be real, whether it's in the past, present or future. We can simulate light going on and off in computer programs by simply adding or deleting information to the existing information that forms objects.