for Sky and godspeaker: Steps to Forgiveness

[Sky Dancer]

This thread seems more aimed at patronizing both Sky Dancer and Godspeak in disguise as wanting to "help" them. I thought this was quite obvious, but nobody has mentioned it so far.

But I might as well ask this... Sky Dancer, isn't forgiveness a form of acceptance? I believe I've seen Buddhists teach about forgiveness all the time. Not to mention the Dhammapada says something about it somewhere.

Hi-

Forgiveness is not a word in Tibetan. I study Tibetan Buddhism. Forgiveness is a christian concept, and you're right, whatever pure motivation emily may have to be 'helpful', her advice is unsolicited and patronizing.

Rather than 'forgiveness', I see the process of moving from a hurt place to a whole one, to be a matter of deep acceptance, that the unwanted hurtful experience happened, and it had an impact on one's very being.

That's completely different from being 'forgiving' which implies a judgment of 'wrongness'. There is a big difference between acknowledging a hurt, and accepting that it happened and bestowing 'forgiveness' on someone.

In my own case, what I work with all the time, is the hurt I feel over the loss of my father who really suffered because he was never accepted for being gay. I get upset with Christians like Scott Lively, who is on a world mission to make gay people miserable and who bragged that he had 'set off a nuclear bomb on homosexuals', by stirring things up in Uganda. The RCC and my family, was rejecting of my father, leaving him no spiritual resources, which contributed to his death. To honor my father, I come on too strong about gay civil rights and how Christians interfere in them. My bad.

Buddhists like Tara Brach, who wrote Radical Acceptance, and who work with people who are trauma survivors have the whole thing down in my opinion.

Of course, no one here is interested in moving into uncharted, non-christian territories with spirituality.

This is one reason, I'm quitting these boards. The other is I just spent a week in retreat asking the question, what activities are life giving and which ones are not.

Posting arguments to Christians about religious politics is not a life giving activity. No one is interested in my Buddhist ramblings here, it's not the place for me.

I hope this makes some of you happy to see the back of my head.

sky

Wherever you go, whatever you do, don't loose your voice or ever think it's bad to bring up injustice - especially in an open forum.

Thank you Avg Joe.

I've just spent the last week at a training retreat. People are encouraging me to write. Clearly, I've been in the wrong place posting here.

Speaking truth to power is a Buddhist practice and so is social activism for human rights. I'm thinking of the Tibetans who are imprisoned for practicing Buddhism in the region of China formerly the country of Tibet.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Dear Sky: Thank you for sharing your deeper insights and explanations of where and why you disagree. This is very helpful to people in general.

I hope you will consider staying for the very reasons you are tempted to leave.
It is because you do not think like others on here, that it is even more
necessary and beneficial to share.

If you only share with people who think like you already, then it is easier but the
rewards are not as valuable as facing challenges of diversity where more people
stand to gain even greater understanding than they had access to before!

I am sorry if I did or said anything to discourage you in any way.
I take it for granted you sounded very committed to your beliefs, so I thought you had a solid capacity to deal with this diversity.

If you need more assurance you are appreciated and heard, where you don't feel you are wasting your time, I will make an effort to be more supportive and verbally acknowledge instead of taking that for granted where you and I already agree.

I had been focusing on identifying where and why you and I disagree since those places were fewer and there is more significant concepts to explore in those areas.

If this seems too negative to you, I'm sorry, and I want to make it clear I believe the point is to reach agreement that includes all the points you are trying to make!

It is not an easy process, and I appreciate you putting up with the learning curve in the meantime, how to talk about these things where it is inclusive and constructive.

Sky, other people on here are learning, too, how to speak and share with someone from as diverse a background as you are coming from. I'm sorry so much has been at your emotional expense. I hope you understand that your pain and suffering is partially because you sympathize with the collective and shared pain of others who suffered religious abuse.

So when we share and correct and heal together, we are not just benefiting ourselves, but opening the door for other people to overcome these same problems and divisions.

If you need time out to reflect and meditate privately, or share with others instead of people here, I understand. The process is interconnected to everyone around you, so changes in one area will affect changes in others, as we grow together.

I just wouldn't want to see you give up and go because of negative things when that negativity is the opposite goal of what any of us really wants. If anyone here means to bash and bully, well the more reason to not let that tactic control how we respond.

If we are going to live by compassion and charity, to show that that is the more compelling force, that speaks to me of continuing to give and share, not to let negativity disrupt us.

Sorry for anything I contributed to any bad feelings between us or others here.
I hope you will continue to post and share in a way that does not let any discouragement in.

You are so honest in your posts, saying exactly how you feel and think, I guess I took it for granted that you were okay continuing to do that. You didn't seem discouraged to me, but determined to follow this path and not have to defend or apologize for it.

Sorry I have not been more encouraging or supportive, but I will try to be more careful in the future.

If it's okay, I would like to reply to some of your points below.

Again I already assume that you have your buddha-nature inherent in you, and that the purpose of the path is to open up and let that bloom to fullness.

So all these things that are exchanged are to get to that truth that is already inside you, where that comes out and is expressed freely. It is not meant to be anything negative.

You already have the truth written on your conscience, but it is just blocked over with the pains and conditioned thoughts from the past, and that is where forgiveness lets all that emotional burden go that otherwise gets in the way of a free mind.

You don't deserve to carry this burden of religious abuse on behalf of other people.

You have your ways of dealing with it, and I believe everyone here can help with that at the same time we heal of our own burdens and biases we carry. We are connected.

Rather than 'forgiveness', I see the process of moving from a hurt place to a whole one, to be a matter of deep acceptance, that the unwanted hurtful experience happened, and it had an impact on one's very being.

Yes, that is the goal. But as long as the emotions block that process, that is why forgiveness of the pain and abuse caused helps to remove that from the equation first.

That's completely different from being 'forgiving' which implies a judgment of 'wrongness'. There is a big difference between acknowledging a hurt, and accepting that it happened and bestowing 'forgiveness' on someone.

Not necessarily assessing blame, and not necessarily toward a person.

We can forgive "in general" that abuse happens, that humans are not perfect, and in general will take something meant for good and hurt someone with it. And forgive that it could have and does happen to many people, but the fact that it happens to us or to you, being able to forgive that you were hurt by this abuse whatever it came from.

Really letting go of the pain and anger, so that doesn't get in the way of the steps
of acceptance and addressing corrections and responsibility for practical changes.



Hey Sky, here we have a lot in common that I would rather focus on, both for practical positive steps we can do, and for our own healing. I haven't been through all the pain you have, but what I have survived gave me skills to help others. I am thinking these days of contacting the parents of that little boy, only 13 years old, who killed himself after being bullied for being Buddhist and being gay. The school blames the parents, who blame the bullying and the school for not stopping it. But I see multiple issues going on, both the Buddhist Christian discrimination thing (he even was trying to learn or convert to Christianity to try to fit in, can you imagine, bless his heart, he tried his best) And the whole homosexuality thing, don't even get me started on that. The college I went to put together a forum on the Bible and Homosexuality, between Christian and Pride groups on campus, and one of the speakers was a gay Christian theology grad student who talked of her experience with "acceptance" of how God made her. And she reached a lot of Christians who had no previous understanding how anyone could be born that way and not from sickness or abuse. I have other friends who have prayed and healed people of the "unnatural type" of homosexual or even heterosexual behavior that is caused by abuse. So there are both kinds of natural or unnatural attractions or even addictions and you can't say all cases are one way or the other. I would like to see this issue addressed to stop all the harassment and political debates over something that is spiritual.

Sky I totally would agree with you on civil and constitutional approaches to this!

I planned to contact the family and propose some club for students that teaches conflict resolution, either just based on civil laws and constitutional principles and ethics, or it can specialize in overcoming religious, political, or racial conflicts if the students wish to focus on that. I believe that kind of training and assistance with mediation can prevent any bullying not only among students but people who abuse religion or politics to bully!

Again I'm sorry for anything that contributed to any bullying here.
Can you please forgive that without assessing blame or trying to forgive one person.
But just forgive in general the pain and suffering this causes,
so it doesn't get in the way of seeking solutions. Together.



This sounds very interesting, sort of like "forgiving the whole thing" instead of trying to assess or take inventory of who contributed what to cause a chain of events.

Of course, no one here is interested in moving into uncharted, non-christian territories with spirituality.

I don't believe that is outside or against Christianity.

If it has anything to do with forgiveness, which it sounds like to me,
then it has everything to do with salvation or enlightenment/liberation of humanity, whatever you call that, Sky.

This is one reason, I'm quitting these boards. The other is I just spent a week in retreat asking the question, what activities are life giving and which ones are not.

Posting arguments to Christians about religious politics is not a life giving activity. No one is interested in my Buddhist ramblings here, it's not the place for me.

I hope this makes some of you happy to see the back of my head.

Sky

I don't want to see bullying win over compassionate HONEST open dialogue and "radical acceptance" of whatever people say or their intent behind it.

Thank you for Sharing honestly Sky.

I hope you will post excerpts, links, or your own words or experience on radical acceptance. I think that would help a lot of people on here who don't get
forgiveness, so maybe teaching it that way is more effective there!

If you must leave, I trust you are needed elsewhere.

I will PM you to see if you would like to collaborate on a Buddhist outreach or even a garden for the students to memorialize their classmate, I know one student who wanted to set one up. I thought of having four trees planted in each corner, to stand for knowledge truth wisdom peaceful understanding, the fig or ficus tree, the apple tree, the Bodhi tree, and the olive tree. The same way there are four noble Truths in Buddhism, there are four spiritual laws taught in Christianity, so I would offer both as themes since this young boy was trying to study and follow both.

He gave up and killed himself in despair or depression, though he was a very happy easygoing and loving soul, loved and missed by many, had a great sense of humor.

I don't want to keep sending that message that we should give up.
We should offer a different way if one thing or another doesn't work.
It's one thing to give up the old ways, to open up to a new angle,
but not to the point you kill off relationships or literally kill yourself.

So sad, I just wish I knew that young boy, and I keep thinking we could have found a way to laugh at how stupid the problems were and not carry them like he did, he was so sensitive and did not have enough support to deal with that, at such a young age.

Sky it makes sense to me that if people have such different ways of approaching "forgiveness" or alternatives to this, then all these ways are even more necessary to offer so all situations are covered!

I would like to propose that whatever this "radical acceptance" is, maybe that would
help set up some useful outreach in this boy's memory; whatever his parents and fellow students and friends feel will help stop the bullying. I think civil rights, civics and conflict resolution training would help, setting up a program where the students agree to follow certain policies on redressing grievances and violations of school conduct policies, and correct issues themselves!

I understand the concept of giving up, as Buddha did, before finding the better way.
Sky, can we find the better way? Can you share your insights on what you think is better, and together we could piece together how we can support each other along the way?

Thanks Sky
Sorry for all these troubles and hassles
I take it for granted you already have the truth inside you
and was just trying to trigger it to come out
Didn't mean to offend you in the process
I just trusted you would share what you know in return
since you have always posted exactly what you think
Sorry that was not clear!
Yours truly,
Love, Emily

Emily--

Leaving the forum has nothing to do with you. For the life of me, I cannot figure out where you're coming from. Are you a Buddhist or a Christian? You can't be both. You can be Christian and practice Buddhist meditation, but you cannot be both Buddhist and Christian.

I've spent a week immersed in looking at my own behavior as it relates to this forum. I've gained many insights, most of them, far too personal to share. The reason I'm leaving has to do with what I've learned. This isn't an appropriate venue for me. This is a waste of time for me. I'm involved in a training in RL that will take most of my time to accomplish. I cannot afford the luxury of a negative thought. Talking about religious politics is not a life affirming, life giving activity.

I'm taking the time to leave slowly and make whatever meaningful connections make sense. I'm doing the forum a service by leaving. Check it out.

If anyone feels they want to clear up anything I will do so in PMs. Wishing you well.

Sky

 

[Intense]

This thread seems more aimed at patronizing both Sky Dancer and Godspeak in disguise as wanting to "help" them. I thought this was quite obvious, but nobody has mentioned it so far.

But I might as well ask this... Sky Dancer, isn't forgiveness a form of acceptance? I believe I've seen Buddhists teach about forgiveness all the time. Not to mention the Dhammapada says something about it somewhere.

Hi-

Forgiveness is not a word in Tibetan. I study Tibetan Buddhism. Forgiveness is a christian concept, and you're right, whatever pure motivation emily may have to be 'helpful', her advice is unsolicited and patronizing.

Rather than 'forgiveness', I see the process of moving from a hurt place to a whole one, to be a matter of deep acceptance, that the unwanted hurtful experience happened, and it had an impact on one's very being.

That's completely different from being 'forgiving' which implies a judgment of 'wrongness'. There is a big difference between acknowledging a hurt, and accepting that it happened and bestowing 'forgiveness' on someone.

In my own case, what I work with all the time, is the hurt I feel over the loss of my father who really suffered because he was never accepted for being gay. I get upset with Christians like Scott Lively, who is on a world mission to make gay people miserable and who bragged that he had 'set off a nuclear bomb on homosexuals', by stirring things up in Uganda. The RCC and my family, was rejecting of my father, leaving him no spiritual resources, which contributed to his death. To honor my father, I come on too strong about gay civil rights and how Christians interfere in them. My bad.

Buddhists like Tara Brach, who wrote Radical Acceptance, and who work with people who are trauma survivors have the whole thing down in my opinion.

Of course, no one here is interested in moving into uncharted, non-christian territories with spirituality.

This is one reason, I'm quitting these boards. The other is I just spent a week in retreat asking the question, what activities are life giving and which ones are not.

Posting arguments to Christians about religious politics is not a life giving activity. No one is interested in my Buddhist ramblings here, it's not the place for me.

I hope this makes some of you happy to see the back of my head.

sky

sky

 

[Sky Dancer]

This thread seems more aimed at patronizing both Sky Dancer and Godspeak in disguise as wanting to "help" them. I thought this was quite obvious, but nobody has mentioned it so far.

But I might as well ask this... Sky Dancer, isn't forgiveness a form of acceptance? I believe I've seen Buddhists teach about forgiveness all the time. Not to mention the Dhammapada says something about it somewhere.

Hi-

Forgiveness is not a word in Tibetan. I study Tibetan Buddhism. Forgiveness is a christian concept, and you're right, whatever pure motivation emily may have to be 'helpful', her advice is unsolicited and patronizing.

Rather than 'forgiveness', I see the process of moving from a hurt place to a whole one, to be a matter of deep acceptance, that the unwanted hurtful experience happened, and it had an impact on one's very being.

That's completely different from being 'forgiving' which implies a judgment of 'wrongness'. There is a big difference between acknowledging a hurt, and accepting that it happened and bestowing 'forgiveness' on someone.

In my own case, what I work with all the time, is the hurt I feel over the loss of my father who really suffered because he was never accepted for being gay. I get upset with Christians like Scott Lively, who is on a world mission to make gay people miserable and who bragged that he had 'set off a nuclear bomb on homosexuals', by stirring things up in Uganda. The RCC and my family, was rejecting of my father, leaving him no spiritual resources, which contributed to his death. To honor my father, I come on too strong about gay civil rights and how Christians interfere in them. My bad.

Buddhists like Tara Brach, who wrote Radical Acceptance, and who work with people who are trauma survivors have the whole thing down in my opinion.

Of course, no one here is interested in moving into uncharted, non-christian territories with spirituality.

This is one reason, I'm quitting these boards. The other is I just spent a week in retreat asking the question, what activities are life giving and which ones are not.

Posting arguments to Christians about religious politics is not a life giving activity. No one is interested in my Buddhist ramblings here, it's not the place for me.

I hope this makes some of you happy to see the back of my head.

sky

sky

Glad to make you happy, hon. Enjoy your Muslim bashing future. sky

 

[AVG-JOE]

Thank you Avg Joe.

I've just spent the last week at a training retreat. People are encouraging me to write. Clearly, I've been in the wrong place posting here.

Speaking truth to power is a Buddhist practice and so is social activism for human rights. I'm thinking of the Tibetans who are imprisoned for practicing Buddhism in the region of China formerly the country of Tibet.

Good luck, Sky, and may (insert your preferred Deity here) bless you in your writing, etc.

 

[icyteru]

Dear Sky: Thank you for sharing your deeper insights and explanations of where and why you disagree. This is very helpful to people in general.

I hope you will consider staying for the very reasons you are tempted to leave.
It is because you do not think like others on here, that it is even more
necessary and beneficial to share.

If you only share with people who think like you already, then it is easier but the
rewards are not as valuable as facing challenges of diversity where more people
stand to gain even greater understanding than they had access to before!

I am sorry if I did or said anything to discourage you in any way.
I take it for granted you sounded very committed to your beliefs, so I thought you had a solid capacity to deal with this diversity.

If you need more assurance you are appreciated and heard, where you don't feel you are wasting your time, I will make an effort to be more supportive and verbally acknowledge instead of taking that for granted where you and I already agree.

I had been focusing on identifying where and why you and I disagree since those places were fewer and there is more significant concepts to explore in those areas.

If this seems too negative to you, I'm sorry, and I want to make it clear I believe the point is to reach agreement that includes all the points you are trying to make!

It is not an easy process, and I appreciate you putting up with the learning curve in the meantime, how to talk about these things where it is inclusive and constructive.

Sky, other people on here are learning, too, how to speak and share with someone from as diverse a background as you are coming from. I'm sorry so much has been at your emotional expense. I hope you understand that your pain and suffering is partially because you sympathize with the collective and shared pain of others who suffered religious abuse.

So when we share and correct and heal together, we are not just benefiting ourselves, but opening the door for other people to overcome these same problems and divisions.

If you need time out to reflect and meditate privately, or share with others instead of people here, I understand. The process is interconnected to everyone around you, so changes in one area will affect changes in others, as we grow together.

I just wouldn't want to see you give up and go because of negative things when that negativity is the opposite goal of what any of us really wants. If anyone here means to bash and bully, well the more reason to not let that tactic control how we respond.

If we are going to live by compassion and charity, to show that that is the more compelling force, that speaks to me of continuing to give and share, not to let negativity disrupt us.

Sorry for anything I contributed to any bad feelings between us or others here.
I hope you will continue to post and share in a way that does not let any discouragement in.

You are so honest in your posts, saying exactly how you feel and think, I guess I took it for granted that you were okay continuing to do that. You didn't seem discouraged to me, but determined to follow this path and not have to defend or apologize for it.

Sorry I have not been more encouraging or supportive, but I will try to be more careful in the future.

If it's okay, I would like to reply to some of your points below.

Again I already assume that you have your buddha-nature inherent in you, and that the purpose of the path is to open up and let that bloom to fullness.

So all these things that are exchanged are to get to that truth that is already inside you, where that comes out and is expressed freely. It is not meant to be anything negative.

You already have the truth written on your conscience, but it is just blocked over with the pains and conditioned thoughts from the past, and that is where forgiveness lets all that emotional burden go that otherwise gets in the way of a free mind.

You don't deserve to carry this burden of religious abuse on behalf of other people.

You have your ways of dealing with it, and I believe everyone here can help with that at the same time we heal of our own burdens and biases we carry. We are connected.

Rather than 'forgiveness', I see the process of moving from a hurt place to a whole one, to be a matter of deep acceptance, that the unwanted hurtful experience happened, and it had an impact on one's very being.

Yes, that is the goal. But as long as the emotions block that process, that is why forgiveness of the pain and abuse caused helps to remove that from the equation first.


Not necessarily assessing blame, and not necessarily toward a person.

We can forgive "in general" that abuse happens, that humans are not perfect, and in general will take something meant for good and hurt someone with it. And forgive that it could have and does happen to many people, but the fact that it happens to us or to you, being able to forgive that you were hurt by this abuse whatever it came from.

Really letting go of the pain and anger, so that doesn't get in the way of the steps
of acceptance and addressing corrections and responsibility for practical changes.



Hey Sky, here we have a lot in common that I would rather focus on, both for practical positive steps we can do, and for our own healing. I haven't been through all the pain you have, but what I have survived gave me skills to help others. I am thinking these days of contacting the parents of that little boy, only 13 years old, who killed himself after being bullied for being Buddhist and being gay. The school blames the parents, who blame the bullying and the school for not stopping it. But I see multiple issues going on, both the Buddhist Christian discrimination thing (he even was trying to learn or convert to Christianity to try to fit in, can you imagine, bless his heart, he tried his best) And the whole homosexuality thing, don't even get me started on that. The college I went to put together a forum on the Bible and Homosexuality, between Christian and Pride groups on campus, and one of the speakers was a gay Christian theology grad student who talked of her experience with "acceptance" of how God made her. And she reached a lot of Christians who had no previous understanding how anyone could be born that way and not from sickness or abuse. I have other friends who have prayed and healed people of the "unnatural type" of homosexual or even heterosexual behavior that is caused by abuse. So there are both kinds of natural or unnatural attractions or even addictions and you can't say all cases are one way or the other. I would like to see this issue addressed to stop all the harassment and political debates over something that is spiritual.

Sky I totally would agree with you on civil and constitutional approaches to this!

I planned to contact the family and propose some club for students that teaches conflict resolution, either just based on civil laws and constitutional principles and ethics, or it can specialize in overcoming religious, political, or racial conflicts if the students wish to focus on that. I believe that kind of training and assistance with mediation can prevent any bullying not only among students but people who abuse religion or politics to bully!

Again I'm sorry for anything that contributed to any bullying here.
Can you please forgive that without assessing blame or trying to forgive one person.
But just forgive in general the pain and suffering this causes,
so it doesn't get in the way of seeking solutions. Together.



This sounds very interesting, sort of like "forgiving the whole thing" instead of trying to assess or take inventory of who contributed what to cause a chain of events.



I don't believe that is outside or against Christianity.

If it has anything to do with forgiveness, which it sounds like to me,
then it has everything to do with salvation or enlightenment/liberation of humanity, whatever you call that, Sky.

This is one reason, I'm quitting these boards. The other is I just spent a week in retreat asking the question, what activities are life giving and which ones are not.

Posting arguments to Christians about religious politics is not a life giving activity. No one is interested in my Buddhist ramblings here, it's not the place for me.

I hope this makes some of you happy to see the back of my head.

Sky

I don't want to see bullying win over compassionate HONEST open dialogue and "radical acceptance" of whatever people say or their intent behind it.

Thank you for Sharing honestly Sky.

I hope you will post excerpts, links, or your own words or experience on radical acceptance. I think that would help a lot of people on here who don't get
forgiveness, so maybe teaching it that way is more effective there!

If you must leave, I trust you are needed elsewhere.

I will PM you to see if you would like to collaborate on a Buddhist outreach or even a garden for the students to memorialize their classmate, I know one student who wanted to set one up. I thought of having four trees planted in each corner, to stand for knowledge truth wisdom peaceful understanding, the fig or ficus tree, the apple tree, the Bodhi tree, and the olive tree. The same way there are four noble Truths in Buddhism, there are four spiritual laws taught in Christianity, so I would offer both as themes since this young boy was trying to study and follow both.

He gave up and killed himself in despair or depression, though he was a very happy easygoing and loving soul, loved and missed by many, had a great sense of humor.

I don't want to keep sending that message that we should give up.
We should offer a different way if one thing or another doesn't work.
It's one thing to give up the old ways, to open up to a new angle,
but not to the point you kill off relationships or literally kill yourself.

So sad, I just wish I knew that young boy, and I keep thinking we could have found a way to laugh at how stupid the problems were and not carry them like he did, he was so sensitive and did not have enough support to deal with that, at such a young age.

Sky it makes sense to me that if people have such different ways of approaching "forgiveness" or alternatives to this, then all these ways are even more necessary to offer so all situations are covered!

I would like to propose that whatever this "radical acceptance" is, maybe that would
help set up some useful outreach in this boy's memory; whatever his parents and fellow students and friends feel will help stop the bullying. I think civil rights, civics and conflict resolution training would help, setting up a program where the students agree to follow certain policies on redressing grievances and violations of school conduct policies, and correct issues themselves!

I understand the concept of giving up, as Buddha did, before finding the better way.
Sky, can we find the better way? Can you share your insights on what you think is better, and together we could piece together how we can support each other along the way?

Thanks Sky
Sorry for all these troubles and hassles
I take it for granted you already have the truth inside you
and was just trying to trigger it to come out
Didn't mean to offend you in the process
I just trusted you would share what you know in return
since you have always posted exactly what you think
Sorry that was not clear!
Yours truly,
Love, Emily

Emily--

Leaving the forum has nothing to do with you. For the life of me, I cannot figure out where you're coming from. Are you a Buddhist or a Christian? You can't be both. You can be Christian and practice Buddhist meditation, but you cannot be both Buddhist and Christian.

I've spent a week immersed in looking at my own behavior as it relates to this forum. I've gained many insights, most of them, far too personal to share. The reason I'm leaving has to do with what I've learned. This isn't an appropriate venue for me. This is a waste of time for me. I'm involved in a training in RL that will take most of my time to accomplish. I cannot afford the luxury of a negative thought. Talking about religious politics is not a life affirming, life giving activity.

I'm taking the time to leave slowly and make whatever meaningful connections make sense. I'm doing the forum a service by leaving. Check it out.

If anyone feels they want to clear up anything I will do so in PMs. Wishing you well.

Sky

I agree with sky. The example is Bernadette Roberts. See the review in: The Real Truth of Life

 

[AllieBaba]

This is also pure Sky. She leaves the forum whenever her lies catch up with her.

 

[Rogo]

Hi Rogo--

You're a breath of fresh air. I would be happy to talk to you about your exploration of Buddhism. Why don't you start a thread just for those interested in Buddhism and I will be happy to post along with you for support.

Which teachers in the Theravadin tradition have you studied with? I've met and done retreat with Jack Kornfield, Joseph Goldstein, Jamie Baraz, Alan Clements, Jacqueline Schwartz Mandel and Ruth Denison. Any of those familiar to you?

sky

Unfortunately, I have not studied under anyone. I learn from books, online video lectures (mostly by Ajahn Brahm), and other internet sources. I'll admit I'm not the best Buddhist, but I am certainly willing to learn more and improve. I'll start up a thread right now.

 

[Rogo]

This is also pure Sky. She leaves the forum whenever her lies catch up with her.

What lies might those be?