Female genital mutilation almost universal in Indonesia

[Sunni Man]

I attend a mosque here in the U.S. where most of the women come from countries that female circumcision is standard practice for all females.

In talking to them about it; I found out they want the procedure done to their daughters, and have trouble understanding why people in America are so against it?

 

[Sunni Man]

Want me to post a video of what actually happens? And the physical ramifications? She will have trouble urinating and menstruating. The hole left is too small, for it be healthy. God made us the way he did for a reason. It was not so you can cut it up

So the Jews are wrong to circumcise baby boys?

Maybe you should ask God why he commanded them to do it in the Torah?

This is about female genital mutilation not male circumcision.

I am only talking about "female circumcision" and not female genital mutilation.

 

[PixieStix]

I attend a mosque here in the U.S. where most of the women come from countries that female circumcision is standard practice for all females.

In talking to them about it; I found out they want the procedure done to their daughters, and have trouble understanding why people in America are so against it?

You are an Imam, if I am not mistaken.

Why would she tell you what she really thinks, considering the culture and the religious ramifications of disagreeing

 

[PixieStix]

So the Jews are wrong to circumcise baby boys?

Maybe you should ask God why he commanded them to do it in the Torah?

This is about female genital mutilation not male circumcision.

I am only talking about "female circumcision" and not female genital mutilation.

Mutilation or maiming is an act of physical injury that degrades the appearance or function of any living body, sometimes causing death.

 

[Valerie]

Some link the practice to Sunni Islam's Shafi'i school of thought, to which most Kurds belong.





Human Rights Watch researchers Nadya Khalife and photographer Samer Muscati traveled to the rural villages and farmlands of Iraqi Kurdistan to interview and photograph women about their experiences with FGM.

The ensuing Human Rights Watch report had immediate impact. Shortly after its release the Kurdistan Islamic Scholars Union issued a fatwa declaring that FGM isn't an Islamic practice and that people should abandon it if it is proven harmful.



A significant number of girls and women in Iraqi Kurdistan suffer female genital mutilation (FGM) and its destructive after-effects, Human Rights Watch said today in a new report. The Kurdistan Regional Government should take immediate action to end FGM and develop a long term plan for its eradication, including passing a law to ban the practice, Human Rights Watch said.

The 73-page report, "‘They Took Me and Told Me Nothing': Female Genital Mutilation in Iraqi Kurdistan," documents the experiences of young girls and women who undergo FGM against a backdrop of conflicting messages from some religious leaders and healthcare professionals about the practice's legitimacy and safety. The report describes the pain and fear that girls and young women experience when they are cut, and the terrible toll that it takes on their physical and emotional health. It says the regional government has been unwilling to prohibit FGM, despite its readiness to address other forms of gender-based violence, including domestic violence and so-called honor killings.

"FGM violates women's and children's rights, including their rights to life, health, and bodily integrity," said Nadya Khalife, Middle East women's rights researcher at Human Rights Watch. "It's time for the regional government to step up to the plate and take concrete actions to eliminate this harmful practice because it simply won't go away on its own."




Iraqi Kurdistan: Girls and Women Suffer the Consequences of Female Genital Mutilation | Human Rights Watch

http://apps.who.int/iris/bitstream/10665/70264/1/WHO_RHR_10.9_eng.pdf

 

[Sunni Man]

I attend a mosque here in the U.S. where most of the women come from countries that female circumcision is standard practice for all females.

In talking to them about it; I found out they want the procedure done to their daughters, and have trouble understanding why people in America are so against it?

You are an Imam, if I am not mistaken.

Why would she tell you what she really thinks, considering the culture and the religious ramifications of disagreeing

No, I am not an Imam

The stereotype of muslim women not speaking out may be true in backwards countries like Afghanistan or Sudan.

But doesn't exist here in the U.S.

Women are on the board of our mosque and participate in all events and decisions.

We have several who are doctors and lawyers.

And none are forbidden to speak their mind; in fact it is encouraged.

 

[Dreamy]

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. As much as you don't like it, Sunni Man is entirely correct. There are also a number of people in the world who find a woman whose lips are not split and fitted with wooden disks to be unattractive too.

A gallery of female "beauty" for your information.
https://www.google.com/search?q=uba...NOYL3igLNlYCABg&ved=0CDkQsAQ&biw=1600&bih=775

There is something quite odd about the west in that they refuse to accept that uncircumcized women might be considered unattractive while at the same time finding a woman with natural breasts unattractive!

Muslim beauty: Remove the female clitoris.
Western beauty: Remove the female's breasts and fit them with plastic bags of various substances some of which will kill them.

I don't see much of a difference.

You are a woman?

To be sure! I certainly am. I do not agree with female mutiliation. I wouldn't do it, nor would I permit it to be done to my daughter if I had a daughter. It is barbaric. The real purpose is to eliminate female sexual enjoyment and make them unlikely to stray from their arranged marriage as a slave to master. However, I am still not so shortsighted as to claim that the excuse of enhanced beauty is any different than the western claim of enhanced beauty by removing women's breasts and replacing them with plastic bags of silicone or saline. A woman raised in a culture of female genital mutilation will demand circumcision the same way a girl in our culture will demand breast implants before she gets out of puberty. I don't see much of a difference. Female mutilation is female mutilation. The only difference is the standard of beauty.

A woman raised in a culture of female genital mutilation will demand circumcision the same way a girl in our culture will demand breast implants before she gets out of puberty.

Do you know this to be true and factual?


Katz, I understand your premise but a woman choosing to be influenced by media's concept of "beauty" and in turn getting breast implants or any other body modifications are still making a choice. We as free people are able to make choices. These women and girls are not making choices. How many of these women are taking themselves to a medical doctor on their own accord to have their FGM?

 

[Valerie]

So the Jews are wrong to circumcise baby boys?

Maybe you should ask God why he commanded them to do it in the Torah?

This is about female genital mutilation not male circumcision.

I am only talking about "female circumcision" and not female genital mutilation.

1. What is female genital mutilation (FGM)?

The World Health Organization (WHO) defines FGM as "all procedures involving partial or total removal of the external female genitalia or injury to the female genital organs for non-medical reasons."

2. What is the difference between female genital mutilation (FGM), female genital cutting (FGC), and female circumcision?

These are all terms used to refer to the practice of removing part of female genitalia for non-medical reasons:

- Female genital mutilation (FGM) is a term used by many human rights groups and health advocates to emphasize the physical, emotional, and psychological consequences associated with this procedure. This term also identifies the practice as a human rights violation because of the violence associated with the procedure and because it is mostly carried out on young girls. In its report "They Took Me and Told Me Nothing: Female Genital Mutilation in Iraqi Kurdistan," Human Rights Watch uses the term female genital mutilation or FGM.

- Female genital cutting (FGC) is a term that is also used by activists and health advocates to show the dangers associated with the practice. This term is sometimes also referred to as female genital mutilation/cutting or FGM/C.

- Female circumcision is a term used to describe the practice that does not take into consideration the harm associated with it. It is misleading because it implicitly compares the practice with male circumcision, regardless of the fact that FGM is a considerably more invasive procedure and is not conducted for medical purposes.



cont...


Q&A on Female Genital Mutilation | Human Rights Watch

 

[Dreamy]

They are Not being mutilated.....just medically circumcised.

By choice?

 

[Sunni Man]

This is about female genital mutilation not male circumcision.

I am only talking about "female circumcision" and not female genital mutilation.

Mutilation or maiming is an act of physical injury that degrades the appearance or function of any living body, sometimes causing death.

So women who get breast implants are mutilating their bodies?

 

[Katzndogz]

You are a woman?

To be sure! I certainly am. I do not agree with female mutiliation. I wouldn't do it, nor would I permit it to be done to my daughter if I had a daughter. It is barbaric. The real purpose is to eliminate female sexual enjoyment and make them unlikely to stray from their arranged marriage as a slave to master. However, I am still not so shortsighted as to claim that the excuse of enhanced beauty is any different than the western claim of enhanced beauty by removing women's breasts and replacing them with plastic bags of silicone or saline. A woman raised in a culture of female genital mutilation will demand circumcision the same way a girl in our culture will demand breast implants before she gets out of puberty. I don't see much of a difference. Female mutilation is female mutilation. The only difference is the standard of beauty.

Standard of beauty? The female genitalia is kind of hidden, it serves a physical purpose, unless I am mistaken

They cannot marry if they have a clitoris because no man of their culture will have them. Its only physical purpose is to enhance female pleasure. It does nothing else. Breasts serve a physical purpose too, but that doesn't stop women from wanting them removed and replaced with plastic bags. To a man of their culture, a woman with a clitoris would disgust them. To a man of western culture a woman with small breasts isn't worth looking at.

 

[Katzndogz]

You are a woman?

To be sure! I certainly am. I do not agree with female mutiliation. I wouldn't do it, nor would I permit it to be done to my daughter if I had a daughter. It is barbaric. The real purpose is to eliminate female sexual enjoyment and make them unlikely to stray from their arranged marriage as a slave to master. However, I am still not so shortsighted as to claim that the excuse of enhanced beauty is any different than the western claim of enhanced beauty by removing women's breasts and replacing them with plastic bags of silicone or saline. A woman raised in a culture of female genital mutilation will demand circumcision the same way a girl in our culture will demand breast implants before she gets out of puberty. I don't see much of a difference. Female mutilation is female mutilation. The only difference is the standard of beauty.

A woman raised in a culture of female genital mutilation will demand circumcision the same way a girl in our culture will demand breast implants before she gets out of puberty.

Do you know this to be true and factual?


Katz, I understand your premise but a woman choosing to be influenced by media's concept of "beauty" and in turn getting breast implants or any other body modifications are still making a choice. We as free people are able to make choices. These women and girls are not making choices. How many of these women are taking themselves to a medical doctor on their own accord to have their FGM?

Most if not all. Mothers take their daughters to have the procedure done. The girls are excited about it. It makes them more desirable and more marriageable. Especially in western nations where it's done surgically under anesthesia. In their home nations, it's done on the kitchen table with a piece of broken glass or a knife.

In time to come, some anthropologist might discover that the west, in its closing days, practiced genital piercings and breast removal and wonder why we did that..

 

[Dreamy]

To be sure! I certainly am. I do not agree with female mutiliation. I wouldn't do it, nor would I permit it to be done to my daughter if I had a daughter. It is barbaric. The real purpose is to eliminate female sexual enjoyment and make them unlikely to stray from their arranged marriage as a slave to master. However, I am still not so shortsighted as to claim that the excuse of enhanced beauty is any different than the western claim of enhanced beauty by removing women's breasts and replacing them with plastic bags of silicone or saline. A woman raised in a culture of female genital mutilation will demand circumcision the same way a girl in our culture will demand breast implants before she gets out of puberty. I don't see much of a difference. Female mutilation is female mutilation. The only difference is the standard of beauty.

A woman raised in a culture of female genital mutilation will demand circumcision the same way a girl in our culture will demand breast implants before she gets out of puberty.

Do you know this to be true and factual?


Katz, I understand your premise but a woman choosing to be influenced by media's concept of "beauty" and in turn getting breast implants or any other body modifications are still making a choice. We as free people are able to make choices. These women and girls are not making choices. How many of these women are taking themselves to a medical doctor on their own accord to have their FGM?

Most if not all. Mothers take their daughters to have the procedure done. The girls are excited about it. It makes them more desirable and more marriageable. Especially in western nations where it's done surgically under anesthesia. In their home nations, it's done on the kitchen table with a piece of broken glass or a knife.

In time to come, some anthropologist might discover that the west, in its closing days, practiced genital piercings and breast removal and wonder why we did that..

Genital piercings and breast removal are choices the person makes as an adult. FGM is done before the age of what some would consider consent. I am truly taking into consideration the cultural differences but can't help but shudder that this type of mutilation is still acceptable in any culture today.

 

[Sunni Man]

Genital piercings and breast removal are choices the person makes as an adult. FGM is done before the age of what some would consider consent. I am truly taking into consideration the cultural differences but can't help but shudder that this type of mutilation is still acceptable in any culture today.

Once again, it is Not mutilation.

Because nothing is being mutilated or disfigured.

It's just a time honored traditional enhancement that is considered normal by many cultures.

 

[Dreamy]

Genital piercings and breast removal are choices the person makes as an adult. FGM is done before the age of what some would consider consent. I am truly taking into consideration the cultural differences but can't help but shudder that this type of mutilation is still acceptable in any culture today.

Once again, it is Not mutilation.

Because nothing is being mutilated or disfigured.

It's just a time honored traditional enhancement that is considered normal by many cultures.

Evidently TGM and what you are describing are not the same. I have been reading some here trying to understand this "cultural" behavior. Is is cultural or religious in nature?

FEMALE GENITAL MUTILATION FEMALE (CIRCUMCISION) IN AFRICA, MIDDLE EAST AND FAR EAST

 

[Sunni Man]

Although many associate female circumcision with muslims and Islam.

It was practiced long before Islam by many cultures and various religions.

Also there are various types and methods of female circumcision practiced by different cultures.

But the western do gooders lump them all together under the label of FGM

 

[Dreamy]

Although many associate female circumcision with muslims and Islam.

It was practiced long before Islam by many cultures and various religions.

What is the purpose of female circumcision on children other than to fulfill a cultural or religious norm ? I am just learning about this in detail so I am not lumping together anything except from a vantage point of being not educated fully on the topic.

 

[Truthseeker420]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EcLq59yrOik]Circumcision: Rabbi Kills Baby - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Unkotare]

To a man of western culture a woman with small breasts isn't worth looking at.

Who told you that?

 

[Unkotare]

Breasts serve a physical purpose too, but that doesn't stop women from wanting them removed and replaced with plastic bags. .

You've got some very strange misinformation and misconceptions.