Far from the Myth of 'Overpopulation'

[Unkotare]

...There is no absolute moral code on the taking of a human life.

So, if such "taking" were made 'legal' tomorrow, you would have no problem grabbing some kid off the street at random and killing him?

 

[Unkotare]

...

Morality is subjective ....

By definition, it is not.

and who made up the definition?
...

There are different words in different languages to describe things we experience in the course of living. The word "blue" does not make the sky blue. The word "time" did not 'invent' time just because the English language developed a word for it. If you suffered aphasia and forgot the word "mountain," would all mountains in the world suddenly vanish? Fish swim in the sea no matter what word in any language we use to describe it.

 

[Blues Man]

...There is no absolute moral code on the taking of a human life.

So, if such "taking" were made 'legal' tomorrow, you would have no problem grabbing some kid off the street at random and killing him?

A hypothetical.

I have been raised in a society that has had a prohibition of murder so I find it reprehensible.

Had I been raised on a society that celebrated the murder of strangers entering the defined territory of my society then I would not find murder on an interloper reprehensible.

How can there be some universal absolute moral code authored by man when in our history or even today we put different standards on killing another for no reason?

If you plan and commit a murder in MA you will not be put to death do the same in TX and you will be put to death.

In this case 2 states in the same country have taken 2 different moral stances. How is that an absolute?

 

[Unkotare]

....The death penalty is a prime example of the subjectivity of morality. Either it's wrong to kill another human or it's not. ...

Incorrect. The death penalty is not arbitrary killing, quite the contrary.

It is a killing that serves no purpose.
.....

Incorrect. It is an endpoint of our judicial system intended to maintain security and order in society. YOU might disagree with the purpose, but it does serve a purpose.

 

[Blues Man]

...

Morality is subjective ....

By definition, it is not.

and who made up the definition?
...

There are different words in different languages to describe things we experience in the course of living. The word "blue" does not make the sky blue. The word "time" did not 'invent' time just because the English language developed a word for it. If you suffered aphasia and forgot the word "mountain," would all mountains in the world suddenly vanish? Fish swim in the sea no matter what word in any language we use to describe it.

So once upon a time morals were called something else. That does not in any way mean that there is some moral absolute standard placed upon humans or inherent to human beings.

 

[Unkotare]

....The fact is the decline if it happens will be quite slow .....

On the contrary, when a turning point is reached things happen fast and can't be turned around on a dime. Take a look at South Korea today. Take a look at China 30 years from now.

China’s Population Destiny: The Looming Crisis

China’s demographic landscape has been thoroughly redrawn by unprecedented population changes in recent decades. Wang Feng writes on China’s rapidly aging population, and its domestic and international ramifications.

www.brookings.edu

China Population: From Explosion to Implosion

China's one-child policy, which compelled couples to seek abortions or undergo sterilization procedures, ended in October 2015. Yet the country's birth rate hasn't increased, and Communist Party officials are concerned about economic growth.

www.planetizen.com

Population decline will hit China hard – DW – 09/09/2019

Business leaders and analysts see the global population declining in the next century, and China will be badly affected. The Asian nation is well-advised to make precautions soon to avoid a humanitarian crisis.

www.dw.com

it's only a crisis if you buy into the theiry [sic] that any and all economic contractions are undesirable.
.....

Now we're back to you not reading the links.

I read all the other ones and this is the theory you buy into so I assume the last couple were just going to support the theory you agree with.

Go ahead tell me I'm wrong.

What is the "theory" as you think you understand it?

In a nutshell, smaller population leads to less productivity and that is undesirable.

But a smaller population will have fewer material needs so a lowering of productivity is to be expected.

There are pros and cons to both.

The population will peak then decline that is inevitable. People adapt that's why there are 7 billion plus people on the planet

Is it not prudent to plan for the inevitable so as to mitigate the suffering of people during the process of adaptation?

 

[Blues Man]

....The death penalty is a prime example of the subjectivity of morality. Either it's wrong to kill another human or it's not. ...

Incorrect. The death penalty is not arbitrary killing, quite the contrary.

It is a killing that serves no purpose.
.....

Incorrect. It is an endpoint of our judicial system intended to maintain security and order in society. YOU might disagree with the purpose, but it does serve a purpose.

As I said we have various states in this country that say the death penalty is immoral and we have some that say it is.

Where is your absolute moral code in this instance?

 

[Unkotare]

...

Morality is subjective ....

By definition, it is not.

and who made up the definition?
...

There are different words in different languages to describe things we experience in the course of living. The word "blue" does not make the sky blue. The word "time" did not 'invent' time just because the English language developed a word for it. If you suffered aphasia and forgot the word "mountain," would all mountains in the world suddenly vanish? Fish swim in the sea no matter what word in any language we use to describe it.

So once upon a time morals were called something else. That does not in any way mean that there is some moral absolute standard placed upon humans or inherent to human beings.

Do you breathe air?

 

[Blues Man]

....The fact is the decline if it happens will be quite slow .....

On the contrary, when a turning point is reached things happen fast and can't be turned around on a dime. Take a look at South Korea today. Take a look at China 30 years from now.

China’s Population Destiny: The Looming Crisis

China’s demographic landscape has been thoroughly redrawn by unprecedented population changes in recent decades. Wang Feng writes on China’s rapidly aging population, and its domestic and international ramifications.

www.brookings.edu

China Population: From Explosion to Implosion

China's one-child policy, which compelled couples to seek abortions or undergo sterilization procedures, ended in October 2015. Yet the country's birth rate hasn't increased, and Communist Party officials are concerned about economic growth.

www.planetizen.com

Population decline will hit China hard – DW – 09/09/2019

Business leaders and analysts see the global population declining in the next century, and China will be badly affected. The Asian nation is well-advised to make precautions soon to avoid a humanitarian crisis.

www.dw.com

it's only a crisis if you buy into the theiry [sic] that any and all economic contractions are undesirable.
.....

Now we're back to you not reading the links.

I read all the other ones and this is the theory you buy into so I assume the last couple were just going to support the theory you agree with.

Go ahead tell me I'm wrong.

What is the "theory" as you think you understand it?

In a nutshell, smaller population leads to less productivity and that is undesirable.

But a smaller population will have fewer material needs so a lowering of productivity is to be expected.

There are pros and cons to both.

The population will peak then decline that is inevitable. People adapt that's why there are 7 billion plus people on the planet

Is it not prudent to plan for the inevitable so as to mitigate the suffering of people during the process of adaptation?

we can prepare the same way we have dealt with a rapidly increasing population by using technology.

if we automate more and more industrial processes fewer people can produce the same or more

 

[Unkotare]

....The death penalty is a prime example of the subjectivity of morality. Either it's wrong to kill another human or it's not. ...

Incorrect. The death penalty is not arbitrary killing, quite the contrary.

It is a killing that serves no purpose.
.....

Incorrect. It is an endpoint of our judicial system intended to maintain security and order in society. YOU might disagree with the purpose, but it does serve a purpose.

As I said we have various states in this country that say the death penalty is immoral and we have some that say it is.

Where is your absolute moral code in this instance?

What people disagree on there is ethics, not morality.

 

[Blues Man]

...

Morality is subjective ....

By definition, it is not.

and who made up the definition?
...

There are different words in different languages to describe things we experience in the course of living. The word "blue" does not make the sky blue. The word "time" did not 'invent' time just because the English language developed a word for it. If you suffered aphasia and forgot the word "mountain," would all mountains in the world suddenly vanish? Fish swim in the sea no matter what word in any language we use to describe it.

So once upon a time morals were called something else. That does not in any way mean that there is some moral absolute standard placed upon humans or inherent to human beings.

Do you breathe air?

Are you sitting in a chair?

 

[Blues Man]

....The death penalty is a prime example of the subjectivity of morality. Either it's wrong to kill another human or it's not. ...

Incorrect. The death penalty is not arbitrary killing, quite the contrary.

It is a killing that serves no purpose.
.....

Incorrect. It is an endpoint of our judicial system intended to maintain security and order in society. YOU might disagree with the purpose, but it does serve a purpose.

As I said we have various states in this country that say the death penalty is immoral and we have some that say it is.

Where is your absolute moral code in this instance?

What people disagree on there is ethics, not morality.

Saying it is wrong to use capital punishment is a moral judgement

 

[Unkotare]

...
we can prepare the same way we have dealt with a rapidly increasing population by using technology.

if we automate more and more industrial processes fewer people can produce the same or more

Just by snapping our fingers, and there would be no disastrous economic consequences in the meantime?

 

[Unkotare]

...

Morality is subjective ....

By definition, it is not.

and who made up the definition?
...

There are different words in different languages to describe things we experience in the course of living. The word "blue" does not make the sky blue. The word "time" did not 'invent' time just because the English language developed a word for it. If you suffered aphasia and forgot the word "mountain," would all mountains in the world suddenly vanish? Fish swim in the sea no matter what word in any language we use to describe it.

So once upon a time morals were called something else. That does not in any way mean that there is some moral absolute standard placed upon humans or inherent to human beings.

Do you breathe air?

Are you sitting in a chair?

No, I am not. Sitting in a chair is not an inescapable aspect of living as a sentient being in this plane of existence.

 

[Unkotare]

....The death penalty is a prime example of the subjectivity of morality. Either it's wrong to kill another human or it's not. ...

Incorrect. The death penalty is not arbitrary killing, quite the contrary.

It is a killing that serves no purpose.
.....

Incorrect. It is an endpoint of our judicial system intended to maintain security and order in society. YOU might disagree with the purpose, but it does serve a purpose.

As I said we have various states in this country that say the death penalty is immoral and we have some that say it is.

Where is your absolute moral code in this instance?

What people disagree on there is ethics, not morality.

Saying it is wrong to use capital punishment is a moral judgement

It is an ethical question for the very reason that the death penalty is not arbitrary killing.

 

[Unkotare]

...

I have been raised in a society that has had a prohibition of murder so I find it reprehensible.

Had I been raised on a society that celebrated the murder of strangers entering the defined territory of my society then I would not find murder on an interloper reprehensible.
...

So, you do not have free will?

 

[Unkotare]

...

How can there be some universal absolute moral code authored by man when in our history or even today we put different standards on killing another for no reason?
...

We are not talking about killing for no reason. Find a death penalty case where the convicted was charged with "just because."

 

[Unkotare]

....

If you plan and commit a murder in MA you will not be put to death do the same in TX and you will be put to death.

In this case 2 states in the same country have taken 2 different moral stances. How is that an absolute?

You're comparing two different laws, not morality itself. Murder is wrong in Texas and Massachusetts. Punishing murder is accepted in Texas and Massachusetts.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

You're comparing two different laws, not morality itself. Murder is wrong in Texas and Massachusetts. Punishing murder is accepted in Texas and Massachusetts.

Correct.
Both agree it is immoral, but approach the punishment of said immorality differently

 

[Blues Man]

....The death penalty is a prime example of the subjectivity of morality. Either it's wrong to kill another human or it's not. ...

Incorrect. The death penalty is not arbitrary killing, quite the contrary.

It is a killing that serves no purpose.
.....

Incorrect. It is an endpoint of our judicial system intended to maintain security and order in society. YOU might disagree with the purpose, but it does serve a purpose.

As I said we have various states in this country that say the death penalty is immoral and we have some that say it is.

Where is your absolute moral code in this instance?

What people disagree on there is ethics, not morality.

Saying it is wrong to use capital punishment is a moral judgement

It is an ethical question for the very reason that the death penalty is not arbitrary killing.

One could say no killing is arbitrary. First degree murder requires malice aforethought so that's not arbitrary/ Second degree murder requires intent so that's not arbitrary. Hell even manslaughter isn't arbitrary it's more accidental.

That still doesn't reconcile the fact that we have states that cannot agree that capital punishment is acceptable.

That comes down to moral relativism. Some people can justify capital punishment some can't.

So what is the absolute moral stance on that subject that you say exists?