Famous Athiest now believes in God

[Avatar4321]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...&u=/ap/20041209/ap_on_re_us/believing_atheist

Interesting article. Interesting isnt it? after decades of unbelief he finally comes to the conclusion thats obvious to everyone who already believes. It took him over 50 years to discover through his own mind what some of discover in a second by kneeling in prayer and asking God for ourselves.

I think the only problem he has now is believing in God is more than believing he exists. Believing in God is trusting Him. It takes a relationship to trust. Sadly he spent so much of his life in disbelief that he has such little time to develop a relationship if he even believes one is possible.

 

[Eightball]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...&u=/ap/20041209/ap_on_re_us/believing_atheist

Interesting article. Interesting isnt it? after decades of unbelief he finally comes to the conclusion thats obvious to everyone who already believes. It took him over 50 years to discover through his own mind what some of discover in a second by kneeling in prayer and asking God for ourselves.

I think the only problem he has now is believing in God is more than believing he exists. Believing in God is trusting Him. It takes a relationship to trust. Sadly he spent so much of his life in disbelief that he has such little time to develop a relationship if he even believes one is possible.

Believing in God or accepting that there is a creator are two different positions.

As mentioned above, believing involves trusting. Most folks really don't believe in God, but just accept the existence of a creator.......sad and regrettable.

Many aspects are in believing.........i.e.

1. Grace = unmeritted favor.
2. Forgiveness = obvious
3. Surrender or Commitment
4. Faith = Hope in that which hasn't come about or is untangible.

Regards, Eightballsidepocket

 

[MissileMan]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...&u=/ap/20041209/ap_on_re_us/believing_atheist

Interesting article. Interesting isnt it? after decades of unbelief he finally comes to the conclusion thats obvious to everyone who already believes. It took him over 50 years to discover through his own mind what some of discover in a second by kneeling in prayer and asking God for ourselves.

I think the only problem he has now is believing in God is more than believing he exists. Believing in God is trusting Him. It takes a relationship to trust. Sadly he spent so much of his life in disbelief that he has such little time to develop a relationship if he even believes one is possible.

I'm not sure I'd call his new belief an Epiphany. He changed his mind about the origins of the universe. The article says he still doesn't believe in an afterlife, and I would doubt that he believes in Bhudda, or Allah, or Jesus Christ. It didn't sound to me like he found any "faith" at all.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Believing in God or accepting that there is a creator are two different positions.

They seem the same to me. Oh well.

 

[rei_t_ex]

They seem the same to me. Oh well.

God, at least the Christian God, has more characteristics attributed to Him than merely being the ultimate mind responsible for the creation of the universe. A creator has no such further characteristics. Indeed, any self-aware entity who had nothing more to do with this universe than setting up very precise conditions for the Big Bang such that the universe could then develop in the direction that it has developed in, on its own, would fully satisfy the definition of a creator. I doubt that such an entity would satisfy the definition of God. A main characteristic of God, IMHO would be to care about (or even know about) human existence and to interact with us in someway at some point. This is absent from a creator.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

God, at least the Christian God, has more characteristics attributed to Him than merely being the ultimate mind responsible for the creation of the universe. A creator has no such further characteristics. Indeed, any self-aware entity who had nothing more to do with this universe than setting up very precise conditions for the Big Bang such that the universe could then develop in the direction that it has developed in, on its own, would fully satisfy the definition of a creator. I doubt that such an entity would satisfy the definition of God. A main characteristic of God, IMHO would be to care about (or even know about) human existence and to interact with us in someway at some point. This is absent from a creator.

What you're describing is known as the intricate wachmaker notion of god. A hands off distant god, but a god. Sounds like a god. creator/god. same diff.

 

[rei_t_ex]

What you're describing is known as the intricate wachmaker notion of god. A hands off distant god, but a god. Sounds like a god. creator/god. same diff.

Perhaps. But would you not agree that a person who believes in a "watchmaker... hands-off distant god" has a VERY different belief system than that of a religion such as Christianity? Ultimately, I think that it would all depend in what is the minimum basket of attributes for an entity to have for you to identify him as a god, but a creator does not even need to be omnipotent or omniscient. Or eternal...

 

[lehr]

Yahoo! News - Latest News & Headlines

Interesting article. Interesting isnt it? after decades of unbelief he finally comes to the conclusion thats obvious to everyone who already believes. It took him over 50 years to discover through his own mind what some of discover in a second by kneeling in prayer and asking God for ourselves.

I think the only problem he has now is believing in God is more than believing he exists. Believing in God is trusting Him. It takes a relationship to trust. Sadly he spent so much of his life in disbelief that he has such little time to develop a relationship if he even believes one is possible.

just a reminder !

there r at least 2 kinds of atheists !

one group is called - CTR. OF INQUIRE - i belonged to that group for 1 yr. - they are socialists !


the other atheist group is called - AYN RAND - they are capitalists !

i belong to that group !

the only bitch i have with the rand group is they believe in abortion ! but i have to still support them because they are anti - communist !

 

[rightwinger]

It's a miracle!

That must prove there is a god

 

[Zagg]

So, if someone who used to be a believer becomes an atheist, that proves there is no god?

 

[Lokiate]

just a reminder !

there r at least 2 kinds of atheists !

There's a lot more than that.

 

[Ducky]

also...

it seems strange that you would use this quote from Ben Franklin,

"If we were as industrious to become good as to make ourselves great, we should become really great by being good, and the number of valuable men would be much increased; but it is a grand mistake to think of being great without goodness; and i pronounce it as certain that there was never yet a truly great man that was not at the same time truly virtuous." - Ben Franklin

because Franklin was an Athiest his whole adult life and died an Athiest

 

[California Girl]

It's a miracle!

That must prove there is a god

Yes. A thread that died in 2004 is suddenly resurrected! Hallelujah! Praise the Lord! And pass the ammunition.

 

[Avatar4321]

It's a miracle!

That must prove there is a god

God proves Himself everyday. He proves Himself in the lives of people. Even those who turn away from Him.

 

[Avatar4321]

also...

it seems strange that you would use this quote from Ben Franklin,

"If we were as industrious to become good as to make ourselves great, we should become really great by being good, and the number of valuable men would be much increased; but it is a grand mistake to think of being great without goodness; and i pronounce it as certain that there was never yet a truly great man that was not at the same time truly virtuous." - Ben Franklin

because Franklin was an Athiest his whole adult life and died an Athiest

You clearly don't know much about Franklin because he was no athiest. He believed in serving God by serving His fellow man. Personally, I don't know many athiests who would write:

I believe there is one Supreme most perfect being. ... I believe He is pleased and delights in the happiness of those He has created; and since without virtue man can have no happiness in this world, I firmly believe He delights to see me virtuous. ("Articles of Belief and Acts of Religion" - 1728)

For my own Part, when I am employed in serving others, I do not look upon myself as conferring Favours, but as paying Debts. In my Travels, and since my Settlement, I have received much Kindness from Men, to whom I shall never have any Opportunity of making the least direct Return. And numberless Mercies from God, who is infinitely above being benefited by our Services. Those Kindnesses from Men, I can therefore only Return on their Fellow Men; and I can only shew my Gratitude for these mercies from God, by a readiness to help his other Children and my Brethren. For I do not think that Thanks and Compliments, tho’ repeated weekly, can discharge our real Obligations to each other, and much less those to our Creator. (Letter to Joseph Huey (6 June 1753); published in Albert Henry Smyth, The Writings of Benjamin Franklin, volume 3, p. 144).

The Faith you mention has doubtless its use in the World. I do not desire to see it diminished, nor would I endeavour to lessen it in any Man. But I wish it were more productive of good Works, than I have generally seen it: I mean real good Works, Works of Kindness, Charity, Mercy, and Publick Spirit; not Holiday-keeping, Sermon-Reading or Hearing; performing Church Ceremonies, or making long Prayers, filled with Flatteries and Compliments, despis’d even by wise Men, and much less capable of pleasing the Deity. The worship of God is a Duty; the hearing and reading of Sermons may be useful; but, if Men rest in Hearing and Praying, as too many do, it is as if a Tree should Value itself on being water’d and putting forth Leaves, tho’ it never produc’d any Fruit. (Letter to Joseph Huey (6 June 1753); published in Albert Henry Smyth, The Writings of Benjamin Franklin, volume 3, p. 145).

I've lived, Sir, a long time, and the longer I live, the more convincing Proofs I see of this Truth — That God governs in the Affairs of Men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without his Notice, is it probable that an Empire can rise without his Aid? We have been assured, Sir, in the Sacred Writings, that except the Lord build the House they labor in vain who build it. I firmly believe this, — and I also believe that without his concurring Aid, we shall succeed in this political Building no better than the Builders of Babel: We shall be divided by our little partial local interests; our Projects will be confounded, and we ourselves shall become a Reproach and Bye word down to future Ages. (Speech to the Constitutional Convention (28 June 1787); Manuscript notes by Franklin preserved in the Library of Congress)

I may not be the smartest man in the world, but that sure doesn't sound like an Athiest to me.