Not a spin job. Reality.
In the meantime, it's not the problem of America's Muslims. So don't lay that crap on them.
explosion at Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, UK
- Thread starter basquebromance
- Start date
Not a spin job. Reality.
In the meantime, it's not the problem of America's Muslims. So don't lay that crap on them.
leftwinger
Diamond Member
oh really? You must of missed: Fort Hood? Georgia? ARK? KY? SanBerDoo? FLA? And about 1000 others.
Put you blinders back on. stay ignorant of actual happenings.
Issa
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I would love to see the same passion towards mass shootings and gun violence that kills thousands each year. But everytime a white supremacist commits a mass murder, he's mentally ill....when a terrorist does it you accuse the while 1.5 billion Muslims all over the world.
leftwinger
Diamond Member
OBammys' imports:
Trumps imports:
any questions?
Trumps imports:
leftwinger
Diamond Member
Good point. But, not good enough. Work on the BIG problem first. islamic violence is 100s' per day. A shooting here and there does not compare? We can't work on little stuff while the big stuff occupies all resources. Another reason to rid islamist cancer. We have given it 50-60-70 years and it is worse than ever.
So this excuses a Useful Idiot blowing up people in Manchester??
There will be a price to pay.
Greg
He's not "excusing" anyone. He has repeatedly said he abhors terrorism and what is done in the name of his religion. But no one wants to hear it because minds were made up as soon as he posted. He's trying to make some points that everyone is to angry, too upset, too horrified to take in after this tragedy so they are dog piling him. Why not give him a chance and listen to what he has to say instead of putting words in his mouth?
His points are that ISIS didn't come out of a vacuum - and it's not going to be gotten rid of without understanding what led to it and what is feeding it.
We have a long history of outside meddling, religious and ethnic factions, nationalistic aspirations and now failed states and a vacuum of power and law that created and nourishes ISIS and provides them with a ready supply of brainwashed recruits becuase it's easy to convince them that they can finally do something "meaningful" against the "enemy". It's easier to claim they just "hate the west" and "freedom" and hate what we stand for but it's nowhere that simple.
I have seen the same arguments used to put the event into "perspective". At its base is a useful idiot Pom (term for Brits) acting out a mixture of Stalinist/Islamist terror to gain a tactical advantage (media) by successfully murdering many people callously and disgustingly. The scum himself was not a "recruit" but a committed fanatic. It IS a war, Coyote, and the enemy leaders have absolutely no hesitation or conscience about murdering hundreds of thousands of fellow Muslims and anyone else that happens to be occupying their "space" or are standing against them. Retaliation is not only expected against such regimes but decency demands it!!
The problem Issa has is that in one breath he says he abhors violence but in the next says that it is understandable because of past WESTERN actions. It is understandable in terms of current Moslem actions. That is why the Sauds, Egyptians and fellow travelers are really vital to the solution. That President Trump has engaged them so publicly says it all as to why fellow Moslems want ISIS utterly destroyed. The solution is in the ME; NOT in downtown Manchester being an apologist for fanatical violence. And on this frankly I consider you in agreement. What we may disagree on is what I consider to be a distraction. "Blaming" past Western actions most of which I agreed with at the time and still do. What I abhor is the disengagement from the Region by the Obama Administration. It was both ill advised and hugely destructive. THAT is where the US mucked it up.
Greg
Issa
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Apart from IsraelI Palestinian conflicts.
There were 0 terrorist attacks. Invading Muslim countries led to this carnage, don't blame ordinary Muslims blame the corporate greed.
There were 0 terrorist attacks. Invading Muslim countries led to this carnage, don't blame ordinary Muslims blame the corporate greed.
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Issa
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Then why me and my family had to answer to some bigots that we muslims have nothing to do with this crap?
My kids are in school, selling girls scouts cookies, we will walk to the beach after that, and go on with our ordinary lives. Why do I have to apologize for something I had no hands in and be accused of something I had no hands in?
Living in a ultra liberal open minded city has been the best decision....I just can't think what kinda hell would've been living in some of the red ultra racist shitholes.
My kids are in school, selling girls scouts cookies, we will walk to the beach after that, and go on with our ordinary lives. Why do I have to apologize for something I had no hands in and be accused of something I had no hands in?
Living in a ultra liberal open minded city has been the best decision....I just can't think what kinda hell would've been living in some of the red ultra racist shitholes.
So this excuses a Useful Idiot blowing up people in Manchester??
There will be a price to pay.
Greg
He's not "excusing" anyone. He has repeatedly said he abhors terrorism and what is done in the name of his religion. But no one wants to hear it because minds were made up as soon as he posted. He's trying to make some points that everyone is to angry, too upset, too horrified to take in after this tragedy so they are dog piling him. Why not give him a chance and listen to what he has to say instead of putting words in his mouth?
His points are that ISIS didn't come out of a vacuum - and it's not going to be gotten rid of without understanding what led to it and what is feeding it.
We have a long history of outside meddling, religious and ethnic factions, nationalistic aspirations and now failed states and a vacuum of power and law that created and nourishes ISIS and provides them with a ready supply of brainwashed recruits becuase it's easy to convince them that they can finally do something "meaningful" against the "enemy". It's easier to claim they just "hate the west" and "freedom" and hate what we stand for but it's nowhere that simple.
I have seen the same arguments used to put the event into "perspective". At its base is a useful idiot Pom (term for Brits) acting out a mixture of Stalinist/Islamist terror to gain a tactical advantage (media) by successfully murdering many people callously and disgustingly. The scum himself was not a "recruit" but a committed fanatic. It IS a war, Coyote, and the enemy leaders have absolutely no hesitation or conscience about murdering hundreds of thousands of fellow Muslims and anyone else that happens to be occupying their "space" or are standing against them. Retaliation is not only expected against such regimes but decency demands it!!
The problem Issa has is that in one breath he says he abhors violence but in the next says that it is understandable because of past WESTERN actions. It is understandable in terms of current Moslem actions. That is why the Sauds, Egyptians and fellow travelers are really vital to the solution. That President Trump has engaged them so publicly says it all as to why fellow Moslems want ISIS utterly destroyed. The solution is in the ME; NOT in downtown Manchester being an apologist for fanatical violence. And on this frankly I consider you in agreement. What we may disagree on is what I consider to be a distraction. "Blaming" past Western actions most of which I agreed with at the time and still do. What I abhor is the disengagement from the Region by the Obama Administration. It was both ill advised and hugely destructive. THAT is where the US mucked it up.
Greg
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Which is why the biggest responses are from Moslem rivals/targets; Sauds, Egypt, Jordan etc etc . Who can forget the time Jordan nearly wiped out that scum Arafat and the PLO. No beg pardons then.
The current mess, again, has it's roots in the US leaving a vacuum in Iraq and Syria. No need to go furthjer back than that and to do so is merely a distraction.
I also think we should be praying for the Iraqi Army and supporters in their battle to liberate Mosul. ALL our prayers should be with them.
Greg
- Moderator
- #1,551
Sigh. Sarcasm is not a valid argument. Are you so obtuse that you can't see some of the same behavior and tactics being used by the Jihadists as the Conquistadors?
I can't alleviate your ignorance of history so I won't even try. Good night.
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Then why me and my family had to answer to some bigots that we muslims have nothing to do with this crap?
My kids are in school, selling girls scouts cookies, we will walk to the beach after that, and go on with our ordinary lives. Why do I have to apologize for something I had no hands in and be accused of something I had no hands in?
Living in a ultra liberal open minded city has been the best decision....I just can't think what kinda hell would've been living in some of the red ultra racist shitholes.
So this excuses a Useful Idiot blowing up people in Manchester??
There will be a price to pay.
Greg
He's not "excusing" anyone. He has repeatedly said he abhors terrorism and what is done in the name of his religion. But no one wants to hear it because minds were made up as soon as he posted. He's trying to make some points that everyone is to angry, too upset, too horrified to take in after this tragedy so they are dog piling him. Why not give him a chance and listen to what he has to say instead of putting words in his mouth?
His points are that ISIS didn't come out of a vacuum - and it's not going to be gotten rid of without understanding what led to it and what is feeding it.
We have a long history of outside meddling, religious and ethnic factions, nationalistic aspirations and now failed states and a vacuum of power and law that created and nourishes ISIS and provides them with a ready supply of brainwashed recruits becuase it's easy to convince them that they can finally do something "meaningful" against the "enemy". It's easier to claim they just "hate the west" and "freedom" and hate what we stand for but it's nowhere that simple.
I have seen the same arguments used to put the event into "perspective". At its base is a useful idiot Pom (term for Brits) acting out a mixture of Stalinist/Islamist terror to gain a tactical advantage (media) by successfully murdering many people callously and disgustingly. The scum himself was not a "recruit" but a committed fanatic. It IS a war, Coyote, and the enemy leaders have absolutely no hesitation or conscience about murdering hundreds of thousands of fellow Muslims and anyone else that happens to be occupying their "space" or are standing against them. Retaliation is not only expected against such regimes but decency demands it!!
The problem Issa has is that in one breath he says he abhors violence but in the next says that it is understandable because of past WESTERN actions. It is understandable in terms of current Moslem actions. That is why the Sauds, Egyptians and fellow travelers are really vital to the solution. That President Trump has engaged them so publicly says it all as to why fellow Moslems want ISIS utterly destroyed. The solution is in the ME; NOT in downtown Manchester being an apologist for fanatical violence. And on this frankly I consider you in agreement. What we may disagree on is what I consider to be a distraction. "Blaming" past Western actions most of which I agreed with at the time and still do. What I abhor is the disengagement from the Region by the Obama Administration. It was both ill advised and hugely destructive. THAT is where the US mucked it up.
Greg
Then get the conflict right. This is not about removing Saddam or the Crusades; it isn't about the Ottomans or bloody Atilla the Hun. This is about a Neo-Stalinist Useful Idiot in the cause of a Totalitarian Sorta Islamic State killing other poms. The only relevant "root" is the Assad regime and its murderous response to the legitimate calls for reform. The lack of Policy action by Obama meant that the Butcher did whatever he wanted to his own people. It has become a disgusting mess and I suspect very strongly that now that the US will LEAD then it will be sorted out. I also think there'll be a lot more blood shed before that happens and I find that most sad.
Greg
Yep -- the old Double Standard, a/k/a having it both ways. When "we" do it they're "outliers" who in no way represent their religion --- when "they" do it they're pure pious absolute models of their religion. Even if neither one is doing it OUT OF religion.
Double Standard, the hallmark of dishonest rhetoric. They'll never admit to it though. Even if you quote it right back to them. And in this case, Double Standard on top of Composition Fallacy, just humping away like there's no tomorrow. Fallacies Gone Wild.
You're spanking AROUND the problem. It is not deeply rooted in History and more than a car accident was caused by the invention of the petrol engine. It is about Syria, Assad, and extremists filling the vacuum. THAT is the immediate cause. Oh; and a Useful Idiot to a shit cause.
Thank you for not bothering; it would have been embarrassing for you.
Greg
I think Iraq is dealing with the situation as best it can and soon ISIL will be defeated in Mosul and from there to the border. I think the situation has just had a dramatic change; the US will participate with others in the stabilization of the region. The Arab League will I think become the main vehicle for that. I am in fact quite optimistic. I look forward to the trials of those who have done the atrocities and their Meeting with Justice. The US has asked for Australia's assistance in Afghanistan. I expect that we will oblige and contribute in our small way. We are already in Iraq and I think we will be part of the Syrian stabilisation agenda; not sure exactly how. But make no mistake; the main movers will be OTHER MOSLEMS including the Kurds. (Their women are fighting where Obama feared to tread.) Says a lot about Obama's failed policies quite frankly but they are GONE now.
Greg
jasonnfree
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This war in the middle east will never end until America gets over the idea it can rule the world.
WEATHER53
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The war in the Middle East will never end until they want it to which mostly begins with ending constant references to the past
Nice fake trying the USA blame
jasonnfree
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Who else to blame, we're over there, and have been for decades, and for what?
- Moderator
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Lol, what's embarrassing is your attempt to talk yourself and your argument up. You're hellbent on labeling billions of people because you can't see past your biases and emotions.
I've embarrassed a number of your friends on this thread already. I'm primed and ready to add you to that list.
Issa
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Japan, new zealand, zambia, Nicaragua ect....don't go around distabilizing countries and creating safe heaven for terrorists do they?
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