Every Classroom Should Have Heavily Armed Teachers In It

[Big Bend Texas]

As republicans let their cult outgun the police.

The Police have automatic weapons, we don't.

There's absolutely nothing wrong however with the general public being able to at least be equally well armed as police.

That's the sole guarantee we have against a "Police State", being able to resist with equal or at least near equal force.

 

[Big Bend Texas]

Schools now resemble prison dorms.

No, prisons are designed to keep people in, fortresses are designed to keep people out.

 

[Nuthin' Fancy]

Who left the door unlocked which he used to gain entry?

So, she was supposed to lock, a self-locking, self-closing door?

 

[eagle1462010]

She's largely correct. Particularly in large cities there's a serious problem with parents not preparing kids to go to school so the teachers spend the first four or five years of grade school having to potty train and instill a minimal level of self discipline in the kids.

Teaching today isn't what it was when I was young, today it's combination zoo and animal trainer's ring at the Circus and of course they can't even put hands on a kid to break up a fight anymore.

I agree with that. We live in a different world than we were kids...........and most of it is financial. Back then one working most could get by very well. Not today. Takes 2 in most cases now just to survive. Poverty causes this. The break up of the family causes it. Then add in they could be sued or jailed for a belt you have a no win situation.

So she's right on it. And it causes many to not want to do it. I agree.

 

[Big Bend Texas]

So, she was supposed to lock, a self-locking, self-closing door?

She was responsible for making sure that it did lock.

 

[eagle1462010]

I'm not gonna blame that teacher for the door. Not going there. When that happened shit was going down. The guy was shooting through windows and headed right for her. They now say she pulled the door shut and it didn't lock. Sounds like it was installed out of plum. That is not her fault and not when she is in a damn hurry because a mad man is trying to kill her with a gun.

 

[Big Bend Texas]

I'm not gonna blame that teacher for the door. Not going there. When that happened shit was going down. The guy was shooting through windows and headed right for her. They now say she pulled the door shut and it didn't lock. Sounds like it was installed out of plum. That is not her fault and not when she is in a damn hurry because a mad man is trying to kill her with a gun.

He wasn't shooting at her, not according to anything that has been put out.

He was apparently flinging some random shots at the building itself but not at the teacher unless something new has come out in the last 18 hours or so I didn't see.

She's absolutely liable for failing to ensure that door was closed and locked since she's the one who opened it to begin with and she was the last person through it before the shooter.

 

[Nuthin' Fancy]

The Police have automatic weapons, we don't.

So, they are supposed to have items not available to the general public.

There's absolutely nothing wrong however with the general public being able to at least be equally well armed as police.

Yes, there is....................deeply wrong.

That's the sole guarantee we have against a "Police State", being able to resist with equal or at least near equal force.

You proved my point.

 

[eagle1462010]

He wasn't shooting at her, not according to anything that has been put out.

He was apparently flinging some random shots at the building itself but not at the teacher unless something new has come out in the last 18 hours or so I didn't see.

She's absolutely liable for failing to ensure that door was closed and locked since she's the one who opened it to begin with and she was the last person through it before the shooter.

We disagree. She is not a vet. Shots were being fired and the funeral home people had just yelled at her that the guy had a gun and shots are being fired.

She was probably terrified. I'll not go down that path to condemn her. The videos show her closing the dang door. She had no idea it didn't lock and at any second she most have thought that she would be shot.

Me and you would be looking for something to kill that fucker with. But that is us.

 

[Auld Phart]

Sure, numbnuts.

As republicans let their cult outgun the police.

As republicans let their cult outgun the police.

So do gangbangers.

(and they're not known generally as Republicans)

 

[JohnDB]

HOW?? How would they "add to the mess"? There were 21 people killed in Texas. It doesn't get much messier than that.

And do you honestly believe that an armed teacher who is properly trained wouldn't know how to react when someone walks into their classroom and starts killing students?

Properly trained....
That's the key point right there.
Thank you for bringing it up.

Now approximately how many hours of training and testing is it going to require for a teacher to be trained to unsecure their firearm and begin to return fire at a perpetrator?
(I am an advocate of an armed civilian population...I believe that the founding fathers were quite right in limiting the federal government from taking guns)

And it is going to require a ridiculous amount of time and training and testing for a teacher to learn to do this.

And that's the point. Shootouts are an extremely emotionally shocking experience. Most people empty their guns when training and hit anything but the cardboard cutouts. And when you go to training you are mentally preparing yourself to shoot targets.
That mental preparation doesn't happen in the course of a normal school day...it's all about tardy slips and grading homework and trying to teach these rowdy kids so you can demonstrate their learning through standardized testing.

I completely agree that a person with a hand gun that had been well trained inside the school at the time the shooter started would have been fortuitous. It would have saved lives.
The problem is the training for shoot/don't shoot is difficult and requires lots of hours. Lots and lots of them. And even police who train specifically for this on a regular basis still make bad shots and bad calls of judgment....happens regularly enough.

Your average school teacher puts in around 70-80 hours a week. That's just dealing with students and parents and lessons and grading papers.

That's why I'm saying what I'm saying. Because the teachers likely won't be proficient with their firearm and will inadvertently begin shooting students, teachers, or even responding police or other responding armed citizens trying to help.

Logistically what you are talking about is a nightmare to pull off.

 

[Nuthin' Fancy]

The police had piss poor leadership.

They had piss poor weapons, relatively speaking too.

As an official timeline coalesces in tandem with relayed instructions on scene outside the Texas elementary school Tuesday, federal officers are now detailing how they had defied orders considered to be the “wrong decision.”

When the 18-year-old suspect first arrived at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, TX at 11:28 a.m., responders from various law enforcement agencies in the surrounding area answered the call. As previously reported, members of the U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) border patrol tactical unit BORTAC were delayed in entering the building after being told the situation had “transitioned from an active shooter to a barricaded subject.”

That call was made by Uvalde Consolidated Independent School District chief of police Pete Arredondo who further instructed officers on the scene to delay entry into the building and await backup and tactical equipment.

You don't need an M60 to defend yourself against a school shooter that's only 15' from you.

Yes, but you need to respond before they do too.

There is absolutely no reason not to arm and train faculty and staff willing and able to take on that mantle of responsibility.

IDK, the cops would know the difference between an armed culprit and an armed teacher?

 

[Nuthin' Fancy]

So do gangbangers.

(and they're not known generally as Republicans)

That's their weapon of choice too.

 

[Auld Phart]

They had piss poor weapons, relatively speaking too.

As an official timeline coalesces in tandem with relayed instructions on scene outside the Texas elementary school Tuesday, federal officers are now detailing how they had defied orders considered to be the “wrong decision.”

When the 18-year-old suspect first arrived at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, TX at 11:28 a.m., responders from various law enforcement agencies in the surrounding area answered the call. As previously reported, members of the U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) border patrol tactical unit BORTAC were delayed in entering the building after being told the situation had “transitioned from an active shooter to a barricaded subject.”

That call was made by Uvalde Consolidated Independent School District chief of police Pete Arredondo who further instructed officers on the scene to delay entry into the building and await backup and tactical equipment.



Yes, but you need to respond before they do too.

IDK, the cops would know the difference between an armed culprit and an armed teacher?

IDK, the cops would know the difference between an armed culprit and an armed teacher?

They'd probably believe the person with the AR-15 is the invader.

 

[eagle1462010]

They had piss poor weapons, relatively speaking too.

As an official timeline coalesces in tandem with relayed instructions on scene outside the Texas elementary school Tuesday, federal officers are now detailing how they had defied orders considered to be the “wrong decision.”

When the 18-year-old suspect first arrived at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, TX at 11:28 a.m., responders from various law enforcement agencies in the surrounding area answered the call. As previously reported, members of the U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) border patrol tactical unit BORTAC were delayed in entering the building after being told the situation had “transitioned from an active shooter to a barricaded subject.”

That call was made by Uvalde Consolidated Independent School District chief of police Pete Arredondo who further instructed officers on the scene to delay entry into the building and await backup and tactical equipment.



Yes, but you need to respond before they do too.

IDK, the cops would know the difference between an armed culprit and an armed teacher?

LOL

If the teacher was armed then he or she would either be dead or alive after engaging the shooter. If the shooter is dead then the issue is done. If the teacher is dead I highly doubt a corpse would be a threat to the police.

Kids are dying. You are either a man and go in to save them or you are nothing to me.

 

[Nuthin' Fancy]

LOL

If the teacher was armed then he or she would either be dead or alive after engaging the shooter. If the shooter is dead then the issue is done. If the teacher is dead I highly doubt a corpse would be a threat to the police.

How would the police know?
That corpse could be a school staff member.

One case of mistaken identity.

June 26 2021
Colorado police on Friday explained how a heroic bystander who had just shot and killed a cop-hating gunman was himself fatally struck by a responding officer.

Johnny Hurley, 40, was shopping in downtown Arvada, a Denver suburb, when he heard Ronald Troyke ambush and murder Officer Gordon Beesley, who was responding to a call Monday afternoon, officials said.

Troyke, 59, then returned to his truck to grab an AR-15, and was holding it when Hurley — who was carrying a concealed weapon — confronted him and shot him dead, Police Chief Link Strate said in a video clip posted Friday.

But when another officer responded to the scene, he saw Hurley holding the suspect’s rifle — and tragically mistook the good Samaritan for the cop killer, fatally shooting him, Strate said.

Kids are dying. You are either a man and go in to save them or you are nothing to me.

Wonder if this is his promotion?

Pete Arredondo, the Uvalde Consolidated Independent School District police chief who was the incident commander during the Robb Elementary School shooting, was sworn in as a city council member on May 31.

Arredondo was elected to the council earlier this month. In his statement on Monday, the mayor said Arredondo was "duly elected" and that there is "nothing in the City Charter, Election Code, or Texas Constitution that prohibits him from taking the oath of office.

Well, there should be.

To our knowledge, we are currently not aware of any investigation of Mr. Arredondo."

Well, there should be.

 

[eagle1462010]

How would the police know?
That corpse could be a school staff member.

One case of mistaken identity.

June 26 2021
Colorado police on Friday explained how a heroic bystander who had just shot and killed a cop-hating gunman was himself fatally struck by a responding officer.

Johnny Hurley, 40, was shopping in downtown Arvada, a Denver suburb, when he heard Ronald Troyke ambush and murder Officer Gordon Beesley, who was responding to a call Monday afternoon, officials said.

Troyke, 59, then returned to his truck to grab an AR-15, and was holding it when Hurley — who was carrying a concealed weapon — confronted him and shot him dead, Police Chief Link Strate said in a video clip posted Friday.

But when another officer responded to the scene, he saw Hurley holding the suspect’s rifle — and tragically mistook the good Samaritan for the cop killer, fatally shooting him, Strate said.


Wonder if this is his promotion?

Pete Arredondo, the Uvalde Consolidated Independent School District police chief who was the incident commander during the Robb Elementary School shooting, was sworn in as a city council member on May 31.

Arredondo was elected to the council earlier this month. In his statement on Monday, the mayor said Arredondo was "duly elected" and that there is "nothing in the City Charter, Election Code, or Texas Constitution that prohibits him from taking the oath of office.

Well, there should be.

To our knowledge, we are currently not aware of any investigation of Mr. Arredondo."

Well, there should be.

LOL

Spin doctor. Everything to kill the idea that armed people are in a better position than unarmed when a mad man comes at them with a gun.

Whatever.

 

[SweetSue92]

Properly trained....
That's the key point right there.
Thank you for bringing it up.

Now approximately how many hours of training and testing is it going to require for a teacher to be trained to unsecure their firearm and begin to return fire at a perpetrator?
(I am an advocate of an armed civilian population...I believe that the founding fathers were quite right in limiting the federal government from taking guns)

And it is going to require a ridiculous amount of time and training and testing for a teacher to learn to do this.

And that's the point. Shootouts are an extremely emotionally shocking experience. Most people empty their guns when training and hit anything but the cardboard cutouts. And when you go to training you are mentally preparing yourself to shoot targets.
That mental preparation doesn't happen in the course of a normal school day...it's all about tardy slips and grading homework and trying to teach these rowdy kids so you can demonstrate their learning through standardized testing.

I completely agree that a person with a hand gun that had been well trained inside the school at the time the shooter started would have been fortuitous. It would have saved lives.
The problem is the training for shoot/don't shoot is difficult and requires lots of hours. Lots and lots of them. And even police who train specifically for this on a regular basis still make bad shots and bad calls of judgment....happens regularly enough.

Your average school teacher puts in around 70-80 hours a week. That's just dealing with students and parents and lessons and grading papers.

That's why I'm saying what I'm saying. Because the teachers likely won't be proficient with their firearm and will inadvertently begin shooting students, teachers, or even responding police or other responding armed citizens trying to help.

Logistically what you are talking about is a nightmare to pull off.

Thank you. This. All of it.

Yet on this forum I just read if we "really care about the kids" we will carry guns.

Sorry to be your bad news messenger here America, but no one can do this job anymore. We're not just "whining" about this. We're walking away. *shrug* And it breaks my heart....but whatever. Just don't whine about it.

 

[eagle1462010]

Thank you. This. All of it.

Yet on this forum I just read if we "really care about the kids" we will carry guns.

Sorry to be your bad news messenger here America, but no one can do this job anymore. We're not just "whining" about this. We're walking away. *shrug* And it breaks my heart....but whatever. Just don't whine about it.

And the military is saying they have had enough too..........You aren't the only ones dealing with hard times. I left the military after Somalia because I couldn't stomach having a leader like Clinton who didn't support our men there with armor and air cover. Playing politics over honoring his oath. But hey we got a great movie out of it huh.

Police are being attacked with the BS rhetoric. Defund the police. Some assassinated just eating a sandwich in their car over BLM garbage.

Our country is in decay. You are just another taking hits in the process. It IS WHAT IT IS..........And it will get worse.

Good luck in whatever decision you make. I do regret not having that pension for staying another 10 years now. But not missing being screwed by politicians.

 

[Nuthin' Fancy]

LOL

Spin doctor. Everything to kill the idea that armed people are in a better position than unarmed when a mad man comes at them with a gun.

Nope.
"IDK, the cops would know the difference between an armed culprit and an armed teacher"?

Or anyone else.

ORLANDO, Fla., An Orlando, Fla., police officer mistakenly shot and killed an undercover university police officer working with state agents to stop illegal drinking at a University of Central Florida (UCF) tailgating party on Sept. 24.

The dead UCF officer was Mario Jenkins, 29, a four-year veteran of the department. Jenkins was shot by Dennis R. Smith, a reserve officer for the Orlando Police Department. Immediately after the shooting, Smith was placed on administrative leave, which is standard procedure in all shootings by police.

Whatever.