Education vs. Indoctrination

[manifold]

A poster in another thread commented that parents do not have the right to indoctrinate their children. I kind of think they do, at least to some extent, since what one views as indoctrination can easily be seen as education by another. And I don't think too many people would argue that a parents don't have the right to educate their children.

So what is the difference between education and indoctrination anyway?

Please discuss.

 

[Ringel05]

I had both and I turned out OK.... well, maybe......... ok, ok, not really.

 

[PixieStix]

Indoctrination is forced.

One of my pet peeves is parents that do not teach children to know who they are.

I think the generation that grew up via the internet age, are in constant social situations, which in turn never allows them any inner reflection, but lots of deflection.

 

[☭proletarian☭]

Education: facts presented. Theories presented. Thinking encouraged.

Indoctrination: brainwashing. Do not challenge or think for self.

 

[☭proletarian☭]

Define: education

• the activities of educating or instructing; activities that impart knowledge or skill; "he received no formal education"; "our instruction was ...
• knowledge acquired by learning and instruction; "it was clear that he had a very broad education"
• the gradual process of acquiring knowledge; "education is a preparation for life"; "a girl's education was less important than a boy's"

Define: indoctrination

teaching someone to accept doctrines uncritically
wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

 

[manifold]

Education: facts presented. Theories presented. Thinking encouraged.

Indoctrination: brainwashing. Do not challenge or think for self.

So when...

...children are taught about the evils of drug use, is that education or indoctrination?

...children are taught that racial differences are merely superficial, is that education or indoctrination?

...children are taught that that homosexuality is normal, is that education or indoctrination?

...children are taught that Vietnam was a mistake, is that education or indoctrination?

 

[Nosmo King]

Education: facts presented. Theories presented. Thinking encouraged.

Indoctrination: brainwashing. Do not challenge or think for self.

So when...

...children are taught about the evils of drug use, is that education or indoctrination?

...children are taught that racial differences are merely superficial, is that education or indoctrination?

...children are taught that that homosexuality is normal, is that education or indoctrination?

...children are taught that Vietnam was a mistake, is that education or indoctrination?

If you substituted the word "told" for the word "taught" then it would be indoctrination rather than education. If, on the other hand, the word "taught" is understood to mean "shown" as in 'here is one position, here is another and here's why we believe ___', then I would have to believe education rather than indoctrination.

And you're right. There are evils associated with drug use. Racial differences are superficial. Homosexuality is normal for the homosexual individual. Vietnam was a colossal mistake.

 

[ItHappens]

Whatever you teach your kids or don't could be described as "indoctrination."

 

[Skull Pilot]

Education: Teaching one how to think

Indoctrination: Teaching one what to think.

 

[PixieStix]

Education: Teaching one how to think

Indoctrination: Teaching one what to think.

Exactly

 

[del]

i think skull nailed it, but i would also say that as a parent one has a responsibility to do some of both.

 

[AllieBaba]

Yes indeed.

 

[PixieStix]

i think skull nailed it, but i would also say that as a parent one has a responsibility to do some of both.

I would agree that we need to "indoctrinate" them into keeping clean, and proper etiquette and manners, but that's just me

 

[del]

i think skull nailed it, but i would also say that as a parent one has a responsibility to do some of both.

I would agree that we need to "indoctrinate" them into keeping clean, and proper etiquette and manners, but that's just me

true dat, but imparting morals and values is what i was thinking about in terms of indoctrination. the more i think about it, though, it seems that that would be a bit of both.

 

[manifold]

I guess the smart folks here at USMB have rightly, and quickly concluded that "indoctrination" is not always a bad thing. In fact, sometimes it's quite necessary.

That concludes our lesson for today.

Feel free to discuss it further amongst yourselves.

 

[Paulie]

Education: facts presented. Theories presented. Thinking encouraged.

Indoctrination: brainwashing. Do not challenge or think for self.

So when...

...children are taught about the evils of drug use, is that education or indoctrination?

...children are taught that racial differences are merely superficial, is that education or indoctrination?

...children are taught that that homosexuality is normal, is that education or indoctrination?

...children are taught that Vietnam was a mistake, is that education or indoctrination?

How about teaching children about the EFFECTS of drug use, and allowing them to make up their own minds?

The homosexuality thing is indoctrination. No one gets to DECIDE what's "normal" for someone else.

Vietnam should simply be taught as it happened. Allow the child to make up their own mind about whether or not it was a mistake.

As far as racial differences, there's no reason to teach a child about said "differences". The only differences are the color of skin that everyone with a set of working eyes can see for themselves. Any differences beyond that are probably more to do with the individual than the race itself.

Basically, the 4 things you listed are indoctrination as per the way you wrote them.

 

[rikules]

Education: facts presented. Theories presented. Thinking encouraged.

Indoctrination: brainwashing. Do not challenge or think for self.

So when...

...children are taught about the evils of drug use, is that education or indoctrination?

...children are taught that racial differences are merely superficial, is that education or indoctrination?

...children are taught that that homosexuality is normal, is that education or indoctrination?

...children are taught that Vietnam was a mistake, is that education or indoctrination?

...children are taught about the evils of drug use, is that education or indoctrination?

since only SELECTIVE information is used in "discussing" drug use
and any POSITIVE information is censored out...

it becomes "indoctrination"

pot, for example,. is presented ONLY as "EVIL"

but in truth pot is no more "evil" than a couple of beers

pot should be legalized, regulated, taxed

the war on pot in an atrocity
an abomination


...children are taught that racial differences are merely superficial, is that education or indoctrination?

education



...children are taught that that homosexuality is normal, is that education or indoctrination?

education. gays ARE normal in most ways. Have you ever spoken to a gay?
or seen one on tv? MOSTLY ther are NORMAL and decent and honorable people.
and can be delightfully amusing conversationalists.

they work, get educated
have careers
own businesses
can carry on conversations with "normal" people
they fall in love
laugh
tell jokes
own property
some of them are even politically conservative and vote republican


judging them SOLELY on their sexual tastes is a rather ignorant, primitive, irrational and unfair bench mark

it would be like judging cons NEGATIVELY solely on how much they hate EVERYONE who isn't as conservative as they are


...children are taught that Vietnam was a mistake, is that education or indoctrination?

indoctrination.

education would be; vietnam was a "mistake" in that

a. it was big mess
b. we didn't play to win...we played to play
c. we made a lot of mistakes
d. if only we could go back and do it RIGHT
e. we lost anyway and there was NO Domino Affect (as had been predicted)
f. far too many Americans died for too little
g. far too many Americans came back broken in body and mind and spirit
h. we didn't prevent the bloodbath that followed so what was the point anyway?

I believe that coming to the aid and defense of the south vietnamese was a GOOD thing
and the right thing to do

I would hope that American would do this for all people living in terror of their neighbors

but we sure did make a mess of it all and didn't accomplish anything

 

[rikules]

I guess the smart folks here at USMB have rightly, and quickly concluded that "indoctrination" is not always a bad thing. In fact, sometimes it's quite necessary.

That concludes our lesson for today.

Feel free to discuss it further amongst yourselves.

I agree.

I "indoctrinated" my own children to BELIEVE just how vile and loathsome and hate-fillled right wing conservatives are

I will work to "indoctrinate" my grandchildren the same way

I'm all for it

as you say
indoctrinating your children the RIGHT WAY is a good thing!

 

[☭proletarian☭]

Education: facts presented. Theories presented. Thinking encouraged.

Indoctrination: brainwashing. Do not challenge or think for self.

So when...

...children are taught about the evils of drug use, is that education or indoctrination?

Depends. 'DRUGS ARE EVIL!' is indoctrination. Showing kids what happens to those who get addicted and informing them of the dangers so they know why smoking meth is a bad idea is education.

...children are taught that racial differences are merely superficial, is that education or indoctrination?

If they're lie to (eg: there's no such thing as race), that's indoctrinating them into a lie. Teaching them that the neighbors are good people because of the way they act and that there are good and bad [people of every colour is education.

...children are taught that that homosexuality is normal, is that education or indoctrination?

If by 'taught that homosexuality is normal' you mean that they're taught at it's natural and no so uncommon and that they shouldn't judge people based on whom they date, that's education. I see no difference between this and the race issue.

...children are taught that Vietnam was a mistake, is that education or indoctrination?

Clarify. If they're taught about tactical and strategic mistakes and the long-term implications as well as the justifications and objections forwarded then and now, that's education. If they're taught that hippies and communists are the devil or that the evil white man wanted to conquer the yellow man, that's indoctrination.


As I said originally:

Education: facts presented. Theories presented. Thinking encouraged.

Indoctrination: brainwashing. Do not challenge or think for self.

 

[Ravi]

Morals aren't innate AND can't be taught? Only indoctrination produces moral people?