Economy grows for the third straight quarter

[edthecynic]

That's not an answer. Obama is on record as having a goal of Single Payer Health Care. The price control provisions of ObamaCare are intended to destroy company provided health care, and drive people into state run exchanges. As Pelosi acknowledged, this is the "first step".

Now, what is government controlled Single Payer health care, with price controls, and an individual mandate?

That's a crock.

Now, the answer to your question is, a CON$ervoFascist scare tactic with no basis in reality.

 

[edthecynic]

Um, yes, as a matter of fact, you have lost your mind. That was a direct quote from you:



I think you have realized that you have been beaten and now are desperately attempting to change my words. No where did I claim providers and delivers were not the same thing, but we have not been discussing providers as the issue here, we have been discussing health insurance. Kaiser has a unique niche. They are both, insurer AND provider. AETNA, United Healthcare are not providers, they are insurers. Kaiser will be ALLOWED (by the grace of your messiah) to continue albeit in a non-profit form, while AETNA and United Healthcare and all the others will be terminated.

My contention has always been that this is a discussion about health insurance. Now you want to make it sound as if I was discussing medical providers. You are dishonestly attempting to change my argument. Face it, you have been proven to be dishonest.

Immie

Your contention has always been single payer is socialized health care. I'm glad to see you have finally backed off from that.

More deceit from you.

You have proven you are beaten. But you are too stupid to admit it and give up.

Immie

Keep telling yourself that until you believe your own delusions.

 

[boedicca]

That's not an answer. Obama is on record as having a goal of Single Payer Health Care. The price control provisions of ObamaCare are intended to destroy company provided health care, and drive people into state run exchanges. As Pelosi acknowledged, this is the "first step".

Now, what is government controlled Single Payer health care, with price controls, and an individual mandate?

That's a crock.

Now, the answer to your question is, a CON$ervoFascist scare tactic with no basis in reality.

I'll take your answer as a concession of defeat. Thanks for playing!

 

[Immanuel]

That's not an answer. Obama is on record as having a goal of Single Payer Health Care. The price control provisions of ObamaCare are intended to destroy company provided health care, and drive people into state run exchanges. As Pelosi acknowledged, this is the "first step".

Now, what is government controlled Single Payer health care, with price controls, and an individual mandate?

That's not an answer. Obama is on record as having a goal of Single Payer Health Care. The price control provisions of ObamaCare are intended to destroy company provided health care, and drive people into state run exchanges. As Pelosi acknowledged, this is the "first step".

Now, what is government controlled Single Payer health care, with price controls, and an individual mandate?

That's a crock.

Now, the answer to your question is, a CON$ervoFascist scare tactic with no basis in reality.

Ed is right in regards to one thing, Boe, as shown by his link, the idea is not to destroy company provided health insurance aka health care, but rather to adjust who the companies pay their premiums to. The company will still have to provide those benefits to the employee (whether or not the employee chooses to have the benefit provided), however, the company will pay these benefits in the form of payroll taxation instead of premiums paid to private insurers.

But, yes, the ultimate goal is to get control of the citizen's health coverage.

Immie

 

[Immanuel]

Your contention has always been single payer is socialized health care. I'm glad to see you have finally backed off from that.

More deceit from you.

You have proven you are beaten. But you are too stupid to admit it and give up.

Immie

Keep telling yourself that until you believe your own delusions.

You have continually proved your dishonesty. In every form of discussion I know of, that is pure and simple defeat.

Immie

 

[boedicca]

Ed is right in regards to one thing, Boe, as shown by his link, the idea is not to destroy company provided health insurance aka health care, but rather to adjust who the companies pay their premiums to. The company will still have to provide those benefits to the employee (whether or not the employee chooses to have the benefit provided), however, the company will pay these benefits in the form of payroll taxation instead of premiums paid to private insurers.

But, yes, the ultimate goal is to get control of the citizen's health coverage.

Immie

That's not how it will work. The Waxman hearing was cancelled because the four companies' internal documents included analyses that showed they would save money by cancelling insurance and having employees move to the state exchanges.

Agreed that an alternative exists with the companies being the payment conduit for the employees' participation in the exchanges - but that does not change the situation that the current private insurance market will be destroyed and replaced by a government command and control version. It's all about Control.

 

[edthecynic]

Um, I think that first quote in your post is from you not me.

Have yo lost your mind?

Immie

That's right, the first quote is mine and the only difference is i used "delivered" instead of "provided" which is no difference at all. So you are still full of it when you claimed I changed when I used provided.

Hmmm,

That is funny, I am a step ahead of you edit: again. I already corrected my earlier statement. I had said, I could not remember you stating "Provider" and then in my post #204, I made this comment and corrected that.

And for the record, I do see in your post that you state:

Single payer refers only to how it is paid for NOT how it is delivered. Nationalized health care refers to how it is delivered.

I had missed that last night.

From my point of view this discussion has always been about Health Insurance.

Please quit your deceptive practices in reference to changing my words.

You see, some of us can be honest and willingly correct our mistakes... as I did much earlier in this discussion when I said that I had the impression that he said Nationalized. Phillip pointed out that the term was "single-payer" and I corrected my teminology. As proven above, many times, "single-payer", means "nationalized" health care. As proven above and defined by the legislation, "health care" means Health Insurance.

However, you continue to deceitfully attempt to change my argument to being one of me stating this is about "Nationalized Medicine". A despicable ploy on your part.

Immie

That has never been "proven." You have simply pontificated they mean the same thing even though you know it is not true.

 

[edthecynic]

That's not an answer. Obama is on record as having a goal of Single Payer Health Care. The price control provisions of ObamaCare are intended to destroy company provided health care, and drive people into state run exchanges. As Pelosi acknowledged, this is the "first step".

Now, what is government controlled Single Payer health care, with price controls, and an individual mandate?

That's a crock.

Now, the answer to your question is, a CON$ervoFascist scare tactic with no basis in reality.

I'll take your answer as a concession of defeat. Thanks for playing!

I'll take your answer as a concession of my nailing it. Thanks for playing!

 

[JakeStarkey]

Single payer does not mean "nationalized" heath care. Absolutely a falsehood and a twisting of words.

 

[Immanuel]

That's right, the first quote is mine and the only difference is i used "delivered" instead of "provided" which is no difference at all. So you are still full of it when you claimed I changed when I used provided.

Hmmm,

That is funny, I am a step ahead of you edit: again. I already corrected my earlier statement. I had said, I could not remember you stating "Provider" and then in my post #204, I made this comment and corrected that.

And for the record, I do see in your post that you state:


I had missed that last night.

From my point of view this discussion has always been about Health Insurance.

Please quit your deceptive practices in reference to changing my words.

You see, some of us can be honest and willingly correct our mistakes... as I did much earlier in this discussion when I said that I had the impression that he said Nationalized. Phillip pointed out that the term was "single-payer" and I corrected my teminology. As proven above, many times, "single-payer", means "nationalized" health care. As proven above and defined by the legislation, "health care" means Health Insurance.

However, you continue to deceitfully attempt to change my argument to being one of me stating this is about "Nationalized Medicine". A despicable ploy on your part.

Immie

That has never been "proven." You have simply pontificated they mean the same thing even though you know it is not true.

Michael,

You have lost all pretenses you ever had of any integrity at all.

Immie

 

[Immanuel]

Single payer does not mean "nationalized" heath care. Absolutely a falsehood and a twisting of words.

Are you switching tunes like Michael?

We are talking about health care as defined by your messiah, meaning the health insurance industry. Are you now going to claim you are talking about the providers?

The fact of the matter is, as shown by the link provided by Michael Savage himself, aka edthecynic, Single Payer "Health Care" is nationalized health insurance.

I do not assert that the man who published that website is an authority or even correct. His presentation is exactly how I see "single-payer health care". Until any contradictory information is obtained (NOTE: your opinion is not considered contradictory information) I have to go with what I understand the case to be.

You have done nothing in this discussion except plaster the pages with smatterings of denial with absolutely zero, and I do mean zero, evidence to support your claims.

Forgive me for this, but in this discussion your word means nothing until you can provide corroborating evidence.

I must say that except in this discussion, you have shown a marked improvement in your attitude and I have begun to enjoy reading many of your posts. I'm just not finding your repeated: "Single payer does not mean "nationalized" heath care", to hold any water.

Thanks,

Immie

 

[JakeStarkey]

Single payer does not mean "nationalized" heath care. Absolutely a falsehood and a twisting of words.

Are you switching tunes like Michael?

We are talking about health care as defined by your messiah, meaning the health insurance industry. Are you now going to claim you are talking about the providers?

The fact of the matter is, as shown by the link provided by Michael Savage himself, aka edthecynic, Single Payer "Health Care" is nationalized health insurance.

I do not assert that the man who published that website is an authority or even correct. His presentation is exactly how I see "single-payer health care". Until any contradictory information is obtained (NOTE: your opinion is not considered contradictory information) I have to go with what I understand the case to be.

You have done nothing in this discussion except plaster the pages with smatterings of denial with absolutely zero, and I do mean zero, evidence to support your claims.

Forgive me for this, but in this discussion your word means nothing until you can provide corroborating evidence.

I must say that except in this discussion, you have shown a marked improvement in your attitude and I have begun to enjoy reading many of your posts. I'm just not finding your repeated: "Single payer does not mean "nationalized" heath care", to hole any water.

Thanks,

Immie

You are misdefining and twisting words, you know you are for mere political points, you have been exposed, and now you look like a fool.

Get over it.

 

[Immanuel]

Single payer does not mean "nationalized" heath care. Absolutely a falsehood and a twisting of words.

Are you switching tunes like Michael?

We are talking about health care as defined by your messiah, meaning the health insurance industry. Are you now going to claim you are talking about the providers?

The fact of the matter is, as shown by the link provided by Michael Savage himself, aka edthecynic, Single Payer "Health Care" is nationalized health insurance.

I do not assert that the man who published that website is an authority or even correct. His presentation is exactly how I see "single-payer health care". Until any contradictory information is obtained (NOTE: your opinion is not considered contradictory information) I have to go with what I understand the case to be.

You have done nothing in this discussion except plaster the pages with smatterings of denial with absolutely zero, and I do mean zero, evidence to support your claims.

Forgive me for this, but in this discussion your word means nothing until you can provide corroborating evidence.

I must say that except in this discussion, you have shown a marked improvement in your attitude and I have begun to enjoy reading many of your posts. I'm just not finding your repeated: "Single payer does not mean "nationalized" heath care", to hole any water.

Thanks,

Immie

You are misdefining and twisting words, you know you are for mere political points, you have been exposed, and now you look like a fool.

Get over it.

I have clearly defined my position, you do not have the integrity to back yours up... seems to me that it is you that appears to look like a fool... a neutered fool, in fact.

Immie

 

[JakeStarkey]

I have backed it up, pointing out that you use misdefinitions that are inaccurate. Political Chic does that all the time, so why waste valuable time arguing with an invalid OP, other than to point it out. The discerning will figure it out quickly.

 

[dab11999]

But in my opinion, recession started when the interest on long term TBills became higher than short term bills. It's my opinion we won't be in a period of growth till that turns around again. With the national debt rising every month, and GDP at consistently lower levels, I don't see that happening anytime soon.
In addition, we still have the problem that started it all; foreclosures at all time highs. The dollar hasn't hit bottom yet. The market rally doesn't have any real fundamental value. Growth by cooking the numbers doesn't fix the economy.

 

[boedicca]

Single payer does not mean "nationalized" heath care. Absolutely a falsehood and a twisting of words.

That's what Obama, Pelosi, and Reid want you to believe. ObamaCare is Phase I of Single Payer-Nationalized Health Care.

When the government is the only payer, sets prices, and mandates paricipation - that is Nationalized Health Care.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Boedicca, that is fuzzy talk.

 

[Vast LWC]

A single payer system is not socialism. A single payer is not nationalization. A single payer is a cooperative run by the electorate to more fairly negotiate with the private health insurance industry for a pricing system that will not break the piggy bank yet more than adequately permit private companies to make a good profit.

This is a good point, and I think it was also made by another poster, via wiki link.

"Single Payer" is not in fact "nationalized health care", nor do I see any reason why it should become "nationalized" health care if a "pool" is used in this way among private insurers.

 

[Vast LWC]

Single payer does not mean "nationalized" heath care. Absolutely a falsehood and a twisting of words.

That's what Obama, Pelosi, and Reid want you to believe. ObamaCare is Phase I of Single Payer-Nationalized Health Care.

When the government is the only payer, sets prices, and mandates paricipation - that is Nationalized Health Care.

That is pure and utter speculation, lacking any proof whatsoever.

The only people who have actually gotten behind true, nationalized healthcare are the extremists on the left, who are not the majority, or the policymakers in the Democratic Party.

And the President certainly does not number among their ranks, despite what Rush Limbaugh tries to get you to believe.

 

[Vast LWC]

And, seeing as how this thread went on a tangent, let's get back to the main point:

The economy seems to be coming back quite nicely, which is good news all around.