Drunk Girl Loses Mind @ Denny's

[Pogo]

If that dumb ***** in the corner had minded her own business, the entire situation would never have escalated.​

Yes and no. The waiter should have owned it, not identified the complainant. Not to a drunk person already out of control. If I were the waiter and knew this person was THAT drunk, I would ask who is in charge of this table?
And ask the sober people to solve the problem by picking a different table to move to because someone else complained (and maybe offer them a free dessert or something for the inconvenience). Let the "designated" sober friends get their buddy to go along, and not try to argue with a drunk guest.

I doubt if she was going to go anywhere peaceably

Nobody was going to tell HER what to do

Okay well for her friends: throw in free dessert to get her to move to a table elsewhere.
(Too bad there wasn't a jukebox to place her next to and drown her out with loud country music.)
For her, offer to throw in more drinks till she's under the table and has to be carried out.
Something!

Funny I have the opposite reaction when I drink, even the tiniest sip of alcohol. I shut down and go right to sleep. I can't even drink the 3-5% alcohol fruit drinks without diluting them with soda first. I'm no fun at all!

Free dessert, hell. Charge her a fine.

 

[mdk]

Looks like she ordered the Grand Slam Breakfast. What a tart! lol

 

[rightwinger]

Looks like she ordered the Grand Slam Breakfast. What a tart! lol

Ashley ordered something that requires THREE marinaras

 

[Ravi]

.... just an example of the self-entitlement problem in this country....

This took place at an unknown Denny’s Restaurant location and shows a drunk female patron absolutely losing her mind after being politely asked by staff to stop using profane language. Immediately after being asked to watch her language, the female states she can say whatever she wants because of her black heritage and subsequently attempts to attack the woman in next booth over for complaining to staff about her drunken behavior

2 RWNJs acting like fools. Who would have thought?

 

[mdk]

Looks like she ordered the Grand Slam Breakfast. What a tart! lol

Ashley ordered something that requires THREE marinaras

They were chasers. lol. I used to work in a restaurant/bar while attending university and late-night drunk ***** would often times cause trouble. Watching this trollop fall on the ground was pretty funny though.

 

[emilynghiem]

.... just an example of the self-entitlement problem in this country....

This took place at an unknown Denny’s Restaurant location and shows a drunk female patron absolutely losing her mind after being politely asked by staff to stop using profane language. Immediately after being asked to watch her language, the female states she can say whatever she wants because of her black heritage and subsequently attempts to attack the woman in next booth over for complaining to staff about her drunken behavior

Yeah, unfortunately drunk means loud and everyone has to listen to me.

As for sober and civil behavior, the same First Amendment used to cite "freedom of speech"
also clearly includes the "right of the people PEACEABLY to assemble."

So if you ABUSE free speech to cause DISRUPTION OF THE PEACE (such as the famous example of not yelling fire in a crowded theatre) then you are VIOLATING THE SAME FIRST AMENDMENT.

People need to be taught NOT TO TAKE LAWS OUT OF CONTEXT.

You can't enforce one part while violating other clauses, and claim to be defending rights and laws equally.

Other people's rights, laws, beliefs and creeds count equally under the First and Fourteenth Amendments.

We need to teach Common Sense, like the Golden Rule of Reciprocity.
If you want rights and freedoms, these need to be enforced and respected for others equally.
Duh!

The First Amendment has absolutely nothing to do with either (a) causing a row at Denny's or (b) being a dick. The 1A restricts the government -- not the People.

Dear Pogo Yes you are talking about the literal law.
I am talking about the NATURAL LAW that the First Amendment is based on.
and the GOLDEN RULE that governs ALL human nature and behavior.

We as humans naturally have free will. But we cannot abuse it to violate the equal freedom and
peace of others. If we violate the sense of security of others, that is what causes a BREACH.

This is NATURAL LAW. If you learn that, then you get what Constitutional laws are based on,
where people ARE EQUAL. PEOPLE ARE THE GOVT when you follow and invoke natural laws.

Pogo if you only teach the "literal" law then only lawyers and judges have any say in this country.
We've got to start enforcing the SPIRIT of the laws based on
* consent of the governed
* equal protection of the laws (I'm saying your interpretation of literal laws is TOO limited,
and restricts protections to "only what is established in Courts" so you give all the power to the Judiciary.
this is out of balance with the purpose of the Constitution to protect the people from abuses
of govt power by checks and balances)
* equal participation and access to democratic due process ie free speech and press
and the right to petition for redressing grievances

We the people are the ultimate check on govt.
So we the people have to FOLLOW AND RESPECT the same laws
if we want to hold govt to those standards.

if we keep relying on your interpretation alone, literally by the letter of the law,
we only have protection insofar as we can
* find a lawyer to fight and defend our right (I can't find one)
* pay and afford a lawyer (I can't afford one)
* WIN the case and not have it delayed appealed but actually enforced

Good luck with that.
Slavery was not changed legally until AFTER the battles were fought
in the public arena first. People, the Abolitionists had to enforce equal standards
before fighting for govt to recognize those same standards of equality.

Pogo if you want to wait for Courts to decide the law for you,
that's what you are asking for if you don't teach people that
we have the authority of law to compel Govt to represent us, not the other way.

See Declaration of Independence: the just powers of governed derived from CONSENT
of the GOVERNED.
See concept of No Taxation without Representation, where the govt and laws
are supposed to represent the People's consent as in a social contract
See Texas Bill of Rights Section Two, the people's authority to alter or
abolish govt as we deem expedient, with respect to the Republic form of govt

Law starts with the people first. We have equal responsibility
where people ARE the government. Not govt dictating to us by the letter that lawyers and judges control in courts.

 

[emilynghiem]

.... just an example of the self-entitlement problem in this country....

This took place at an unknown Denny’s Restaurant location and shows a drunk female patron absolutely losing her mind after being politely asked by staff to stop using profane language. Immediately after being asked to watch her language, the female states she can say whatever she wants because of her black heritage and subsequently attempts to attack the woman in next booth over for complaining to staff about her drunken behavior

2 RWNJs acting like fools. Who would have thought?

Dear Ravi
The only people I've heard pull the Black Race card as a privilege
weren't rightwing conservatives.

 

[Pogo]

.... just an example of the self-entitlement problem in this country....

This took place at an unknown Denny’s Restaurant location and shows a drunk female patron absolutely losing her mind after being politely asked by staff to stop using profane language. Immediately after being asked to watch her language, the female states she can say whatever she wants because of her black heritage and subsequently attempts to attack the woman in next booth over for complaining to staff about her drunken behavior

Yeah, unfortunately drunk means loud and everyone has to listen to me.

As for sober and civil behavior, the same First Amendment used to cite "freedom of speech"
also clearly includes the "right of the people PEACEABLY to assemble."

So if you ABUSE free speech to cause DISRUPTION OF THE PEACE (such as the famous example of not yelling fire in a crowded theatre) then you are VIOLATING THE SAME FIRST AMENDMENT.

People need to be taught NOT TO TAKE LAWS OUT OF CONTEXT.

You can't enforce one part while violating other clauses, and claim to be defending rights and laws equally.

Other people's rights, laws, beliefs and creeds count equally under the First and Fourteenth Amendments.

We need to teach Common Sense, like the Golden Rule of Reciprocity.
If you want rights and freedoms, these need to be enforced and respected for others equally.
Duh!

The First Amendment has absolutely nothing to do with either (a) causing a row at Denny's or (b) being a dick. The 1A restricts the government -- not the People.

Dear Pogo Yes you are talking about the literal law.
I am talking about the NATURAL LAW that the First Amendment is based on.
and the GOLDEN RULE that governs ALL human nature and behavior.

We as humans naturally have free will. But we cannot abuse it to violate the equal freedom and
peace of others. If we violate the sense of security of others, that is what causes a BREACH.

This is NATURAL LAW. If you learn that, then you get what Constitutional laws are based on,
where people ARE EQUAL. PEOPLE ARE THE GOVT when you follow and invoke natural laws.

Pogo if you only teach the "literal" law then only lawyers and judges have any say in this country.
We've got to start enforcing the SPIRIT of the laws based on
* consent of the governed
* equal protection of the laws (I'm saying your interpretation of literal laws is TOO limited,
and restricts protections to "only what is established in Courts" so you give all the power to the Judiciary.
this is out of balance with the purpose of the Constitution to protect the people from abuses
of govt power by checks and balances)
* equal participation and access to democratic due process ie free speech and press
and the right to petition for redressing grievances

We the people are the ultimate check on govt.
So we the people have to FOLLOW AND RESPECT the same laws
if we want to hold govt to those standards.

if we keep relying on your interpretation alone, literally by the letter of the law,
we only have protection insofar as we can
* find a lawyer to fight and defend our right (I can't find one)
* pay and afford a lawyer (I can't afford one)
* WIN the case and not have it delayed appealed but actually enforced

Good luck with that.
Slavery was not changed legally until AFTER the battles were fought
in the public arena first. People, the Abolitionists had to enforce equal standards
before fighting for govt to recognize those same standards of equality.

Pogo if you want to wait for Courts to decide the law for you,
that's what you are asking for if you don't teach people that
we have the authority of law to compel Govt to represent us, not the other way.

See Declaration of Independence: the just powers of governed derived from CONSENT
of the GOVERNED.
See concept of No Taxation without Representation, where the govt and laws
are supposed to represent the People's consent as in a social contract
See Texas Bill of Rights Section Two, the people's authority to alter or
abolish govt as we deem expedient, with respect to the Republic form of govt

Law starts with the people first. We have equal responsibility
where people ARE the government. Not govt dictating to us by the letter that lawyers and judges control in courts.

Dear Emily:

 

[Pogo]

Looks like she ordered the Grand Slam Breakfast. What a tart! lol

Ashley ordered something that requires THREE marinaras

They were chasers. lol. I used to work in a restaurant/bar while attending university and late-night drunk ***** would often times cause trouble. Watching this trollop fall on the ground was pretty funny though.

It's too bad she won't feel the pain as a reminder.

I hope she bruised her coccyx. That'll follow her around, literally.

 

[mdk]

Looks like she ordered the Grand Slam Breakfast. What a tart! lol

Ashley ordered something that requires THREE marinaras

They were chasers. lol. I used to work in a restaurant/bar while attending university and late-night drunk ***** would often times cause trouble. Watching this trollop fall on the ground was pretty funny though.

It's too bad she won't feel the pain as a reminder.

I hope she bruised her coccyx. That'll follow her around, literally.

Dad jokes.

 

[Bonzi]

People still eat at Dennys?

I know, right?

 

[emilynghiem]

.... just an example of the self-entitlement problem in this country....

This took place at an unknown Denny’s Restaurant location and shows a drunk female patron absolutely losing her mind after being politely asked by staff to stop using profane language. Immediately after being asked to watch her language, the female states she can say whatever she wants because of her black heritage and subsequently attempts to attack the woman in next booth over for complaining to staff about her drunken behavior

Yeah, unfortunately drunk means loud and everyone has to listen to me.

As for sober and civil behavior, the same First Amendment used to cite "freedom of speech"
also clearly includes the "right of the people PEACEABLY to assemble."

So if you ABUSE free speech to cause DISRUPTION OF THE PEACE (such as the famous example of not yelling fire in a crowded theatre) then you are VIOLATING THE SAME FIRST AMENDMENT.

People need to be taught NOT TO TAKE LAWS OUT OF CONTEXT.

You can't enforce one part while violating other clauses, and claim to be defending rights and laws equally.

Other people's rights, laws, beliefs and creeds count equally under the First and Fourteenth Amendments.

We need to teach Common Sense, like the Golden Rule of Reciprocity.
If you want rights and freedoms, these need to be enforced and respected for others equally.
Duh!

The First Amendment has absolutely nothing to do with either (a) causing a row at Denny's or (b) being a dick. The 1A restricts the government -- not the People.

Dear Pogo Yes you are talking about the literal law.
I am talking about the NATURAL LAW that the First Amendment is based on.
and the GOLDEN RULE that governs ALL human nature and behavior.

We as humans naturally have free will. But we cannot abuse it to violate the equal freedom and
peace of others. If we violate the sense of security of others, that is what causes a BREACH.

This is NATURAL LAW. If you learn that, then you get what Constitutional laws are based on,
where people ARE EQUAL. PEOPLE ARE THE GOVT when you follow and invoke natural laws.

Pogo if you only teach the "literal" law then only lawyers and judges have any say in this country.
We've got to start enforcing the SPIRIT of the laws based on
* consent of the governed
* equal protection of the laws (I'm saying your interpretation of literal laws is TOO limited,
and restricts protections to "only what is established in Courts" so you give all the power to the Judiciary.
this is out of balance with the purpose of the Constitution to protect the people from abuses
of govt power by checks and balances)
* equal participation and access to democratic due process ie free speech and press
and the right to petition for redressing grievances

We the people are the ultimate check on govt.
So we the people have to FOLLOW AND RESPECT the same laws
if we want to hold govt to those standards.

if we keep relying on your interpretation alone, literally by the letter of the law,
we only have protection insofar as we can
* find a lawyer to fight and defend our right (I can't find one)
* pay and afford a lawyer (I can't afford one)
* WIN the case and not have it delayed appealed but actually enforced

Good luck with that.
Slavery was not changed legally until AFTER the battles were fought
in the public arena first. People, the Abolitionists had to enforce equal standards
before fighting for govt to recognize those same standards of equality.

Pogo if you want to wait for Courts to decide the law for you,
that's what you are asking for if you don't teach people that
we have the authority of law to compel Govt to represent us, not the other way.

See Declaration of Independence: the just powers of governed derived from CONSENT
of the GOVERNED.
See concept of No Taxation without Representation, where the govt and laws
are supposed to represent the People's consent as in a social contract
See Texas Bill of Rights Section Two, the people's authority to alter or
abolish govt as we deem expedient, with respect to the Republic form of govt

Law starts with the people first. We have equal responsibility
where people ARE the government. Not govt dictating to us by the letter that lawyers and judges control in courts.

Dear Emily:

OK short version Pogo
If you want the govt to follow Constitutional standards
such as respect for free speech, press, right to assembly,
equal protection of the laws and due process from discrimination by creed, etc.

The since People ARE the Govt
then we the People need to follow the same laws.

Literally they apply to govt.
But in spirit People are the Govt so they apply to us
if we want to enforce laws CONSISTENTLY.
Otherwise we come across as HYPOCRITES so people don't respect our rights.

Is that clear? It's the Golden Rule, you can't break the rules you are trying to enforce.
Or people won't listen or respect you, because you aren't respecting their rights either.

 

[rightwinger]

People still eat at Dennys?

I know, right?

She will not eat there anymore.....she will boycott Denny's because they treated her so badly

 

[emilynghiem]

She will not eat there anymore.....she will boycott Denny's because they treated her so badly

And Denny's and their Customers will call that a win.

 

[Pogo]

.... just an example of the self-entitlement problem in this country....

This took place at an unknown Denny’s Restaurant location and shows a drunk female patron absolutely losing her mind after being politely asked by staff to stop using profane language. Immediately after being asked to watch her language, the female states she can say whatever she wants because of her black heritage and subsequently attempts to attack the woman in next booth over for complaining to staff about her drunken behavior

Yeah, unfortunately drunk means loud and everyone has to listen to me.

As for sober and civil behavior, the same First Amendment used to cite "freedom of speech"
also clearly includes the "right of the people PEACEABLY to assemble."

So if you ABUSE free speech to cause DISRUPTION OF THE PEACE (such as the famous example of not yelling fire in a crowded theatre) then you are VIOLATING THE SAME FIRST AMENDMENT.

People need to be taught NOT TO TAKE LAWS OUT OF CONTEXT.

You can't enforce one part while violating other clauses, and claim to be defending rights and laws equally.

Other people's rights, laws, beliefs and creeds count equally under the First and Fourteenth Amendments.

We need to teach Common Sense, like the Golden Rule of Reciprocity.
If you want rights and freedoms, these need to be enforced and respected for others equally.
Duh!

The First Amendment has absolutely nothing to do with either (a) causing a row at Denny's or (b) being a dick. The 1A restricts the government -- not the People.

Dear Pogo Yes you are talking about the literal law.
I am talking about the NATURAL LAW that the First Amendment is based on.
and the GOLDEN RULE that governs ALL human nature and behavior.

We as humans naturally have free will. But we cannot abuse it to violate the equal freedom and
peace of others. If we violate the sense of security of others, that is what causes a BREACH.

This is NATURAL LAW. If you learn that, then you get what Constitutional laws are based on,
where people ARE EQUAL. PEOPLE ARE THE GOVT when you follow and invoke natural laws.

Pogo if you only teach the "literal" law then only lawyers and judges have any say in this country.
We've got to start enforcing the SPIRIT of the laws based on
* consent of the governed
* equal protection of the laws (I'm saying your interpretation of literal laws is TOO limited,
and restricts protections to "only what is established in Courts" so you give all the power to the Judiciary.
this is out of balance with the purpose of the Constitution to protect the people from abuses
of govt power by checks and balances)
* equal participation and access to democratic due process ie free speech and press
and the right to petition for redressing grievances

We the people are the ultimate check on govt.
So we the people have to FOLLOW AND RESPECT the same laws
if we want to hold govt to those standards.

if we keep relying on your interpretation alone, literally by the letter of the law,
we only have protection insofar as we can
* find a lawyer to fight and defend our right (I can't find one)
* pay and afford a lawyer (I can't afford one)
* WIN the case and not have it delayed appealed but actually enforced

Good luck with that.
Slavery was not changed legally until AFTER the battles were fought
in the public arena first. People, the Abolitionists had to enforce equal standards
before fighting for govt to recognize those same standards of equality.

Pogo if you want to wait for Courts to decide the law for you,
that's what you are asking for if you don't teach people that
we have the authority of law to compel Govt to represent us, not the other way.

See Declaration of Independence: the just powers of governed derived from CONSENT
of the GOVERNED.
See concept of No Taxation without Representation, where the govt and laws
are supposed to represent the People's consent as in a social contract
See Texas Bill of Rights Section Two, the people's authority to alter or
abolish govt as we deem expedient, with respect to the Republic form of govt

Law starts with the people first. We have equal responsibility
where people ARE the government. Not govt dictating to us by the letter that lawyers and judges control in courts.

Dear Emily:

OK short version Pogo
If you want the govt to follow Constitutional standards
such as respect for free speech, press, right to assembly,
equal protection of the laws and due process from discrimination by creed, etc.

The since People ARE the Govt
then we the People need to follow the same laws.

Literally they apply to govt.
But in spirit People are the Govt so they apply to us
if we want to enforce laws CONSISTENTLY.
Otherwise we come across as HYPOCRITES so people don't respect our rights.

Is that clear? It's the Golden Rule, you can't break the rules you are trying to enforce.
Or people won't listen or respect you, because you aren't respecting their rights either.

Better, thanks, but still not following what that applies to here.

It seems like you're saying the restaurant doesn't have the right to toss her ass out. You even wanted them to reward her with a free dessert.

OK wait --- it's Denny's so I guess "reward" doesn't apply....

 

[emilynghiem]

Yeah, unfortunately drunk means loud and everyone has to listen to me.

As for sober and civil behavior, the same First Amendment used to cite "freedom of speech"
also clearly includes the "right of the people PEACEABLY to assemble."

So if you ABUSE free speech to cause DISRUPTION OF THE PEACE (such as the famous example of not yelling fire in a crowded theatre) then you are VIOLATING THE SAME FIRST AMENDMENT.

People need to be taught NOT TO TAKE LAWS OUT OF CONTEXT.

You can't enforce one part while violating other clauses, and claim to be defending rights and laws equally.

Other people's rights, laws, beliefs and creeds count equally under the First and Fourteenth Amendments.

We need to teach Common Sense, like the Golden Rule of Reciprocity.
If you want rights and freedoms, these need to be enforced and respected for others equally.
Duh!

The First Amendment has absolutely nothing to do with either (a) causing a row at Denny's or (b) being a dick. The 1A restricts the government -- not the People.

Dear Pogo Yes you are talking about the literal law.
I am talking about the NATURAL LAW that the First Amendment is based on.
and the GOLDEN RULE that governs ALL human nature and behavior.

We as humans naturally have free will. But we cannot abuse it to violate the equal freedom and
peace of others. If we violate the sense of security of others, that is what causes a BREACH.

This is NATURAL LAW. If you learn that, then you get what Constitutional laws are based on,
where people ARE EQUAL. PEOPLE ARE THE GOVT when you follow and invoke natural laws.

Pogo if you only teach the "literal" law then only lawyers and judges have any say in this country.
We've got to start enforcing the SPIRIT of the laws based on
* consent of the governed
* equal protection of the laws (I'm saying your interpretation of literal laws is TOO limited,
and restricts protections to "only what is established in Courts" so you give all the power to the Judiciary.
this is out of balance with the purpose of the Constitution to protect the people from abuses
of govt power by checks and balances)
* equal participation and access to democratic due process ie free speech and press
and the right to petition for redressing grievances

We the people are the ultimate check on govt.
So we the people have to FOLLOW AND RESPECT the same laws
if we want to hold govt to those standards.

if we keep relying on your interpretation alone, literally by the letter of the law,
we only have protection insofar as we can
* find a lawyer to fight and defend our right (I can't find one)
* pay and afford a lawyer (I can't afford one)
* WIN the case and not have it delayed appealed but actually enforced

Good luck with that.
Slavery was not changed legally until AFTER the battles were fought
in the public arena first. People, the Abolitionists had to enforce equal standards
before fighting for govt to recognize those same standards of equality.

Pogo if you want to wait for Courts to decide the law for you,
that's what you are asking for if you don't teach people that
we have the authority of law to compel Govt to represent us, not the other way.

See Declaration of Independence: the just powers of governed derived from CONSENT
of the GOVERNED.
See concept of No Taxation without Representation, where the govt and laws
are supposed to represent the People's consent as in a social contract
See Texas Bill of Rights Section Two, the people's authority to alter or
abolish govt as we deem expedient, with respect to the Republic form of govt

Law starts with the people first. We have equal responsibility
where people ARE the government. Not govt dictating to us by the letter that lawyers and judges control in courts.

Dear Emily:

OK short version Pogo
If you want the govt to follow Constitutional standards
such as respect for free speech, press, right to assembly,
equal protection of the laws and due process from discrimination by creed, etc.

The since People ARE the Govt
then we the People need to follow the same laws.

Literally they apply to govt.
But in spirit People are the Govt so they apply to us
if we want to enforce laws CONSISTENTLY.
Otherwise we come across as HYPOCRITES so people don't respect our rights.

Is that clear? It's the Golden Rule, you can't break the rules you are trying to enforce.
Or people won't listen or respect you, because you aren't respecting their rights either.

Better, thanks, but still not following what that applies to here.

It seems like you're saying the restaurant doesn't have the right to toss her ass out. You even wanted them to reward her with a free dessert.

OK wait --- it's Denny's so I guess "reward" doesn't apply....

I didn't say that. I was talking about where SHE went wrong.
If you disrupt the peace sure people can ask you to leave.
Most conflicts require working out in private anyway, and while sober.
This was not the time or place to "redress grievances" especially
with someone not looking to do so.

To preserve the peace, the first step is often to separate space where
ppl aren't fighting over turf. When ppl are standing on equal ground,
and feel secure they are being heard included and respected equally, THEN you
can set up equal process to facilitate how to address conflicts going on.
After good working relations are restored, then you can address the external conflicts.
But if you never address the internal conflicts, people will continue to project those on each other, and the blame game will go in circles. That's why grievances aren't getting redressed.
Inner conflicts need to be settled first, establish common ground, then take on bigger issues.

 

[rightwinger]

The First Amendment has absolutely nothing to do with either (a) causing a row at Denny's or (b) being a dick. The 1A restricts the government -- not the People.

Dear Pogo Yes you are talking about the literal law.
I am talking about the NATURAL LAW that the First Amendment is based on.
and the GOLDEN RULE that governs ALL human nature and behavior.

We as humans naturally have free will. But we cannot abuse it to violate the equal freedom and
peace of others. If we violate the sense of security of others, that is what causes a BREACH.

This is NATURAL LAW. If you learn that, then you get what Constitutional laws are based on,
where people ARE EQUAL. PEOPLE ARE THE GOVT when you follow and invoke natural laws.

Pogo if you only teach the "literal" law then only lawyers and judges have any say in this country.
We've got to start enforcing the SPIRIT of the laws based on
* consent of the governed
* equal protection of the laws (I'm saying your interpretation of literal laws is TOO limited,
and restricts protections to "only what is established in Courts" so you give all the power to the Judiciary.
this is out of balance with the purpose of the Constitution to protect the people from abuses
of govt power by checks and balances)
* equal participation and access to democratic due process ie free speech and press
and the right to petition for redressing grievances

We the people are the ultimate check on govt.
So we the people have to FOLLOW AND RESPECT the same laws
if we want to hold govt to those standards.

if we keep relying on your interpretation alone, literally by the letter of the law,
we only have protection insofar as we can
* find a lawyer to fight and defend our right (I can't find one)
* pay and afford a lawyer (I can't afford one)
* WIN the case and not have it delayed appealed but actually enforced

Good luck with that.
Slavery was not changed legally until AFTER the battles were fought
in the public arena first. People, the Abolitionists had to enforce equal standards
before fighting for govt to recognize those same standards of equality.

Pogo if you want to wait for Courts to decide the law for you,
that's what you are asking for if you don't teach people that
we have the authority of law to compel Govt to represent us, not the other way.

See Declaration of Independence: the just powers of governed derived from CONSENT
of the GOVERNED.
See concept of No Taxation without Representation, where the govt and laws
are supposed to represent the People's consent as in a social contract
See Texas Bill of Rights Section Two, the people's authority to alter or
abolish govt as we deem expedient, with respect to the Republic form of govt

Law starts with the people first. We have equal responsibility
where people ARE the government. Not govt dictating to us by the letter that lawyers and judges control in courts.

Dear Emily:

OK short version Pogo
If you want the govt to follow Constitutional standards
such as respect for free speech, press, right to assembly,
equal protection of the laws and due process from discrimination by creed, etc.

The since People ARE the Govt
then we the People need to follow the same laws.

Literally they apply to govt.
But in spirit People are the Govt so they apply to us
if we want to enforce laws CONSISTENTLY.
Otherwise we come across as HYPOCRITES so people don't respect our rights.

Is that clear? It's the Golden Rule, you can't break the rules you are trying to enforce.
Or people won't listen or respect you, because you aren't respecting their rights either.

Better, thanks, but still not following what that applies to here.

It seems like you're saying the restaurant doesn't have the right to toss her ass out. You even wanted them to reward her with a free dessert.

OK wait --- it's Denny's so I guess "reward" doesn't apply....

I didn't say that. I was talking about where SHE went wrong.
If you disrupt the peace sure people can ask you to leave.
Most conflicts require working out in private anyway, and while sober.
This was not the time or place to "redress grievances" especially
with someone not looking to do so.

To preserve the peace, the first step is often to separate space where
ppl aren't fighting over turf. When ppl are standing on equal ground,
and feel secure they are being heard included and respected equally, THEN you
can set up equal process to facilitate how to address conflicts going on.
After good working relations are restored, then you can address the external conflicts.
But if you never address the internal conflicts, people will continue to project those on each other, and the blame game will go in circles. That's why grievances aren't getting redressed.
Inner conflicts need to be settled first, establish common ground, then take on bigger issues.

Inner conflicts need to be settled first, establish common ground, then take on bigger issues.

What inner conflicts need to be resolved to get her to shut her filthy mouth in a public restaurant?

 

[Pogo]

Dear Pogo Yes you are talking about the literal law.
I am talking about the NATURAL LAW that the First Amendment is based on.
and the GOLDEN RULE that governs ALL human nature and behavior.

We as humans naturally have free will. But we cannot abuse it to violate the equal freedom and
peace of others. If we violate the sense of security of others, that is what causes a BREACH.

This is NATURAL LAW. If you learn that, then you get what Constitutional laws are based on,
where people ARE EQUAL. PEOPLE ARE THE GOVT when you follow and invoke natural laws.

Pogo if you only teach the "literal" law then only lawyers and judges have any say in this country.
We've got to start enforcing the SPIRIT of the laws based on
* consent of the governed
* equal protection of the laws (I'm saying your interpretation of literal laws is TOO limited,
and restricts protections to "only what is established in Courts" so you give all the power to the Judiciary.
this is out of balance with the purpose of the Constitution to protect the people from abuses
of govt power by checks and balances)
* equal participation and access to democratic due process ie free speech and press
and the right to petition for redressing grievances

We the people are the ultimate check on govt.
So we the people have to FOLLOW AND RESPECT the same laws
if we want to hold govt to those standards.

if we keep relying on your interpretation alone, literally by the letter of the law,
we only have protection insofar as we can
* find a lawyer to fight and defend our right (I can't find one)
* pay and afford a lawyer (I can't afford one)
* WIN the case and not have it delayed appealed but actually enforced

Good luck with that.
Slavery was not changed legally until AFTER the battles were fought
in the public arena first. People, the Abolitionists had to enforce equal standards
before fighting for govt to recognize those same standards of equality.

Pogo if you want to wait for Courts to decide the law for you,
that's what you are asking for if you don't teach people that
we have the authority of law to compel Govt to represent us, not the other way.

See Declaration of Independence: the just powers of governed derived from CONSENT
of the GOVERNED.
See concept of No Taxation without Representation, where the govt and laws
are supposed to represent the People's consent as in a social contract
See Texas Bill of Rights Section Two, the people's authority to alter or
abolish govt as we deem expedient, with respect to the Republic form of govt

Law starts with the people first. We have equal responsibility
where people ARE the government. Not govt dictating to us by the letter that lawyers and judges control in courts.

Dear Emily:

OK short version Pogo
If you want the govt to follow Constitutional standards
such as respect for free speech, press, right to assembly,
equal protection of the laws and due process from discrimination by creed, etc.

The since People ARE the Govt
then we the People need to follow the same laws.

Literally they apply to govt.
But in spirit People are the Govt so they apply to us
if we want to enforce laws CONSISTENTLY.
Otherwise we come across as HYPOCRITES so people don't respect our rights.

Is that clear? It's the Golden Rule, you can't break the rules you are trying to enforce.
Or people won't listen or respect you, because you aren't respecting their rights either.

Better, thanks, but still not following what that applies to here.

It seems like you're saying the restaurant doesn't have the right to toss her ass out. You even wanted them to reward her with a free dessert.

OK wait --- it's Denny's so I guess "reward" doesn't apply....

I didn't say that. I was talking about where SHE went wrong.
If you disrupt the peace sure people can ask you to leave.
Most conflicts require working out in private anyway, and while sober.
This was not the time or place to "redress grievances" especially
with someone not looking to do so.

To preserve the peace, the first step is often to separate space where
ppl aren't fighting over turf. When ppl are standing on equal ground,
and feel secure they are being heard included and respected equally, THEN you
can set up equal process to facilitate how to address conflicts going on.
After good working relations are restored, then you can address the external conflicts.
But if you never address the internal conflicts, people will continue to project those on each other, and the blame game will go in circles. That's why grievances aren't getting redressed.
Inner conflicts need to be settled first, establish common ground, then take on bigger issues.

Inner conflicts need to be settled first, establish common ground, then take on bigger issues.

What inner conflicts need to be resolved to get her to shut her filthy mouth in a public restaurant?

Inner conflict between alcohol and brain cells methinks.

 

[JOSweetHeart]

If the people in charge let her get away with her disruptive attitude, they should be fired because she isn't the only person in the country who has rights.

God bless you and the other customers always!!!

Holly

 

[Bonzi]

True story: I have not even watched this video!