Does it bother me

[shoshi]

That Palestinian civilians have to suffer because of Hamas? Yes. If it didn’t I would be worried about what sort of person I am

 

[progressive hunter]

That Palestinian civilians have to suffer because of Hamas? Yes. If it didn’t I would be worried about what sort of person I am

I highly doubt anyone wants civilians to suffer,,

the problem is some people dont care when their ideology takes over,,

 

[Dogmaphobe]

I just want people to place responsibility upon those who are responsible, myself. Israel has a right to go after Hamas. They have given civilians every chance to leave. If they do not leave willingly, the onus is upon them. If Hamas prevents them from leaving, the onus is on Hamas.

 

[Roudy]

I don’t see the confusion. They voted for Hamas.

 

[buttercup]

That Palestinian civilians have to suffer because of Hamas? Yes. If it didn’t I would be worried about what sort of person I am

Thank you for restoring my faith in humanity.

 

[Ancient lion]

Israel kills at least 400 Palestinians in Gaza in one day...and counting​

Israeli criminal terrorists killed over 400 Palestinians, the majority of whom were children and women, on Sunday in multiple locations in Gaza as Tel Aviv continues its carpet-bombing of the besieged enclave, report says.

At least 4,651 Palestinians, including 1,873 children, have been killed in Israeli attacks

https://www.trtworld.com/middle-eas...-400-palestinians-in-gaza-in-one-day-15511577

 

[luiza]

That Palestinian civilians have to suffer because of Hamas? Yes. If it didn’t I would be worried about what sort of person I am

And also Israeli civilians because of bully boy terrorists , but from Israel and the US

 

[August West]

Israel kills at least 400 Palestinians in Gaza in one day...and counting​

Israeli criminal terrorists killed over 400 Palestinians, the majority of whom were children and women, on Sunday in multiple locations in Gaza as Tel Aviv continues its carpet-bombing of the besieged enclave, report says.

At least 4,651 Palestinians, including 1,873 children, have been killed in Israeli attacks

https://www.trtworld.com/middle-eas...-400-palestinians-in-gaza-in-one-day-15511577

You must have forgotten that Israel calls their terrorists "commandos".

 

[Hellbilly]

That Palestinian civilians have to suffer because of Hamas? Yes. If it didn’t I would be worried about what sort of person I am

Does the fact that Israel is killing Palestinian children bother you as well?

 

[Sixties Fan]

Does the fact that Israel is killing Palestinian children bother you as well?

Does the fact that you and many others believe anything HAMAS, not a non biased source says, is a problem?

Are children being killed? Of course?
Israel targets the Hamas leaders and their infrastructure.

Hamas knows that is what is going to be targeted.

So, WHY, would Hamas allow anyone, child or not, civilians.....to be near them or those targets?

If you truly do not think that Hamas would not be capable......of using human shields, especially children......to turn the world against Israel.....you do not want to know what Hamas is capable of.

Civilian casualties in wars happen in every war.
ONLY when the war is over and the truth comes out about how many Hamas, Islamic Jihad and others were killed, with their families whom they chose to keep right next to them for protection from attacks, or worse.....so that it would look like Israel was targeting civilians.....only then the world will know the truth.


And as USUAL, the world will not care about the truth, anymore than it does right now, as it is Israel. And Israel is always at fault by the extremists of the world who are extremely loud in screaming about how murderous Israel is.

 

[Sixties Fan]

You must have forgotten that Israel calls their terrorists "commandos".

Israel is a real Military, which follows the rules of war from the Geneva Convention, not the ISIS like terrorist, barbarians Hamas has always been which has not signed the Geneva Convention.

 

[Hellbilly]

Does the fact that you and many others believe anything HAMAS, not a non biased source says, is a problem?

Are children being killed? Of course?
Israel targets the Hamas leaders and their infrastructure.

Hamas knows that is what is going to be targeted.

So, WHY, would Hamas allow anyone, child or not, civilians.....to be near them or those targets?

If you truly do not think that Hamas would not be capable......of using human shields, especially children......to turn the world against Israel.....you do not want to know what Hamas is capable of.

Civilian casualties in wars happen in every war.
ONLY when the war is over and the truth comes out about how many Hamas, Islamic Jihad and others were killed, with their families whom they chose to keep right next to them for protection from attacks, or worse.....so that it would look like Israel was targeting civilians.....only then the world will know the truth.


And as USUAL, the world will not care about the truth, anymore than it does right now, as it is Israel. And Israel is always at fault by the extremists of the world who are extremely loud in screaming about how murderous Israel is.

Let me make my position crystal clear. I do not support the killing of children, by anyone. I don't support Israel. I don't support Hamas. I do see the similarities with this conflict and what happened in this nations history. Israel wants to eliminate Palestine just as the colonists wanted to eliminate us. It should never have happened then, or now. Children are sacred and they are the future and need to be protected, not killed.

 

[Sixties Fan]

Let me make my position crystal clear. I do not support the killing of children, by anyone. I don't support Israel. I don't support Hamas. I do see the similarities with this conflict and what happened in this nations history. Israel wants to eliminate Palestine just as the colonists wanted to eliminate us. It should never have happened then, or now. Children are sacred and they are the future and need to be protected, not killed.

Us, as in you are indigenous First Nation to the Americas.

It so happens that the Jews are Indigenous First Nation to Ancient Canaan, amongst other indigenous Nations.

The Jewish People became the Nation of Israel, conquered by many, ended up with smaller land.
Then the Romans changed the name of their land from Judea to Syria Palestine for the two Empires which had defeated the Jews. The Assyrians and the Philistines.

So, No....Israel does not want to eliminate Palestine. Palestine is what is left of the name Syria Palestine, which is a Region, not a country.
It was always a region, not a country invaded after the Romans by the Byzantine, the Muslim Arabs, Crusaders, Ottomans and with WWI, the British.


Jews are the indigenous people. Indigenous people do not "colonize" their own ancient homeland.

On the other hand, Palestinians are Arabs, descended from those Muslim Arabs who invaded the region in the 7th Century, and thousands more who moved into the Region.....
when the Jews decided that they needed to rebuild their ancient Nation on their ancient homeland because of endless massacres and persecution not only in Europe by in Muslim held territories. North Africa, Turkey, Mesopotamia, Syria, Lebanon, Iran.

No life is sacred to the Palestinians since about 50 years ago when they devised the idea that those who die to destroy Israel will become Martyrs and will receive 72 virgins.

Do not believe any of it, but that is what it is.
One did not see an attack on Egypt or Jordan between 1948 and 1967 for taking over Gaza and Judea and Samaria. Only when Israel won the territories after the Arab countries attacked in 1967.

No Arab leader called for a day of Jihad against Egypt of Jordan to free Palestine.

The only free Palestine which happened was the creation on the PLO, in 1964, to liberate Palestine.


The Palestine he was referring to was Israel of 1948. Only that. Why? Why not liberate Gaza from Egypt? Or Judea and Samaria from Jordan?


If you are not interested in historical facts, so be it, but above is the History of the region, and will be happy to answer any other questions you may have.
----------
[ Before Israel became Independent. The Mandate for Palestine was to rebuild the Nation of Israel. The British chose to humiliate the Jews by calling it what the Romans had called it, Palestine. A name meant to have Jews forget their ancient homeland and never fight for it again. All....ALL in the Mandate for Palestine became known as Palestinians. Jews, Muslims, Druze, Bedouins, etc]


First there was the Arab League. Why not the PLO?

The Arab League (Arabic: الجامعة العربية, al-Jāmiʿa al-ʻArabiyya Arabic pronunciation:[al.d͡ʒaː.mi.ʕa al.ʕa.ra.bij.ja] ⓘ), formally the League of Arab States (Arabic: جامعة الدول العربية, Jāmiʿat ad-Duwal al-ʿArabiyya), is a regional organization in the Arab world, which is located in North Africa, West Asia, and part of East Africa. The Arab League was formed in Cairo on 22 March 1945, initially with six members: Egypt, Iraq, Transjordan, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia, and Syria.[3] Yemen joined as a member on 5 May 1945. Currently, the League has 22 members.

Arab League - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Palestinian Liberation Organization

At its first summit meeting in Cairo in 1964, the Arab League initiated the creation of an organization representing the Palestinian people.[17] The Palestinian National Councilconvened in Jerusalem on 28 May 1964. After concluding the meeting, the PLO was founded on 2 June 1964. Its stated "complementary goals" were Arab unity and the liberation of Palestine.[18]

Palestine Liberation Organization - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Thank you.

 

[Hellbilly]

Us, as in you are indigenous First Nation to the Americas.

I figured my avatar was a dead giveaway.

It so happens that the Jews are Indigenous First Nation to Ancient Canaan, amongst other indigenous Nations.

So, Indigenous land should only be inhabited by the indigenous people of that land? Is that what you're saying?

The Jewish People became the Nation of Israel, conquered by many, ended up with smaller land.
Then the Romans changed the name of their land from Judea to Syria Palestine for the two Empires which had defeated the Jews. The Assyrians and the Philistines.

We lived on Turtle Island, conquered by colonials, for no reason other than greed and we ended up with smaller land. Much smaller. Then they changed the name to the United States. They went after our women and children. They brought disease, torture, and murder. They stole our children. They took our food.

Are you seeing the similarities?

Obviously you know more about the history of Israel than I do so I won't comment on that. What I do know is the murder of innocent children and elders needs to stop.

 

[Sixties Fan]

I figured my avatar was a dead giveaway.


So, Indigenous land should only be inhabited by the indigenous people of that land? Is that what you're saying?


We lived on Turtle Island, conquered by colonials, for no reason other than greed and we ended up with smaller land. Much smaller. Then they changed the name to the United States. They went after our women and children. They brought disease, torture, and murder. They stole our children. They took our food.

Are you seeing the similarities?

Obviously you know more about the history of Israel than I do so I won't comment on that. What I do know is the murder of innocent children and elders needs to stop.

No, I did not say that indigenous land should only be inhabited by the Indigenous people.

I know the history of the European invasion of the Americas.

There are no similarities if you are referring to the lies about Jews being Indigenous Europeans who came to "take" land from the indigenous people.


The indigenous people are the Jews/Israelis.
The invaders are the Arabs/Muslims. The Palestinians are Arabs, mostly Muslims, some are Christians who have already been displaced by Muslims in Bethlehem and other Christian cities since Israel signed the Oslo Accors in 1993 creating the PA.

Bethlehem was 85% Christian under Israel. It is now less than 15% under Muslim rule. And they are all Arabs.

I wish you would get to know more about the history of the region and the various groups which invaded and then lost the region and why....Jews were forced to want to rebuild their Nation again, which had not been allowed to happen since the Romans destroyed the second Temple.

There is lots of history about it on this thread

The NEWEST Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate

MYTH The Zionists were colonialist tools of Western imperialism. FACT “Colonialism means living by exploiting others,” Yehoshafat Harkabi has written. “But what could be further from colonialism than the ide- alism of city-dwelling Jews who strive to become farmers and laborers and to live by...

www.usmessageboard.com

Feel free to browse through the posts.

Israel, Jews, do not target children or elderly people.

What you are seeing is the disregard for life Hamas has as it attempts, once again, to destroy Israel and bring the land into Islamic hands. Nothing to do with Palestinians, they want to make it go back before WWI when the Ottoman Empire was defeated. Turn the whole area into an Islamic Caliphate.

This is Hamas' plan when they attacked Israel this time:

Documents exclusively obtained by NBC News show that Hamas created detailed plans to target elementary schools and a youth center in the Israeli kibbutz of Kfar Sa'ad, to "kill as many people as possible," seize hostages and quickly move them into the Gaza Strip.

The attack plans, which are labeled "top secret" in Arabic, appear to be orders for two highly trained Hamas units to surround and infiltrate villages and target places where civilians, including children, gather. Israeli authorities are still determining the death toll in Kfar Sa'ad.


The documents were found on the bodies of Hamas terrorists by Israeli first responders and shared with NBC News. They include detailed maps and show that Hamas intended to kill or take hostage civilians and school children.

'Top secret' Hamas documents show that terrorists intentionally targeted elementary schools and a youth center

Maps and documents recovered from the bodies of Hamas attackers reveal a coordinated plan to target children and take hostages inside an Israeli village near Gaza.

www.nbcnews.com

------------

Hamas and other Arab leaders consider all who live in Israel as Military. There are no civilians. They are all targets. Which is why the killed Muslims, Thai workers, tourists at the festival and many others, and the way they did.

 

[Hellbilly]

No, I did not say that indigenous land should only be inhabited by the Indigenous people.

I know the history of the European invasion of the Americas.

There are no similarities if you are referring to the lies about Jews being Indigenous Europeans who came to "take" land from the indigenous people.


The indigenous people are the Jews/Israelis.
The invaders are the Arabs/Muslims. The Palestinians are Arabs, mostly Muslims, some are Christians who have already been displaced by Muslims in Bethlehem and other Christian cities since Israel signed the Oslo Accors in 1993 creating the PA.

Bethlehem was 85% Christian under Israel. It is now less than 15% under Muslim rule. And they are all Arabs.

I wish you would get to know more about the history of the region and the various groups which invaded and then lost the region and why....Jews were forced to want to rebuild their Nation again, which had not been allowed to happen since the Romans destroyed the second Temple.

There is lots of history about it on this thread

The NEWEST Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate

MYTH The Zionists were colonialist tools of Western imperialism. FACT “Colonialism means living by exploiting others,” Yehoshafat Harkabi has written. “But what could be further from colonialism than the ide- alism of city-dwelling Jews who strive to become farmers and laborers and to live by...

www.usmessageboard.com

Feel free to browse through the posts.

Israel, Jews, do not target children or elderly people.

What you are seeing is the disregard for life Hamas has as it attempts, once again, to destroy Israel and bring the land into Islamic hands. Nothing to do with Palestinians, they want to make it go back before WWI when the Ottoman Empire was defeated. Turn the whole area into an Islamic Caliphate.

This is Hamas' plan when they attacked Israel this time:

Documents exclusively obtained by NBC News show that Hamas created detailed plans to target elementary schools and a youth center in the Israeli kibbutz of Kfar Sa'ad, to "kill as many people as possible," seize hostages and quickly move them into the Gaza Strip.

The attack plans, which are labeled "top secret" in Arabic, appear to be orders for two highly trained Hamas units to surround and infiltrate villages and target places where civilians, including children, gather. Israeli authorities are still determining the death toll in Kfar Sa'ad.


The documents were found on the bodies of Hamas terrorists by Israeli first responders and shared with NBC News. They include detailed maps and show that Hamas intended to kill or take hostage civilians and school children.

'Top secret' Hamas documents show that terrorists intentionally targeted elementary schools and a youth center

Maps and documents recovered from the bodies of Hamas attackers reveal a coordinated plan to target children and take hostages inside an Israeli village near Gaza.

www.nbcnews.com

------------

Hamas and other Arab leaders consider all who live in Israel as Military. There are no civilians. They are all targets. Which is why the killed Muslims, Thai workers, tourists at the festival and many others, and the way they did.

In your opinion, where should the Palestinian people live?

 

[Sixties Fan]

In your opinion, where should the Palestinian people live?

Where they are. In peace. As so many Arab Israelis live in Israel. In peace.

Gaza had the chance to create a Mexico, Monaco, anything South of Israel since 2005 when Israel took all its citizens from North Gaza.

They chose to use the closer proximity to Israel to launch more rockets to kill more civilians in Israel. All the money which they receive goes to Hamas for ways to destroy Israel.

No one is keeping the Arabs in Gaza from becoming a new nation and turn it into a paradise for tourists. But that is not what the Palestinian leaders want. They even destroyed a Roman site they found instead of using it for future touristic purposes.

They want to destroy Israel and turn the whole Mandate (which was to be for a Jewish state with the Arabs and others becoming Israelis) into an Islamic State, and in case you have not heard about it, they will be expelling all the Jews from the area, just as Mohammed did in Arabia (not Jewish homeland but they were there for centuries), or the Hashemites expelled the Jews from TransJordan in 1925 once Britain gave 78% of the Mandate for Palestine to them.
The Hashemites had just been kicked out of Arabia around WWI and ended up in TranJordan.

The Jews were also expelled from ALL of Judea and Samaria in 1948 when the Hashemites conquered that area in the 1948 war after Israel declared Independence.

So, in other words, an Arab clan is kicked out by another Arab clan out of Arabia and they ended up with 78% of the Mandate for Palestine.

You will not find one Muslim leader anywhere who complained about the Hashemite clan getting those 78%, much less the Arab clans living in the Mandate and what was left of it.
To this day there is none. The PLO did not want to liberate West Bank from the Jordanians, or Gaza from Egypt, only Israel.

So, after losing 80% of their ancient homeland by the British just giving most of it away to non Jews, and unilaterally leaving Gaza in 2005, what is Israel to do but to defend what is left?

 

[Hellbilly]

Where they are. In peace. As so many Arab Israelis live in Israel. In peace.

Gaza had the chance to create a Mexico, Monaco, anything South of Israel since 2005 when Israel took all its citizens from North Gaza.

They chose to use the closer proximity to Israel to launch more rockets to kill more civilians in Israel. All the money which they receive goes to Hamas for ways to destroy Israel.

No one is keeping the Arabs in Gaza from becoming a new nation and turn it into a paradise for tourists. But that is not what the Palestinian leaders want. They even destroyed a Roman site they found instead of using it for future touristic purposes.

They want to destroy Israel and turn the whole Mandate (which was to be for a Jewish state with the Arabs and others becoming Israelis) into an Islamic State, and in case you have not heard about it, they will be expelling all the Jews from the area, just as Mohammed did in Arabia (not Jewish homeland but they were there for centuries), or the Hashemites expelled the Jews from TransJordan in 1925 once Britain gave 78% of the Mandate for Palestine to them.
The Hashemites had just been kicked out of Arabia around WWI and ended up in TranJordan.

The Jews were also expelled from ALL of Judea and Samaria in 1948 when the Hashemites conquered that area in the 1948 war after Israel declared Independence.

So, in other words, an Arab clan is kicked out by another Arab clan out of Arabia and they ended up with 78% of the Mandate for Palestine.

You will not find one Muslim leader anywhere who complained about the Hashemite clan getting those 78%, much less the Arab clans living in the Mandate and what was left of it.
To this day there is none. The PLO did not want to liberate West Bank from the Jordanians, or Gaza from Egypt, only Israel.

So, after losing 80% of their ancient homeland by the British just giving most of it away to non Jews, and unilaterally leaving Gaza in 2005, what is Israel to do but to defend what is left?

Preventing innocent children from being murdered is more important than being right.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

The deception is strong in this thread

 

[Carl in Michigan]

Does the fact that Israel is killing Palestinian children bother you as well?

Their parents need to turn in the Hamas criminals.

Deaths in Gaza are the responsibility of Hamas, not israel