Did voter fraud alter the outcome of the MN 2008 Senate race?

[JoeB131]

I oppose voter fraud in all forms and cases.

That's why common sense safeguards, such as voter ID, are so important.

There is no voter fraud.

This is about disenfranchising poor people, and it's unconstitutional.

Look up the 24th Amendment and poll taxes.

Twenty-fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The 2008 case Crawford v. Marion County Election Board ruled that an Indiana law that required voters to obtain and present picture identification such as a driver's license was constitutional because the Supreme Court found no substantial burden imposed on voters and preventing voter fraud was a valid governmental objective.[citation needed] The lawsuit continued in the 2010 case League of Women Voters, et al. v. Todd Rokita where the Indiana Supreme Court ruled that requiring photo identification for voting was within the legislature's power.[17][18]

 

[Billo_Really]

Attention! Attention!
Dumbfuck right-wingers,
Pencils down and eyes to the front,
You are wasting our time and resources on something
that has occured only 10 times since 2000.​

New Nationwide Study of Election Fraud Since 2000
Finds Just 10 Cases of In-Person Voter Fraud

A new nationwide analysis of 2,068 alleged election-fraud cases since 2000 shows that while fraud has occurred, the rate is infinitesimal, and in-person voter impersonation on Election Day, which prompted 37 state legislatures to enact or consider tough voter ID laws, is virtually non-existent.

So knock this shit off! You're not doing the country any favors.

 

[GuyPinestra]

Attention! Attention!
Dumbfuck right-wingers,
Pencils down and eyes to the front,
You are wasting our time and resources on something
that has occured only 10 times since 2000.​

New Nationwide Study of Election Fraud Since 2000
Finds Just 10 Cases of In-Person Voter Fraud

A new nationwide analysis of 2,068 alleged election-fraud cases since 2000 shows that while fraud has occurred, the rate is infinitesimal, and in-person voter impersonation on Election Day, which prompted 37 state legislatures to enact or consider tough voter ID laws, is virtually non-existent.

So knock this shit off! You're not doing the country any favors.

Voter ID stops MILLIONS of illegal aliens from casting ballots in our elections. You guys are pissed because they are one of your largest voting blocs.

Tough shit, no more Juan and Maria votes for YOU!

 

[Truthmatters]

Lies and cheating is all they have left

 

[Uncensored2008]

There is no voter fraud.

If there wasn't, you fascist democrats wouldn't fight against ID.

This is about disenfranchising poor people, and it's unconstitutional.

ROFL

What a fucknut moron you are.

Yep, asking for ID to vote is unconstitutional... DailyKOS trained the drones to say so.

Look up the 24th Amendment and poll taxes.

ID isn't a "poll tax," shit fer brains.

The 2008 case Crawford v. Marion County Election Board ruled that an Indiana law that required voters to obtain and present picture identification such as a driver's license was constitutional because the Supreme Court found no substantial burden imposed on voters and preventing voter fraud was a valid governmental objective.[citation needed] The lawsuit continued in the 2010 case League of Women Voters, et al. v. Todd Rokita where the Indiana Supreme Court ruled that requiring photo identification for voting was within the legislature's power.[17][18]

You DO realize that refutes, rather than supports the argument of your shameful party, doncha, dumbfuck?

 

[Uncensored2008]

Lies and cheating is all they have left

Which is why you are fighting to make sure no one stops you from lying and cheating, eh Catz, er TM....

 

[Billo_Really]

Voter ID stops MILLIONS of illegal aliens from casting ballots in our elections. You guys are pissed because they are one of your largest voting blocs.

Tough shit, no more Juan and Maria votes for YOU!

Are you incapable of rational thought? Only 10 cases of voter fraud has occured in the last 12 years of elections in the entire country.

As for you statement about those "MILLIONS", there is no such thing as "illegal" people. And you're FOS about these voting blocs. Un-documented workers try to limit their contact and exposure with government services as much as possible. They do this for obvious reasons. The more interaction with the government, the more chances they will be found out, they're in the country illegally. So they keep their contact with government (any government at federal, state and local level) to an absolute minimum.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Are you incapable of rational thought? Only 10 cases of voter fraud has occured in the last 12 years of elections in the entire country.

Oh look, it's a Nazi **** - who is SURPRISE, a leftist.

Here are over 60 ACORN pukes convicted of voter fraud, you lying sack of shit.

Fraud Map :: Rotten Acorn ::

As for you statement about those "MILLIONS", there is no such thing as "illegal" people.

Unless they're JOOOOZZZ, imeyerite Adolf?

And you're FOS about these voting blocs. Un-documented workers try to limit their contact and exposure with government services as much as possible.

ROFL

Utter bullshit. Illegals grab every welfare benefit that exists, It's half the reason they come here - moron.

They do this for obvious reasons. The more interaction with the government, the more chances they will be found out their in the country illegally. So they keep their contact with government (any government at federal, state and local level) to an absolute minimum.

Yeah, illegals keep a low profile - shitferbrains.

 

[Billo_Really]

Oh look, it's a Nazi **** - who is SURPRISE, a leftist.

Here are over 60 ACORN pukes convicted of voter fraud, you lying sack of shit.

Fraud Map :: Rotten Acorn ::

Boy, you really fell out of the stupid tree and hit every limb going down.

That "map", is denoting voter "registration" fraud, not voter fraud. Even though someone might register as Mickey Mouse, it is highly unlikely someone claiming to be Mickey Mouse, will show up to vote.

BTW, do you know how those cases dipicted on your map were discovered? They were turned into the authorities by ACORN representatives themselves, as required by law. One other thing you might want to remember in your amoeba brain before going on another ACORN rant, is that no one from the organization was ever convicted of any charges you idiots claimed they made and all investigations into their organization have now been closed. Not one charge of your purely political claims, ever made it to a court of law.

So all that crap you people have been spewing about ACORN from day one, was nothing but total bullshit!

Unless they're JOOOOZZZ, imeyerite Adolf?

Bringing something in that is completely un-related to the discussion, just shows you have less than no argument at all. Like I've already said, you people talk like 10 year olds.

ROFL

Utter bullshit. Illegals grab every welfare benefit that exists, It's half the reason they come here - moron.

How do you know why they come here? Do you know every person coming across the border? Do you stand their like a "Greeter" at the Sands and say, "Hi! I'm a god-damn American! Who the **** are you?"

Yeah, illegals keep a low profile - shitferbrains.

Yeah, they do. You'd realize this, if you ever grew a pair.

 

[Claudette]

Nothing wrong with showing voter ID.

Hell I voted last week and had to show my DL. No problem. Voted and went on my way.

You need ID for everything today. No reason a person can't get an ID to vote.

Common sense 101.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Boy, you really fell out of the stupid tree and hit every limb going down.

That "map", is denoting voter "registration" fraud, not voter fraud.

Oh, well gawdamn - they weren't registering them to vote so that they could vote, it was so they could go to Disneyland..

Even though someone might register as Mickey Mouse, it is highly unlikely someone claiming to be Mickey Mouse, will show up to vote.

Then what would the purpose be?

You see, what the scam is is to flood the precincts with fraudulent registrations so that workers are overwhelmed and cannot vet the applicants. Yeah, the "Mickey Mouse" ones will get tossed, but the 20,000 dead people that ACORN uses are less likely. After which, ACORN loads up the buses with illegals and drunks, on voting day.

Fraud is rampant, overwhelming; and we all know it. You support fraud because it is engaged in by your shameful party.

BTW, do you know how those cases dipicted on your map were discovered? They were turned into the authorities by ACORN representatives themselves, as required by law.

ROFL

Ah the lies you tell, Nazi boi.

{In 2005, the Virginia State Board of Elections admonished Project Vote and ACORN for turning in a significant number of faulty voter registrations. An audit revealed that 83% of sampled registrations that were rejected for carrying false or questionable }

That ain't your fellow leftists in ACORN turning themselves in, you lying **** - they got caught - red handed.

One other thing you might want to remember in your amoeba brain before going on another ACORN rant, is that no one from the organization was ever convicted of any charges you idiots claimed they made and all investigations into their organization have now been closed. Not one charge of your purely political claims, ever made it to a court of law.

Oh, this is good.

So no one in ACORN was ever convicted?\

Is that your claim, Nazi boi?

ROFL

Wanna back out?

So all that crap you people have been spewing about ACORN from day one, was nothing but total bullshit!

Sniff, because, uh, JOOZZZ SUCK...

ROFL

You pile of shit.

{Yet another former ACORN employee was convicted of voter fraud last week. This brings the total number of convictions for former workers from the embattled group to at least 15 so far this year.}

The voter fraud hall of shame: Milwaukee voter fraud conviction makes ACORN

You stupid, lying ****.

Bringing something in that is completely un-related to the discussion, just shows you have less than no argument at all. Like I've already said, you people talk like 10 year olds.

You being yet another JOOOOO hating leftist is very much pertinent. You have absolutely no integrity and are a person of generally low character.

How do you know why they come here? Do you know every person coming across the border? Do you stand their like a "Greeter" at the Sands and say, "Hi! I'm a god-damn American! Who the **** are you?"

No, I stand there like a broken piggy bank as they pick my pocket, you simpering fool.

Yeah, they do. You'd realize this, if you ever grew a pair.

Yep, our illegals are hiding in the shadows, fer shere.

 

[daveman]

Some research I did:




2008 Minnesota U.S. Senate Election: Results after election contest[1][2][64][65]
Party Candidate Votes
DFL Al Franken 1,212,629
Republican Norm Coleman 1,212,317


The difference?

312 votes.

The report finds that 113 individuals who voted illegally in the 2008 election have been convicted of the crime, "ineligible voter knowingly votes" under Minnesota Statute 201.014.

--

Minnesota's recent charges and convictions stem from research initiated by Minnesota Majority. The research identified upwards of 2,800 ineligible felons believed to have unlawfully voted in Minnesota's 2008 general election.

--

At the time of this report, nearly 200 additional cases are still pending trial.​

So: 113 convictions. 200 more pending cases. 2,800 ineligibles possibly voted.

That assumes those 113 people all voted for Franken. And it still wouldn't have made a difference.

So you don't care that 113 legally-voting Minnesotans were disenfranchised by illegal votes.

Personally, I'm wondering why you think a person with a criminal record shouldn't be allowed to vote. They did their time.

That's up to the people of each state.

 

[daveman]

Franken and Bush both won legally. There is zero way to prove which way the votes for ballots cast by felons would have gone because its a secret ballot. You can't pull Johnny Felony's specific ballot and nullify the vote. The election has been certified. It's over. No amount of partisan gnashing from TSgt Democracy is going change things.

As I said, there is no way to fix this particular election.

But we can prevent it happening again.

Oddly enough, Democrats seem to oppose those efforts.

Well, sometimes a solution can we worse than the problem.

You can fix a hangnail by amputating an arm, but no one thinks that's really a good idea.

How many valid voters are you willing to disenfranchise to get the one guy who might not be able to?

No one would be disenfranchised. That's just silly.

Again, giving you the total benefit of the doubt here and assuming that this is really your goal. You only want to get Johnny Felony out, not the guy who has a similar name, or the guy who couldn't come up with 35 bucks for a driver's license because he doesn't have a car.

I really don't know how I could make it any plainer:

I want everyone who is legally eligible to vote to vote. I don't want anyone is is NOT eligible to vote to vote. I don't care who the legal voters vote for.

In this thread, we can see who really values the sanctity of the vote.

And it's not the left.

 

[daveman]

Some research I did:




2008 Minnesota U.S. Senate Election: Results after election contest[1][2][64][65]
Party Candidate Votes
DFL Al Franken 1,212,629
Republican Norm Coleman 1,212,317


The difference?

312 votes.

The report finds that 113 individuals who voted illegally in the 2008 election have been convicted of the crime, "ineligible voter knowingly votes" under Minnesota Statute 201.014.

--

Minnesota's recent charges and convictions stem from research initiated by Minnesota Majority. The research identified upwards of 2,800 ineligible felons believed to have unlawfully voted in Minnesota's 2008 general election.

--

At the time of this report, nearly 200 additional cases are still pending trial.​

So: 113 convictions. 200 more pending cases. 2,800 ineligibles possibly voted.

Your linky doesn't work.

It did earlier this year.

 

[daveman]

Conservative media hype "not accurate" report to suggest Franken's election was "an illegal victory" | Media Matters for America

MediaMatters' little temper tantrum does nothing to refute the numbers in the OP.

But your party benefited, so it's okay with you.

You're anti-democracy.

How do you know for sure that just the dem party was the only beneficiary?

Are you trying to sell that there is no voter fraud coming from the con side?

How so?

Once again:

I want everyone who is legally eligible to vote to vote. I don't want anyone is is NOT eligible to vote to vote. I don't care who the legal voters vote for, as long as their votes are not cancelled out by illegal votes.

I haven't seen anyone from the left espouse that.

 

[daveman]

Franken and Bush both won legally. There is zero way to prove which way the votes for ballots cast by felons would have gone because its a secret ballot. You can't pull Johnny Felony's specific ballot and nullify the vote. The election has been certified. It's over. No amount of partisan gnashing from TSgt Democracy is going change things.

As I said, there is no way to fix this particular election.

But we can prevent it happening again.

Oddly enough, Democrats seem to oppose those efforts.

The problem is virtually, if not straight up nonexistent. It's a waste of time and money for those who have limited money to begin with. I personally think the con's fear losing the elections they and their buds are trying to BUY. Only thing left to do is to try and rig the game. Per as usual!!

- Google Search

So: I provide proof that voter fraud may have affected a Senate race, and you claim it's virtually if not straight-up nonexistent.

How's that selective perception thing working out for you?

 

[daveman]

Some research I did:




2008 Minnesota U.S. Senate Election: Results after election contest[1][2][64][65]
Party Candidate Votes
DFL Al Franken 1,212,629
Republican Norm Coleman 1,212,317


The difference?

312 votes.

The report finds that 113 individuals who voted illegally in the 2008 election have been convicted of the crime, "ineligible voter knowingly votes" under Minnesota Statute 201.014.

--

Minnesota's recent charges and convictions stem from research initiated by Minnesota Majority. The research identified upwards of 2,800 ineligible felons believed to have unlawfully voted in Minnesota's 2008 general election.

--

At the time of this report, nearly 200 additional cases are still pending trial.​

So: 113 convictions. 200 more pending cases. 2,800 ineligibles possibly voted.

United States Senate election in Minnesota, 2008 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Further investigations

In July 2010, Minnesota Majority, a conservative watchdog group, conducted a study in which they claimed that at least 341 convicted felons in the largely Democratic Minneapolis-St. Paul area voted illegally in the Senate race.[112] Subsequent investigations of Minnesota Majority's claims by election officials found that many of their allegations were incorrect. Some of the cases that were submitted involved mistaking a legal voter for a felon with the same name, others involved felons who had had their voting rights reinstated after serving their sentences, and others were felons who illegally registered to vote, but did not vote in 2008 election.[113][114] Columnist Nick Coleman of the Minneapolis-based Star Tribune called the idea that illegal voting by felons made a difference in the race "unbelievable" and the Minnesota Majority report "good fodder for a right-wing scare campaign."[115]

In October 2010, the Hennepin County Sheriff's Office concluded an extensive investigation into 110 allegations of fraud, which resulted in six charges being filed — two individuals were charged with the separate felonies of registering to vote while ineligible and voting while ineligible and four others were charged with voting while ineligible.[116]

[edit] See also

It's funny the way you think that doesn't mean 113 people were convicted of voter fraud.

And by "funny", I mean "utterly pathetic".

 

[daveman]

That assumes those 113 people all voted for Franken. And it still wouldn't have made a difference.

They were criminals, of course they voted for Franken.

Personally, I'm wondering why you think a person with a criminal record shouldn't be allowed to vote. They did their time.

No doubt YOU would allow them to voted democrat while in prison.

Some countries do let convicts vote. Israel does, for instance, if they are Jews.

to the point, though, when you've got the national insanity of throwing 2 million people in prison and a lot more on parole or probation or with convictions to feed a prison industrial complex, you probably need to address this level of disenfranchisement.

"Stop breakin' the law, asshole!"

-- Jim Carey, Liar Liar

 

[daveman]

Man,,this never dies,,,except in the courts.
Look, the RNC and the Minny GOP hired their top attorneys to represent them. After all the proceedings/presentations/recounts; etc, Franken was declared the winner. The GOP accepted it and Norm Coleman accepted it, they all moved on. Also, Norm Coleman is making a ton-o-bucks with the PAC he started. He's happy. But I guess some people are still hung up on this event almost 4 years later.

Uh huh.

"The Democrat won; that's all that matters. That proves it was a fair election."

You could just say that and be done with it.

 

[daveman]

I oppose voter fraud in all forms and cases.

That's why common sense safeguards, such as voter ID, are so important.

So, you like socialism, communism, etc.? How about supporting the US CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO VOTE, do you support that - or just claim to? How about democracy, do you support that - or just claim to?

The only voter fraud worth writing about and REALLY matters is the fraud that takes place and IS TAKING PLACE trying to disenfranchise voters. The con's are behind it AND only focusing on those voters who tend to vote democratic. They know they cannot win on their radical issues so they are trying to rig the process.

It's a waste of limited money to those who are among the poor and no different than a poll tax. It is a hassle and unaffordable to those who are elderly and on a fixed income. Both classes which already have no voice in DC or their respective states due to corporate money and influence.

If you supported democracy, you'd be disgusted that 113 Minnesotans were disenfrachised by illegal voters.

But you're not. So you don't.