Democracy over promised and under delivered

[dblack]

As Americans, on the "US" message board, it might be easy to lose sight of, but the rejection of democracy in favor of more authoritarian government is a worldwide change. So I thought it might be worth discussing what's going on. Why is democracy losing ground? Why are people so disenchanted with it that they're willing to give control to unrestrained populist leaders?

Here's something I've been thinking about. A possible motive: Populist authoritarianism is winning out over democracy because it is more responsive to the will of the people. That's right - MORE responsive to the will of the people. Liberals are probably a bit confused by that statement, but it's true. By contrast, democracy is slow and plodding. It requires endless deliberation and negotiation to effect change in government. It requires that we build consensus and come to agreement before we pass laws.

Populism sheds these impediments and puts power in the hands of the people, via the people's tyrant. As long as you like what he's doing, it's all wine and roses.

I think the frustration behind this change is largely driven by misconceptions of what democracy is, and how it works. Democracy was sold as a way for people to get what they want out of their government. They told us that democratic government would make us all happy, healthy, educated, etc, etc ... But it just doesn't work that way. Constitutionally limited democracy, working properly, prevents identity politics and requires government to attend to the general welfare of the people, rather the focused interests. It prevents people from getting what they want, unless everyone else wants it too.

So, can it be turned around? Is there a way to convince people that democracy is a good thing, even if it doesn't give them exactly what they want out of government?

 

[Thinker101]

As Americans, on the "US" message board, it might be easy to lose sight of, but the rejection of democracy in favor of more authoritarian government is a worldwide change. So I thought it might be worth discussing what's going on. Why is democracy losing ground? Why are people so disenchanted with it that they're willing to give control to unrestrained populist leaders?

Here's something I've been thinking about. A possible motive: Populist authoritarianism is winning out over democracy because it is more responsive to the will of the people. That's right - MORE responsive to the will of the people. Liberals are probably a bit confused by that statement, but it's true. By contrast, democracy is slow and plodding. It requires endless deliberation and negotiation to effect change in government. It requires that we build consensus and come to agreement before we pass laws.

Populism sheds these impediments and puts power in the hands of the people, via the people's tyrant. As long as you like what he's doing, it's all wine and roses.

I think the frustration behind this change is largely driven by misconceptions of what democracy is, and how it works. Democracy was sold as a way for people to get what they want out of their government. They told us that democratic government would make us all happy, healthy, educated, etc, etc ... But it just doesn't work that way. Constitutionally limited democracy, working properly, prevents identity politics and requires government to attend to the general welfare of the people, rather the focused interests. It prevents people from getting what they want, unless everyone else wants it too.

So, can it be turned around? Is there a way to convince people that democracy is a good thing, even if it doesn't give them exactly what they want out of government?

"Constitutionally limited democracy, working properly, prevents identity politics and requires government to attend to the general welfare of the people, rather the focused interests."

Well, democrats pretty much screwed the pooch on that one.

 

[Hafar1014]

America is not a democracy. Trump is not authoritarian. You start with two false statements.
therefore the rest of you post is crap.
Trump has cut the power of government with tax cuts regulation cuts and spending cuts. An authoritarian increases the power of government.

Democrats under Biden expanded the power of government and inserted it into our personal lives. Thats authoritarian. They used the government to attack political opponents. Thats authoritarian. They controlled free speech. Thats authoritarian.

See a pattern yet

 

[Mac1958]

So, can it be turned around? Is there a way to convince people that democracy is a good thing, even if it doesn't give them exactly what they want out of government?

"With freedom comes great responsibility". That appears to be asking a bit too much of humans.

Can it work? Only if the system places enough controls on the worst human impulses. Ours does not.

 

[dblack]

America is not a democracy. Trump is not authoritarian. You start with two false statements.

Alright. We're clearly not one the same page, not using the same definitions of these words. But thanks for posting.

 

[1srelluc]

To people like the OP the word Republic is about as foreign to them as the words Personal Responsibility.

 

[dblack]

To people like the OP the word Republic is about as foreign to them as the words Personal Responsibility.

Not really. I totally get the republic/democracy distinction. But it has nothing to do with the topic. Thanks anyway.

 

[dblack]

Can it work? Only if the system places enough controls on the worst human impulses. Ours does not.

How do you mean?

 

[Meister]

As Americans, on the "US" message board, it might be easy to lose sight of, but the rejection of democracy in favor of more authoritarian government is a worldwide change. So I thought it might be worth discussing what's going on. Why is democracy losing ground? Why are people so disenchanted with it that they're willing to give control to unrestrained populist leaders?

Here's something I've been thinking about. A possible motive: Populist authoritarianism is winning out over democracy because it is more responsive to the will of the people. That's right - MORE responsive to the will of the people. Liberals are probably a bit confused by that statement, but it's true. By contrast, democracy is slow and plodding. It requires endless deliberation and negotiation to effect change in government. It requires that we build consensus and come to agreement before we pass laws.

Populism sheds these impediments and puts power in the hands of the people, via the people's tyrant. As long as you like what he's doing, it's all wine and roses.

I think the frustration behind this change is largely driven by misconceptions of what democracy is, and how it works. Democracy was sold as a way for people to get what they want out of their government. They told us that democratic government would make us all happy, healthy, educated, etc, etc ... But it just doesn't work that way. Constitutionally limited democracy, working properly, prevents identity politics and requires government to attend to the general welfare of the people, rather the focused interests. It prevents people from getting what they want, unless everyone else wants it too.

So, can it be turned around? Is there a way to convince people that democracy is a good thing, even if it doesn't give them exactly what they want out of government?

The democrat party is pushing their way towards socialism/communism. What are you pushing again?

 

[dblack]

The democrat party is pushing their way towards socialism/communism. What are you pushing again?

Constitutional limited government and individual liberty. Hint: I'm not a Democrat.

Anyhow, do you have any thoughts on the topic?

 

[Mac1958]

How do you mean?

Our political/electoral system incentivizes and rewards the worst impulses of its participants. So -- if we cared enough -- we'd install better guardrails like term limits, bipartisan redistricting commissions, ranked choice voting, publicly-funded elections.

 

[Meister]

Constitutional limited government and individual liberty. Hint: I'm not a Democrat.

Anyhow, do you have any thoughts on the topic?

We are not a democracy, we are best described as a constitutional republic.
What the democrats are leaning towards is a authoritarian government, and seems
to be getting violent in it's process.

 

[dblack]

We are not a democracy, we are best described as a constitutional republic.

Yeah, yeah. I know that argument, and I agree. But it has nothing to do with the topic.

What the democrats are leaning towards is a authoritarian government, and seems
to be getting violent in it's process.

Yeah. It's a general trend. This isn't another idiot-****-partisan-pissing-match thread.

 

[Meister]

Yeah, yeah. I know that argument, and I agree. But it has nothing to do with the topic.

Yeah. It's a general trend. This isn't another idiot-****-partisan-pissing-match thread.

The facts are obvious, I guess I could just hide the facts to keep this thread "non partisan".
But the facts get in the way. I'll bow out so you can have clean
posts in your controversial topic.

 

[Dekster]

As Americans, on the "US" message board, it might be easy to lose sight of, but the rejection of democracy in favor of more authoritarian government is a worldwide change. So I thought it might be worth discussing what's going on. Why is democracy losing ground? Why are people so disenchanted with it that they're willing to give control to unrestrained populist leaders?

Here's something I've been thinking about. A possible motive: Populist authoritarianism is winning out over democracy because it is more responsive to the will of the people. That's right - MORE responsive to the will of the people. Liberals are probably a bit confused by that statement, but it's true. By contrast, democracy is slow and plodding. It requires endless deliberation and negotiation to effect change in government. It requires that we build consensus and come to agreement before we pass laws.

Populism sheds these impediments and puts power in the hands of the people, via the people's tyrant. As long as you like what he's doing, it's all wine and roses.

I think the frustration behind this change is largely driven by misconceptions of what democracy is, and how it works. Democracy was sold as a way for people to get what they want out of their government. They told us that democratic government would make us all happy, healthy, educated, etc, etc ... But it just doesn't work that way. Constitutionally limited democracy, working properly, prevents identity politics and requires government to attend to the general welfare of the people, rather the focused interests. It prevents people from getting what they want, unless everyone else wants it too.

So, can it be turned around? Is there a way to convince people that democracy is a good thing, even if it doesn't give them exactly what they want out of government?

I suspect that a great many people who lived through COVID will carry bitterness forward the rest of their lives in the same way that people who lived through the Great Depression did. Many people saw authoritarianism keep them under de facto house arrest, so the right wing "No!" has a lot more appeal to them currently.

 

[dblack]

The facts are obvious, I guess I could just hide the facts to keep this thread "non partisan".
But the facts get in the way. I'll bow out so you can have clean
posts in your controversial topic.

That's fair. I'm just sick to death of the "sides" horseshit. And, it has nothing to do with the topic. This is a worldwide trend.

 

[whitehall]

As Americans, on the "US" message board, it might be easy to lose sight of, but the rejection of democracy in favor of more authoritarian government is a worldwide change. So I thought it might be worth discussing what's going on. Why is democracy losing ground? Why are people so disenchanted with it that they're willing to give control to unrestrained populist leaders?

Here's something I've been thinking about. A possible motive: Populist authoritarianism is winning out over democracy because it is more responsive to the will of the people. That's right - MORE responsive to the will of the people. Liberals are probably a bit confused by that statement, but it's true. By contrast, democracy is slow and plodding. It requires endless deliberation and negotiation to effect change in government. It requires that we build consensus and come to agreement before we pass laws.

Populism sheds these impediments and puts power in the hands of the people, via the people's tyrant. As long as you like what he's doing, it's all wine and roses.

I think the frustration behind this change is largely driven by misconceptions of what democracy is, and how it works. Democracy was sold as a way for people to get what they want out of their government. They told us that democratic government would make us all happy, healthy, educated, etc, etc ... But it just doesn't work that way. Constitutionally limited democracy, working properly, prevents identity politics and requires government to attend to the general welfare of the people, rather the focused interests. It prevents people from getting what they want, unless everyone else wants it too.

So, can it be turned around? Is there a way to convince people that democracy is a good thing, even if it doesn't give them exactly what they want out of government?

Democracy was sold? They told us? WTF does that mean? The United States of America is the only Country in the world that lists guaranteed freedoms in the Bill of Rights. Quit whining and learn and appreciate what you got.

 

[Rawley]

As Americans, on the "US" message board, it might be easy to lose sight of, but the rejection of democracy in favor of more authoritarian government is a worldwide change. So I thought it might be worth discussing what's going on. Why is democracy losing ground? Why are people so disenchanted with it that they're willing to give control to unrestrained populist leaders?

Here's something I've been thinking about. A possible motive: Populist authoritarianism is winning out over democracy because it is more responsive to the will of the people. That's right - MORE responsive to the will of the people. Liberals are probably a bit confused by that statement, but it's true. By contrast, democracy is slow and plodding. It requires endless deliberation and negotiation to effect change in government. It requires that we build consensus and come to agreement before we pass laws.

Populism sheds these impediments and puts power in the hands of the people, via the people's tyrant. As long as you like what he's doing, it's all wine and roses.

I think the frustration behind this change is largely driven by misconceptions of what democracy is, and how it works. Democracy was sold as a way for people to get what they want out of their government. They told us that democratic government would make us all happy, healthy, educated, etc, etc ... But it just doesn't work that way. Constitutionally limited democracy, working properly, prevents identity politics and requires government to attend to the general welfare of the people, rather the focused interests. It prevents people from getting what they want, unless everyone else wants it too.

So, can it be turned around? Is there a way to convince people that democracy is a good thing, even if it doesn't give them exactly what they want out of government?

OK. The leaders in your cult have given you the buzzwords DEMOCRACY and AUTHORITARIANISM. What are your specific examples of how AUTHORITARIANISM is winning out over DEMOCRACY.

 

[BrokeLoser]

As Americans, on the "US" message board, it might be easy to lose sight of, but the rejection of democracy in favor of more authoritarian government is a worldwide change. So I thought it might be worth discussing what's going on. Why is democracy losing ground? Why are people so disenchanted with it that they're willing to give control to unrestrained populist leaders?

Here's something I've been thinking about. A possible motive: Populist authoritarianism is winning out over democracy because it is more responsive to the will of the people. That's right - MORE responsive to the will of the people. Liberals are probably a bit confused by that statement, but it's true. By contrast, democracy is slow and plodding. It requires endless deliberation and negotiation to effect change in government. It requires that we build consensus and come to agreement before we pass laws.

Populism sheds these impediments and puts power in the hands of the people, via the people's tyrant. As long as you like what he's doing, it's all wine and roses.

I think the frustration behind this change is largely driven by misconceptions of what democracy is, and how it works. Democracy was sold as a way for people to get what they want out of their government. They told us that democratic government would make us all happy, healthy, educated, etc, etc ... But it just doesn't work that way. Constitutionally limited democracy, working properly, prevents identity politics and requires government to attend to the general welfare of the people, rather the focused interests. It prevents people from getting what they want, unless everyone else wants it too.

So, can it be turned around? Is there a way to convince people that democracy is a good thing, even if it doesn't give them exactly what they want out of government?

You are seeing the Cloward-Piven strategy taking hold. It’s just that simple.

Cloward–Piven strategy - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[BrokeLoser]

Constitutional limited government and individual liberty. Hint: I'm not a Democrat.

Anyhow, do you have any thoughts on the topic?

While the globalists like GolfingGator and ‘others’ were cheering on the recruitment and importation of tens of millions of government needy thirdworlders I warned him that his embrace of globalism tolerance and inclusion would bite him in his small government, freedom loving, fiscally responsible ass one day…Here we are, the Great Experiment has failed miserably and the cost of the experiment has come due.

Cloward–Piven strategy - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org