Defending Israel VS. Closing the border

[rtwngAvngr]

Which is more important in the long term success, sovereignty, and security of the United States, defending israel or closing the border?

 

[dilloduck]

Which is more important in the long term success, sovereignty, and security of the U.S. of the United Stated, defending israel or closing the border?

Easy---closing the border. Israel can take care of itself in spite of the fact that people continue to think they lost the skirmish with the Hizbullys.

 

[CSM]

Which is more important in the long term success, sovereignty, and security of the U.S. of the United Stated, defending israel or closing the border?

Hmmm...are they mutually exclusive?

Given your well publicized feelings on Israel, I suspect you are looking for a heated debate fostered by what could be viewed as a deliberate troll.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Easy---closing the border. Israel can take care of itself in spite of the fact that people continue to think they lost the skirmish with the Hizbullys.

It seems obvious I agree. Yet our president is doing the exact opposite.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Hmmm...are they mutually exclusive?

Given your well publicized feelings on Israel, I suspect you are looking for a heated debate fostered by what could be viewed as a deliberate troll.

They're not necessarily mutually exclusive, but judging from this administrations actions, one might think they were.

Which is MORE important, in your view?

This is NOT a troll. I'm asking people to really analyze whether American security is really the neocon goal. It's just a question.

 

[dilloduck]

They're not necessarily mutually exclusive, but judging from this administrations actions, one might think they were.

Which is MORE important, in your view?

This is NOT a troll. I'm asking people to really analyze whether American security is really the neocon goal. It's just a question.

It's election time ----everyone is suddenly for a secure America. Who woulda thunk it ?:rotflmao:

 

[Jennifer.Bush]

Easy---closing the border. Israel can take care of itself in spite of the fact that people continue to think they lost the skirmish with the Hizbullys.

pretty much, we need to take care of home instead of caring about other nations.

 

[CSM]

They're not necessarily mutually exclusive, but judging from this administrations actions, one might think they were.

Which is MORE important, in your view?

I think both are equally important (not a choice in your poll). International relations and foriegn policy have as much an impact (sometimes more) as secure borders.

As for the administration, illegal immigration and the failure of this administration to address the issue is a HUGE negative in their standing with me. Unfortunately, I dont think the Dems offer anything any different. Neither seems to want to come to grips with the issue and neither is offering any effective and efficient means to curb the flood of illegals. That makes them all a bunch of spineless carpetbaggers in my book.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

I think both are equally important (not a choice in your poll). International relations and foriegn policy have as much an impact (sometimes more) as secure borders.

As for the administration, illegal immigration and the failure of this administration to address the issue is a HUGE negative in their standing with me. Unfortunately, I dont think the Dems offer anything any different. Neither seems to want to come to grips with the issue and neither is offering any effective and efficient means to curb the flood of illegals. That makes them all a bunch of spineless carpetbaggers in my book.

I'm asking you to Prioritize. Choose one. Let's say there were resource constraints and we could only afford one. Which would you choose?

 

[CSM]

pretty much, we need to take care of home instead of caring about other nations.

National security is not a single issue. It is affected and impacted by many many things including the actions of foreign nations and foriegn institutions. The US was mostly isolationist pre-WW II and we paid for that in blood and treasure.

 

[CSM]

I'm asking you to Prioritize. Choose one. Let's say there were resource constraints and we could only afford one. Which would you choose?

Not gonna do it...my view is that both are equally important. Your hypothetical will lead nowhere except to a heated debate over an artificially constructed and constrained scenario. I believe the US has the resources to handle both at the same time; IF the politicians and the citizens had the will power!

 

[Jennifer.Bush]

National security is not a single issue. It is affected and impacted by many many things including the actions of foreign nations and foriegn institutions. The US was mostly isolationist pre-WW II and we paid for that in blood and treasure.

um ok well this is 2006 and there is a huge problem w/ the U.s having their board open

 

[CSM]

um ok well this is 2006 and there is a huge problem w/ the U.s having their board open

I am not saying that the borders are not an issue. I am saying that we, as a nation, have to control our borders with something a wee bit more substantial than lip service and at the same time, stay engaged internationally. Failure to do both will result in journey down the path that looks a whole lot like the fall of the Roman Empire.

One of my biggest gripes with the political scene in this country is that BOTH parties try to get elected on the basis of a particular stance on a single issue. Debates such as this thread lead to that philosophy and I think that is just plain wrong. There are many issues facing this country and electing a politician because of his/her stance on a single issue has historically resulted in the worsening of all the other issues.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Not gonna do it...my view is that both are equally important. Your hypothetical will lead nowhere except to a heated debate over an artificially constructed and constrained scenario. I believe the US has the resources to handle both at the same time; IF the politicians and the citizens had the will power!

Hypothetical scenarios are indicative of higher thinking and planning.

This administration has demonstrated their priorities; they obviously DON'T feel they're the same in importance. Your attempt to denigrate me and the thread and this discussion belies your actual priority.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Debates such as this thread lead to that philosophy and I think that is just plain wrong.

So much for free speech and open discussion, eh, csm.

There are other threads discussing other issues on this forum.

Debate is wrong? What is wrong with you?

 

[dilloduck]

So much for free speech and open discussion, eh, csm.

There are other threads discussing other issues on this forum.

Debate is wrong? What is wrong with you?

Are you saying screw Israel--protect our borders or are you hoping for a larger debate on Judaism?

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Are you saying screw Israel--protect our borders

Yes.

 

[CSM]

So much for free speech and open discussion, eh, csm.

There are other threads discussing other issues on this forum.

Debate is wrong? What is wrong with you?

How did you go from "debate based on artificially constructed and constrained scenarios" is wrong to "debate is wrong"????

As for free speech, I have not anywhere here posted anything infringing yours (or anyone elses) right to free speech nor suggested that anyone be barred fromn this discussion.

As for other threads and other issues, you are exactly correct. Perhaps what I should have said is that I would vote in your poll if there was an "equally important" category. The way you have phrased your poll is like asking someone "Which is more important to your personal health: treating infection or surgery for a gunshot wound"?

Since I seem to have upset your little applecart here, I will wirthdraw from this discussion.

 

[CSM]

Yes.

And there you you have the real impetus behind the poll.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

And there you you have the real impetus behind the poll.

It is the obvious impetus behind the poll. You're not really sherlock holmes on this one.

I believe we should put defending israel on a lower priority than closing the border, even if it means, NOT defending israel.