Creationists

[UltimateReality]

40 years of not just reading scriptures but studying them. I am merely asking you for scriptures that support an old earth view. Why were days of creation longer then the days of man ? How long do you believe man was on this planet ?

I believe God put Adam in the garden about 10,000 years ago.

Chronology of man according to the scriptures suggest 6,000 years, Why do you believe 10,000 years ?

Fossil evidence.

 

[Hollie]

I believe God put Adam in the garden about 10,000 years ago.

Chronology of man according to the scriptures suggest 6,000 years, Why do you believe 10,000 years ?

Fossil evidence.

How convenient that creationists will selectively cite fossil evidence when it can be manipulated to further creationist claims.

 

[UltimateReality]

Please provide scriptures that support your old earth beliefs. I will provide scriptures in this article that support my position.

Days or ages in Genesis 1

Read it. For the most part I side with Ross and I have never heard of him or read his works. So does that mean the Holy Spirit revealed it to me? And I am not even joking!!

Progressive creationism is built on assumptions not facts just like many scientific theories. What was the point of God handing down judgment on adam if things were already dying.

Let's take this logic one step further. Christ conquered death on the cross. I believe in him and confess that God has raised him from the dead. Yet, I will still die a physical death. "For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believeth in him shall not perish but have everlasting life. Yet Christians still perish physically. What on earth could John be talking about? Are you saying the Bible's definition of death is contradictory?

 

[Hollie]

Already been done several times with the reprint of Stephen Meyers scientific theory.

Refuted every time you post it.

It is currently the best explanation that an intelligent agent was the source of information in dna, and ultimately, the source for the micro machines that all had to be in place wholly functional for the contraption to work.

It is no explanation at all for the origin of the life of this "Creator" that you posit as the source of life on this planet.

Yes, it presents a proof that an intelligent agent is responsible based on present observations.

Using supermagicalism as "proof" of anything is an exercise in silliness.

 

[Hollie]

Read it. For the most part I side with Ross and I have never heard of him or read his works. So does that mean the Holy Spirit revealed it to me? And I am not even joking!!

Progressive creationism is built on assumptions not facts just like many scientific theories. What was the point of God handing down judgment on adam if things were already dying.

Let's take this logic one step further. Christ conquered death on the cross. I believe in him and confess that God has raised him from the dead. Yet, I will still die a physical death. "For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believeth in him shall not perish but have everlasting life. Yet Christians still perish physically. What on earth could John be talking about? Are you saying the Bible's definition of death is contradictory?

So much else within christianity is contradictory, why agonize over this detail?

 

[Jimmy_Jam]

I believe God put Adam in the garden about 10,000 years ago.

Chronology of man according to the scriptures suggest 6,000 years, Why do you believe 10,000 years ?

Fossil evidence.

How do you explain starlight from objects that are well beyond 10,000 light years away? I have seen a number of ideas presented by YE Creationists, but they are so far-fetched as to be devoid of the slighted bit of merit.

I've seen the Omphalos hypothesis that states that the Universe only appears old. Even many YE Creationists are uncomfortable with this one because it strongly suggests a deliberately deceptive Creator.

One of my favorites is the "c decay," which proposes that the speed of light was much, much faster at the time of creation, and has been slowing down exponentially since that time. I've got no words for that one.

Another work of fantasy is the "Anisotropic Synchrony Convention," which proposes that light travels at an infinite speed to Earth, but travels away from Earth at the recognized constant. This is the ultimate in "the Earth is the center of the Universe" thinking that plagued the Church in the Dark Ages, as this suggests that light travels away from Earth in all directions at one speed, but comes to Earth from everywhere else at infinite speeds.

 

[UltimateReality]

UR the scrptures say in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. When was that beginning ?

4.5 Billion years ago.

 

[UltimateReality]

Well, I didn't dig too deeply into the old thread, but if you're asking why we are so lucky, I guess I don't understand the question. The universe is simply too vast to know that we ARE totally unique. It seems rather arrogant to me to assume that, given that virtually incomprehensible vastness, that we are the only planet with life, whether one believes we are created by a higher power or not.

Incidentally, you appear to making an assumption that I am an atheist. That's understandable given the polarized nature of culture today. If somebody weighs in or makes an observation, it is natural these days for people to draw their lines and place that person on one side or the other, and the only two options, I'm guessing, would be Christian and atheist. My beliefs are irrelevant. Either we are seeing stars that are billions of light years away or we are not, and all considerations of spiritual beliefs are entirely out of the equation of whether or not that is true.

Evolutionary science, like ALL science, makes assumptions. You can't get by in life without assumptions. I walk out to my car every morning making an assumption that it is going to start. If we didn't make assumptions we would simply stagnate to inertia. My problem with fundamental religious belief is that it doesn't make assumptions, it makes extraordinary assertions. These assertions are sometimes, some would say often, contradicted by natural law. I can't help that. I accept the natural laws of my Creator on their own terms. To me it seems insulting to those laws to accept somebody's word for it that a human being resurrected from the dead when natural law would tell us that this is impossible. The burden of proof of such a thing rests with the person making the claim, and not with me or anybody else to disprove. This does not mean that I don't believe in a Creator, nor does it diminish my capacity to do so.

We are lucky to get the precision in nature that is observed and required for lifes survival. Don't you feel lucky if it all just happened by chance ?

Once again you make nonsensical comments about "precision in nature" yet you ignore how imprecise nature actually is.

How "precise" are tornadoes, earthquakes, tsunami, meteor impacts, etc?

Not as precise as circuit boards, spaceships, and internal combustion engines.

 

[Hollie]

We are lucky to get the precision in nature that is observed and required for lifes survival. Don't you feel lucky if it all just happened by chance ?

Once again you make nonsensical comments about "precision in nature" yet you ignore how imprecise nature actually is.

How "precise" are tornadoes, earthquakes, tsunami, meteor impacts, etc?

Not as precise as circuit boards, spaceships, and internal combustion engines.

The gods created the conditions that lend rise to tornadoes, earthquakes, tsunamis, meteor impacts, etc.... because they are gods of love and compassion.... or just incompetent designers.

 

[UltimateReality]

Refuted every time you post it.

It is no explanation at all for the origin of the life of this "Creator" that you posit as the source of life on this planet.

Yes, it presents a proof that an intelligent agent is responsible based on present observations.

Using supermagicalism as "proof" of anything is an exercise in silliness.

Tell that to Stephen Hawkins and his multiple universe theory. Tell that to all the Quantum physicists. Maybe you would have studied these instances if you had gone to college.

 

[UltimateReality]

Chronology of man according to the scriptures suggest 6,000 years, Why do you believe 10,000 years ?

Fossil evidence.

How do you explain starlight from objects that are well beyond 10,000 light years away?

Jimmy, you have failed to follow the points in the discussion between myself and YWC. My claim that God placed Adam in the garden 10,000 years ago makes no inference that was when the earth was created.

 

[Hollie]

Yes, it presents a proof that an intelligent agent is responsible based on present observations.

Using supermagicalism as "proof" of anything is an exercise in silliness.

Tell that to Stephen Hawkins and his multiple universe theory. Tell that to all the Quantum physicists. Maybe you would have studied these instances if you had gone to college.

Your goofy comment makes no sense.

 

[UltimateReality]

Once again you make nonsensical comments about "precision in nature" yet you ignore how imprecise nature actually is.

How "precise" are tornadoes, earthquakes, tsunami, meteor impacts, etc?

Not as precise as circuit boards, spaceships, and internal combustion engines.

The gods created the conditions that lend rise to tornadoes, earthquakes, tsunamis, meteor impacts, etc.... because they are gods of love and compassion.... or just incompetent designers.

I thought we already settled this point but you keep bringing it up. I hate to say it Hollie, but your posts reveal you might have some learning disabilities.

Christianity teaches that Hollie's god, Satan, is the god of this world and he is the master of chaos, responsible for decay and destruction we see, and is the father of lies. God created angels with a choice. He created us with a choice. Google dualism.

However, since you are a Darwinists, you don't have a choice. Your behavior is determined by your programed response to stimuli.

That and the fact you have never been formally educated.

 

[UltimateReality]

Using supermagicalism as "proof" of anything is an exercise in silliness.

Tell that to Stephen Hawkins and his multiple universe theory. Tell that to all the Quantum physicists. Maybe you would have studied these instances if you had gone to college.

Your goofy comment makes no sense.

Not to you because of your lack of education.

 

[Hollie]

Not as precise as circuit boards, spaceships, and internal combustion engines.

The gods created the conditions that lend rise to tornadoes, earthquakes, tsunamis, meteor impacts, etc.... because they are gods of love and compassion.... or just incompetent designers.

I thought we already settled this point but you keep bringing it up. I hate to say it Hollie, but your posts reveal you might have some learning disabilities.

Your god, Satan, is the god of this world and he is the master of chaos, responsible for decay and destruction we see, and is the father of lies. God created angels with a choice. He created us with a choice. Google dualism.

However, since you are a Darwinists, you don't have a choice. Your behavior is determined by your programed response to stimuli.

That and the fact you have never been formally educated.

As is typical of your posts, your comments are disjointed, confused and rambling.

If you had ever read the creation tale, it was your god who created Satan. You are very typical of the fundie crowd. You really know nothing of the creation tales and fables but nevertheless, build entire worldviews on fables you change and edit per a whim.

 

[Hollie]

Tell that to Stephen Hawkins and his multiple universe theory. Tell that to all the Quantum physicists. Maybe you would have studied these instances if you had gone to college.

Your goofy comment makes no sense.

Not to you because of your lack of education.

Oh you poor fundie. Are you finding that a degree from the ICR is not embraced by employers who snicker when they find your job skills are limited to....well... nothing

 

[UltimateReality]

Your goofy comment makes no sense.

Not to you because of your lack of education.

Oh you poor fundie. Are you finding that a degree from the ICR is not embraced by employers who snicker when they find your job skills are limited to....well... nothing

Better than your degree from Haran Yahya online university.

 

[Jimmy_Jam]

Fossil evidence.

How do you explain starlight from objects that are well beyond 10,000 light years away?

Jimmy, you have failed to follow the points in the discussion between myself and YWC. My claim that God placed Adam in the garden 10,000 years ago makes no inference that was when the earth was created.

This thread is far too enormous for me to spend that much time on it. So, your beliefs allow for a Universe that is potentially billions of year old? Okay then.

 

[Hollie]

Not to you because of your lack of education.

Oh you poor fundie. Are you finding that a degree from the ICR is not embraced by employers who snicker when they find your job skills are limited to....well... nothing

Better than your degree from Haran Yahya online university.

There is no such degree. I suppose you're furious that the ICR suffered a humiliating setback in their attempts to offer degree programs in Texas. Take a cue and phony-up your credentials as many fundies do. You're in appropriate company.

 

[ima]

Read it. For the most part I side with Ross and I have never heard of him or read his works. So does that mean the Holy Spirit revealed it to me? And I am not even joking!!

Progressive creationism is built on assumptions not facts just like many scientific theories. What was the point of God handing down judgment on adam if things were already dying.

Let's take this logic one step further. Christ conquered death on the cross. I believe in him and confess that God has raised him from the dead. Yet, I will still die a physical death. "For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believeth in him shall not perish but have everlasting life. Yet Christians still perish physically. What on earth could John be talking about? Are you saying the Bible's definition of death is contradictory?

Logic would say instead that there's no real proof that Jesus was on a cross. Or even existed.