Conservatives Beginning to Recognize Global Warming

[Gunny]

The Earth does go through natural changes...EXTREME natural changes. I learned in my Geology courses that North America extended roughly 100 miles along the East Coast during the last Ice Age.

The Earth cools, the Earth warms...naturally. The problem is that the Earth does not cool or warm at this rate. In the 1970's it was thought that the Earth was cooling (and cooling too quickly to be natural) and it was thought the result would be famine. Scientists blamed the problem on sulfur emissions. Environmental standars were increased, the sulfur emissions were patrolled, and the cooling problem disappeared as quickly as it arrived.

You mean it has not cooled nor warmed at the current rate in the recorded past, not that it cannot happen.

The truth is, no one REALLY knows what is causing global warming at present, but liberals are taking guesswork and stating it as fact and attempting to villify those that don't immediately fall in line with their theory.

If a REAL cause is found, and the evidence is verifiable by someone besides Al Gore or Jimmy Carter, THEN I'll be willing to listen. Until that time, my guess is as valid as yours, and actually is more logical.


If you do not know the topic, why post?

The fear is that the Gulf Stream will die out as a result of the warming. If the Gulf Stream dies, North America will heat up and Europe will freeze. The Gulf Stream moves up the Atlantic toward Greenland. Hence, we study Greenland.

But don't worry, Glaciers all over the world are being impacted and shrinking.

/

 

[CockySOB]

The fear is that the Gulf Stream will die out as a result of the warming. If the Gulf Stream dies, North America will heat up and Europe will freeze. The Gulf Stream moves up the Atlantic toward Greenland. Hence, we study Greenland.

You are aware that "The Day After Tommorrow" was NOT a documentary nor even a quality docu-drama, right? It was Hollywood out to make a buck, pure and simple.

Or should I assume that we have raptors running around because I saw "Jurassic Park" or that ghosts exist because I saw Patrick, Demi and Whoopee in the movie "Ghost?"

 

[Said1]

The Earth does go through natural changes...EXTREME natural changes. I learned in my Geology courses that North America extended roughly 100 miles along the East Coast during the last Ice Age.

The Earth cools, the Earth warms...naturally. The problem is that the Earth does not cool or warm at this rate.

What rate?

 

[Hobbit]

What rate?

He means the less than 1 degree its gone up in the past 70 years.

Oh, and all you need to know about "The Day After Tomorrow" is that it was based on a book written by Art Bell.

 

[Said1]

He means the less than 1 degree its gone up in the past 70 years.

Oh, and all you need to know about "The Day After Tomorrow" is that it was based on a book written by Art Bell.

I saw that on my BIL's big screen, good movie, albeit a bit off base. The shelf that broke, know as the Larson ice shelf actually broke before the movie was made. The ice or ice bergs, basically floated away and probably melted in various places, not causing any severe consequences, thus far (that was in 2002, newer data may suggest other wise). It's pretty small compaired to others. Nice special effects though.

Here's a good link, with pics and everything.

http://nsidc.org/iceshelves/larsenb2002/

 

[glockmail]

A link I picked up on the Drudge Report:

http://www.noaanews.noaa.gov/stories2006/s2700.htm

As you can see, Nevada experienced the warmest June-August period in the state's recorded history. Your subjective experience is great, but I am going to trust NOAA.

I've studied weather fluctuations in some of my work previously. What I've found is that a change in one degree in over 70 years can be explained by several factors:

1. Mathematically insignificant compared to the accuracy of the instruments used, and actual data recorded.
2. Change in measurement technology within the data range.
3. Urbanization of the area surrounding the measurement point.
4. Relocation of measurement points.

Therefore, to assume that the earth is warming based on this type of data is pure foolishness. One can only assume that there is some other agenda at work that The Left is unwilling to mention.

 

[glockmail]

Ice measures heat and precipitation the same way as tree rings. Years are represented by ice layers, and ice layers vary based on climate.

.....

I've read similar reports with a different conclusion: the earth has a record of temperature fluctuations. Period.

 

[glockmail]

Yesterday I picked up a copy of The Economist. Much to my surprise, the conservative magazine had put Global Warming on their cover. Yes, this is the same magazine that has denied Global Warming's existence.......
The Economist article emphasized that the problem will get solved. I think it is time for the Republicans to dump there 901st rule science so we can solve this before it has any kind of major impact on our lives.

As a conservative myself, I prefer to err on the side of caution. Especially since the decline in use of fossil fuels will deny our enemies (OPEC) resources. That is why I welcome your enthusiastic support of nuclear power.

 

[1549]

That's just out and out false. Prove me wrong.

-Blomstrandreen Glacier, Norway...nearly gone.
-Antarctic Peninsula...shrinking (Larsen B ice shelf all but gone)
-Jakobshavn Isbrae (Greenland's largest Glacier): doubled its melting rate between 1997 and 2003.
-Mt. Kilimanjaro, Tanzania...shrinking

The first three were mentioned in the aforementioned magazine article, the last I read elsewhere. A google search would probably yield plenty more examples as well.

If a REAL cause is found, and the evidence is verifiable by someone besides Al Gore or Jimmy Carter, THEN I'll be willing to listen. Until that time, my guess is as valid as yours, and actually is more logical.

901st rule science...look it up. It perfectly describes every Republican's stance on this issue.

You are aware that "The Day After Tommorrow" was NOT a documentary nor even a quality docu-drama, right? It was Hollywood out to make a buck, pure and simple.

Nice joke, but the accepted theory you just criticized is not the one described in the movie. In the movie, both America and Europe froze. In reality, Europe would freeze and North America would heat up.

I've studied weather fluctuations in some of my work previously. What I've found is that a change in one degree in over 70 years can be explained by several factors:

1. Mathematically insignificant compared to the accuracy of the instruments used, and actual data recorded.
2. Change in measurement technology within the data range.
3. Urbanization of the area surrounding the measurement point.
4. Relocation of measurement points.

Therefore, to assume that the earth is warming based on this type of data is pure foolishness. One can only assume that there is some other agenda at work that The Left is unwilling to mention.

Global warming would not necessarily be represented by major differences in Global temperature.

-The Earth attempts to maintain equilibrium. When one part heats, another cools. Thus, you should never see even a major change in global temperature--mostly just local temps.
-A small increase in temperature can have a profound affect. We are seeing the physical evidence of the small change that you want to excuse. Sea level is rising, glaciers are melting.

 

[007]

The GD made her run at Tahoe...was snowing 3" snow on the ground...she finished top 10...22 minutes for the 3.5 mile run...hoo rah!

That's some damn good runnin' for 6,000 feet! Tell the GD Pale Rider say's SHIT HOT GIRL!

And arch isn't lying. It snowed here the other day. There's snow on the mountain tops. Ought to make for some beautiful riding for Street Vibrations.

 

[Hobbit]

-Blomstrandreen Glacier, Norway...nearly gone.
-Antarctic Peninsula...shrinking (Larsen B ice shelf all but gone)
-Jakobshavn Isbrae (Greenland's largest Glacier): doubled its melting rate between 1997 and 2003.
-Mt. Kilimanjaro, Tanzania...shrinking

I did do a Google search, and I've found that most Norwegian glaciers are growing at an alarming pace. I've also found that glaciers sometimes shrink because they, uh, MOVE. The funniest thing is that I've also found dozens of sights claiming shrinking glaciers are definitive proof of global warming. I've also found dozens of sights claiming that growing glaciers are definitive proof of global warming. I've found sites calling falling temperatures, rising temperatures, rainfall, snowfall, hailfall, sleetfall, tidal activities, and every kind of weather pattern imaginable as definitive proof of global warming.

Having seen all this research, I have reached the conclusion that global warming is nothing but a politically correct term for 'summer.'

 

[Dr Grump]

Having seen all this research, I have reached the conclusion that global warming is nothing but a politically correct term for 'summer.'

The VAST majority of scientists disagree with you. Let's see.....hhhhmmmmm....Scientists or Hobbit googling? Scientists or Hobbit googling? Scientists or Hobbit googling?...hhhhmmmm..it's a hard one!

 

[Hobbit]

The VAST majority of scientists disagree with you. Let's see.....hhhhmmmmm....Scientists or Hobbit googling? Scientists or Hobbit googling? Scientists or Hobbit googling?...hhhhmmmm..it's a hard one!

Actually, there's a huge petition going around to prove that most scientists actually don't buy the idea. The idea that most scientists believe in global warming is a myth.

 

[Hobbit]

And here is a link to that petition. It blows the hell out of the one supporting global warming. This petition has over 17,000 signatures, 2100 of whom are well-qualified (at least one Ph.D.) physicists, geophysicists, climatologists, and meteorologists. The petition supporting the global warming theory only has 2800 signatures, and only one of those is a climatologist.

http://www.oism.org/pproject/

 

[Stephanie]

Up here in Northern Alaska, we're hoping for global warming too hurry up....

Whoo hoo, no more 50 below zero.....

Good friggen grief......
I'm sure the sky will stay up above me for many, many yrs.....

 

[jillian]

Oh yeah.... let the environment go to hell so Steffie can have better weather... ooh baby! :cof:

Is Global Warming Killing the Polar Bears?

By JIM CARLTON
Staff Reporter of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL
December 14, 2005

It may be the latest evidence of global warming: Polar bears are drowning.

Scientists for the first time have documented multiple deaths of polar bears off Alaska, where they likely drowned after swimming long distances in the ocean amid the melting of the Arctic ice shelf. The bears spend most of their time hunting and raising their young on ice floes.

In a quarter-century of aerial surveys of the Alaskan coastline before 2004, researchers from the U.S. Minerals Management Service said they typically spotted a lone polar bear swimming in the ocean far from ice about once every two years. Polar-bear drownings were so rare that they have never been documented in the surveys.

But in September 2004, when the polar ice cap had retreated a record 160 miles north of the northern coast of Alaska, researchers counted 10 polar bears swimming as far as 60 miles offshore. Polar bears can swim long distances but have evolved to mainly swim between sheets of ice, scientists say.

Polar bears in Alaska face melting ice floes.
The researchers returned to the vicinity a few days after a fierce storm and found four dead bears floating in the water. "Extrapolation of survey data suggests that on the order of 40 bears may have been swimming and that many of those probably drowned as a result of rough seas caused by high winds," the researchers say in a report set to be released today.

While the government researchers won't speculate on why a climate change is taking place in the Arctic, environmentalists unconnected to the survey say U.S. policies emphasizing oil and gas development are exacerbating global warming, which is accelerating the melting of the ice. "For anyone who has wondered how global warming and reduced sea ice will affect polar bears, the answer is simple -- they die," said Richard Steiner, a marine-biology professor at the University of Alaska.

The environmental group Greenpeace began airing a 30-second commercial yesterday in New York, Los Angeles, Atlanta and other cities showing an animated adult polar bear and a cub on a cracking ice floe. The two bears, nowhere near land, slip underneath the water. "Polar bears may soon be extinct because of global warming," the voice-over states. It ends with "Global Warming: It's the Real Thing," a takeoff of a Coca-Cola Co. commercial featuring polar bears.

Some experts say that climate change may indeed be shrinking the ice pack, but they dispute that emissions are the main culprit or that significantly cutting greenhouse gases would really make a difference. "Whether humans are responsible for some, most, or all of the current warming trend in the Arctic, there is no proposal on the table that would actually prevent continued warming or reverse present trends," said Sterling Burnett, a senior fellow at the National Center for Policy Analysis, a nongovernment organization based in Dallas. "The question is how to adapt to future changes in climate, regardless of the direction or the cause."

In addition to documenting polar-bear deaths, the Minerals Management Service researchers, Chuck Monnett, Jeffrey Gleason and Lisa Rotterman, also found a striking shift in the bears' habits. From 1979 to 1991, 87% of the bears spotted were found mostly on sea ice. From 1992 to 2004, the percentage dropped to 33%. Most of the remaining bears have been found either in the ocean or on beaches, congregating around carcasses of whales butchered by hunters. In the past, polar bears were rarely seen at such kill sites, because they spent their time hunting their favorite meal -- seals -- on sea ice.

A Greenpeace commercial parodies a Coke ad.
Marine experts consider the findings -- to be presented at a marine-mammal conference this week in San Diego -- an ominous sign. Some have warned for years that a rapid thawing of the Arctic from global warming could endanger species like the polar bear. Already, a warmer Alaska over the past half-century has been linked to increased erosion of rivers and streams, insect infestations and the undermining of pipelines and roads as the permafrost thaws.

Alarmed by the swift changes, the Alaska Inter-Tribal Council, a consortium of the state's tribes, earlier this month passed a resolution urging that the U.S. government enact a mandatory program to reduce global warming.

Some scientists predict polar bears could become extinct within the next century because they have adapted over the millennia to only hunting on ice. If they try to swim in disappearing ice conditions to catch seals, more are likely to tire and drown, scientists say. Polar bears that stay onshore aren't adapted to hunting land animals like caribou, which are preyed upon by more-aggressive grizzly bears. Polar bears also require more fat intake than most food on land offers them, experts say.

"As the sea ice goes, that will direct to a very great extent what happens to polar bears," said Steven Amstrup, a polar-bear specialist with the U.S. Geological Survey in Anchorage, Alaska.

Another study set to be released at the marine-mammal conference shows what might happen to the Alaskan polar bears over time. Researchers from the USGS, the University of Wyoming and the Canadian Wildlife Service found that the population of polar bears in Canada's western Hudson Bay -- near the southernmost habitat for the bears in the world -- fell to 935 in 2004 from 1,194 in 1987, a 22% drop. Researchers said the decline -- the first recorded for these bears -- came in tandem with an extension by nearly a full month in the time it takes for Hudson Bay to ice over after the summer.

"Our findings may foreshadow how more northerly populations will respond to projected warming in the Arctic ecosystem," wrote Mr. Amstrup, a co-author of the report.

Previous studies by the U.S. and Canadian governments support a link between the decline in sea ice in the Arctic and the ways polar bears try to adapt to their surroundings. For example, researchers say polar bears in the Beaufort Sea off Alaska and Canada used to spend most of their lives jumping from ice floe to ice floe in pursuit of seals. Only pregnant bears would occasionally wander onto the mainland, in search of a den.

But weekly aerial surveys by the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service show that, over the past five years, an unusually large number of bears have congregated along the beaches. Between the coastal town of Barrow, Alaska and the Canadian border, about 300 miles east, researchers counted as many as 200 bears on land, said Scott Schliebe, director of the Fish and Wildlife's polar-bear project. Many bears could be seen gathered around whale carcasses near villages like Kaktovik, which lies in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge where the Bush administration is pushing for drilling.

Scientists measured the distances from where the bears were gathered to the nearest ice sheets at sea and found this correlation: The farther the ice was from shore, the larger the number of bears were found on land.

Scientists estimate there are 20,000 to 25,000 polar bears world-wide, including about 2,000 that frequent the Beaufort Sea off Alaska. The latest population study by federal officials, in 1997, suggested the Alaskan bear population wasn't endangered. An update is expected by the end of next year.

http://online.wsj.com/public/articl...905-vnekw47PQGtDyf3iv5XEN71_o5I_20061214.html

 

[Nuc]

Up here in Northern Alaska, we're hoping for global warming too hurry up....

Whoo hoo, no more 50 below zero.....

Good friggen grief......
I'm sure the sky will stay up above me for many, many yrs.....

Laugh all you want, but you're not going to like it when the permafrost melts and you are inundated with plagues of mosquitos.

Global warming is a fact. I really wonder about what the motivation is for people to deny it, other than some perceived economic benefit.

 

[glockmail]

-..... Sea level is rising, glaciers are melting.

I notice you artfully ignored the issue brought up it my post 28, as you know it provides us conservatives with a slam-dunk answer to your global warming paranoia. Why don't you simply admit your true agenda? Then we can have an interesting conversation about that, instead of this made-up issue.

 

[Gunny]

Laugh all you want, but you're not going to like it when the permafrost melts and you are inundated with plagues of mosquitos.

Global warming is a fact. I really wonder about what the motivation is for people to deny it, other than some perceived economic benefit.

I don't see the denial. As stated earlier, what I see is one side of the political spectrum embracing this theory and that theory in attempts to justify a man-made shift in climate.

Believing the Earth is in fact warming and buying off on the above unsupported crapola are two different things.

 

[archangel]

That's some damn good runnin' for 6,000 feet! Tell the GD Pale Rider say's SHIT HOT GIRL!

And arch isn't lying. It snowed here the other day. There's snow on the mountain tops. Ought to make for some beautiful riding for Street Vibrations.

I told her...she said to tell you Thanks! and said she would have done better if she had brought some 'snow shoes'...lol also she told me to tell you that if it snows during 'SV' you had better borrow a 'dirt bike' said they do much better than 'fat boys' in the snow!