toomuchtime_
Gold Member
- Dec 29, 2008
- 22,094
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In fact, you are close to nothing because you seem to have no understanding why Clinton lost the election.
Conservatives and Liberals: A little more civility please
- Thread starter bill718
- Start date
deltex1
Gold Member
It's not a technicality, Mona...it's the constitution.You mean the Trump landslide?Conservatives and Liberals: The election is over. I think both sides need to stop inflaming this situation. Democrats need to stop the protests, show business tours, and accept the results of the election. Republicans need to stop the name calling, trash talking and other "in your face" behavior. I know it's too much to ask for American voters to behave like civilized people, but hope springs eternal.
Both Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton displayed good manners and respect in their speeches immediately after the election. Maybe American voters should do the same.
Well the display of 'good manners' ended after election night. Didn't you hear? Trump totally won the popular vote and he didn't scapegoat brown people at all for his over 2 million vote loss.
Civility, sure. Who doesn't want that? However this place is poison and it's never going to happen at USMB.
There's no such thing. He won the election on a technicality, just like Bush the first time.
HappyJoy
Platinum Member
- Apr 15, 2015
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She lost the election mostly because of the electoral college. I mean, if you want to look at in who got the most votes.
Other than that you have a lot of anger in white communities who feel they've been ignored, specifically in the rust belt and they wanted change. It was a relatively low voter turnout presidential election and that's a shame.
HenryBHough
Diamond Member
The election was over in 2008, too.
Now conservatives are exhibiting the same civility practiced by liberals at that time.
Suck it up buttercups!
What does around doesn't just come around. it HAS come around and you need to get used to it.
Now conservatives are exhibiting the same civility practiced by liberals at that time.
Suck it up buttercups!
What does around doesn't just come around. it HAS come around and you need to get used to it.
Yet it was Ok when Obama played the super delagates game better than Hillary did in 2008.
Trump played the game better than Hillary did in 2016 so now its get rid of the E.C. Go for it and see how hard it it to get amendments added.
There is a reason for that too.
Papageorgio
The Ultimate Winner
You mean the Trump landslide?Conservatives and Liberals: The election is over. I think both sides need to stop inflaming this situation. Democrats need to stop the protests, show business tours, and accept the results of the election. Republicans need to stop the name calling, trash talking and other "in your face" behavior. I know it's too much to ask for American voters to behave like civilized people, but hope springs eternal.
Both Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton displayed good manners and respect in their speeches immediately after the election. Maybe American voters should do the same.
Well the display of 'good manners' ended after election night. Didn't you hear? Trump totally won the popular vote and he didn't scapegoat brown people at all for his over 2 million vote loss.
Civility, sure. Who doesn't want that? However this place is poison and it's never going to happen at USMB.
There's no such thing. He won the election on a technicality, just like Bush the first time.
Technicality? The Electoral College is not a technicality, it is how every President has been elected. It is that kind of dishonesty that creates the division.
Soggy in NOLA
Diamond Member
- Jul 31, 2009
- 40,565
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- 1,830
It's not a technicality, Mona...it's the constitution.You mean the Trump landslide?Conservatives and Liberals: The election is over. I think both sides need to stop inflaming this situation. Democrats need to stop the protests, show business tours, and accept the results of the election. Republicans need to stop the name calling, trash talking and other "in your face" behavior. I know it's too much to ask for American voters to behave like civilized people, but hope springs eternal.
Both Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton displayed good manners and respect in their speeches immediately after the election. Maybe American voters should do the same.
Well the display of 'good manners' ended after election night. Didn't you hear? Trump totally won the popular vote and he didn't scapegoat brown people at all for his over 2 million vote loss.
Civility, sure. Who doesn't want that? However this place is poison and it's never going to happen at USMB.
There's no such thing. He won the election on a technicality, just like Bush the first time.
Yeah, darn that Article 2!!!
HappyJoy
Platinum Member
- Apr 15, 2015
- 32,056
- 5,942
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- Banned
- #228
It's not a technicality, Mona...it's the constitution.You mean the Trump landslide?Conservatives and Liberals: The election is over. I think both sides need to stop inflaming this situation. Democrats need to stop the protests, show business tours, and accept the results of the election. Republicans need to stop the name calling, trash talking and other "in your face" behavior. I know it's too much to ask for American voters to behave like civilized people, but hope springs eternal.
Both Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton displayed good manners and respect in their speeches immediately after the election. Maybe American voters should do the same.
Well the display of 'good manners' ended after election night. Didn't you hear? Trump totally won the popular vote and he didn't scapegoat brown people at all for his over 2 million vote loss.
Civility, sure. Who doesn't want that? However this place is poison and it's never going to happen at USMB.
There's no such thing. He won the election on a technicality, just like Bush the first time.
Yes, it's in the Constitution and I'm not saying Trump didn't win. I'm saying it's time to end the EC. It's two different things.
HappyJoy
Platinum Member
- Apr 15, 2015
- 32,056
- 5,942
- 1,140
- Banned
- #229
You mean the Trump landslide?Conservatives and Liberals: The election is over. I think both sides need to stop inflaming this situation. Democrats need to stop the protests, show business tours, and accept the results of the election. Republicans need to stop the name calling, trash talking and other "in your face" behavior. I know it's too much to ask for American voters to behave like civilized people, but hope springs eternal.
Both Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton displayed good manners and respect in their speeches immediately after the election. Maybe American voters should do the same.
Well the display of 'good manners' ended after election night. Didn't you hear? Trump totally won the popular vote and he didn't scapegoat brown people at all for his over 2 million vote loss.
Civility, sure. Who doesn't want that? However this place is poison and it's never going to happen at USMB.
There's no such thing. He won the election on a technicality, just like Bush the first time.
Technicality? The Electoral College is not a technicality, it is how every President has been elected. It is that kind of dishonesty that creates the division.
No, this doesn't create any division, I'm not saying Trump isn't going to be president.
Soggy in NOLA
Diamond Member
- Jul 31, 2009
- 40,565
- 5,360
- 1,830
It's not a technicality, Mona...it's the constitution.You mean the Trump landslide?Conservatives and Liberals: The election is over. I think both sides need to stop inflaming this situation. Democrats need to stop the protests, show business tours, and accept the results of the election. Republicans need to stop the name calling, trash talking and other "in your face" behavior. I know it's too much to ask for American voters to behave like civilized people, but hope springs eternal.
Both Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton displayed good manners and respect in their speeches immediately after the election. Maybe American voters should do the same.
Well the display of 'good manners' ended after election night. Didn't you hear? Trump totally won the popular vote and he didn't scapegoat brown people at all for his over 2 million vote loss.
Civility, sure. Who doesn't want that? However this place is poison and it's never going to happen at USMB.
There's no such thing. He won the election on a technicality, just like Bush the first time.
Yes, it's in the Constitution and I'm not saying Trump didn't win. I'm saying it's time to end the EC. It's two different things.
It isn't going away... it is there for a reason and it works well. There is no way in hell you're going to get a majority of the states to amend the constitution over this.
Papageorgio
The Ultimate Winner
You mean the Trump landslide?Conservatives and Liberals: The election is over. I think both sides need to stop inflaming this situation. Democrats need to stop the protests, show business tours, and accept the results of the election. Republicans need to stop the name calling, trash talking and other "in your face" behavior. I know it's too much to ask for American voters to behave like civilized people, but hope springs eternal.
Both Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton displayed good manners and respect in their speeches immediately after the election. Maybe American voters should do the same.
Well the display of 'good manners' ended after election night. Didn't you hear? Trump totally won the popular vote and he didn't scapegoat brown people at all for his over 2 million vote loss.
Civility, sure. Who doesn't want that? However this place is poison and it's never going to happen at USMB.
There's no such thing. He won the election on a technicality, just like Bush the first time.
Technicality? The Electoral College is not a technicality, it is how every President has been elected. It is that kind of dishonesty that creates the division.
No, this doesn't create any division, I'm not saying Trump isn't going to be president.
You are intentionally trying to cheapen his victory by calling it a technicality and you know it and that is why you are being dishonest. Now you are pretending to take the high road, only idiots wouldn't realize what you are doing.
Soggy in NOLA
Diamond Member
- Jul 31, 2009
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It is explained quite elegantly in the Federalist Papers.
EverCurious
Gold Member
End American Colonialism
"But Alaska is no less a colony than were those thirteen colonies along the Atlantic seaboard in 1775. The colonialism which the United States imposes on us and which we have suffered for 88 years, is no less burdensome, no less unjust, than that against which they poured out their blood and treasure. And while most Alaskans know that full well, we repeat:
"To prove this let the facts be submitted to a candid world."
To begin at the beginning, the Treaty of Cession by which Alaska was annexed, contained a solemn and specific commitment:
"The inhabitants of the ceded territory ... shall be admitted to the enjoyment of all the rights, advantages and immunities of citizens of the United States. . . "
That was the pledge. The United States has not kept that pledge. Yet a treaty is the highest law of the land. And it is made in the clear view of all mankind.
The United States has broken that pledge for 88 years. It has not admitted the inhabitants of Alaska to the enjoyment of "all the rights, advantages and immunities of citizens of the United States.
"All the rights, advantages and immunities of citizens of the United States" would entitle us to vote for President and Vice-President, to representation in the Congress by two Senators and a Representative with a vote, and would free us from the restrictions imposed by the Organic Act of 1912, and the Act of Congress of July 30, 1886. Obviously we have neither the vote, nor the representation, nor the freedom from restrictions.
We suffer taxation without representation, which is no less "tyranny" in 1955 than it was in 1775. Actually it is much worse in 1955 than in 1775 because the idea that it was "tyranny" was then new. Since the Revolutionaries abolished it for the states a century and three-quarters ago, it has become a national synonym for something repulsive and intolerable.
We are subject to military service for the nation--a privilege and obligation we accept gladly--yet we have not voice in the making and ending of the wars into which our young men are drafted. In this respect we are worse off than our colonial forefathers. King George III did not impose conscription upon them. They were not drafted to fight for the mother country. Therefore there was no revolutionary slogan "no conscription without representation." But it is a valid slogan for Alaskans today.
The treaty obligation of 1867 is an obligation to grant us the full equality of statehood, for which Alaskans did not press in the first 80 years of their subordination, but which now, overdue, they demand as their right.
But that is only a small part of the evidence of our colonialism under the American flag. Let us submit more facts to a candid world.
First, let us ask, what is a colony? And let us answer that question.
A colony has been defined in a standard college text-book by a Columbia University professor as "a geographic area held for political, strategic and economic advantage."
That, as the facts will show, is precisely what the Territory of Alaska is--"a geographic area held for political, strategic and economic advantage." The maintenance and exploitation of those political, strategic and economic advantages by the holding power is colonialism.
The United States is that holding power.
Inherent in colonialism is an inferior political status.
Inherent in colonialism is an inferior economic status.
The inferior economic status is a consequence of the inferior political status.
The inferior economic status results from discriminatory laws and practices imposed upon the colonials through the superior political strength of the colonial power in the interest of its own non-colonial citizens.
The economic disadvantages of Alaskans which in consequence of such laws and practices redound to the advantage of others living in the states who prosper at the expense of Alaskans--these are the hall-marks of colonialism....
- http://www.asdk12.org/staff/miller_roger/pages/Alaska_Studies/Constitution/Let Us Now End American Colonialism excerpts.pdf
Alaska State Constitution, Article XV section 24:
"Ordinance No. 3 outlawed the use of fish traps in commercial salmon fishing. This issue had special significance in territorial Alaska. Fish traps, usually operated by Outside-owned canneries and widely blamed for the near-collapse of the salmon fishery, were seen as a symbol of exploitation of Alaska by absentee commercial interests. Former territorial Governor Ernest Gruening alluded to the issue in his keynote address to the convention:
The people of Alaska have repeatedly and unchangingly manifested their overwhelming opposition to fish traps. But fish trap beneficiaries, residents of the mother country, want to retain their Alaska traps. So the traps are retained. And it is the power and authority of the federal government which retains them. In a clear-cut issue between the few, profiting, non-colonial Americans and the many, seriously damaged, colonial Alaskans, the state-side interest wins hands down.
Ordinance No. 3 passed by 21,285 – 4,004."
"But Alaska is no less a colony than were those thirteen colonies along the Atlantic seaboard in 1775. The colonialism which the United States imposes on us and which we have suffered for 88 years, is no less burdensome, no less unjust, than that against which they poured out their blood and treasure. And while most Alaskans know that full well, we repeat:
"To prove this let the facts be submitted to a candid world."
To begin at the beginning, the Treaty of Cession by which Alaska was annexed, contained a solemn and specific commitment:
"The inhabitants of the ceded territory ... shall be admitted to the enjoyment of all the rights, advantages and immunities of citizens of the United States. . . "
That was the pledge. The United States has not kept that pledge. Yet a treaty is the highest law of the land. And it is made in the clear view of all mankind.
The United States has broken that pledge for 88 years. It has not admitted the inhabitants of Alaska to the enjoyment of "all the rights, advantages and immunities of citizens of the United States.
"All the rights, advantages and immunities of citizens of the United States" would entitle us to vote for President and Vice-President, to representation in the Congress by two Senators and a Representative with a vote, and would free us from the restrictions imposed by the Organic Act of 1912, and the Act of Congress of July 30, 1886. Obviously we have neither the vote, nor the representation, nor the freedom from restrictions.
We suffer taxation without representation, which is no less "tyranny" in 1955 than it was in 1775. Actually it is much worse in 1955 than in 1775 because the idea that it was "tyranny" was then new. Since the Revolutionaries abolished it for the states a century and three-quarters ago, it has become a national synonym for something repulsive and intolerable.
We are subject to military service for the nation--a privilege and obligation we accept gladly--yet we have not voice in the making and ending of the wars into which our young men are drafted. In this respect we are worse off than our colonial forefathers. King George III did not impose conscription upon them. They were not drafted to fight for the mother country. Therefore there was no revolutionary slogan "no conscription without representation." But it is a valid slogan for Alaskans today.
The treaty obligation of 1867 is an obligation to grant us the full equality of statehood, for which Alaskans did not press in the first 80 years of their subordination, but which now, overdue, they demand as their right.
But that is only a small part of the evidence of our colonialism under the American flag. Let us submit more facts to a candid world.
First, let us ask, what is a colony? And let us answer that question.
A colony has been defined in a standard college text-book by a Columbia University professor as "a geographic area held for political, strategic and economic advantage."
That, as the facts will show, is precisely what the Territory of Alaska is--"a geographic area held for political, strategic and economic advantage." The maintenance and exploitation of those political, strategic and economic advantages by the holding power is colonialism.
The United States is that holding power.
Inherent in colonialism is an inferior political status.
Inherent in colonialism is an inferior economic status.
The inferior economic status is a consequence of the inferior political status.
The inferior economic status results from discriminatory laws and practices imposed upon the colonials through the superior political strength of the colonial power in the interest of its own non-colonial citizens.
The economic disadvantages of Alaskans which in consequence of such laws and practices redound to the advantage of others living in the states who prosper at the expense of Alaskans--these are the hall-marks of colonialism....
- http://www.asdk12.org/staff/miller_roger/pages/Alaska_Studies/Constitution/Let Us Now End American Colonialism excerpts.pdf
Alaska State Constitution, Article XV section 24:
"Ordinance No. 3 outlawed the use of fish traps in commercial salmon fishing. This issue had special significance in territorial Alaska. Fish traps, usually operated by Outside-owned canneries and widely blamed for the near-collapse of the salmon fishery, were seen as a symbol of exploitation of Alaska by absentee commercial interests. Former territorial Governor Ernest Gruening alluded to the issue in his keynote address to the convention:
The people of Alaska have repeatedly and unchangingly manifested their overwhelming opposition to fish traps. But fish trap beneficiaries, residents of the mother country, want to retain their Alaska traps. So the traps are retained. And it is the power and authority of the federal government which retains them. In a clear-cut issue between the few, profiting, non-colonial Americans and the many, seriously damaged, colonial Alaskans, the state-side interest wins hands down.
Ordinance No. 3 passed by 21,285 – 4,004."
TyroneSlothrop
Diamond Member
- Banned
- #238
Soggy in NOLA
Diamond Member
- Jul 31, 2009
- 40,565
- 5,360
- 1,830
I don't have a favorite part. I'm sure if you Google it, you can find it and read it.
But I know you won't.
deltex1
Gold Member
You have one point I'll admit. The vast majority of morons voted for Hillary....too bad they were all concentrated in ny and Ca...
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