Cons say the government doesn't create jobs....

[rightwinger]

2014
2,663 Executive branch civilians (thousands)
1,459 Uniformed military personnel (thousands)
63 Legislative and judicial branch personnel (thousands)

4,185 Total Federal personnel (thousands)

(SOURCE: Total Government Employment Since 1962 )

Something to think about:
How many IRS employees are there?
about 93,337.
According to the IRS 2009 Data Book, IRS workforce counts up 93,337 employees 91,082 of which being full-time permanent.​

Divide that into 50 states is about 1821 IRS employee's per state
(SOURCE: Number of IRS Employees Number Of How Many )

That is a lot of payroll just to TAKE YOUR MONEY FROM YOU!

1821 employees to handle the tax returns for millions of people does not seem that much. How long do you want to wait for your return?

Most of the work is done by computers, dumbass. Most people don't even file a paper return these days.

No shit fingerboy

93,000 employees for all of the personal, business and corporate returns for a country of 330 million is damned efficient, wouldn't you say?

 

[daws101]

2014
2,663 Executive branch civilians (thousands)
1,459 Uniformed military personnel (thousands)
63 Legislative and judicial branch personnel (thousands)

4,185 Total Federal personnel (thousands)

(SOURCE: Total Government Employment Since 1962 )

Something to think about:
How many IRS employees are there?
about 93,337.
According to the IRS 2009 Data Book, IRS workforce counts up 93,337 employees 91,082 of which being full-time permanent.​

Divide that into 50 states is about 1821 IRS employee's per state
(SOURCE: Number of IRS Employees Number Of How Many )

That is a lot of payroll just to TAKE YOUR MONEY FROM YOU!

1821 employees to handle the tax returns for millions of people does not seem that much. How long do you want to wait for your return?

Most of the work is done by computers, dumbass. Most people don't even file a paper return these days.

right it not automatic and you still have to wait.
electronic filing has to be checked too.

 

[bripat9643]

2014
2,663 Executive branch civilians (thousands)
1,459 Uniformed military personnel (thousands)
63 Legislative and judicial branch personnel (thousands)

4,185 Total Federal personnel (thousands)

(SOURCE: Total Government Employment Since 1962 )

Something to think about:
How many IRS employees are there?
about 93,337.
According to the IRS 2009 Data Book, IRS workforce counts up 93,337 employees 91,082 of which being full-time permanent.​

Divide that into 50 states is about 1821 IRS employee's per state
(SOURCE: Number of IRS Employees Number Of How Many )

That is a lot of payroll just to TAKE YOUR MONEY FROM YOU!

1821 employees to handle the tax returns for millions of people does not seem that much. How long do you want to wait for your return?

Most of the work is done by computers, dumbass. Most people don't even file a paper return these days.

No shit fingerboy

93,000 employees for all of the personal, business and corporate returns for a country of 330 million is damned efficient, wouldn't you say?

The last thing this country needs is an efficient IRS.

 

[rightwinger]

2014
2,663 Executive branch civilians (thousands)
1,459 Uniformed military personnel (thousands)
63 Legislative and judicial branch personnel (thousands)

4,185 Total Federal personnel (thousands)

(SOURCE: Total Government Employment Since 1962 )

Something to think about:
How many IRS employees are there?
about 93,337.
According to the IRS 2009 Data Book, IRS workforce counts up 93,337 employees 91,082 of which being full-time permanent.​

Divide that into 50 states is about 1821 IRS employee's per state
(SOURCE: Number of IRS Employees Number Of How Many )

That is a lot of payroll just to TAKE YOUR MONEY FROM YOU!

1821 employees to handle the tax returns for millions of people does not seem that much. How long do you want to wait for your return?

Most of the work is done by computers, dumbass. Most people don't even file a paper return these days.

No shit fingerboy

93,000 employees for all of the personal, business and corporate returns for a country of 330 million is damned efficient, wouldn't you say?

The last thing this country needs is an efficient IRS.

Stops more people from cheating
Less you and I have to pay

 

[Fishlore]

...Cons say Obama doesn't deserve credit for cutting unemployment in have, because the government can't create jobs.

But now Jeb Bush is promising to create 19 million jobs. And Trump is promising to create the most jobs of any previous POTUS.

Hypocrisy IS the GOP.

The Republican palaver about "jobs, jobs, jobs" is a deflection. The issue isn't jobs; after all, under slavery everyone had a job. The real issue is quality of life, or as the Founders put it, the pursuit of happiness. That pursuit, is right up there with life and liberty as the explicitly stated mission of the government.

Small government can't accomplish the mission of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. It couldn't in the 18th century, when nobody thought small government was a good idea, and small government is even less able to accomplish the mission in today's technological, global economy. Forget about "small government," it's not a real idea.

Enabling the fantasy of "small government" is the naive delusion that government activity and corporate activity are separated in distinct public and private sectors. A nation's economy is not a Leggo style conglomeration of distinct components. An economy is a circulatory system, like that of blood in the body or electricity in a wiring diagram. Everything in an economy is connected to everything else. That includes government. Rewarding employment is not the responsibility of a "sector" of the economy such as industry or government, it is the job of the economy created as a whole by the government.

"Whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it." The people are responsible for the government; the government is responsible for the economy. Don't worry about "jobs, jobs, jobs" that is too trivial an issue. Think "Mission Statement," life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

 

[Flipper]

...Cons say Obama doesn't deserve credit for cutting unemployment in have, because the government can't create jobs.

But now Jeb Bush is promising to create 19 million jobs. And Trump is promising to create the most jobs of any previous POTUS.

Hypocrisy IS the GOP.

The Republican palaver about "jobs, jobs, jobs" is a deflection. The issue isn't jobs; after all, under slavery everyone had a job. The real issue is quality of life, or as the Founders put it, the pursuit of happiness. That pursuit, is right up there with life and liberty as the explicitly stated mission of the government.

Small government can't accomplish the mission of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. It couldn't in the 18th century, when nobody thought small government was a good idea, and small government is even less able to accomplish the mission in today's technological, global economy. Forget about "small government," it's not a real idea.

Enabling the fantasy of "small government" is the naive delusion that government activity and corporate activity are separated in distinct public and private sectors. A nation's economy is not a Leggo style conglomeration of distinct components. An economy is a circulatory system, like that of blood in the body or electricity in a wiring diagram. Everything in an economy is connected to everything else. That includes government. Rewarding employment is not the responsibility of a "sector" of the economy such as industry or government, it is the job of the economy created as a whole by the government.

"Whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it." The people are responsible for the government; the government is responsible for the economy. Don't worry about "jobs, jobs, jobs" that is too trivial an issue. Think "Mission Statement," life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

"Rewarding employment is not the responsibility of a "sector" of the economy such as industry or government, it is the job of the economy created as a whole by the government."

Too funny

The Gov creates no economy bejeeeesus.

 

[Flipper]

What they mean is to create an environment where private businesses can create jobs. Like reducing taxes, giving tax incentives, cutting regulations, and basically getting the goverent out if the way.

as usual a con post complete bull poo.

GW cut taxes by 1.7 trillion and the economy proceeded to loose 8 million jobs.
by 2004 the JOB LOSS was a major campaign issue.

Bill Clinton raised taxes and has the record for job creation.

Another ignorant Right wing smacked down. My job is done here.

Says a guy who lives in a State that is going broke

 

[kazvorpal]

The Government creates millions of jobs

2 million federal employees, state and local employees, policemen, firemen, teachers....

The entire defense industry is created by the governement

I know that people have been trying to explain this to the victims of socialized education for 63 pages now, but I'll give it a shot:

Government does not add jobs to the economy. Each job it "creates" consumes somewhat more than one private sector job. So the more jobs government "creates", the more unemployment we have. This is why Sweden had double digit unemployment during its "lost decade" of heavy socialism, before rolling back its nanny state in the past decade or so.

The reason for this is what economist Frederic Bastiat called The Seen and the Unseen...the government spending is seen, but the jobs and wealth lost when the government obtained that money by taxing or spending at a deficit are unseen.

Bastiat described this best as the The Broken Window Fallacy. Here's how it goes:

Some troublemaking kid breaks a shopkeeper's window.

Some Democrat speaks up, saying at least this will stimulate the economy, because now the glazier has work.

But the shopkeeper points out that, in fact, the money he will now have to spend on the window is money he was going to use to buy a new suit. So the tailor is now poorer. The tailor/glazier thing breaks even, there's no stimulus...

But it's actually worse than that...because now the shopkeeper has no suit, and only the window he would have already had if it weren't broken.

So society is POORER because of this "stimulus".

The same is true of every natural disaster, every war, every government spending or jobs program, all of it.

In every case, the taxpayers who actually create wealth had money taken away from them, losing the things they would have bought with it, making society poorer.

And worse, at least in the Parable of the Glazier there is nothing lost by middlemen and bureaucrats. In the case of government spending, the majority of the "spending" even on "infrastructure" never builds a single road, bridge, or anything. It goes to useless government bureaucrats whose main job is to justify budgets.

So even MORE wealth is lost to society.

By the way, any supposed Conservative who claims that jobs will be lost if military spending is cut IS a hypocrite. Military spending is the very most economically depressing of all government spending, with the possible exception of an authoritarian police force. Military spending may be a necessary evil, but it NEVER creates net jobs. It always destroys jobs, overall.

 

[rightwinger]

The Government creates millions of jobs

2 million federal employees, state and local employees, policemen, firemen, teachers....

The entire defense industry is created by the governement

I know that people have been trying to explain this to the victims of socialized education for 63 pages now, but I'll give it a shot:

Government does not add jobs to the economy. Each job it "creates" consumes somewhat more than one private sector job. So the more jobs government "creates", the more unemployment we have. This is why Sweden had double digit unemployment during its "lost decade" of heavy socialism, before rolling back its nanny state in the past decade or so.

The reason for this is what economist Frederic Bastiat called The Seen and the Unseen...the government spending is seen, but the jobs and wealth lost when the government obtained that money by taxing or spending at a deficit are unseen.

Bastiat described this best as the The Broken Window Fallacy. Here's how it goes:

Some troublemaking kid breaks a shopkeeper's window.

Some Democrat speaks up, saying at least this will stimulate the economy, because now the glazier has work.

But the shopkeeper points out that, in fact, the money he will now have to spend on the window is money he was going to use to buy a new suit. So the tailor is now poorer. The tailor/glazier thing breaks even, there's no stimulus...

But it's actually worse than that...because now the shopkeeper has no suit, and only the window he would have already had if it weren't broken.

So society is POORER because of this "stimulus".

The same is true of every natural disaster, every war, every government spending or jobs program, all of it.

In every case, the taxpayers who actually create wealth had money taken away from them, losing the things they would have bought with it, making society poorer.

And worse, at least in the Parable of the Glazier there is nothing lost by middlemen and bureaucrats. In the case of government spending, the majority of the "spending" even on "infrastructure" never builds a single road, bridge, or anything. It goes to useless government bureaucrats whose main job is to justify budgets.

So even MORE wealth is lost to society.

By the way, any supposed Conservative who claims that jobs will be lost if military spending is cut IS a hypocrite. Military spending is the very most economically depressing of all government spending, with the possible exception of an authoritarian police force. Military spending may be a necessary evil, but it NEVER creates net jobs. It always destroys jobs, overall.

Thanks for posting. You made some interesting points

I disagree on Government jobs. Government is a necessary evil. They perform functions necessary for a society to operate. We need police. We need firemen. We need teachers
They are not a drain on the economy. The economy would be much worse without them

 

[daws101]

The Government creates millions of jobs

2 million federal employees, state and local employees, policemen, firemen, teachers....

The entire defense industry is created by the governement

I know that people have been trying to explain this to the victims of socialized education for 63 pages now, but I'll give it a shot:

Government does not add jobs to the economy. Each job it "creates" consumes somewhat more than one private sector job. So the more jobs government "creates", the more unemployment we have. This is why Sweden had double digit unemployment during its "lost decade" of heavy socialism, before rolling back its nanny state in the past decade or so.

The reason for this is what economist Frederic Bastiat called The Seen and the Unseen...the government spending is seen, but the jobs and wealth lost when the government obtained that money by taxing or spending at a deficit are unseen.

Bastiat described this best as the The Broken Window Fallacy. Here's how it goes:

Some troublemaking kid breaks a shopkeeper's window.

Some Democrat speaks up, saying at least this will stimulate the economy, because now the glazier has work.

But the shopkeeper points out that, in fact, the money he will now have to spend on the window is money he was going to use to buy a new suit. So the tailor is now poorer. The tailor/glazier thing breaks even, there's no stimulus...

But it's actually worse than that...because now the shopkeeper has no suit, and only the window he would have already had if it weren't broken.

So society is POORER because of this "stimulus".

The same is true of every natural disaster, every war, every government spending or jobs program, all of it.

In every case, the taxpayers who actually create wealth had money taken away from them, losing the things they would have bought with it, making society poorer.

And worse, at least in the Parable of the Glazier there is nothing lost by middlemen and bureaucrats. In the case of government spending, the majority of the "spending" even on "infrastructure" never builds a single road, bridge, or anything. It goes to useless government bureaucrats whose main job is to justify budgets.

So even MORE wealth is lost to society.

By the way, any supposed Conservative who claims that jobs will be lost if military spending is cut IS a hypocrite. Military spending is the very most economically depressing of all government spending, with the possible exception of an authoritarian police force. Military spending may be a necessary evil, but it NEVER creates net jobs. It always destroys jobs, overall.

when I see the phrase " victims of socialized education" coming from a fringe right con, I just have to laugh at that lie.

 

[PredFan]

What they mean is to create an environment where private businesses can create jobs. Like reducing taxes, giving tax incentives, cutting regulations, and basically getting the goverent out if the way.

as usual a con post complete bull poo.

GW cut taxes by 1.7 trillion and the economy proceeded to loose 8 million jobs.
by 2004 the JOB LOSS was a major campaign issue.

Bill Clinton raised taxes and has the record for job creation.

Another ignorant Right wing smacked down. My job is done here.

Ha ha moron. You don't even know what caused the economic collapse.

You are too stupid to talk to.

 

[rightwinger]

The Government creates millions of jobs

2 million federal employees, state and local employees, policemen, firemen, teachers....

The entire defense industry is created by the governement

I know that people have been trying to explain this to the victims of socialized education for 63 pages now, but I'll give it a shot:

Government does not add jobs to the economy. Each job it "creates" consumes somewhat more than one private sector job. So the more jobs government "creates", the more unemployment we have. This is why Sweden had double digit unemployment during its "lost decade" of heavy socialism, before rolling back its nanny state in the past decade or so.

The reason for this is what economist Frederic Bastiat called The Seen and the Unseen...the government spending is seen, but the jobs and wealth lost when the government obtained that money by taxing or spending at a deficit are unseen.

Bastiat described this best as the The Broken Window Fallacy. Here's how it goes:

Some troublemaking kid breaks a shopkeeper's window.

Some Democrat speaks up, saying at least this will stimulate the economy, because now the glazier has work.

But the shopkeeper points out that, in fact, the money he will now have to spend on the window is money he was going to use to buy a new suit. So the tailor is now poorer. The tailor/glazier thing breaks even, there's no stimulus...

But it's actually worse than that...because now the shopkeeper has no suit, and only the window he would have already had if it weren't broken.

So society is POORER because of this "stimulus".

The same is true of every natural disaster, every war, every government spending or jobs program, all of it.

In every case, the taxpayers who actually create wealth had money taken away from them, losing the things they would have bought with it, making society poorer.

And worse, at least in the Parable of the Glazier there is nothing lost by middlemen and bureaucrats. In the case of government spending, the majority of the "spending" even on "infrastructure" never builds a single road, bridge, or anything. It goes to useless government bureaucrats whose main job is to justify budgets.

So even MORE wealth is lost to society.

By the way, any supposed Conservative who claims that jobs will be lost if military spending is cut IS a hypocrite. Military spending is the very most economically depressing of all government spending, with the possible exception of an authoritarian police force. Military spending may be a necessary evil, but it NEVER creates net jobs. It always destroys jobs, overall.

when I see the phrase " victims of socialized education" coming from a fringe right con, I just have to laugh at that lie.

I know....cons want to substitute a good Christian education
Kind of like the Taliban

 

[ShaklesOfBigGov]

And taxes rob from individuals and businesses. Gov't doesnt create jobs. Gov't steals jobs that private industry would have created.

More trickle down nonsense

All of those tax dollars would have gone for private sector jobs. Where have we heard that bullshit before?

You dont know what trickle down means.
Are you saying you actually think that if businesses and people didnt have to cough up money for the gov't they would just...burn the money? What do you think here? Do you, in fact, think at all?

The "job creator" myth that additional tax revenue equates to more jobs is just that

Taxes pay for government services. Society benefits from those services

Please show the benefit of bridges to nowhere, airports for no one, and studies of drinking habits of Chinese prostitutes.
Again, if businesses werent forced to fork over the money to the gov't what do you think they would do with it?

The Government provides essential services such as infrastructure, police and fire protection, schools, legal system, defense

The people benefit from those services as well as pay for them. The resulting jobs are a benefit to society

That's not true when you have liberals who believe that government pays for public schools and detests a parents right to choose the "quality" of education for their kids, whether private or public schools. When Democrat politicians are given the choice of private schools for their kids, a free right that the middle class doesn't equally partake of, it equates to this idea of "the benefit of society as a whole" as being a mere myth. What IS demonstrated is the choice of parents to choose which form of education best meets their kids needs, is only presented to the very rich. A view which is supported among the liberal Democrats who, through rhetoric over action, still in turn try to perceive themselves as helping the middle class.

 

[boedicca]

Government doesn't create jobs. It creates transfer payments for its cronies by taxing productive non-government people.

 

[cutter]

When a government employee can pay enough taxes to pay his own salary it will be a job that contributes to our economy, until then it's just like a vampire sucking blood from a dieing victim.

 

[kazvorpal]

I disagree on Government jobs. Government is a necessary evil. They perform functions necessary for a society to operate. We need police. We need firemen. We need teachers
They are not a drain on the economy. The economy would be much worse without them

First, what you are saying doesn't change my point. That these things are necessary does not alter the fact that when those things are imposed by government-coerced funding, they each consume more than their number in private sector jobs. The broken window math is the same.

Second, you are assuming that when government imposes a socialized monopoly on education, you actually get educated people. In fact, public school teachers harm the economy, because they produce ignorance, not knowledge. How much algebra do you remember? How many people took years of Spanish, but could not so much as ask for directions in Mexico successfully? How many absurd abuses of the apostrophe and homonym errors are probably on this very message board? Knowledge is important, but that no more means public school teachers are beneficial than the need for health care means that homeopathic medicine is beneficial.

While private fire departments tend to do better than government ones, let's assume that (unlike our faux education system) police and fire departments are something the government needs to run. If we eliminated all of the unconstitutional police state aspects of the police force, like vice/prohibition enforcement and the robber baron aspect of using fees (speed traps, for example) as a form of backdoor taxation, then that's fine, some aspect is beneficial. But it still is a necessary evil at best, which consumes more than its count in jobs

 

[kazvorpal]

when I see the phrase " victims of socialized education" coming from a fringe right con, I just have to laugh at that lie.

If I understand your slightly garbled statement, you're attempting to claim that the US educational system is not socialized.

How, precisely, are you asserting this? What is your definition of "socialized", that does not include the government imposing an effective monopoly on an industry, forcing everyone to pay for its being universally provided from a government agency, so that even those who recognize its failure and seek an alternative means of production are forced to pay for that government provision, and anyone who has no way to both pay for it AND provide an alternative is forced to use it, rather than abstain?

 

[hangover]

What they mean is to create an environment where private businesses can create jobs. Like reducing taxes, giving tax incentives, cutting regulations, and basically getting the goverent out if the way.

as usual a con post complete bull poo.

GW cut taxes by 1.7 trillion and the economy proceeded to loose 8 million jobs.
by 2004 the JOB LOSS was a major campaign issue.

Bill Clinton raised taxes and has the record for job creation.

Another ignorant Right wing smacked down. My job is done here.

Ha ha moron. You don't even know what caused the economic collapse.

You are too stupid to talk to.

Everybody knows Shrub and the cons caused the economic collapse with deregulation of banks and mortgage industry.

 

[PredFan]

What they mean is to create an environment where private businesses can create jobs. Like reducing taxes, giving tax incentives, cutting regulations, and basically getting the goverent out if the way.

as usual a con post complete bull poo.

GW cut taxes by 1.7 trillion and the economy proceeded to loose 8 million jobs.
by 2004 the JOB LOSS was a major campaign issue.

Bill Clinton raised taxes and has the record for job creation.

Another ignorant Right wing smacked down. My job is done here.

Ha ha moron. You don't even know what caused the economic collapse.

You are too stupid to talk to.

Everybody knows Shrub and the cons caused the economic collapse with deregulation of banks and mortgage industry.

No, only partisan idiots "know" that.

 

[hangover]

What they mean is to create an environment where private businesses can create jobs. Like reducing taxes, giving tax incentives, cutting regulations, and basically getting the goverent out if the way.

as usual a con post complete bull poo.

GW cut taxes by 1.7 trillion and the economy proceeded to loose 8 million jobs.
by 2004 the JOB LOSS was a major campaign issue.

Bill Clinton raised taxes and has the record for job creation.

Another ignorant Right wing smacked down. My job is done here.

Ha ha moron. You don't even know what caused the economic collapse.

You are too stupid to talk to.

Everybody knows Shrub and the cons caused the economic collapse with deregulation of banks and mortgage industry.

No, only partisan idiots "know" that.

No, only partisan con idiots DON'T know that. NA NA NA NA NA!