Compelling evidence for the non-existence of God

[JakeStarkey]

[QUOTE="Meriweather, pos
t: 10269962, member: 51965"Take a look at Isaiah, Chapter 64. It says of God, "You have hidden your face from us...you have delivered us up to our guilt."

Jewish Scripture (Christian Old Testament) spans thousands of years, and we do read within it of the times God "Hid His face."

Like some here, I, too, can speak of God's presence--His fingerprints--in my life.

Some may say, "Fingerprints are not enough. I want to see God's face."

We are not the first generation with such a longing. Psalm 24 speaks of a people who longed to see His face.[/QUOTE]

Meri, thank you, and I hope that M. D. reads your wonderful testimony.

 

[Justin Davis]

There are posters just not worth reading, let alone responding to.

Beginning with you, the man who doesn't even know what objectivity is.

 

[Justin Davis]

M. D. has nothing to offer than wuckfitian bozo philosophy.

He will talk you into senselessness much like his own.

The social con philosophers have nothing of worth to offer.

You and PratchettFan are idiots. You make philosophical declarations about the supposed nonexistence of evidence or the nonexistence of God when only idiots don’t understand that the universe's existence is the evidence.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Justin, shut up, sit up, grow up.

And listen, wuckfit.

I am a born again in the blood believer in my Lord and Saviour. I call him "Lord", and He calls me by my first name.

My belief, however, does not meet the standards of objective evidence for critical thinking. I admit that. But that does not change what I know.

I don't need wuckfit criticism by social con or atheist standard bearers who do not understand that critical thinking cannot provide objective evidence in either case.

You all need to grow up and understand that difference between faith and critical thinking. Neither can prove or disprove the existence of God.

Have a blessed day.

 

[PratchettFan]

Justin, shut up, sit up, grow up.

And listen, wuckfit.

I am a born again in the blood believer in my Lord and Saviour. I call him "Lord", and He calls me by my first name.

My belief, however, does not meet the standards of objective evidence for critical thinking. I admit that. But that does not change what I know.

I don't need wuckfit criticism by social con or atheist standard bearers who do not understand that critical thinking cannot provide objective evidence in either case.

You all need to grow up and understand that difference between faith and critical thinking. Neither can prove or disprove the existence of God.

Have a blessed day.

Exactly. Speaking as someone who is not born again in the blood, I could not agree more. Perhaps someday we will discover the answer to this question, but until then it is a matter of faith. I think too many people fail to appreciate the importance of faith, or are simply afraid of it. It is the one thing which absolutely requires you be true to yourself.

 

[Hollie]

Justin, shut up, sit up, grow up.

And listen, wuckfit.

I am a born again in the blood believer in my Lord and Saviour. I call him "Lord", and He calls me by my first name.

My belief, however, does not meet the standards of objective evidence for critical thinking. I admit that. But that does not change what I know.

I don't need wuckfit criticism by social con or atheist standard bearers who do not understand that critical thinking cannot provide objective evidence in either case.

You all need to grow up and understand that difference between faith and critical thinking. Neither can prove or disprove the existence of God.

Have a blessed day.

Exactly. Speaking as someone who is not born again in the blood, I could not agree more. Perhaps someday we will discover the answer to this question, but until then it is a matter of faith. I think too many people fail to appreciate the importance of faith, or are simply afraid of it. It is the one thing which absolutely requires you be true to yourself.

To be "true to yourself"?

What does that mean? Is religious faith a requirement for someone to to be "true to themselves? And if so, is a believer in Shiva available to be "true to themselves" or is belief in your partisan gawds the requirement?

 

[PratchettFan]

Justin, shut up, sit up, grow up.

And listen, wuckfit.

I am a born again in the blood believer in my Lord and Saviour. I call him "Lord", and He calls me by my first name.

My belief, however, does not meet the standards of objective evidence for critical thinking. I admit that. But that does not change what I know.

I don't need wuckfit criticism by social con or atheist standard bearers who do not understand that critical thinking cannot provide objective evidence in either case.

You all need to grow up and understand that difference between faith and critical thinking. Neither can prove or disprove the existence of God.

Have a blessed day.

Exactly. Speaking as someone who is not born again in the blood, I could not agree more. Perhaps someday we will discover the answer to this question, but until then it is a matter of faith. I think too many people fail to appreciate the importance of faith, or are simply afraid of it. It is the one thing which absolutely requires you be true to yourself.

To be "true to yourself"?

What does that mean? Is religious faith a requirement for someone to to be "true to themselves? And if so, is a believer in Shiva available to be "true to themselves" or is belief in your partisan gawds the requirement?

Faith is entirely internal. To be true to yourself simply means to accept what you believe. Not to prove it, not to get others to believe, but to just accept it. Once you have done that, there is no need to be concerned with what others believe. No need to convince them they are wrong. Whether that belief is in Jesus, Shiva, or nothing really doesn't matter. Ultimately, all of the insults, proselytizing and insistence of non-existent proofs come down to an inability to accept who you are. If you insist you don't believe in leprechauns when you actually do or you do believe in Bigfoot when you actually don't, then all you are doing is denying who you are and fighting with yourself.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Justin, shut up, sit up, grow up.

And listen, wuckfit.

I am a born again in the blood believer in my Lord and Saviour. I call him "Lord", and He calls me by my first name.

My belief, however, does not meet the standards of objective evidence for critical thinking. I admit that. But that does not change what I know.

I don't need wuckfit criticism by social con or atheist standard bearers who do not understand that critical thinking cannot provide objective evidence in either case.

You all need to grow up and understand that difference between faith and critical thinking. Neither can prove or disprove the existence of God.

Have a blessed day.

Exactly. Speaking as someone who is not born again in the blood, I could not agree more. Perhaps someday we will discover the answer to this question, but until then it is a matter of faith. I think too many people fail to appreciate the importance of faith, or are simply afraid of it. It is the one thing which absolutely requires you be true to yourself.

To be "true to yourself"?

What does that mean? Is religious faith a requirement for someone to to be "true to themselves? And if so, is a believer in Shiva available to be "true to themselves" or is belief in your partisan gawds the requirement?

So you have faith god does not exist. Fine. Don't be presumptuous to think you can prove it.

 

[Hollie]

Justin, shut up, sit up, grow up.

And listen, wuckfit.

I am a born again in the blood believer in my Lord and Saviour. I call him "Lord", and He calls me by my first name.

My belief, however, does not meet the standards of objective evidence for critical thinking. I admit that. But that does not change what I know.

I don't need wuckfit criticism by social con or atheist standard bearers who do not understand that critical thinking cannot provide objective evidence in either case.

You all need to grow up and understand that difference between faith and critical thinking. Neither can prove or disprove the existence of God.

Have a blessed day.

Exactly. Speaking as someone who is not born again in the blood, I could not agree more. Perhaps someday we will discover the answer to this question, but until then it is a matter of faith. I think too many people fail to appreciate the importance of faith, or are simply afraid of it. It is the one thing which absolutely requires you be true to yourself.

To be "true to yourself"?

What does that mean? Is religious faith a requirement for someone to to be "true to themselves? And if so, is a believer in Shiva available to be "true to themselves" or is belief in your partisan gawds the requirement?

So you have faith god does not exist. Fine. Don't be presumptuous to think you can prove it.

Faith is not a requirement to conclude gawds do not exist.

 

[Meriweather]

Faith is not a requirement to conclude gawds do not exist.

I tend to agree with this. In religious discussion, faith is a belief in God. True, another definition of faith is 'trust' and anyone may certainly trust their conclusion that there is no God. In that case, trust is used more as a verb, whereas often in religious discussion, we see faith being used as a noun.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Justin, shut up, sit up, grow up.

And listen, wuckfit.

I am a born again in the blood believer in my Lord and Saviour. I call him "Lord", and He calls me by my first name.

My belief, however, does not meet the standards of objective evidence for critical thinking. I admit that. But that does not change what I know.

I don't need wuckfit criticism by social con or atheist standard bearers who do not understand that critical thinking cannot provide objective evidence in either case.

You all need to grow up and understand that difference between faith and critical thinking. Neither can prove or disprove the existence of God.

Have a blessed day.

Exactly. Speaking as someone who is not born again in the blood, I could not agree more. Perhaps someday we will discover the answer to this question, but until then it is a matter of faith. I think too many people fail to appreciate the importance of faith, or are simply afraid of it. It is the one thing which absolutely requires you be true to yourself.

To be "true to yourself"?

What does that mean? Is religious faith a requirement for someone to to be "true to themselves? And if so, is a believer in Shiva available to be "true to themselves" or is belief in your partisan gawds the requirement?

So you have faith god does not exist. Fine. Don't be presumptuous to think you can prove it.

Faith is not a requirement to conclude gawds do not exist.

To believe something does not exist when you cannot prove it does require faith. Logic dictates that conclusion.

 

[Hollie]

Justin, shut up, sit up, grow up.

And listen, wuckfit.

I am a born again in the blood believer in my Lord and Saviour. I call him "Lord", and He calls me by my first name.

My belief, however, does not meet the standards of objective evidence for critical thinking. I admit that. But that does not change what I know.

I don't need wuckfit criticism by social con or atheist standard bearers who do not understand that critical thinking cannot provide objective evidence in either case.

You all need to grow up and understand that difference between faith and critical thinking. Neither can prove or disprove the existence of God.

Have a blessed day.

Exactly. Speaking as someone who is not born again in the blood, I could not agree more. Perhaps someday we will discover the answer to this question, but until then it is a matter of faith. I think too many people fail to appreciate the importance of faith, or are simply afraid of it. It is the one thing which absolutely requires you be true to yourself.

To be "true to yourself"?

What does that mean? Is religious faith a requirement for someone to to be "true to themselves? And if so, is a believer in Shiva available to be "true to themselves" or is belief in your partisan gawds the requirement?

Faith is entirely internal. To be true to yourself simply means to accept what you believe. Not to prove it, not to get others to believe, but to just accept it. Once you have done that, there is no need to be concerned with what others believe. No need to convince them they are wrong. Whether that belief is in Jesus, Shiva, or nothing really doesn't matter. Ultimately, all of the insults, proselytizing and insistence of non-existent proofs come down to an inability to accept who you are. If you insist you don't believe in leprechauns when you actually do or you do believe in Bigfoot when you actually don't, then all you are doing is denying who you are and fighting with yourself.

"Faith", the affiliation with partisan religious doctrine, is much more a group exercise as it is internal. Religious faith is overwhelmingly a function of geographic location and familial associations so in that sense, it's entirely arbitrary.

And yes, truth is important, especially when truth contradicts religious dogma.

How do we discern the truth? By faith? By assertion and stepping away and accepting untested and anecdotal claims? Or do we assiduously test our truths, hold them up to scrutiny, demand they be accountable at some level?

Yet again, we're left to question If everyone simply accepts as the answer to existence that multiple conceptions of various gawds are the primal cause we would condemn humanity to never probing the answers to the deeper questions. And in fact during the dark ages this thought held sway -- do not seek the answers to the mysteries of life, because you cannot answer them because you cannot know the mind or character of god.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Faith is a belief in things unproven. Since God cannot be disproved, then Hollie is operating by aith.

 

[Hollie]

Justin, shut up, sit up, grow up.

And listen, wuckfit.

I am a born again in the blood believer in my Lord and Saviour. I call him "Lord", and He calls me by my first name.

My belief, however, does not meet the standards of objective evidence for critical thinking. I admit that. But that does not change what I know.

I don't need wuckfit criticism by social con or atheist standard bearers who do not understand that critical thinking cannot provide objective evidence in either case.

You all need to grow up and understand that difference between faith and critical thinking. Neither can prove or disprove the existence of God.

Have a blessed day.

Exactly. Speaking as someone who is not born again in the blood, I could not agree more. Perhaps someday we will discover the answer to this question, but until then it is a matter of faith. I think too many people fail to appreciate the importance of faith, or are simply afraid of it. It is the one thing which absolutely requires you be true to yourself.

To be "true to yourself"?

What does that mean? Is religious faith a requirement for someone to to be "true to themselves? And if so, is a believer in Shiva available to be "true to themselves" or is belief in your partisan gawds the requirement?

So you have faith god does not exist. Fine. Don't be presumptuous to think you can prove it.

Faith is not a requirement to conclude gawds do not exist.

To believe something does not exist when you cannot prove it does require faith. Logic dictates that conclusion.

Conclusions do not require faith. I don't need to prove that the Tooth Fairy does not exist to conclude that the Tooth Fairy is an invention of mankind.

By your "standards", we can have faith that Zeus is just as likely to exist as your partisan gawds.

 

[Hollie]

Faith is a belief in things unproven. Since God cannot be disproved, then Hollie is operating by aith.

There is no faith required to reach conclusions about the natural world.

Why do you have faith ( other than for completely arbitrary reasons of parenthood), that your gawds are "true" vs. the Hindu gawds?

 

[Hollie]

Faith is not a requirement to conclude gawds do not exist.

I tend to agree with this. In religious discussion, faith is a belief in God. True, another definition of faith is 'trust' and anyone may certainly trust their conclusion that there is no God. In that case, trust is used more as a verb, whereas often in religious discussion, we see faith being used as a noun.

Ultimately, there is a deep difference between trust and faith. Faith is belief despite or contrary to evidence, (as identified a couple of posts ago), whereas trust requires evidence to be maintained. People talk about "faith" in one's doctor, and "faith" in one's friends, but I suggest to you it's really trust based upon their behavior-- if your doctor butchers you or a loved one or a friend fully betrays you, your "faith" is gone. What you had all along was trust, which they betrayed, which is why you no longer trust them.

With faith, you would continue to trust them no matter what they did to you.

 

[PratchettFan]

Justin, shut up, sit up, grow up.

And listen, wuckfit.

I am a born again in the blood believer in my Lord and Saviour. I call him "Lord", and He calls me by my first name.

My belief, however, does not meet the standards of objective evidence for critical thinking. I admit that. But that does not change what I know.

I don't need wuckfit criticism by social con or atheist standard bearers who do not understand that critical thinking cannot provide objective evidence in either case.

You all need to grow up and understand that difference between faith and critical thinking. Neither can prove or disprove the existence of God.

Have a blessed day.

Exactly. Speaking as someone who is not born again in the blood, I could not agree more. Perhaps someday we will discover the answer to this question, but until then it is a matter of faith. I think too many people fail to appreciate the importance of faith, or are simply afraid of it. It is the one thing which absolutely requires you be true to yourself.

To be "true to yourself"?

What does that mean? Is religious faith a requirement for someone to to be "true to themselves? And if so, is a believer in Shiva available to be "true to themselves" or is belief in your partisan gawds the requirement?

So you have faith god does not exist. Fine. Don't be presumptuous to think you can prove it.

Faith is not a requirement to conclude gawds do not exist.

Perhaps. But belief is certainly a requirement since there is no evidence to support that conclusion.

 

[PratchettFan]

Justin, shut up, sit up, grow up.

And listen, wuckfit.

I am a born again in the blood believer in my Lord and Saviour. I call him "Lord", and He calls me by my first name.

My belief, however, does not meet the standards of objective evidence for critical thinking. I admit that. But that does not change what I know.

I don't need wuckfit criticism by social con or atheist standard bearers who do not understand that critical thinking cannot provide objective evidence in either case.

You all need to grow up and understand that difference between faith and critical thinking. Neither can prove or disprove the existence of God.

Have a blessed day.

Exactly. Speaking as someone who is not born again in the blood, I could not agree more. Perhaps someday we will discover the answer to this question, but until then it is a matter of faith. I think too many people fail to appreciate the importance of faith, or are simply afraid of it. It is the one thing which absolutely requires you be true to yourself.

To be "true to yourself"?

What does that mean? Is religious faith a requirement for someone to to be "true to themselves? And if so, is a believer in Shiva available to be "true to themselves" or is belief in your partisan gawds the requirement?

Faith is entirely internal. To be true to yourself simply means to accept what you believe. Not to prove it, not to get others to believe, but to just accept it. Once you have done that, there is no need to be concerned with what others believe. No need to convince them they are wrong. Whether that belief is in Jesus, Shiva, or nothing really doesn't matter. Ultimately, all of the insults, proselytizing and insistence of non-existent proofs come down to an inability to accept who you are. If you insist you don't believe in leprechauns when you actually do or you do believe in Bigfoot when you actually don't, then all you are doing is denying who you are and fighting with yourself.

"Faith", the affiliation with partisan religious doctrine, is much more a group exercise as it is internal. Religious faith is overwhelmingly a function of geographic location and familial associations so in that sense, it's entirely arbitrary.

And yes, truth is important, especially when truth contradicts religious dogma.

How do we discern the truth? By faith? By assertion and stepping away and accepting untested and anecdotal claims? Or do we assiduously test our truths, hold them up to scrutiny, demand they be accountable at some level?

Yet again, we're left to question If everyone simply accepts as the answer to existence that multiple conceptions of various gawds are the primal cause we would condemn humanity to never probing the answers to the deeper questions. And in fact during the dark ages this thought held sway -- do not seek the answers to the mysteries of life, because you cannot answer them because you cannot know the mind or character of god.

Faith is not an affiliation with a religious doctrine. That is religion. Faith is acceptance of belief and belief is done in the individual brain. You can share an identification with a particular religion or doctrine, but no one can share their own belief. We are all unique and we do not mind meld. No two people are going to believe the exact same thing, even if they describe it the same way.

I don't believe I used the word "truth". I expect we don't share the same definition of that word. To me, truth is just that which is. For others, truth is an idea. For others, it is an excuse to impose. I do not declare my faith to have anything at all to do with truth, other than it being my faith. If you can present me with objective, valid evidence that what I believe is wrong, then I will change what I believe. However, until you can do that, I see absolutely no reason to think your belief is at all superior to mine. Because, no matter how much you may disclaim this, belief is all you are offering.

 

[Taz]

faith=fantasy. For people who want to live in a dream world. Pretty simple really.

 

[PratchettFan]

faith=fantasy. For people who want to live in a dream world. Pretty simple really.

We all live in a dream world.