Greenbeard
Gold Member
You're spoiling beautiful dogma and slogans with the ugliness of real life.
Compare Socialized Medicine to the American Mess.
- Thread starter Neubarth
- Start date
You're spoiling beautiful dogma and slogans with the ugliness of real life.
There is always choice. Trying to deny it is the source of the problem.
regent
Gold Member
- Jan 30, 2012
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A democracy causes problems with legislation. To appeal to both sides of the aisle bills are written that are not clean nor totally sensible. America will someday have an adequate medicial program but it will be a step by step procedure, and in the process will be inadequate, primitive and costly. Social Security was relatively fast because of the Great Depression crisis, but it too has been modified over the years, and is still being fought by Republicans.
Dragon
Senior Member
- Sep 16, 2011
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Well, technically, yes, there is. People can go without needed health care, suffer and die. That's a choice. Doesn't really change what I was saying, though.
Listening
Gold Member
- Aug 27, 2011
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It was great long before he moved to destroy it.
Listening
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All subjective statements that make you feel better......but are even more hollow than Nancy Pelosi.
You are not taking anything back. You had it, you lost it.
You lost the house.
You lose the super majority and now you lose the senate.
And quite possibly the WH.
I can't wait.
Listening
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Only to those who can't get out of a freshamen economics book.
Oh, come on. That's not the only choice. There's a wide array of options between that extreme and simply paying whatever a doctor or drug company demands. It's our state of denial about this fact that is making the health care market so dysfunctional. We've bought into the misguided notion that, when it comes to healthcare, no one should ever be burdened with worrying about how much it costs. But that's worse than naive, it's deeply destructive to the market.
When people don't make value judgments, markets don't work. Unfortunately, we spent the last half-century building a health care system designed to allow people to avoid these difficult decisions and it's cost us dearly.
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Sallow
The Big Bad Wolf.
Sallow
The Big Bad Wolf.
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-usmvYOPfco]Alan Grayson on the GOP Health Care Plan: "Don't Get Sick! And if You Do Get Sick, Die Quickly!"' - YouTube[/ame]
He was so damned right about this.
hortysir
In Memorial of 47
Listening
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Yeah, and he won re-election by a landslide.
Listening
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Once again we see the solution before we've defined the problem.
This is a classic mistake on both sides and while I expect it from the left, the right is really screwing it up.
Usually, you start out with what problem you'd like to solve. You usually have a set of guidelines and principles that you use to arrive at your best solution.
No defintion and no agreement on principles. This argument will never end.
Obamacare is no solution because you don't know the problem.
Now, I'll wait for the "But there are a gazillion people without insurance". And someone will say, but many could afford it...they just don't want it.
And on and on and on and on......
This is a classic mistake on both sides and while I expect it from the left, the right is really screwing it up.
Usually, you start out with what problem you'd like to solve. You usually have a set of guidelines and principles that you use to arrive at your best solution.
No defintion and no agreement on principles. This argument will never end.
Obamacare is no solution because you don't know the problem.
Now, I'll wait for the "But there are a gazillion people without insurance". And someone will say, but many could afford it...they just don't want it.
And on and on and on and on......
- Moderator
- #34
In the case of emergency care, you'd be correct, hence the reason for the insurance. In the case of more common less urgent care, you do have a choice. You can shop around between physicians, hospitals, and care centers. Health care was incredibly more affordable in this country before the government got involved and everyone started getting cadillac health plans that cover every sniffle and sneeze.
- Moderator
- #35
You have no idea who I'm voting for so stop your blustering. I am my own master. I imagine that's a tough concept for you because you have to be told what to think, but not all of us are as intellectually inept as yourself.
What party am I a member of?
Just out of curiosity, how old are you? 13? 14? That's the vibe I'm getting from your infantile rants. That or it's just the frustration you're feeling from me quite easily owning your ass in every discussion.
- Moderator
- #36
Sure, if you want to suffer and die a miserable death.
- Moderator
- #37
- Moderator
- #38
California Girl
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Check out France and Sweden. Two tier systems work best. And although Sweden is excellent, France I believe still rates number one as far as getting more bang for your buck.
Highly efficient. And yes I am a conservative.But I've been watching my health care system failing for years now and politics always gets in the way of just getting things improved.
The French system is the one I would favor, if we were to go down that route. It is excellent... but many French people find the cost very expensive... I'd have to ask to find out how much they pay... but having seen their system up close, it is really good.
Yes it is frustrating making so many good points and getting so little back in return and then you suggest it is you who has schooled me.
My satisfaction comes watching your side implode. You can't even admit what side you are on because then I'd back you into a corner you couldn't get out of. Then you would have to defend the fools you support. Most of you have chosen to support Ron Paul. So what I suggest is that you look into what the Commons are and decide if you want to sell the Grand Canyon to a private corporation.
We have a 2 party system. You pick one party or the other. Both are corrupt, so try to change the one that you choose for the better. Conservatives believe government is the problem and Democrats know that Government is the only solution. Corporations didn't give you raises, sick days, vacation days and 40 hour work weeks out of the kindness of their hearts.
You middle class cons voting GOP really need to wake up. The current GOP worships Ayn Rand. Google that ***** and see that the GOP are trying to create a society of greedy every man for himself society. None of you will benefit from this. You already have been hurt. Either you lost your job or their regulations cut the value of your home and 401K in half.
I can't keep explaining it to one righty at a time. But I try. So it seems like I'm ranting. Trust me dude, if you are not rich you should not be voting for any GOP candidate.
Start listening to Randi Rhodes and Thom Hartmann at least 2 days a week until you realize you have been conned.
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