Christian Baker Punished For Refusing To Make Gay Wedding Cake Fights Back

[Syriusly]

Stop shoveling shit against the tide.

What tide? Republican vs Democrat, it always goes in and out. Stop being less relevant, as most of the country is already over the wedding cake and same-sex marriage.

Yeah, that's why this thread keeps getting action nearing 60,000 views and 7,000 responses with 82% voting against gay marraige on this very subject BTW: Should Churches be forced to accomodate for homosexual weddings Page 701 US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum".

You are delusional- the question asked is whether churches should be forced to accommodate homosexuals weddings- a question I and every proponent of marriage equality say 'No' to.

None of us were voting against gay marriage- we were voting no on the question you actually asked. Not the one you see in your head.

 

[hipeter924]

He was sentenced to undergo sensitivity training, pay for all of his employees to undergo sensitivity training and ordered to provide quarterly reports to the court detailing every time he declined a specialty service.

This could be considered a punishment.

Baker forced to make gay wedding cakes undergo sensitivity training after losing lawsuit Fox News

It absolutely is punishment and an undue infringement on his privacy..

Business's are subject to public accommodation laws.

Simple as that.

Don't like the law- change it.

Or do what gay couples did who were not allowed by law to marry- go to court to argue that the law is unconstitutional.

But this baker is subject to the law in the same way a Jew or a Muslim or a Hindu would be.

It is a waste of time trying to get some people in this thread to get it, and they are set in their ways. You might be able to get them to see sense if the issue was 'parking meters' or 'public toilets', but in an emotionalized thread - not a chance.

 

[hipeter924]

Stop shoveling shit against the tide.

What tide? Republican vs Democrat, it always goes in and out. Stop being less relevant, as most of the country is already over the wedding cake and same-sex marriage.

Yeah, that's why this thread keeps getting action nearing 60,000 views and 7,000 responses with 82% voting against gay marraige on this very subject BTW: Should Churches be forced to accomodate for homosexual weddings Page 701 US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum".

You are delusional- the question asked is whether churches should be forced to accommodate homosexuals weddings- a question I and every proponent of marriage equality say 'No' to.

None of us were voting against gay marriage- we were voting no on the question you actually asked. Not the one you see in your head.

No church is forced to perform same-sex marriage in the deepest of deep blue states - so why would it be in deep red states.

 

[Silhouette]

No church is forced to perform same-sex marriage in the deepest of deep blue states - so why would it be in deep red states.

But a church in the law's eyes is nothing more than a congregation of individual christians, open to the general public. In fact, being open to the general public is a congregation's #1 hallmark.

 

[hipeter924]

No church is forced to perform same-sex marriage in the deepest of deep blue states - so why would it be in deep red states.

But a church in the law's eyes is nothing more than a congregation of individual christians, open to the general public. In fact, being open to the general public is a congregation's #1 hallmark.

Is a Mosque open to Jews? Hardly. Plenty of restrictions already, do you really believe this wouldn't be another allowable restriction like not allowing in farm animals and armed citizens.

 

[Silhouette]

Is a Mosque open to Jews? Hardly. Plenty of restrictions already, do you really believe this wouldn't be another allowable restriction like not allowing in farm animals and armed citizens.

Yes, a Mosque would be open to jews who are interested in converting to islam. Sure. Any church is open to the public. How do you think there came to be so many muslims in the world? They didn't breed themselves in. They evangelize just like christians do. So technically a congregation of individual faithfuls (a church, mosque etc.) would have to do the public accomodation just like individual christians. Why would being congregated suddenly grant individual christians special rights to protect the edicts of their faith?

 

[BlindBoo]

There is no doubt that same sex marriage will be imposed on the people whether they accept it or not. Then it will become one of the many imposed but unresolved issues that we deal with on a day to day basis. How many years have we had the forced acceptance of civil rights for blacks? How has that worked out? We have had forced legality of abortion for how many years? How is that working out?

There are some issues that just can't be forced. Same sex marriage is one of them.

You mean they're going to be allowed the same benefits of marriage? You mean they're still gonna ride in the front of the bus and eat at the same counter as white folks. Why there should be a law or something against that. Abortion still legal.

 

[Syriusly]

No church is forced to perform same-sex marriage in the deepest of deep blue states - so why would it be in deep red states.

But a church in the law's eyes is nothing more than a congregation of individual christians, open to the general public. In fact, being open to the general public is a congregation's #1 hallmark.

Yes it is- once again from the Colorado PA law

(1) As used in this part 6, "place of public accommodation" means any place of business engaged in any sales to the public and any place offering services, facilities, privileges, advantages, or accommodations to the public, including but not limited to any business offering wholesale or retail sales to the public; any place to eat, drink, sleep, or rest, or any combination thereof; any sporting or recreational area and facility; any public transportation facility; a barber shop, bathhouse, swimming pool, bath, steam or massage parlor, gymnasium, or other establishment conducted to serve the health, appearance, or physical condition of a person; a campsite or trailer camp; a dispensary, clinic, hospital, convalescent home, or other institution for the sick, ailing, aged, or infirm; a mortuary, undertaking parlor, or cemetery; an educational institution; or any public building, park, arena, theater, hall, auditorium, museum, library, exhibit, or public facility of any kind whether indoor or outdoor.

"Place of public accommodation" shall not include a church, synagogue, mosque, or other place that is principally used for religious purposes.

 

[Syriusly]

Is a Mosque open to Jews? Hardly. Plenty of restrictions already, do you really believe this wouldn't be another allowable restriction like not allowing in farm animals and armed citizens.

Yes, a Mosque would be open to jews who are interested in converting to islam. Sure. Any church is open to the public. How do you think there came to be so many muslims in the world? They didn't breed themselves in.

No- you are as ignorant about religion as you are about virtually everything else.

Just try to wander freely around a Mormon Temple. Try to insist that the Catholic Church provide you communion even though you are a Catholic.

Churches- Mosques- Temples- can restrict admittance anyway that they want. No- not all Churches are open to the public.

 

[hipeter924]

Is a Mosque open to Jews? Hardly. Plenty of restrictions already, do you really believe this wouldn't be another allowable restriction like not allowing in farm animals and armed citizens.

Yes, a Mosque would be open to jews who are interested in converting to islam. Sure. Any church is open to the public. How do you think there came to be so many muslims in the world? They didn't breed themselves in.

No- you are as ignorant about religion as you are about virtually everything else.

Just try to wander freely around a Mormon Temple. Try to insist that the Catholic Church provide you communion even though you are a Catholic.

Churches- Mosques- Temples- can restrict admittance anyway that they want. No- not all Churches are open to the public.

Yep. Churches are private property, here is a case about a Black heterosexual marriage not being allowed to be performed at a church:

 

[Silhouette]

Yes it is- once again from the Colorado PA law
"Place of public accommodation" shall not include a church, synagogue, mosque, or other place that is principally used for religious purposes.

But for some reason your ilk is arguing that it SHALL include individual christians. So I'll ask you again: Does the 1st Amendment say it's freedom of religion meant for individuals or groups of them (churches)?

Again, Colorado is not going to be the final word on this. It will come before the US Supreme Court, maybe even this year or next.

 

[Syriusly]

Yes it is- once again from the Colorado PA law
"Place of public accommodation" shall not include a church, synagogue, mosque, or other place that is principally used for religious purposes.

But for some reason your ilk is arguing that it SHALL include individual christians. So I'll ask you again: Does the 1st Amendment say it's freedom of religion meant for individuals or groups of them (churches)?

Again, Colorado is not going to be the final word on this. It will come before the US Supreme Court, maybe even this year or next.

I am saying that Colorado law is very clear- and its not my problem that you don't understand it.

And not even on the Supreme Court's radar screen- just your usual delusion.

once again from the Colorado PA law

(1) As used in this part 6, "place of public accommodation" means any place of business engaged in any sales to the public and any place offering services, facilities, privileges, advantages, or accommodations to the public, including but not limited to any business offering wholesale or retail sales to the public; any place to eat, drink, sleep, or rest, or any combination thereof; any sporting or recreational area and facility; any public transportation facility; a barber shop, bathhouse, swimming pool, bath, steam or massage parlor, gymnasium, or other establishment conducted to serve the health, appearance, or physical condition of a person; a campsite or trailer camp; a dispensary, clinic, hospital, convalescent home, or other institution for the sick, ailing, aged, or infirm; a mortuary, undertaking parlor, or cemetery; an educational institution; or any public building, park, arena, theater, hall, auditorium, museum, library, exhibit, or public facility of any kind whether indoor or outdoor.

"Place of public accommodation" shall not include a church, synagogue, mosque, or other place that is principally used for religious purposes.

 

[Silhouette]

"Place of public accommodation" shall not include a church, synagogue, mosque, or other place that is principally used for religious purposes.

I notice you are using obfuscation and repetition to answer my question directly. Don't tell me what Colorado says. Don't tell me what anyone else says. Tell me what either you say or what you believe the US Supreme Court will say when I ask this question (and do it without spamming 5 one-paragraph posts in a row to try to bury the page. I'm not going to forget that I asked you this question.. I'll save it and repost it on the next page and so on until you do)

Does the 1st Amendment say it's freedom of religion meant for individuals or groups of them (churches)?

 

[Syriusly]

"Place of public accommodation" shall not include a church, synagogue, mosque, or other place that is principally used for religious purposes.

I notice you are using obfuscation and repetition to answer my question directly. Don't tell me what Colorado says. Don't tell me what anyone else says. Tell me what either you say or what you believe the US Supreme Court will say when I ask this question (and do it without spamming 5 one-paragraph posts in a row to try to bury the page. I'm not going to forget that I asked you this question.. I'll save it and repost it on the next page and so on until you do)

Does the 1st Amendment say it's freedom of religion meant for individuals or groups of them (churches)?

This is a thread about public accommodation laws- and I am showing you the distinction between business's- covered by PA laws- and Church's- not covered by PA laws.

If you don't like the answer- well tough.

once again from the Colorado PA law

(1) As used in this part 6, "place of public accommodation" means any place of business engaged in any sales to the public and any place offering services, facilities, privileges, advantages, or accommodations to the public, including but not limited to any business offering wholesale or retail sales to the public; any place to eat, drink, sleep, or rest, or any combination thereof; any sporting or recreational area and facility; any public transportation facility; a barber shop, bathhouse, swimming pool, bath, steam or massage parlor, gymnasium, or other establishment conducted to serve the health, appearance, or physical condition of a person; a campsite or trailer camp; a dispensary, clinic, hospital, convalescent home, or other institution for the sick, ailing, aged, or infirm; a mortuary, undertaking parlor, or cemetery; an educational institution; or any public building, park, arena, theater, hall, auditorium, museum, library, exhibit, or public facility of any kind whether indoor or outdoor.

"Place of public accommodation" shall not include a church, synagogue, mosque, or other place that is principally used for religious purposes.

 

[Silhouette]

This is a thread about public accommodation laws- and I am showing you the distinction between business's- covered by PA laws- and Church's- not covered by PA laws.

If you don't like the answer- well tough.

once again from the Colorado PA law
"Place of public accommodation" shall not include a church, synagogue, mosque, or other place that is principally used for religious purposes.

"Place" eh? Freedom of a religious "place"? I don't recall that in the Constitution. But for sake of that argument, let's chase that down shall we? Is a man's heart "a place"? Why yes, it is a physical object that occupies space in the material world. So individual men are not exempt from that protection. Colorado is therefore, in the wrong.

The 1st Amendment protects freedom of religious exercise. Nowhere is that more important to the faithful than in the trenches of temptation: the public venue, not some lofty building with stained glass. The 1st Amendment doesn't say "freedom of Church" or "freedom of pastors" or "freedom of Bible". It says the exercise of religion. A church is where religion sits on a couch and eats bon bons. The EXERCISE of a religion is in the gymnasium of the streets.

 

[Syriusly]

This is a thread about public accommodation laws- and I am showing you the distinction between business's- covered by PA laws- and Church's- not covered by PA laws.

If you don't like the answer- well tough.

once again from the Colorado PA law
"Place of public accommodation" shall not include a church, synagogue, mosque, or other place that is principally used for religious purposes.

"Place" eh? Freedom of a religious "place"? I don't recall that in the Constitution. But for sake of that argument, let's chase that down shall we? Is a man's heart "a place"? Why yes, it is a physical object that occupies space in the material world. So individual men are not exempt from that protection. Colorado is therefore, in the wrong.

The 1st Amendment protects freedom of religious exercise. Nowhere is that more important to the faithful than in the trenches of temptation: the public venue, not some lofty building with stained glass. The 1st Amendment doesn't say "freedom of Church" or "freedom of pastors" or "freedom of Bible". It says the exercise of religion. A church is where religion sits on a couch and eats bon bons. The EXERCISE of a religion is in the gymnasium of the streets.

Then by all means, go to Colorado, and file suit making that Constitutional argument.

I strongly support the right of people to file lawsuit to ask for protection against what they consider to be unconstitutional laws- whether they are Christian bakers, or same gender couples who ant to get married.

 

[QuickHitCurepon]

Who thought baking could be so complicated?

 

[QuickHitCurepon]

Can photographers be forced to do portraits of two gays kissing?

 

[bodecea]

Well, if one has problems with legal marriage of one kind or another, perhaps they should not be in the wedding business.

 

[Conservative65]

"Place of public accommodation" shall not include a church, synagogue, mosque, or other place that is principally used for religious purposes.

I notice you are using obfuscation and repetition to answer my question directly. Don't tell me what Colorado says. Don't tell me what anyone else says. Tell me what either you say or what you believe the US Supreme Court will say when I ask this question (and do it without spamming 5 one-paragraph posts in a row to try to bury the page. I'm not going to forget that I asked you this question.. I'll save it and repost it on the next page and so on until you do)

Does the 1st Amendment say it's freedom of religion meant for individuals or groups of them (churches)?

This is a thread about public accommodation laws- and I am showing you the distinction between business's- covered by PA laws- and Church's- not covered by PA laws.

If you don't like the answer- well tough.

once again from the Colorado PA law

(1) As used in this part 6, "place of public accommodation" means any place of business engaged in any sales to the public and any place offering services, facilities, privileges, advantages, or accommodations to the public, including but not limited to any business offering wholesale or retail sales to the public; any place to eat, drink, sleep, or rest, or any combination thereof; any sporting or recreational area and facility; any public transportation facility; a barber shop, bathhouse, swimming pool, bath, steam or massage parlor, gymnasium, or other establishment conducted to serve the health, appearance, or physical condition of a person; a campsite or trailer camp; a dispensary, clinic, hospital, convalescent home, or other institution for the sick, ailing, aged, or infirm; a mortuary, undertaking parlor, or cemetery; an educational institution; or any public building, park, arena, theater, hall, auditorium, museum, library, exhibit, or public facility of any kind whether indoor or outdoor.

"Place of public accommodation" shall not include a church, synagogue, mosque, or other place that is principally used for religious purposes.

My State has a law on the books that says marriage is between a man and a woman. Do you know what it took to invadlidate that law for the fags? It didn't take a legislative body rewriting it. It took a judge interpreting that it was wrong. If you don't think that can happen here, guess again fool.