Changing Attitudes On Veterans Day

[skye]

Comment:​

Vietnam was a tragedy based on a lie, and had ZERO to do with protecting America from any sort of threat, because duh, despite horror FAKE NEWS of "Domino Theory" Communism is inherently economically incapable of sustaining itself long term. Those boys were used by the government plain and simple. Those boys were used by Lyndon B. Johnson (D-Tx) and the government plain and simple.
I firmly believe that our military would be given more respect and honor if the draft was reinstated. Today, Americans don’t give a damn because the military is currently a tool of the MIC and Deep State. When families have skin in the game they'll pay attention to where/why their children are. Vietnam taught the Elitist Progressive Democrats there is blowback when war is fought and lost for profit and not for Country if there was a draft no friggin way we’d be in the ME

The older I get and the more I learn, the more I realize that just about every single war is based on lies and deceit. It is the worst crime, constantly sending our young men and women in uniform off to die for unjust globalist wars based on false pretexts. I can't wait for the day when more people will wake up.

Beautifully said, Thank you!

 

[Doc7505]

Once we are attacked, I will be willing to do what I can for a war effort. Let some country attack us and the division we see in this country will be on the mend. The words "Democrat" and "Republican" will change to "Us"

Hmmm...., That happened on September 11, 2001 when a group of Muslims flew two planes into the World Trade Towers in NYC. How long did that 'US' last?

 

[Doc7505]

Changing Attitudes On Veterans Day​

Changing Attitudes On Veterans Day | Zero Hedge
11/11/2019 ~ By Kelli Ballard via LibertyNation.com,
Throughout history, there have been conflicts and wars, and the attitude about the engagements – and its warriors – change depending on the public opinion at the time. Consider the medieval era where being a knight was romanticized. They were considered chivalrous with a code that expected them to be pure in both thought and deed. When the brave knights returned after a battle, they were honored and celebrated. Great feasts were given in their name and the ladies swooned and threw lace, ribbons, and other personal effects to show their support – and hopefully catch a legendary hero husband in the process.
But now, let’s flash forward to the Vietnam War and the veterans who suffered not only from wartime injuries (both physical and mental), but also from hostility and disrespect from the very citizens they put their lives on the line to protect. Whether being drafted into service or signing up on their own, young men, boys, and women, did their duty and served their nation. They went into unfamiliar and hostile territory to fight against the enemy; some being injured or even losing their lives. They witnessed atrocities, saw their platoon brethren die, and dreamed of the day when they could return home, to their loved ones. However, when that day came, instead of open, welcoming arms, many veterans were met with anger, people spitting on them, calling them “baby killers.” Far from being worshipped as heroes, as their former soldiers were, Vietnam veterans were harassed and made to feel ashamed for their patriotic service. It took another 20 years after the Vietnam War for Americans to return to respecting their warriors. The first step in the healing process began in 1982 with the dedication of the Vietnam Veterans Memorial. After the Gulf War (1990-91), people began waving flags and celebrating soldiers. Langenus, who had suffered as a Vietnam veteran, and also a veteran of Desert Storm, couldn’t believe the change around.


Comment:
Vietnam was a tragedy based on a lie, and had ZERO to do with protecting America from any sort of threat, because duh, despite horror FAKE NEWS of "Domino Theory" Communism is inherently economically incapable of sustaining itself long term. Those boys were used by the government plain and simple. Those boys were used by Lyndon B. Johnson (D-Tx) and the government plain and simple.
I firmly believe that our military would be given more respect and honor if the draft was reinstated. Today, Americans don’t give a damn because the military is currently a tool of the MIC and Deep State. When families have skin in the game they'll pay attention to where/why their children are. Vietnam taught the Elitist Progressive Democrats there is blowback when war is fought and lost for profit and not for Country if there was a draft no friggin way we’d be in the ME

Point well taken --- when I read "the veterans who suffered not only from wartime injuries (both physical and mental), but also from hostility and disrespect from the very citizens they put their lives on the line to protect" I could not remember the MIC and Bell Helicopter and Raytheon et al, the citizens they put their lives on the line to protect, disrespecting them. The whole picture they paint here is one that frankly I don't recall at all and I have to wonder if it's an ongoing historical revision.

Curious that you single out Lyndon Johnson, when Vietnam spanned two decades that started well before he was POTUS and continued well after. If there's a single figure upon whose feet to lay the blame it should be John Foster Dulles, who threw a hissyfit when France admitted defeat and left Indochina and maneuvered this country into a twenty-year morass, conveniently dying before the shit really hit the fan.

Finally, the military is a tool of the MIC regardless whether there is a draft or not. That's not even related. Orders come from the same direction either way.

The Indo-Chinese war began in 1946, Truman created and sent the first Military Assistance Advisory Group (MAAG).
Dien Bien Phu fell to the Viet Minh in 1954 with the French were required to leave under a partitioning of the country at the 17th parallel . The U.S. directed by Dwight D. Eisenhower assisted South Vietnam with arms and small cadres MAAG to train the new S.V. Army. During the years of 1955 to 1960 U.S. MAAG personnel were rotated out every 90 days to 180 days and they had to speak French fluently. Personnel were taken from all segments of the military. There were never more than 1,000 Americans in Laos or Nam until the Kennedy Administration 11,000 until his assassination and then exploded under Lyndon B. Johnson.
Oh, there's no doubt that the CIA was heavily involved in Nam and their numbers in SE Asia were more than MAAG.
Yes, I singled out LBJ because he expanded the assistance to Nam from small cadres to 500,000 men.

And Nixon expanded into Laos and Cambodia after, and in the other direction Eisenhower got us in there in the first place by being Dulles' yes-man, and that's where it starts. I just said that. No Dulles, no Vietnam.

Thanks, I don't need a history lesson.

Hmmm..., except for the fact that he began the removal of troops from Nam and increased the bombing of Hanoi.

 

[Doc7505]

Changing Attitudes On Veterans Day​

Changing Attitudes On Veterans Day | Zero Hedge
11/11/2019 ~ By Kelli Ballard via LibertyNation.com,
Throughout history, there have been conflicts and wars, and the attitude about the engagements – and its warriors – change depending on the public opinion at the time. Consider the medieval era where being a knight was romanticized. They were considered chivalrous with a code that expected them to be pure in both thought and deed. When the brave knights returned after a battle, they were honored and celebrated. Great feasts were given in their name and the ladies swooned and threw lace, ribbons, and other personal effects to show their support – and hopefully catch a legendary hero husband in the process.
But now, let’s flash forward to the Vietnam War and the veterans who suffered not only from wartime injuries (both physical and mental), but also from hostility and disrespect from the very citizens they put their lives on the line to protect. Whether being drafted into service or signing up on their own, young men, boys, and women, did their duty and served their nation. They went into unfamiliar and hostile territory to fight against the enemy; some being injured or even losing their lives. They witnessed atrocities, saw their platoon brethren die, and dreamed of the day when they could return home, to their loved ones. However, when that day came, instead of open, welcoming arms, many veterans were met with anger, people spitting on them, calling them “baby killers.” Far from being worshipped as heroes, as their former soldiers were, Vietnam veterans were harassed and made to feel ashamed for their patriotic service. It took another 20 years after the Vietnam War for Americans to return to respecting their warriors. The first step in the healing process began in 1982 with the dedication of the Vietnam Veterans Memorial. After the Gulf War (1990-91), people began waving flags and celebrating soldiers. Langenus, who had suffered as a Vietnam veteran, and also a veteran of Desert Storm, couldn’t believe the change around.


Comment:
Vietnam was a tragedy based on a lie, and had ZERO to do with protecting America from any sort of threat, because duh, despite horror FAKE NEWS of "Domino Theory" Communism is inherently economically incapable of sustaining itself long term. Those boys were used by the government plain and simple. Those boys were used by Lyndon B. Johnson (D-Tx) and the government plain and simple.
I firmly believe that our military would be given more respect and honor if the draft was reinstated. Today, Americans don’t give a damn because the military is currently a tool of the MIC and Deep State. When families have skin in the game they'll pay attention to where/why their children are. Vietnam taught the Elitist Progressive Democrats there is blowback when war is fought and lost for profit and not for Country if there was a draft no friggin way we’d be in the ME

Point well taken --- when I read "the veterans who suffered not only from wartime injuries (both physical and mental), but also from hostility and disrespect from the very citizens they put their lives on the line to protect" I could not remember the MIC and Bell Helicopter and Raytheon et al, the citizens they put their lives on the line to protect, disrespecting them. The whole picture they paint here is one that frankly I don't recall at all and I have to wonder if it's an ongoing historical revision.

Curious that you single out Lyndon Johnson, when Vietnam spanned two decades that started well before he was POTUS and continued well after. If there's a single figure upon whose feet to lay the blame it should be John Foster Dulles, who threw a hissyfit when France admitted defeat and left Indochina and maneuvered this country into a twenty-year morass, conveniently dying before the shit really hit the fan.

Finally, the military is a tool of the MIC regardless whether there is a draft or not. That's not even related. Orders come from the same direction either way.

The Indo-Chinese war began in 1946, Truman created and sent the first Military Assistance Advisory Group (MAAG).
Dien Bien Phu fell to the Viet Minh in 1954 with the French were required to leave under a partitioning of the country at the 17th parallel . The U.S. directed by Dwight D. Eisenhower assisted South Vietnam with arms and small cadres MAAG to train the new S.V. Army. During the years of 1955 to 1960 U.S. MAAG personnel were rotated out every 90 days to 180 days and they had to speak French fluently. Personnel were taken from all segments of the military. There were never more than 1,000 Americans in Laos or Nam until the Kennedy Administration 11,000 until his assassination and then exploded under Lyndon B. Johnson.
Oh, there's no doubt that the CIA was heavily involved in Nam and their numbers in SE Asia were more than MAAG.
Yes, I singled out LBJ because he expanded the assistance to Nam from small cadres to 500,000 men.

And Nixon expanded into Laos and Cambodia after, and in the other direction Eisenhower got us in there in the first place by being Dulles' yes-man, and that's where it starts. I just said that. No Dulles, no Vietnam.

Thanks, I don't need a history lesson.

~~~~~~~
Seems you do. Your sense of history has more gaps than between your teeth.

 

[Doc7505]

Logistics for supporting front line soldiers has become greater with each war. Today it takes nine people to supply one front line trooper. During WWII the ratio was 3 to supply one man.

If I'm not mistaken, I think there were around 550,000 troops in Vietnam at its peak with around 50,000 actual combat troops. So, that's half a million of those troops of the 550,000 performing administrative and logistics functions, if true.

I think we have several Vietnam veterans who post here regularly. Perhaps they might chime in and add some perspective on those numbers.

Now you're making wrong conclusions from what I wrote. My statement was about WWII and today's modern Army. Vietnam was in between.

 

[Natural Citizen]

Now you're making wrong conclusions from what I wrote. My statement was about WWII and today's modern Army. Vietnam was in between.

I was trying to stay within the parameters of the op. But whatever. Proceed...

 

[Pogo]

Logistics for supporting front line soldiers has become greater with each war. Today it takes nine people to supply one front line trooper. During WWII the ratio was 3 to supply one man.

If I'm not mistaken, I think there were around 550,000 troops in Vietnam at its peak with around 50,000 actual combat troops. So, that's half a million of those troops of the 550,000 performing administrative and logistics functions, if true.

I think we have several Vietnam veterans who post here regularly. Perhaps they might chime in and add some perspective on those numbers.

Now you're making wrong conclusions from what I wrote. My statement was about WWII and today's modern Army. Vietnam was in between.

You brought up Vietnam. Check your own OP.
Then you want to whine because somebody knows more about it than you do. SMH

 

[whitehall]

Was Vietnam any different from WW1 or Normandy or Korea? Not so much except for the media's support or lack of it and whichever democrat president's negligence was involved. Korea was a legitimate military operation. NK invaded the South and the U.S. was determined to stop the aggression. The problem was that Truman hired an old soldier who served in WW1, and who might have had senior citizen problems, to run the freaking operation. We lost approximately the same amount of Troops as we did in LBJ's adventure in Vietnam because Truman was a timid bureaucrat who couldn't control his general who ordered U.S. forces into the biggest ambush in history. The media couldn't bring themselves to criticize FDR's heir apparent so they called Korea the "forgotten war" and gave Truman and MacArthur a tickertape parade. Vietnam started out as a legitimate operation but LBJ set the rules so that we would win every battle and still lose the freaking war. The CIA was running military operations in Vietnam while the Military sat on the sidelines and soon it became a political war that soured the media. Ironically LBJ quit just when it seemed that the VC was done and the propaganda gave the enemy new life. Democrats managed to blame the whole thing on Nixon anyway.

 

[Gdjjr]

NK invaded the South and the U.S. was determined to stop the aggression.

I've read the constitution several times and I can't find where that power was granted- can you, or someone else, point it out?
I believe the oath that people in DC take is to protect and defend the constitution- it says nothing about aggression on whoever is deemed to be an enemy by whoever ain't- including the current mess in the ME which began under the Dulles regime.
It's funny, in a sad sort of way, that Ike warned us about the MIC in his farewell address- yet he had appointed that Dulles idiot to head up the agency that is at the heart of our most recent (1953 forward) conflicts which is to enrich the MIC and create hegemony.
Communism didn't threaten the constitution. It provided an outlet for coup's and US aggression enriching the MIC while ingraining our society with a militaristic mind set and creating jobs paid for by tax payers creating a Welfare/Warfare state apparatus while establishing a global Empire with world wide colonies- I seriously doubt the founders had that in mind when they created a federal gov't.