Cash for clunkers

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Cash for Clunkers clearly wasn't a success. How could anyone consider a foolish program that ran out of funding a success? Not to mention how it subverts market forces.

At any rate, the Clunkers program isn't going anywhere.

The House voted Friday to transfer $2 billion in emergency funding from the economic stimulus plan to the "cash for clunkers" program, ensuring it has sufficient funds to continue.

The move follows a scramble Thursday after it emerged that the initial $1 billion allocated to the clunkers program may have been close to exhausted after just one week. The legislation would shift $2 billion from the $787 billion stimulus plan to the program.

House Votes to Extend 'Clunkers' Program - WSJ.com

It was a success in popularity

It was a failure in Planning and funding.

Sounds typical for a govt created program

Yes, it was a success in popularity. It was also a success in manipulating the market by convincing people it's a good idea to buy a brand new car they might not be able to afford rather than keeping their used car, and distorting prices in the used car market.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

Cash for Clunkers clearly wasn't a success. How could anyone consider a foolish program that ran out of funding a success? Not to mention how it subverts market forces.

At any rate, the Clunkers program isn't going anywhere.



House Votes to Extend 'Clunkers' Program - WSJ.com

It was a success in popularity

It was a failure in Planning and funding.

Sounds typical for a govt created program

Yes, it was a success in popularity. It was also a success in manipulating the market by convincing people it's a good idea to buy a brand new car they might not be able to afford rather than keeping their used car, and distorting prices in the used car market.

Social engineering.....

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

wah! wah! wah!

You guys are priceless.

Apparently this "Cash for Clunkers" program isn't priceless, however. Going to be $3 billion after the Senate votes for it, but how much more money is going to need to be sunk into this after that? Hard to say. We should have cut our losses after $1 billion.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Those were some excellent points.

Especially this statement "convincing people it's a good idea to buy a brand new car they might not be able to afford "

That was one of my issues with the plan....people are too stupid to know they can't afford stuff as evidenced by the housing market crisis.

 

[Ravi]

wah! wah! wah!

You guys are priceless.

Apparently this "Cash for Clunkers" program isn't priceless, however. Going to be $3 billion after the Senate votes for it, but how much more money is going to need to be sunk into this after that? Hard to say. We should have cut our losses after $1 billion.

I'd say it is wildly successful and that's why all the wingnuts are having a fit. Not including you with the wingnuts, I understand something besides partisan hackery motivates you.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Those were some excellent points.

Especially this statement "convincing people it's a good idea to buy a brand new car they might not be able to afford "

That was one of my issues with the plan....people are too stupid to know they can't afford stuff as evidenced by the housing market crisis.

Well I think the problem is that our current regime thinks that people living beyond their means is the mark of a healthy economy, which couldn't be further from the truth.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

I'd say it is wildly successful and that's why all the wingnuts are having a fit. Not including you with the wingnuts, I understand something besides partisan hackery motivates you.

Never confuse "having a fit" with "laughing at ineptitude and incompetence."

And so far, no "wingnuts" besides yourself have posted in this thread. You should read it from the beginning, your lone brain cell might pick up some knowledge.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Those were some excellent points.

Especially this statement "convincing people it's a good idea to buy a brand new car they might not be able to afford "

That was one of my issues with the plan....people are too stupid to know they can't afford stuff as evidenced by the housing market crisis.

Well I think the problem is that our current regime thinks that people living beyond their means is the mark of a healthy economy, which couldn't be further from the truth.

Lead by example right .

First we had do-do head bush with his crazy defecit spending and people buying homes they couldn't afford.

Now we have do-do head obama with his even crazier than bush's defecit spending and people buying cars they possibly can't afford.


New face, same crap

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

wah! wah! wah!

You guys are priceless.

Apparently this "Cash for Clunkers" program isn't priceless, however. Going to be $3 billion after the Senate votes for it, but how much more money is going to need to be sunk into this after that? Hard to say. We should have cut our losses after $1 billion.

I'd say it is wildly successful and that's why all the wingnuts are having a fit. Not including you with the wingnuts, I understand something besides partisan hackery motivates you.

Well I appreciate you acknowledging I'm not being any kind of partisan in my analysis. However, I don't see how a program that manipulates the market and fails after a week could possibly be considered a success. Would you consider it a bigger success when it blows through it's $2 billion in additional funding in a few more weeks? I'm curious how it's being judged as a success considering these facts.

 

[Ravi]

Apparently this "Cash for Clunkers" program isn't priceless, however. Going to be $3 billion after the Senate votes for it, but how much more money is going to need to be sunk into this after that? Hard to say. We should have cut our losses after $1 billion.

I'd say it is wildly successful and that's why all the wingnuts are having a fit. Not including you with the wingnuts, I understand something besides partisan hackery motivates you.

Well I appreciate you acknowledging I'm not being any kind of partisan in my analysis. However, I don't see how a program that manipulates the market and fails after a week could possibly be considered a success. Would you consider it a bigger success when it blows through it's $2 billion in additional funding in a few more weeks? I'm curious how it's being judged as a success considering these facts.

The purpose of stimulating the economy has been met by this program. Personally, I'd rather see everyone get a nice big check to do as they please but if you accept the overall economic plan I have to say this part of it at least is proving successful.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

I'd say it is wildly successful and that's why all the wingnuts are having a fit. Not including you with the wingnuts, I understand something besides partisan hackery motivates you.

Well I appreciate you acknowledging I'm not being any kind of partisan in my analysis. However, I don't see how a program that manipulates the market and fails after a week could possibly be considered a success. Would you consider it a bigger success when it blows through it's $2 billion in additional funding in a few more weeks? I'm curious how it's being judged as a success considering these facts.

The purpose of stimulating the economy has been met by this program. Personally, I'd rather see everyone get a nice big check to do as they please but if you accept the overall economic plan I have to say this part of it at least is proving successful.

Well that's where we differ then, I think. I don't accept the overall economic plan. However, I still don't see how even in regards to that this could be seen as a success, considering they have to dip into the stimulus money to dump into this black hole of a program.

 

[Oddball]

I'd say it is wildly successful and that's why all the wingnuts are having a fit. Not including you with the wingnuts, I understand something besides partisan hackery motivates you.

Never confuse "having a fit" with "laughing at ineptitude and incompetence."

 

[MaggieMae]

Pretty good demonstration of the stimulus money stimulating the economy, isn't it?

It is a little scary thinking of all the dying people coming out of the wood work to be cured if they can actually afford health care in the near future.

This is not a fix ... its a freaking band aid.
If the free money from the gov err I mean us wasnt there these people wouldn't be purchasing a new vehicle. Id like to see WHO all purchased one ... that'd be interesting.

Free Money and they will come. lol funny to watch this happen. And think if health care is this way. A friend of mine went to Ford to buy his vehicle after the lease was up and said there was a 3 hour wait for paper work. Lets see,if there are 42 million Americans without healthcare and they all of a sudden have it. Wow I wouldn't want to be around a hospital or doctors office wow.

So I guess you'd rather those thousands of new cars did not get sold and that the dealers suffered even more than they already are. I guess you'd rather $94 million (so far) that was put back in circulation is a bad thing. I guess you'd rather see the old hogs rusting in junkyards and doing no one any good at all. I guess you'd rather the people who QUALIFIED for the cash for clunkers deal just buy another old hog that's still running instead of an opportunity of a lifetime. I guess that pretty much defines the I-GOT-MINE-SO-FUCK-YOU generation...

 

[Ravi]

Well I appreciate you acknowledging I'm not being any kind of partisan in my analysis. However, I don't see how a program that manipulates the market and fails after a week could possibly be considered a success. Would you consider it a bigger success when it blows through it's $2 billion in additional funding in a few more weeks? I'm curious how it's being judged as a success considering these facts.

The purpose of stimulating the economy has been met by this program. Personally, I'd rather see everyone get a nice big check to do as they please but if you accept the overall economic plan I have to say this part of it at least is proving successful.

Well that's where we differ then, I think. I don't accept the overall economic plan. However, I still don't see how even in regards to that this could be seen as a success, considering they have to dip into the stimulus money to dump into this black hole of a program.

I don't think it's a black hole of a program. Maybe the economy is just recovering faster than expected...and people are taking advantage of a rather large incentive to buy a new car.

 

[MaggieMae]

The plan worked to serve two purposes:

1 to stimulate new car sales; and

2. to get people out of gas guzzling clukers and into more efficient cars.

Is it working?

I don't know.

What do the car sales look like, and how many gas guzzlers have been traded in to take advantage of this program?

Anyone actually have any figures on this?

Absolutely right.

The theoretical aspect of the program worked correctly.

It was expected to do what it did: encourage the pruchases, and, essentially be a 'targeted tax refund.'

Now, I would have liked to see the Dems support an across the board cut, but Dems like to use the money to make sure that folks do what the Dems want them to do. It worked this time.

Even in times like these, there are approximately 1 million sales per month, so the cash-back was expected to stimulate about one weeks buys. It did.

Now, if I were in charge, I would have done this and the same for homes instead of the Stimulus Pkg, but at this point I would continue the program.

Yes, and of course that worked so well the last two times.

 

[KittenKoder]

Cash for Clunkers is a con game used to take away choices from people with the guise of getting paid for it. Most "clunkers" can be taken to a shop and fixed up really nice for far less than buying a new car, even a frame is valuable to those who restore cars.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

The purpose of stimulating the economy has been met by this program. Personally, I'd rather see everyone get a nice big check to do as they please but if you accept the overall economic plan I have to say this part of it at least is proving successful.

Well that's where we differ then, I think. I don't accept the overall economic plan. However, I still don't see how even in regards to that this could be seen as a success, considering they have to dip into the stimulus money to dump into this black hole of a program.

I don't think it's a black hole of a program. Maybe the economy is just recovering faster than expected...and people are taking advantage of a rather large incentive to buy a new car.

The economy is not recovering, and people are taking advantage of this incentive. However, I'm guessing that most of them can't afford a new car even with this incentive. It's clearly a black hole of a program considering it wasted $1 billion in a week.

 

[Ravi]

Cash for Clunkers is a con game used to take away choices from people with the guise of getting paid for it. Most "clunkers" can be taken to a shop and fixed up really nice for far less than buying a new car, even a frame is valuable to those who restore cars.

How does it take away choices? No one is being forced to participate.

 

[KittenKoder]

Cash for Clunkers is a con game used to take away choices from people with the guise of getting paid for it. Most "clunkers" can be taken to a shop and fixed up really nice for far less than buying a new car, even a frame is valuable to those who restore cars.

How does it take away choices? No one is being forced to participate.

Did you not read the last sentence or are you just blindly endorsing your saviors ideals for the hell of it. Put up an old car in the local want ads and at least one offer will be made for parts, go national and you will get the whole thing sold quite quickly.

Then there is the logic part of it, what other real reason would they have for pushing this program?

 

[MaggieMae]

IF i was looking to get a new vehicle I would have taken advantage of this.

I guess the dealers are making people sign wavers now saying "If the govt doesn't pay up you must return the vehicle or pay the difference"

If I owned a gas guzzler, I DEFINITELY would have.