*Blasting Off The New Year: Muslim Style!*

[Jroc]

I'm not impressed with the cut and paste, No one man opinion's is the right one, No interpretations of the ancient text are set in stone, They are only opinions.

 

[Ropey]

Humm...I can name righteous Jews, and righteous Christians, But I can't really name any righteous muslims of the top of my head?

Then you might need to research Jroc. The loudest voices are often the most frightening and quell the more moderate voices.

Tarek Fatah is a great writer and activist. He lives in constant danger and had to quit his TV show after extremists attempted to capture his daughter in order to behead them.

Now, he is not someone I agree with politically, but that adds to his credibility as he was a (or still is not sure anymore) a supporter of the Left Wing NDP of Canada. He wrote a great series in the National Post about Jihad and the "Mirage" of Sharia and has been the most vocal and active advocate against Sharia in Canada.

Tarek Fatah: The Tragic Illusion of an Islamic State
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-YofXoJHons[/ame]

He did criticize Wafah Sultan for Islamophobia.

It takes both sides to fight, and there are both sides in extreme and moderate thinking.

To think there is no such thing as moderate interpretations of Islam is incorrect. True, the loudest interpretations have been under the control of extremist for nigh on to three generations.

Fanaticism must be fought on a per event and per government basis and not as an attachment to some amorphous 'them" out there. Just like hate must be fought in the same way.

We need to protect our moderates from the fanatics. We don't understand that well in the West, having been birthed to Democracy. We need to protect our minorities from hate and racism. Jews and Muslims et al. This will take a few generations before the Muslims now born here feel safe and a part of Society. Right now we often have moderates cowering and the more fanatical minded controlling.

They have not been protected from their own fanatics in their community, sometimes in their houses, and are subject to approaches we don't often hear about. In Nazi Germany, many Hitler youth turned in not only Jews, but their parents for helping Jews.

Moderate Muslims intimidated in Canada:

Part 1
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWPvuAg4HjI&feature=related[/ame]

Part 2
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKgaVaNagfM&feature=related[/ame]

This is what we need to be supporting. Not an amorphous Islamic "Them" to focus our fear or anger into hate.

There's enough events out there to deal with on a singular level already while many are bemoaning and frothing at "Them".

Which does nothing but legitimize an attachment on a group that never was and never will be.

There is no Jewish "Them" or Christian "Them" either.

 

[chesswarsnow]

Sorry bout that,

1. Sorry old bud, but what is tefilin?

The Torah tells us "And you shall bind them as a sign on your arm, and they shall be as frontlets on your head between your eyes" (Deuteronomy 6:8).

This is the Mitzvah of Tefillin which is the binding of ones heart and soul to G-d. However, how the Torah is interpreted into the book of laws is not more than inspired thinking. So, the laying of the tefillin is only the cultural representation of the traditionally interpreted Tefillin expression in the Torah.

There's a lot of wiggle room in the term "bind them as a sign on your arm, and they shall be as frontlets on your head, between your eyes."

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9NJtJJoVIY[/ame]

That's what I mean by interpretations are at issue, not the belief. I know, you don't see that, but maybe someday. I know you understand my words, just not their connections.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbvkwiFg3Yw[/ame]

2. We haven't gotten into the G-d questions, we are still asking is there *Satan*?

^Slow down, read up^

4. So you killed Muslims because it was kill or be killed?
5. I think thats okay my friend.
6. I just told you, seeing you were protecting your Nation, its justified, relax, theres killing, then theres murder, Muslims just murder, they do it to thier own, and any body who gets in the way, and feel nothing about it, inhuman, at least you are human, and have feelings of guilt, but this guilt is misplaced, forgetabloutit!:

It's not you who will be judging my actions. I personally fought Egyptians. Calling them Muslims indicts all other Muslims into an attachment with this fight.

I won't go there. It's not real to me. It's a lie of words.

1. Oh I knew about how the Jews wrap thier arms with the leather straps and the little leather box and all, thats great and all, I don't understand it much, and I know its tradiional and all, its a part of where the Jews came from and all, but so is alot of things, like the golden calf the Jews made when Moses was up learning from G-d the ten comandments.
2. Thats also there, in the Jewish heritage, but not so good, its still there thou.
3. Theres a lot of things that make up a heritage, our past we draw from, all cultures have them, and its usually based on tradition, things that used to be, but were not always used culturally.
4. The likely hood that anyone but Muslims will attack Israel, is slim, but being PC might keep you out of the lions den, seeing you had to kill an Egyptian or three, in war or whatever, makes no differnce, he was a Muslim for sure, and he would of killed you if he had a chance, and then cut your head off, and swung it around while laughing uncontrolablly, this is just the facts, and not far from the truth either.
5. Stay thirsty my friend.


Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

 

[Sunni Man]

I'm not impressed with the cut and paste, No one man opinion's is the right one, No interpretations of the ancient text are set in stone, They are only opinions.

I know what the Jews believe.

I studied with them for 2 years at a synagogue.

What I posted is very accurate.

Prove me wrong.

 

[Jroc]

I'm not impressed with the cut and paste, No one man opinion's is the right one, No interpretations of the ancient text are set in stone, They are only opinions.

I know what the Jews believe.

I studied with them for 2 years at a synagogue.

What I posted is very accurate.

Prove me wrong.

Well.. since you know it all, What can you learn from me? It's not for me to force my views on you Mr Sunni Man.

 

[Ropey]

I'm not impressed with the cut and paste, No one man opinion's is the right one, No interpretations of the ancient text are set in stone, They are only opinions.

I know what the Jews believe.

I studied with them for 2 years at a synagogue.

What I posted is very accurate.

Prove me wrong.

A FULL EXPLANATION?

Who's explaining Sunni Man? And what is an explanation?

An interpretation????

 

[Ropey]

I know what the Jews believe.

I studied with them for 2 years at a synagogue.

What I posted is very accurate.

Prove me wrong.

What synagogue was this?

 

[Sunni Man]

A FULL EXPLANATION?

Who's explaining Sunni Man? And what is an explanation?

An interpretation????

OK then, tell me what is wrong with the post concerning the Jewish view of Satan?

 

[Jroc]

Then you might need to research Jroc. The loudest voices are often the most frightening and quell the more moderate voices.

I know there is such thing as moderate muslims I just said I couldn’t name any RIGHTOUS muslims off the top of my head, which says something about that religion

 

[Jroc]

A FULL EXPLANATION?

Who's explaining Sunni Man? And what is an explanation?

An interpretation????

OK then, tell me what is wrong with the post concerning the Jewish view of Satan?

Nothing

 

[gautama]

That's simply extreme. To look at the books, one must needs look at the times in which the books were birthed.

When I look to the ancient Hebrew Torah and use pilpul to study Talmud with many other who are more learned than I, there is a marked difference in the approach of ancient Judaism then and how it is practiced today.

The difference, as I said, is interpretive. I know you will not accept this, so I will just agree to disagree with you.

Ropey,

You are correct in that I will OBVIOUSLY disagree with you.

Could be because you are STILL missing my point.

I get the impression that we are in the apple/orange stage.

I am talking about apples.....you responding by talking about oranges.

I agree with you that when we talk about statements by people, when interpreting what they say you must consider the context, and obviously the "times" when that made some things culturally acceptable and others not....example a hottie wearing a bikini.....where here it's not only whether this is in the 50's or today.....but location as well (i.e. Saudi Arabia vs Fort Lauterdale).

But, this should occur when we "INTERPRET" the statement and pronounce judgment on the whole statement !

Example: PSYCHO MOHAMMED stated: "KILL THE MISHRAKUN"

That's a DOCUMENTED FACT. You may "INTERPRET" the statement from all perspectives: Context, Age, Place, etc....BUT YOU CANNOT CHANGE or "MISINTERPRET" THE ACTUAL WORDS INVOLVED in the sentence by Psycho Mohammed.

You can "INTERPRET" Mohammed's statement by saying "that's par for the course". That was a "good" or "bad" thing. Or, it is a "good" or "bad" thing in that period of History..........BUT YOU CANNOT DO ANY "INTERPRETATION" of the fact that Psycho Mohammed actually said the words: ""KILL", "THE", "MISHRAKUN" !!!"

THE WORDS IN "KILLTHE MISHRAKUN" are INVIOLATE..... THE WORDS CANNOT BE CHANGED IN THE PROCESS OF "INTERPRETATION".

And, that my confused friend is what I am stating in my post:

I state the INVIOLATE WORDS of Mohammed, or the people in the HADITH that have given the FINALLY APPROVED ISLAMIC VERSION that has the same INVIOLABILITY as the KORAN'S WORDS........and then......ONLY THEN...... I make my judgment......

And, in most cases I don't even have to "INTERPRET" or make my judgment.

The very words and actions of the PSYCHO Mohammed are so fucking REPULSIVE that NO INTERPRETATION IS NECESSARY.

When I repeatedly state that the PSYCHO Mohammed is a Historically Documented MASS MURDERER, THIEF, PEDOPHILIC RAPIST........Each one of these epithets IS A DOCUMENTED FACT USING THE INVIOLATE WORDS OF THE KORAN and/or THE HADITH !!!

Yes, my conclusion is an "INTERPRETATION". However, if in the Koran or Hadith, the Psycho Mohammed is stated as saying that he actually robbed caravans.....and those words are INVIOLATE then my "INTERPRETATION" of the TRUTH of the subject should be, by all that's sacred in LOGIC, that Psycho Mohammed was a THIEF.

Bottom line: I get the distinct impression that you are confused and doing some "double-talk" to cover up your confusion.

 

[Ropey]

A FULL EXPLANATION?

Who's explaining Sunni Man? And what is an explanation?

An interpretation????

OK then, tell me what is wrong with the post concerning the Jewish view of Satan?

Nothing. And I explained it. Look above and you will see my quote of the question regarding Satan and responded. But you can't say that this interpretation is from the Torah.

An explanation is an interpretations Sunni Man. The Torah is sacrosanct, but the Talmud? Any other books? Holy? Divine? Sorry. Inspired? Yes, but even then, man is not perfect.

So, if you want non-interpretive stuff, then you need go to the Torah. Just as we would need to got to the Qur'an as you stated previously.

You made my point in reverse.

 

[Sunni Man]

I know there is such thing as moderate muslims I just said I couldn’t name any RIGHTOUS muslims off the top of my head, which says something about that religion

“The Role of Righteous Muslim Persons,”

LONDON – A new publication highlighting Muslim acts of heroism during the Holocaust will be published on Wednesday, chronicling the role played by Muslims who defended Jews during World War II.

The 34-page booklet, titled “The Role of Righteous Muslim Persons,” was initiated by Faith Matters, a London-based interfaith organization that works toward reducing extremism and fostering social cohesion in the UK. The aim of the booklet is to inform religious communities and the general public about the littleknown stories of courageous Muslims who stood up against injustice, protecting Jews during the Holocaust.


Guided by their Muslim faith and personal desire to do what was right, they protected and saved the lives of many potential victims. The publication also aims to counter the narrative that no Muslims played a part in the defense of Jewish communities during the War.

The work focuses on people deemed ”Righteous Gentiles” by Jerusalem’s Yad Vashem and highlights the role played by individuals, families and communities in countries such as Albania, Algeria, Tunisia, Morocco, Turkey, Croatia, and Bosnia and Herzegovina.

New booklet reveals Muslim acts of heroism during Holocaust

 

[Ropey]

That's simply extreme. To look at the books, one must needs look at the times in which the books were birthed.

When I look to the ancient Hebrew Torah and use pilpul to study Talmud with many other who are more learned than I, there is a marked difference in the approach of ancient Judaism then and how it is practiced today.

The difference, as I said, is interpretive. I know you will not accept this, so I will just agree to disagree with you.

Ropey,

You are correct in that I will OBVIOUSLY disagree with you.

Could be because you are STILL missing my point.

I get the impression that we are in the apple/orange stage.

I am talking about apples.....you responding by talking about oranges.

I agree with you that when we talk about statements by people, when interpreting what they say you must consider the context, and obviously the "times" when that made some things culturally acceptable and others not....example a hottie wearing a bikini.....where here it's not only whether this is in the 50's or today.....but location as well (i.e. Saudi Arabia vs Fort Lauterdale).

But, this should occur when we "INTERPRET" the statement and pronounce judgment on the whole statement !

Example: PSYCHO MOHAMMED stated: "KILL THE MISHRAKUN"

That's a DOCUMENTED FACT. You may "INTERPRET" the statement from all perspectives: Context, Age, Place, etc....BUT YOU CANNOT CHANGE or "MISINTERPRET" THE ACTUAL WORDS INVOLVED in the sentence by Psycho Mohammed.

You can "INTERPRET" Mohammed's statement by saying "that's par for the course". That was a "good" or "bad" thing. Or, it is a "good" or "bad" thing in that period of History..........BUT YOU CANNOT DO ANY "INTERPRETATION" of the fact that Psycho Mohammed actually said the words: "KILL THE MISHRAKUN !!!"

THE WORDS IN "KILLTHE MISHRAKUN" are INVIOLATE..... THE WORDS CANNOT BE CHANGED IN THE PROCESS OF "INTERPRETATION".

And, that my confused friend is what I am stating in my post:

I state the INVIOLATE WORDS of Mohammed, or the people in the HADITH that have given the FINALLY APPROVED ISLAMIC VERSION that has the same INVIOLABILITY as the KORAN'S WORDS........and then......ONLY THEN...... I make my judgment......

And, in most cases I don't even have to "INTERPRET" or make my judgment.

The very words and actions of the PSYCHO Mohammed are so fucking REPULSIVE that NO INTERPRETATION IS NECESSARY.

When I repeatedly state that the PSYCHO Mohammed is a Historically Documented MASS MURDERER, THIEF, PEDOPHILIC RAPIST........Each one of these epithets IS A DOCUMENTED FACT USING THE INVIOLATE WORDS OF THE KORAN and/or THE HADITH !!!

Yes, my conclusion is an "INTERPRETATION". However, if in the Koran or Hadith, the Psycho Mohammed is stated as saying that he actually robbed caravans.....and those words are INVIOLATE then my "INTERPRETATION" of the TRUTH of the subject should be, by all that's sacred in LOGIC, that Psycho Mohammed was a THIEF.

I get the distinct impression that you are confused and doing some "double-talk" to cover up your confusion.

You've been hanging around idiots and haters. Look at your Caps and Bolds and outrage. Online?

That's not the language or method of those who truly want to discuss.

That's the language of one who wants to demand, and from those kinds of demands springs hate.

Regardless of any book. I could refute all of what you say, but that would change nothing in your mind, so why would I even try.

Go with yours as I go with mine.

 

[Ropey]

1. Okay man, I wasn't getting the answers I was asking for anyways.
2. Stay thirsty my friend.


Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

I put forward that you were not getting the answers you wanted to get.

Then why did you ask questions? For your own answers back.

Just get a tape recorder. Record all this 'stuff' you have and then when you are alone you can listen to your own words.

That's not discussion. You are already on your track. I see that.

I am out of this thread that I wouldn't have normally entered into anyway.

So, it must be for some reason that your title drew me in.

Be well.

 

[chesswarsnow]

Sorry bout that,


1. Sorry but Satan has power in this world, I can't agree with the Jewish teachings on this.
2. And death is in the power of Satan, says so when Adam and Eve followed Satan's will eating the forbiden fruit, they were warned that knowing what good and evil was, and it meant that they had to surely die, because they bowed to another non-god, Satan, this is why men die, because they put another before G-d, which costed Adam and Eve, and costs us too.
3. This may be hard for you to digest, but if there is no Satan, then there is no sin.
4. Because if Satan wasn't real, and was fictional, then being tempted never happened, and no one could of displeased G-d, because no one listened to a false god.
5. There is a battle going on, and this battles is for your souls, and Satan is here in the world, and can kill you, and will kill you and be there when you die.
6. Even G-d sent a reminder to the Jews from Mt. Sinai, *You shall have no other gods before ME*.
7. Thats the first one!
8. G-ds saying, do not follow Satan anymore, but what does Moses find them doing when he comes down from Sinai?
9. Making a god, the golden calf.
10. Who put the Jews up to it?
11. Satan.
12. That is why Moses went back up Sinai, and had G-d, transcribe the second set of tablets, both he and G-d knew Satan did this, and didn't allow the ruler of this world to win, thats why G-d didn't just wipe all the Jews out and start over again with Moses.


Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

 

[Ropey]

Good and Evil

But the tree was knowledge. Nowhere did I say that evil was fictional. You do not read to understand.

My last post to you and advice.

Use your knowledge to make your choices.

If your choices are to vomit hate, then go ahead.

There are more than a few others here on all sides of the divides that will support it.

I won't. Even if you put the platform that ISLAM = Devil that must be fought.

I simply disagree with your interpretation.

Keep yours. I keep mine.

 

[Sunni Man]

Islams view of the the evil one is very similar to Judiasms.

Satan can only do what God allows.

The story of Job illustrates this.

 

[chesswarsnow]

Sorry bout that,

Good and Evil

But the tree was knowledge. Nowhere did I say that evil was fictional. You do not read to understand.

My last post to you and advice.

Use your knowledge to make your choices.

If your choices are to vomit hate, then go ahead.

There are more than a few others here on all sides of the divides that will support it.

I won't. Even if you put the platform that ISLAM = Devil that must be fought.

I simply disagree with your interpretation.

Keep yours. I keep mine.

1. The Jewish interprtation is Satan is fictional, you have been saying there's just good and evil from the beginning of your conversation. *I say thats false!!!!*
2. If there is no Satan, then I say there can be no sin.
3. Thats a *period*.
4. No sin could of ever happened.
5. And we could never sin.
6. And should not of ever had to die.
7. Now you go and keep yours, cause I don't want it.
8. I will keep mine too., thanks.
9. Stay thirsty my friend.
10. And you don't have to respond again, you seem to talk riddles anyways, you can keep it.
11. Also G-d and Satan are not working together, G-d is against Satan, and will some day remove Satan from the earth, till then, humans deal.
12. How do you teach that to your children, "Okay son, G-d and Satan are working together in the earth, just to trick you into sin, its up to you to choose good or evil though, but again then ofcourse, you could of lived for ever but,..to bad, G-d is out to get you!"


Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

 

[chesswarsnow]

Sorry bout that,


1. Thats was some strange dude Ropey.
2. Anyway, Islam is the agent and personally directed by Satan, there is no doubt about it.
3. Look at Islam, and what it condones.
4. Sunni man, hasn't even said it was wrong, or evil, or anything for that matter.
5. He approves of what happened to the Christians in Egypt and Nigeria.
6. If anyone can prove Islam isn't a death cult working for Satan, then get busy doing it.


Regards,
SirJamesofTexas