Best win for Ukraine

[sealybobo]

The problem is Russia never keeps its agreements unless forced to; nobody trusts them and for good reason. They need a completely new regime and govt. culture.

Ultimately we are going to be at the negotiation table with Putin. Someone suggested the other day we call Putin and ask him what he needs to stop this. Chances are he's going to want a section of Ukraine. I think Ukraine is going to have to give it to them. It's probably a part where everyone sympathizes with Russia and speaks Russian. This will allow Putin to say he won and end the war.

Biden needs to make the call.

 

[sealybobo]

If the U.S. is so bad, and NATO is so evil, go over there and live in Russia, land of the free!

I wonder what us Democrats would be saying if Trump were president and helping Ukraine. I suspect nothing.

But Trump wouldn't be supporting Ukraine. Russia would have won already. Don't forget Trump is friends with Russia. Most Republicans are pro Russia. I guess the Ukrainian President should have dug up that dirt on Trump's opponent. Trump warned him in that call. Now look at Ukraine. Typical shake down went wrong.

I suspect Russia is partially doing this to make Biden look bad so they can have Trump back. Collusion? Wouldn't surprise me. Wouldn't be the first time. Not even the 2nd.

When presidential candidate Donald Trump asked Russia to find his 2016 opponent’s emails — i.e., “Russia, if you’re listening” — Republicans hinted that maybe this was a bad idea. So Trump claimed it was a joke. And Republicans moved on and stood by him.

When Trump in 2020 used the presidency to leverage Ukraine for an investigation into his next opponent, a number of Republicans admitted it was unseemly, but said it wasn’t impeachable. They moved on and stood by him. One of them even ventured that Trump had learned a “pretty big lesson” about asking a foreign country to investigate a political rival, and predicted he would “be much more cautious in the future.”

Trump wasn’t joking. He will not be more cautious in the future. And if anything, the big lesson he learned seems to have been that he has so effectively demolished this norm that it no longer encumbers him whatsoever.

When is the last time a really substantial number of Republicans said they liked Putin? Right after Trump won in 2016, and we learned that Russia had interfered to assist in that victory. Favorable GOP views of Putin shot up from 16 percent the previous summer to 37 percent in one poll.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/03/29/trump-putin-political-help/

 

[1srelluc]

Good Lord....This thread is dildos.

 

[Confederate Soldier]

I wonder what us Democrats would be saying if Trump were president and helping Ukraine. I suspect nothing.

But Trump wouldn't be supporting Ukraine. Russia would have won already. Don't forget Trump is friends with Russia. Most Republicans are pro Russia. I guess the Ukrainian President should have dug up that dirt on Trump's opponent. Trump warned him in that call. Now look at Ukraine. Typical shake down went wrong.

I suspect Russia is partially doing this to make Biden look bad so they can have Trump back. Collusion? Wouldn't surprise me. Wouldn't be the first time. Not even the 2nd.

When presidential candidate Donald Trump asked Russia to find his 2016 opponent’s emails — i.e., “Russia, if you’re listening” — Republicans hinted that maybe this was a bad idea. So Trump claimed it was a joke. And Republicans moved on and stood by him.

When Trump in 2020 used the presidency to leverage Ukraine for an investigation into his next opponent, a number of Republicans admitted it was unseemly, but said it wasn’t impeachable. They moved on and stood by him. One of them even ventured that Trump had learned a “pretty big lesson” about asking a foreign country to investigate a political rival, and predicted he would “be much more cautious in the future.”

Trump wasn’t joking. He will not be more cautious in the future. And if anything, the big lesson he learned seems to have been that he has so effectively demolished this norm that it no longer encumbers him whatsoever.

When is the last time a really substantial number of Republicans said they liked Putin? Right after Trump won in 2016, and we learned that Russia had interfered to assist in that victory. Favorable GOP views of Putin shot up from 16 percent the previous summer to 37 percent in one poll.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/03/29/trump-putin-political-help/

Let's be clear, I am no democrat.

 

[sealybobo]

Let's be clear, I am no democrat.

I am

 

[Bleipriester]

If the U.S. is so bad, and NATO is so evil, go over there and live in Russia, land of the free!

Sure thing, Confederate soldier.

 

[Ringo]

The problem is Russia never keeps its agreements

The old lie of the western faggots.

 

[Baron Von Murderpaws]

Easy win for Ukraine.....................

Exterminate this piece of shit and everybody that stands with him...........

 

[Confederate Soldier]

The old lie of the western faggots.

 

[Ringo]

View attachment 767218

Oh yes! A man from a country where faggotry is promoted from kindergarten level shows such a picture... You're a real moron.

 

[DudleySmith]

The old lie of the western faggots.

The hundreds of years old fact about Russians, the one faggots deny. Russian males worship 'Strong Man' leaders like Stalin and Putin.

 

[DudleySmith]

If the U.S. is so bad, and NATO is so evil, go over there and live in Russia, land of the free!

They want to surrender they should go do so. Planes leave for Europe every day.

 

[DudleySmith]

Ultimately we are going to be at the negotiation table with Putin. Someone suggested the other day we call Putin and ask him what he needs to stop this. Chances are he's going to want a section of Ukraine. I think Ukraine is going to have to give it to them. It's probably a part where everyone sympathizes with Russia and speaks Russian. This will allow Putin to say he won and end the war.

Biden needs to make the call.

Most of those vaunted 'Russian citizens' in the Russian occupied parts of Ukraine and Crimea have left; the Russians tanked the economy of the regions and people left. There is nothing to 'negotiate'; Russia can't do squat with their 'conquests'. Cave in to his ludicrous nuclear threats and we have a bigger war in the future. That is over 500 years of Russian history, over 15 invasions of Poland alone, two in the last century. Their occupation of Polish territory preceded WW I so there weren't three invasions in the 20th century technically.

 

[sealybobo]

Most of those vaunted 'Russian citizens' in the Russian occupied parts of Ukraine and Crimea have left; the Russians tanked the economy of the regions and people left. There is nothing to 'negotiate'; Russia can't do squat with their 'conquests'. Cave in to his ludicrous nuclear threats and we have a bigger war in the future. That is over 500 years of Russian history, over 15 invasions of Poland alone, two in the last century. Their occupation of Polish territory preceded WW I so there weren't three invasions in the 20th century technically.

So you are saying we have to stand firm and keep supporting Ukraine?

I don't tend to listen to Republicans because they just want the opposite of what Biden wants. He's probably doing exactly what most of them would do too. Maybe Trump Republicans are isolationists and would just let Russia have Ukraine. It's old USSR property so it's not our business. They didn't say anything when we did Iraq. Did Iraq mean we were trying to take over the world? Well yes. At least the middle east.

The Middle East is the last and maybe only territory the west hasn't completely taken over with our western bankers.

 

[Confederate Soldier]

Oh yes! A man from a country where faggotry is promoted from kindergarten level shows such a picture... You're a real moron.

In very isolated, newsworthy incidents. The overwhelmingly vast majority of teachers are normal people. It's the fags that make the headlines.


Headlines and fantasy sells, not regular news.

 

[Silver Cat]

If you want to win Crymea and Donbass - be ready to lose Alaska and California. Higher stakes - higher possible losses. And US cards are not that good to play this game against Russia.

 

[Baron Von Murderpaws]

View attachment 767218

Looks like the cover of a Beatles album.

 

[AZrailwhale]

If you want to win Crymea and Donbass - be ready to lose Alaska and California. Higher stakes - higher possible losses. And US cards are not that good to play this game against Russia.

I doubt it you could find a hundred people split between the two states that would be willing to be ruled from Moscow. If you are talking about taking them by force, that’s a real belly-laugh. Everybody in Alaska is armed and are rugged individuals, and in California, even the gangs would fight against invaders. That’s not even considering the flood of volunteers from Idaho, Arizona and Nevada. That’s leaving the military completely out of it. There’s generally a reinforced brigade sized unit at Fort Irwin, a Division at Fort Lewis Washington and an armored Division at Fort Hood in Texas.

 

[Confederate Soldier]

Looks like the cover of a Beatles album.

What would that album be called?

Puttin' It in Putin?

 

[Vrenn]

I am going to make a suggestion for Ukraine where they don't win but the don't win. But the drain Russia over and over without a lot of loss of Ukrainian lives.

First of all. Take the Land Bridge to the South of Ukrainia without entering into Crimea. Then take the territory right up to Armyansk and stop there. Now that is done, use the drones and missiles to take out the land bridge at Kerch once again. And sink anything and everything in the sea of Azov. Now, just do skirmishes.

The ONLY reason the Russians want Crimea is for Sevastopol which is the only deep water major depot in that region. They need it to support the Black Sea. The reason that the Russians attacked above Crimea was that the water was cutoff that Crimea direly needs for it's crops. The Ukrainians built a Dam to keep the water from flowing into Crimea in 2014. It was either attack Ukraine or capitulate with Ukraine and trust me, that ain't going to happen and Ukraine wouldn't believe it if Christ, himself, delivered the promise.

Ukraine can't have Russia controlling Crimea because they need to keep a large swath of Ukraine where the Dam used to be that was diverting the water to Crimea. Russia can't have Ukraine controlling Crimea because they lose their only Black Sea deep water port.

But Russia is not going to be able to afford the stalemate for any length of time so they may do something really crazy like NBC weapons. There is another option that maybe both can live with. Crimea has voiced that it may want to be independent from both of them. What happens if it does go that route. Ukraine gets what it wants. Then the Indy Crimea can rent out the deep water port out to Russia for the Black Sea Navy.

I imagine Russia would go along with that until they resupply and then here they come again in full force. What would make it work would be it Crimea would be patrolled by UN Troops.

Not my original idea. Someone else originally thought it up and it sounded the best solution.

As of this morning, Ukraine just took a part of the land bridge in southern Ukraine. And they are marching on Mariupol. When the land bridge is taken, all they have to do is start nailing the bridge that goes from Russia to Crimea that transports trains, trucks and cars. The Ukrainians have already hit the bridge before once and can pound it into the black sea.

After the land bridge is taken and the western bridge is taken down, the rest of Crimea is well within drones and Himars range. That means the Port starts to be disassembled. The UN is not far from getting involved.