basic poll : who do you support, and why? ... Israel rejects calls to scale back attacks

[peacefan]

Israel, respectively the Zionist want to get their hands onto the entire former British Palestine.
They have been using every possible means to pursue that specific agenda, latest since 1948 - thus ignoring refuting around 70 UN resolutions.

There isn't really anything to discuss about - is there? other then for how much longer will the Zionists get away with it.

we can widen this discussion here; Zone1 - why oh why did the Europeans have to start so many colonies?
(i think we should widen it for a while)..

 

[Kruska]

we can widen this discussion here; Zone1 - why oh why did the Europeans have to start so many colonies?
(i think we should widen it for a while)..

This thread is about ISRAEL and not former European/USA Colonialism

As I had stated already - the only thing that can be discussed is "how long will the Zionists manage to get away with their "deeds".
Anything else pertaining to the Israeli-Palestine issue are KNOWN FACTS - some accept it, and some will always refute those KNOWN facts.

Therefore IMO, it's a pure waste of time (okay, my time) to "discuss" about known facts.

 

[peacefan]

This thread is about ISRAEL and not former European/USA Colonialism

As I had stated already - the only thing that can be discussed is "how long will the Zionists manage to get away with their "deeds".
Anything else pertaining to the Israeli-Palestine issue are KNOWN FACTS - some accept it, and some will always refute those KNOWN facts.

Therefore IMO, it's a pure waste of time (okay, my time) to "discuss" about known facts.

ah, you don't know yet that it was a British Jew businessman that 'backed a Zionist state in Palestine', that seems to be one of the pillars that all of the current suffering in Palestine and Israel is built on.

so it's not entirely unrelated, ok.

 

[Kruska]

ah, you don't know yet that it was a British Jew businessman that 'backed a Zionist state in Palestine',

That is known, and he certainly wasn't the only one - so what is there to discuss about?

 

[peacefan]

That is known, and he certainly wasn't the only one - so what is there to discuss about?

you'll find that unless you do widen that discussion, to EU+US colonization+emperial+unipolar thinking and practices, you'll be facing endless war. especially given what Hamas is currently preaching about it (to their youngest!).

 

[Kruska]

you'll find that unless you do widen that discussion, to EU+US colonization+emperial+unipolar thinking and practices, you'll be facing endless war. especially given what Hamas is currently preaching about it (to their youngest!).

You need to widen a futile and meaningless discussion in order to come to the conclusion, that Zionists preach the same bull as e.g. Hamas, (to their youngest)?? you got to be kidding.

Both are nutcases, and both are fighting for the same cake, whilst Israel is already in possession of the cake. And cries and whines every-time when e.g. Hamas is scraping at the topping.

 

[peacefan]

You need to widen a futile discussion in order to come to the conclusion, that Zionists preach the same bull as e.g. Hamas, (to their youngest)?? you got to be kidding.

so you think this is futile? fine, then you shut up first, and i will too, until i find a discussion partner that is willing and able to dig deeper.

 

[peacefan]

I don't think he ever has.

i got more clue than both of you put together will ever have.

 

[Kruska]

so you think this is futile? fine, then you shut up first, and i will too, until i find a discussion partner that is willing and able to dig deeper.

You started this meaningless thread - if you don't like the answers based on known facts, your problem not mine.

 

[peacefan]

You started this meaningless thread - if you don't like the answers based on known facts, your problem not mine.

does this mean you're fine with the concept of an endless war?
from that comfy safe seat you're typing all this warmongering hatred from?
with your incredibly one-sided "facts"? disputed facts at that? after all, the Israelis got a Divine Mandate to "occupy Palestine" (read : migrate into Palestine and pray for good neighbors there).

 

[Kruska]

does this mean you're fine with the concept of an endless war?
from that comfy safe seat you're typing all this warmongering hatred from?

As I had stated already - the only thing that can be discussed is "how long will the Zionists manage to get away with their "deeds".

Since YOU stated that you are fine with 25,000 dead Palestinians, even claiming absurdly that it constitutes a proof towards Israel using precision weapons - guess who the FACTUAL warmonger is??

And "divine mandate"?? so much for lopsidedness and a sick mind, prone towards a distorted view of FACTS.

 

[Grau]

Wrong and useless lies

The king david hotel was not the start of this conflict and it was a retaliation against those wishing to commit genocide against Iseal.

The 1948 was started by arabs


Israel has been consistebntly the victim

Ah, yes,.... where would Israel be without the "victim / pity card"?

Apparently, you're unaware that Palestine's population was about 85% Muslim before the invasion of Nazi trained and armed Zionist terrorist gangs from Europe (1).

These same foreign terrorists destroyed over 500 Muslim town and villages, massacred their residents and even bayonetted pregnant women in the abdomen. (2)

To this day, foreign, militant "Settlers" murder and steal land from Palestine's native residents with the aid of IDF occupiers. (3)

So much for Israel's "victim / pity card".



(1). “Zionism and the Third Reich”
Zionism and the Third Reich

EXCERPT “In cooperation with the German authorities, Zionist groups organized a network of some forty camps and agricultural centers throughout Germany where prospective settlers were trained for their new lives in Palestine. Although the Nuremberg Laws forbid Jews from displaying the German flag, Jews were specifically guaranteed the right to display the blue and white Jewish national banner. The flag that would one day be adopted by Israel was flown at the Zionist camps and centers in Hitler's Germany. /19

Himmler's security service cooperated with the Haganah, the Zionist underground military organization in Palestine. The SS agency paid Haganah official Feivel Polkes for information about the situation in Palestine and for help in directing Jewish emigration to that country. Meanwhile, the Haganah was kept well informed about German plans by a spy it managed to plant in the Berlin headquarters of the SS. /20 Haganah-SS collaboration even included secret deliveries of German weapons to Jewish settlers for use in clashes with Palestinian Arabs. /21

In the aftermath of the November 1938 "Kristallnacht" outburst of violence and destruction, the SS quickly helped the Zionist organization to get back on its feet and continue its work in Germany, although now under more restricted supervision. /22” CONTINUED



(2). “Deir Yasin Massacre, 09.04.1948”

https://www.countercurrents.org/alhelsi100410.htm

EXCERPT " One of the worst Zionist massacres committed against Palestinians is the Deir Yasin massacre. Defenceless Palestinian civilians were tortured before being massacres and their bodies mutilated. Women and children were raped, babies were butchered and pregnant women were bayoneted." CONTINUED


(3). "Israel Must Loudly Arrest the Murderous West Bank Settlers"

Israel Must Loudly Arrest the Settlers Who Are Killing West Bank Palestinians

Or risk losing any moral authority in this war.

slate.com

EXCERPT "Since Hamas’ Oct. 7 attack, settlers there have killed more than 120 Palestinians and injured at least 2,000. They have forcibly expelled more than 800 Palestinians from their homes, blown up their generators and solar panels, and burned down tents of Bedouin herders.

Again: This has been going on not in Gaza but in the West Bank—which is governed by the Palestinian Authority, not by Hamas." CONTINUED

 

[Grau]

You support Hamas.

Greg

I've never said that but I have studied history long enough to to know that native populations have resisted foreign invader / occupiers since the beginning of time.

Apparently, you support Nazi trained and armed Zionist terrorist gangs (1) who commit genocide and even bayonet pregnant women in the abdomen (2).

I can support my claims so not it's your turn to show where I've ever stated support for Hamas.

[sound of crickets]


(1). “Zionism and the Third Reich”
Zionism and the Third Reich

EXCERPT “In cooperation with the German authorities, Zionist groups organized a network of some forty camps and agricultural centers throughout Germany where prospective settlers were trained for their new lives in Palestine. Although the Nuremberg Laws forbid Jews from displaying the German flag, Jews were specifically guaranteed the right to display the blue and white Jewish national banner. The flag that would one day be adopted by Israel was flown at the Zionist camps and centers in Hitler's Germany. /19

Himmler's security service cooperated with the Haganah, the Zionist underground military organization in Palestine. The SS agency paid Haganah official Feivel Polkes for information about the situation in Palestine and for help in directing Jewish emigration to that country. Meanwhile, the Haganah was kept well informed about German plans by a spy it managed to plant in the Berlin headquarters of the SS. /20 Haganah-SS collaboration even included secret deliveries of German weapons to Jewish settlers for use in clashes with Palestinian Arabs. /21

In the aftermath of the November 1938 "Kristallnacht" outburst of violence and destruction, the SS quickly helped the Zionist organization to get back on its feet and continue its work in Germany, although now under more restricted supervision. /22” CONTINUED


(2). “Deir Yasin Massacre, 09.04.1948”

https://www.countercurrents.org/alhelsi100410.htm

EXCERPT " One of the worst Zionist massacres committed against Palestinians is the Deir Yasin massacre. Defenceless Palestinian civilians were tortured before being massacres and their bodies mutilated. Women and children were raped, babies were butchered and pregnant women were bayoneted." CONTINUED

 

[ShahdagMountains]

I've never said that but I have studied history long enough to to know that native populations have resisted foreign invader / occupiers since the beginning of time.

Apparently, you support Nazi trained and armed Zionist terrorist gangs (1) who commit genocide and even bayonet pregnant women in the abdomen (2).

I can support my claims so not it's your turn to show where I've ever stated support for Hamas.

[sound of crickets]


(1). “Zionism and the Third Reich”
Zionism and the Third Reich

EXCERPT “In cooperation with the German authorities, Zionist groups organized a network of some forty camps and agricultural centers throughout Germany where prospective settlers were trained for their new lives in Palestine. Although the Nuremberg Laws forbid Jews from displaying the German flag, Jews were specifically guaranteed the right to display the blue and white Jewish national banner. The flag that would one day be adopted by Israel was flown at the Zionist camps and centers in Hitler's Germany. /19

Himmler's security service cooperated with the Haganah, the Zionist underground military organization in Palestine. The SS agency paid Haganah official Feivel Polkes for information about the situation in Palestine and for help in directing Jewish emigration to that country. Meanwhile, the Haganah was kept well informed about German plans by a spy it managed to plant in the Berlin headquarters of the SS. /20 Haganah-SS collaboration even included secret deliveries of German weapons to Jewish settlers for use in clashes with Palestinian Arabs. /21

In the aftermath of the November 1938 "Kristallnacht" outburst of violence and destruction, the SS quickly helped the Zionist organization to get back on its feet and continue its work in Germany, although now under more restricted supervision. /22” CONTINUED


(2). “Deir Yasin Massacre, 09.04.1948”

https://www.countercurrents.org/alhelsi100410.htm

EXCERPT " One of the worst Zionist massacres committed against Palestinians is the Deir Yasin massacre. Defenceless Palestinian civilians were tortured before being massacres and their bodies mutilated. Women and children were raped, babies were butchered and pregnant women were bayoneted." CONTINUED

Scrolled.

Your excesses are excessive.

 

[GLASNOST]

i got more clue than both of you put together will ever have.

Not even possible so don't embarrass yourself even further by making such a statement.

 

[peacefan]

As I had stated already - the only thing that can be discussed is "how long will the Zionists manage to get away with their "deeds".

Since YOU stated that you are fine with 25,000 dead Palestinians, even claiming absurdly that it constitutes a proof towards Israel using precision weapons - guess who the FACTUAL warmonger is??

And "divine mandate"?? so much for lopsidedness and a sick mind, prone towards a distorted view of FACTS.

halt it right there, "buddy"...

the Muslims in that region claim just as hard that they have a divine mandate of their own to drive the Israelis out of what they still consider to be "their lands".

and yes, let's see if the Palestinians are smart enough to understand that the price of attacking Israelis went way up since Oct 7th.

 

[Grau]

Anyone who is firmly acquainted with the Zionist agenda (known since it's very beginning) is fully aware that Israels goal is to gain control over the entire former British Palestine (including former Trans-Jordan). Since the latter aka Jordan is a US ally - the Zionists will have to think about other means to get their hands onto Jordan as well.
The Zionists have succeeded since 1948 to paint the PLO etc. as terrorist organizations that wants to destroy Israel, whilst denying the Palestinians any right towards self-determination. Israel therefore is in dire need of Palestinian/Muslim terrorist activities in order to further their own agenda.
It is foremost due to the rise of China and a Putin in Russia, that the "known" world-order is being challenged - aka the USA, and as such also Israels main supporter.

The EU is already in disarray - since they need to balance their economic interests with China and Russia, with the political/economic interests of and towards the USA. Africa, the Middle-East, Asia and South-America are in vast majority in a favorable position towards China and Russia.

The "new" world order is getting into place - no doubt IMO, and therefore "antisemitism" as the known Israeli propaganda tool is dying out. There is a reason as to why Israels aka the Zionists new enemy #1 is the UN. And IMO it is reasonable to say that Israel will be on the international sanctions and embargo list within the next 5 years in an increasing manner.

The USA is fully aware of this - and therefore in order to gain or at least keep their support and position in the UN, even the USA will sacrifice their undying support towards the Zionist agenda. After all, who the heck in the respective US government, cares about some 7 million Jews in Israel and it's subsidized economy - if it endangers the position of the USA on the world stage? there are far bigger issues at stake, just my 2 cents.

There's little I can add to your excellent observations except to note that ethical Jews around the world and in Israel condemn Zionist genocide (1) and recognize the fraudulence of the worn out "anti Semite card" (2)

Thanks and keep up the good work.






(1). “A Textbook Case of Genocide”

“Israel has been explicit about what it’s carrying out in Gaza. Why isn’t the world listening?”

A Textbook Case of Genocide

Israel has been explicit about what it’s carrying out in Gaza. Why isn’t the world listening?

jewishcurrents.org

EXCERPT " I have written about settler colonialism and Jewish supremacy in Israel, the distortion of the Holocaust to boost the Israeli arms industry, the weaponization of antisemitism accusations to justify Israeli violence against Palestinians, and the racist regime of Israeli apartheid. “

“Israeli Minister of Defense Yoav Gallant declared it in no uncertain terms on October 9th: “We are imposing a complete siege on Gaza. No electricity, no food, no water, no fuel. Everything is closed. We are fighting human animals, and we will act accordingly.”

Indeed, Israel’s genocidal assault on Gaza is quite explicit, open, and unashamed. Perpetrators of genocide usually do not express their intentions so clearly,

Israel’s goal is to destroy the Palestinians of Gaza. And those of us watching around the world are derelict in our responsibility to prevent them from doing so.” CONTINUED


(2). "Don’t be caught out by ‘the trick'

Don’t be caught out by ‘the trick'

In August 2002 former Israeli Minister of Education Shulamit Aloni was interviewed on the radio and television program Democracy Now .

www.scoop.co.nz

EXCERPTS "“Well, it’s a trick, we always use it. When from Europe somebody is criticizing Israel, then we bring up the Holocaust. When in this country people are criticizing Israel, then they are anti-Semitic.....

And it’s very easy to blame people who criticize certain acts of the Israeli government as anti-Semitic, and to bring up the Holocaust, and the suffering of the Jewish people, and that is to justify everything we do to the Palestinians.”CONTINUED

Shulamit Aloni

 

[Grau]

Scrolled.

Your excesses are excessive.

In other words, you can't refute a word I've both written and supported.

 

[ShahdagMountains]

In other words, you can't refute a word I've both written and supported.

How can l refute something l didn’t read?

 

[GLASNOST]

halt it right there, "buddy"...

the Muslims in that region claim just as hard that they have a divine mandate of their own to drive the Israelis out of what they still consider to be "their lands".

and yes, let's see if the Palestinians are smart enough to understand that the price of attacking Israelis went way up since Oct 7th.

You're wrong about all of that. The Palestinians have been slowly pushed up against the wall. And just like when the Russians could be pushed no more ... all hell broke loose. Before very long the Zionists will be battening down the hatches in a bunker and when it's S.R.O. the US will have to dismantle the Statue of Liberty to make room for cheap emergency housing developments.