AT&T Spokesgirl, "Lily" Now Shouting Her Abortion. Pathetic.

[Mashmont]

because fetuses aren't babies. They can't live outside the womb, and in most cases, they are smaller than a kidney bean when they are aborted.

Fetuses are babies according to Merriam Webster, and what does that baby's size have to do with anything? What does living outside the womb have to do with anything?

Uh, guy, the purpose of a business is to make money, not provide jobs and benefits. The best business in the world is one with no employees.

Not sure how you can encourage people who don't really like each other that much to marry. "Here, I don't really like you and the sex was mediocre, but I'm going to sign away half my stuff to you!" Tell me in what universe that makes sense.

What does your definition of 'the purpose' of a business have to do with the fact that most Americans earn their livelihood through them?

Um, actually, no. that was the number of RECORDED abortions in states that legalized it. In states where it was illegal, OB/GYN's wrote something else on the charts.

Here's how you can tell there were just as many abortion. The birth rate in 1973 didn't drop. It actually went up in 1974.

Wrong, United States abortion rates, 1960-2013

Uh, no. Making abortion illegal will not save a single fetus, and a lot of women will end up getting maimed. And frankly given what an utter failure the war on drugs has been, I'm not sure why you would make such a retarded comparison.

Wrong about the drugs. Legality has led to more addictions.

Marijuana Legalization Has Led To More Use And Addiction While Illegal Market Continues To Thrive - RiverMend Health

It comes as no surprise that the prevalence of marijuana use has significantly increased over the last decade. With marijuana legal for recreational use in four states and the District of Columbia and for medical use in an additional 31 states, the public perception about marijuana has shifted...

www.rivermendhealth.com

Abortions will drop once illegalized as well. It only stands to reason. There is a segment that will follow the law.

 

[Mashmont]

But yet you can't say why Trump was 'bad', even though by your admission he was more conservative than everybody on your list.

And this question remains unanswered by Golfing Gator.

 

[bodecea]

And this question remains unanswered by Golfing Gator.

You haven't had an abortion, have you?

 

[hjmick]

I see Mushmouth's idiocy is still active...

 

[JoeB131]

Wow, this clown can be wrong about so much....

Full term babies can't survive outside the womb either. They require medical and parental help.

But they won't die immediately, that's the point. It actually takes open neglect.

You've never run a business, have you? There are actually other purposes for a business besides making money and, if your purpose is other than making money - enjoyment of the work, personal gratification, helping others, etc., then having no employees can be a great way run a business.

But to make money almost always takes employees.

First, I do run a business.
Secondly, as the Capitalists always tell us, it's about profit, not employees... except now employees are telling them to go **** themselves in the "Great Resignation".

How about people that don't like each other don't have sex? Since making a child is always the risk of having sex, consider before having sex that you might be making a child. You should not have sex with someone you're not willing to consider as a parent for your children and with whom you're not willing to spend much of the rest of your life.

Actually, you don't have to make a child. If contraception fails, you always have abortion.

As always, abortion is about just one thing: sex with out consequences - unless of course you're the child product of that sex; the unborn child suffers the consequences.

Fetuses aren't babies.

The birth rate went up because it was the sexual revolution. Sex outside of marriage was exploding but not every child that resulted from that sex was murdered. If OB/GYNs were doing abortions without recording it then you have no way of knowing they did it; you're making it up.

Actually, we know this because the OB/GYN's admitted as much. Also, the birth rate didn't go up because of the Sexual Revolution. The birth rate did go up between 1946 and 1965, but it dropped off after 1965 when birth control pills became widely available. It did not drop further in 1973 when abortion became legal.

Making abortion illegal will save most babies. Most women aren't going into the alley with a coat hanger. But for those who do, I'm completely OK if they come out of the alley maimed or in a body bag. Just as I'm OK with an armed robber taking a bullet in the head from a liquor store owner, or a home invader taking a bullet, I'm OK with a mother who would murder her child dying from her (moral) crime.

Ah, the open misogyny of the Right Wing.

Here's the thing. If you want to look at a country that has the kinds of laws you want, you can look at the Philippines.

Abortion is illegal in the Philippines except for threats to the mother's life.

And how is that working out for them.

Unintended Pregnancy and Unsafe Abortion in the Philippines

CONTRACEPTIVE USE IS LOW • In 2011, 49% of married Filipino women were using any method of contraception, slightly higher than the proportion in 1998 (47%), but lower than the proportion in 2008 (51%). • Many women are unable to achieve their desired family size, in part because modern method...

www.guttmacher.org

• The Philippines abortion law is among the strictest in the world. Abortion is illegal under all circumstances and there are no explicit exceptions. Nonetheless, because of high levels of unintended pregnancy, abortion is common in the country. Projections that were based on the national abortion rate in 2000 (the most recent available) and that took into account population increase estimated that 560,000 abortions occurred in 2008 and 610,000 abortions took place in 2012.

But the unwanted kids who were born were better off, right?

Philippines has 1.8M abandoned kids - North Shore

digitaledition.chicagotribune.com

The Philippines has an abandoned children problem. About 1.8 million children in the country, more than 1 percent of its entire population, are “abandoned or neglected,” according to the United Nations' Children's Rights & Emergency Relief Organization.

 

[JoeB131]

Fetuses are babies according to Merriam Webster, and what does that baby's size have to do with anything? What does living outside the womb have to do with anything?

Actually, kind of has everything to do with it, when you are asking a woman to undergo the health effects and economic strains of pregnancies they don't want.

Wrong,

The chart shows REPORTED abortions. Most illegal abortions went UNREPORTED before 1973, that was the point.

Wrong about the drugs. Legality has led to more addictions.

No, it really hasn't. Cannabis isn't addictive.

Abortions will drop once illegalized as well. It only stands to reason. There is a segment that will follow the law.

Actually, that's what idiots said about Prohibition, and no, it didn't.

Go up one post and read about abortion policy in the Philippines.... A country much more religious than ours is, with a lot less freedom than we have.

 

[BackAgain]

Or when Romney wins........

That boredtoseeya! Such a dull hack.

 

[BackAgain]

I don't know....he might still win the Presidency......if he didn't, Liarbility wouldn't be here anymore....in any form. After all, he stands by his bets..............

If only it had been a bet. It ceased being a bet — as boredtoseeya knows — once the other party got bounced off the board.

But I command boredtoseeya to try her hackery some more. No worries. She will.

 

[Mashmont]

Actually, kind of has everything to do with it, when you are asking a woman to undergo the health effects and economic strains of pregnancies they don't want.

So what you call the child/babyfetus in the womb has 'everything to do with it"? That's stupid as hell. It makes no sense.

The chart shows REPORTED abortions. Most illegal abortions went UNREPORTED before 1973, that was the point.

Guttmacher Institute reports illegal abortions dropped only about 120,000 between 1972 and 1974. Legal abortions rose during the same period from 587.000 to 899,000. That's a whopping net increase of over 200,000 in those three years before and after Roe. Ouch.

No, it really hasn't. Cannabis isn't addictive.

Yep, it is. Cannabis Addiction and the Brain: a Review

Actually, that's what idiots said about Prohibition, and no, it didn't.

Go up one post and read about abortion policy in the Philippines.... A country much more religious than ours is, with a lot less freedom than we have.

Alcohol use dropped during Prohibition. Alcohol Consumption During Prohibition. Philippines' banning of abortion is a great thing. Many less children killed.

Looks like you're 0 for 4, Skippy. And the links prove it. Maybe best for you to admit defeat and stop arguing.

 

[JoeB131]

So what you call the child/babyfetus in the womb has 'everything to do with it"? That's stupid as hell. It makes no sense.

I was specifically talking about VIABILITY. If it can't live outside the womb, IT'S NOT A BABY. It's a fetus, and it's disposable

Guttmacher Institute reports illegal abortions dropped only about 120,000 between 1972 and 1974. Legal abortions rose during the same period from 587.000 to 899,000. That's a whopping net increase of over 200,000 in those three years before and after Roe. Ouch.

Not really. Again, you only have a very rough measure of illegal abortion because the doctors performing them were not reporting it.

A MUCH BETTER measure would be the birth rate.

Live Births and Birth Rates, by Year

The following table shows the number of live births and the crude birth rate (births per 1,000 total population) in the United States between 1910 and 2023. A 2024 provisional update follows the...

www.infoplease.com

The birth rate in 1972 was 3,258,411. The birth rate in 1973 was 3,136,965. The birth rate in 1974 was 3,159,958. In short, we were ONLY seeing a drop in live births of about 100K a year. To get to your absurd number of 300,000 excess abortions, that would mean women were having extra pregnancies just to abort them.

Alcohol use dropped during Prohibition. Alcohol Consumption During Prohibition.

Um, not really. Obviously, you never heard of Al Capone. Prohibition actually damaged the economy by destroying the country's fifth largest industry, put millions of people out of work, enabled organized crime and undermined respect for law and order. President Harding himself broke the law and had wild drinking parties in the White House.

From your own link...

During the next several years, however, alcohol consumption increased sharply, to about 60-70 percent of its pre-prohibition level. The level of consumption was virtually the same immediately after Prohibition as during the latter part of Prohibition, although consumption increased to approximately its pre-Prohibition level during the subsequent decade.

Philippines' banning of abortion is a great thing. Many less children killed.

If you think grinding poverty, abandoned children, women being maimed in illegal abortions are "good" things, um yes. Here's the thing, you don't see American women signing up to be Mail Order Brides to the Philippines, you see Filipinas signing up to be mail order brides to this country.

Looks like you're 0 for 4, Skippy. And the links prove it. Maybe best for you to admit defeat and stop arguing.

Your links are shit, Mush mouth.

 

[Mashmont]

I was specifically talking about VIABILITY. If it can't live outside the womb, IT'S NOT A BABY. It's a fetus, and it's disposable

Who says 'viability' should be the determinant as to whether you can kill a child? That's arbitrary nonsense no different that any other developmental marker. Life begins when the child is conceived. Period. That's 100% scientific.

Not really. Again, you only have a very rough measure of illegal abortion because the doctors performing them were not reporting it.

A MUCH BETTER measure would be the birth rate.

Live Births and Birth Rates, by Year

The following table shows the number of live births and the crude birth rate (births per 1,000 total population) in the United States between 1910 and 2023. A 2024 provisional update follows the...

www.infoplease.com

The birth rate in 1972 was 3,258,411. The birth rate in 1973 was 3,136,965. The birth rate in 1974 was 3,159,958. In short, we were ONLY seeing a drop in live births of about 100K a year. To get to your absurd number of 300,000 excess abortions, that would mean women were having extra pregnancies just to abort them.

You can't use birth rate because it ignores other trends. In the early 70s we were coming off the baby boom, so births were on the decline anyway. Leftwing pollster Guttmacher came up with the estimates of illegal abortions in those years. You're saying you know more than they do?

Um, not really. Obviously, you never heard of Al Capone. Prohibition actually damaged the economy by destroying the country's fifth largest industry, put millions of people out of work, enabled organized crime and undermined respect for law and order. President Harding himself broke the law and had wild drinking parties in the White House.

From your own link...

During the next several years, however, alcohol consumption increased sharply, to about 60-70 percent of its pre-prohibition level. The level of consumption was virtually the same immediately after Prohibition as during the latter part of Prohibition, although consumption increased to approximately its pre-Prohibition level during the subsequent decade.

Read your own quote, skippy. The rise in alcohol usage towards the end of prohibition still left is considerably short (60-70%) of pre-prohibition usage.

If you think grinding poverty, abandoned children, women being maimed in illegal abortions are "good" things, um yes. Here's the thing, you don't see American women signing up to be Mail Order Brides to the Philippines, you see Filipinas signing up to be mail order brides to this country.

If you think maimed little babies by the millions is a good thing, um, yes. It's a shame some stupid women put their lives at risk by going to these shady vile back-alley baby-killers. Those fake "doctors" are the ones who should be gone after. Again, it's no different than heroin addicts risking their lives to go to the back-alley heroin dealers. It doesn't mean we make it legal so that even more people are maimed.

Your links are shit, Mush mouth.

You keep getting defeated. 0 for 4 again. Just admit it and QUIT. Be a man, not a troll.

 

[bodecea]

Actually, kind of has everything to do with it, when you are asking a woman to undergo the health effects and economic strains of pregnancies they don't want.


The chart shows REPORTED abortions. Most illegal abortions went UNREPORTED before 1973, that was the point.


No, it really hasn't. Cannabis isn't addictive.



Actually, that's what idiots said about Prohibition, and no, it didn't.

Go up one post and read about abortion policy in the Philippines.... A country much more religious than ours is, with a lot less freedom than we have.

I'm guessing Mushmouth never was pregnant.

 

[Mashmont]

I'm guessing Mushmouth never was pregnant.

Bye, troll.
That was easy.

 

[Superbadbrutha]

And this question remains unanswered by Golfing Gator.

There must be a thousand threads on this forum explaining why he is a POS.

 

[bodecea]

Bye, troll.
That was easy.

So, you can't stand the debate and run away? That's not surprising.

 

[bodecea]

Who says 'viability' should be the determinant as to whether you can kill a child? That's arbitrary nonsense no different that any other developmental marker. Life begins when the child is conceived. Period. That's 100% scientific.

You can't use birth rate because it ignores other trends. In the early 70s we were coming off the baby boom, so births were on the decline anyway. Leftwing pollster Guttmacher came up with the estimates of illegal abortions in those years. You're saying you know more than they do?


Read your own quote, skippy. The rise in alcohol usage towards the end of prohibition still left is considerably short (60-70%) of pre-prohibition usage.


If you think maimed little babies by the millions is a good thing, um, yes. It's a shame some stupid women put their lives at risk by going to these shady vile back-alley baby-killers. Those fake "doctors" are the ones who should be gone after. Again, it's no different than heroin addicts risking their lives to go to the back-alley heroin dealers. It doesn't mean we make it legal so that even more people are maimed.


You keep getting defeated. 0 for 4 again. Just admit it and QUIT. Be a man, not a troll.

I even bet you haven't marked "organ donor" on your driver's license...............so much for being pro-life.

 

[Mashmont]

So, you can't stand the debate and run away? That's not surprising.

You're not debating, troll. You're asking the same dumbass question over and over.

 

[Zincwarrior]

I was specifically talking about VIABILITY. If it can't live outside the womb, IT'S NOT A BABY. It's a fetus, and it's disposable



Not really. Again, you only have a very rough measure of illegal abortion because the doctors performing them were not reporting it.

A MUCH BETTER measure would be the birth rate.

Live Births and Birth Rates, by Year

The following table shows the number of live births and the crude birth rate (births per 1,000 total population) in the United States between 1910 and 2023. A 2024 provisional update follows the...

www.infoplease.com

The birth rate in 1972 was 3,258,411. The birth rate in 1973 was 3,136,965. The birth rate in 1974 was 3,159,958. In short, we were ONLY seeing a drop in live births of about 100K a year. To get to your absurd number of 300,000 excess abortions, that would mean women were having extra pregnancies just to abort them.


Um, not really. Obviously, you never heard of Al Capone. Prohibition actually damaged the economy by destroying the country's fifth largest industry, put millions of people out of work, enabled organized crime and undermined respect for law and order. President Harding himself broke the law and had wild drinking parties in the White House.

From your own link...

During the next several years, however, alcohol consumption increased sharply, to about 60-70 percent of its pre-prohibition level. The level of consumption was virtually the same immediately after Prohibition as during the latter part of Prohibition, although consumption increased to approximately its pre-Prohibition level during the subsequent decade.



If you think grinding poverty, abandoned children, women being maimed in illegal abortions are "good" things, um yes. Here's the thing, you don't see American women signing up to be Mail Order Brides to the Philippines, you see Filipinas signing up to be mail order brides to this country.


Your links are shit, Mush mouth.

How is the War on Drugs going?

 

[JoeB131]

Who says 'viability' should be the determinant as to whether you can kill a child? That's arbitrary nonsense no different that any other developmental marker. Life begins when the child is conceived. Period. That's 100% scientific.

Viability is the determinant of whether or not it is a child. 2/3rd of conceived zygote never attach to the uterine wall. We don't hold funerals for tampons.

200,000 Pregnancies miscarry. We don't treat every miscarriage as a murder investigation.

You can't use birth rate because it ignores other trends. In the early 70s we were coming off the baby boom, so births were on the decline anyway. Leftwing pollster Guttmacher came up with the estimates of illegal abortions in those years. You're saying you know more than they do?

Except the birthrate DIDN'T Decline. It leveled off. Which means there wasn't an increase in abortions when they became legal.

Read your own quote, skippy. The rise in alcohol usage towards the end of prohibition still left is considerably short (60-70%) of pre-prohibition usage.

If you criminalize an action and ONLY reduce it's occurrence by 30%, that's a complete ******* failure. In fact, the government KNEW it was a failure, which is why they sheepishly repealed prohibition.

If you think maimed little babies by the millions is a good thing, um, yes. It's a shame some stupid women put their lives at risk by going to these shady vile back-alley baby-killers. Those fake "doctors" are the ones who should be gone after. Again, it's no different than heroin addicts risking their lives to go to the back-alley heroin dealers. It doesn't mean we make it legal so that even more people are maimed.

You miss the point, Mushmouth. Woman are going to get abortions whether they are legal or not. If a country like the Philippines (More religious and less free than ours) bans abortions and ends up having MORE abortions per capita than the US, that's probably a sign of what a fools errand prohibition is.

 

[Mashmont]

Viability is the determinant of whether or not it is a child.

Ridiculous made-up statement. Summarily dismissed.

200,000 Pregnancies miscarry. We don't treat every miscarriage as a murder investigation.

Just like we don't have murder investigations over heart attacks. But murders we do. Did you have a point?

Except the birthrate DIDN'T Decline. It leveled off. Which means there wasn't an increase in abortions when they became legal.

Birthrates declined, then rose again. In other words, they are an unreliable measure of illegal abortions as you claimed.

If you criminalize an action and ONLY reduce it's occurrence by 30%, that's a complete ******* failure. In fact, the government KNEW it was a failure, which is why they sheepishly repealed prohibition.

30% or 200,000 saved lives is a failure. Another ridiculous statement. Summarily dismissed

You miss the point, Mushmouth. Woman are going to get abortions whether they are legal or not. If a country like the Philippines (More religious and less free than ours) bans abortions and ends up having MORE abortions per capita than the US, that's probably a sign of what a fools errand prohibition is.

I already demonstrated how every activity that was illegalized was reduced. Philippines has fewer per capita abortions our numbers do not include R-486. Everything you say is wrong, and has proven to be wrong. And there is no need for me to keep proving them wrong. This conversation is over. You lost.