Aren't we violating ALL Muslim's 1st Amendment rights?

[emilynghiem]

Re: Amir Taheri: "Islam Is Incompatible With Democracy"

The head of Houston CAIR cited principles given by Mohammad
which enforced democratic and religious freedom.

The shortcut I would offer, is for Muslims to hold a conference over whether
the natural laws and Constitution are "sent by God."

If so, these laws are supposed to followed and respected as part of "all sent by God."

So then the concepts of religious freedom, due process BEFORE depriving liberties,
and equal protection of the laws would be "given by God" through the Constitution.

If this is agreed upon by all Muslims, it can more readily be enforced
to prevent and deter violations of due process, as with terrorist/jihadists
who execute and punish without first proving which wrongdoers committed violations.

CAIR is a front for the Muslim Brotherhood and is an unindicted co-conspirator in the HolyLands Foundation scandal.

There is usually an Islamist ulterior motive behind everything they say and do.

And rather than trying to invent or discover or figure out excuses for what they do or say I just assume that whatever they do or say is to further their goal of establishing a global caliphate.

Dear [MENTION=45791]Mojo2[/MENTION]:

1. The friend with CAIR I mentioned has Christian/Baptist preachers in his own family and works alongside other Christians; respects the laws in the Bible equally which he IS supposed to follow according to Islam. His view of the Christian faith in Jesus is similar to other people who respect Christians, laws and practices, though they may not understand Jesus directly only indirectly. At least he is not like the stereotypes or corrupt people you hear of or know, but I know this man personally as straightforward, honest and not trying to cover up for anything negative. In fact, he tries to correct problems at the source so there is peace. He has won peace and justice awards for his work and outreach in the community, which is all based on conflict resolution principles that the peace and justice movement believes in.

2. As for the concept offered:
What do you think of that idea?

Of asking Muslim American leaders to consider recognizing
Constitutional laws as "divinely inspired" natural principles of govt as "sent by God"
so that these are included with:
Christian scripture, Jewish Torah and Muslim Quran.

Would this help reinforce "due process" and "religious freedom"
"equal protections" and "checks and balances/separation of power"
if the Constitutional laws were recognized as given by God?

What do you think?

 

[Mojo2]

The head of Houston CAIR cited principles given by Mohammad
which enforced democratic and religious freedom.

The shortcut I would offer, is for Muslims to hold a conference over whether
the natural laws and Constitution are "sent by God."

If so, these laws are supposed to followed and respected as part of "all sent by God."

So then the concepts of religious freedom, due process BEFORE depriving liberties,
and equal protection of the laws would be "given by God" through the Constitution.

If this is agreed upon by all Muslims, it can more readily be enforced
to prevent and deter violations of due process, as with terrorist/jihadists
who execute and punish without first proving which wrongdoers committed violations.

CAIR is a front for the Muslim Brotherhood and is an unindicted co-conspirator in the HolyLands Foundation scandal.

There is usually an Islamist ulterior motive behind everything they say and do.

And rather than trying to invent or discover or figure out excuses for what they do or say I just assume that whatever they do or say is to further their goal of establishing a global caliphate.

Dear [MENTION=45791]Mojo2[/MENTION]:

1. The friend with CAIR I mentioned has Christian/Baptist preachers in his own family and works alongside other Christians; respects the laws in the Bible equally which he IS supposed to follow according to Islam. His view of the Christian faith in Jesus is similar to other people who respect Christians, laws and practices, though they may not understand Jesus directly only indirectly. At least he is not like the stereotypes or corrupt people you hear of or know, but I know this man personally as straightforward, honest and not trying to cover up for anything negative. In fact, he tries to correct problems at the source so there is peace. He has won peace and justice awards for his work and outreach in the community, which is all based on conflict resolution principles that the peace and justice movement believes in.

2. As for the concept offered:
What do you think of that idea?

Of asking Muslim American leaders to consider recognizing
Constitutional laws as "divinely inspired" natural principles of govt as "sent by God"
so that these are included with:
Christian scripture, Jewish Torah and Muslim Quran.

Would this help reinforce "due process" and "religious freedom"
"equal protections" and "checks and balances/separation of power"
if the Constitutional laws were recognized as given by God?

What do you think?

 

[Luddly Neddite]

Read and memorize the first 5 words of the First Amendment.

Pay especially close attention to the word "congress".

Whatcha think?

Oh yeah Luddly, it says it right there doesn't it? The right for religious people to murder themselves and kill as many as they can while doing it.

Even when the 1st Amendment was written, it did not give religious rights to Satanists back then who killed.

Yes, actually it did give First Amendment rights to any and all religions, including satanism.

In post #5, Mojo says, "To my mind..." His mind, your mind, my mind doesn't matter. What matters is the SCOTUS.

Read the first five words of the First Amendment:

"Congress shall make no law ..."

The OP asks "Aren't we violating ALL Muslim's 1st Amendment rights?"

(I suspect he meant to write "... all AMERICAN Muslim's ... " but let's ignore that.)

How are we "violating" anyone's First Amendment rights? EXACTLY when and where did "Congress make a law" that violates anyone's First Amendment rights?

THAT is what I'm talking about.

Every frikken day, some RW starts whining about the First Amendment but they never bother to understand it.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

.
Don't worry about Muslims' 1st Amendment rights, they've fixed it for us:

"Malaysia's top court on Monday upheld a government ban forbidding non-Muslims from using "Allah" to refer to God, rejecting an appeal by the Roman Catholic Church that argued that the ban failed to consider the rights of minorities in the mostly Muslim nation."

Malaysia's top court forbids non-Muslims from using 'Allah' - IBNLive

Now we know how we should express ourselves. Thank you "somebody up there".


.

You sure?

You really want to give up YOUR First Amendment rights?

Or, are you saying we should pick and choose which Americans get First Amendment protection and which ones don't?

That is exactly what the RW is saying when they try to stop marriage equality, equal pay for equal work for all Americans, etc.

Before you start taking rights away from some Americans, think hard about what rights you're willing to give up.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

Aren't we violating ALL Muslim's 1st Amendment rights?

Is it Unfair to Make Muslims Follow an Untrue Religion?

The TRUE religion is practiced by the terrorists and Fundamentalists.

Why are they called FUNDAMENTALISTS?

Because they get as close to what the Prophet said and they follow it as closely as possible.

Fundamentals.

Old School.

The MODERATE Muslims practice a lesser interpretation of Islam.

We, America non-Muslims, smile on Islam and Muslims only because we assume all Muslims will follow the FALSE Islam.

We EXPECT all Muslims to follow the lesser interpretation. The FALSE interpretation.


But what about what THEY think and feel and believe?

By expecting all Muslims to be the moderate kind of Muslims aren't we IMPOSING our religious vision on them???

Aren't we violating the Muslim's 1st Amendment rights?

Is it Unfair to Make Muslims Follow an Untrue Religion?

I have no problem with their beliefs until they start killing people who don't believe the same thing. That is when they violate other people's rights, and when I get to react with whatever force I feel needed to defend those rights.

Violence, killing, violating other people's rights - those are not First Amendment issues.

 

[Mojo2]

Aren't we violating ALL Muslim's 1st Amendment rights?

Is it Unfair to Make Muslims Follow an Untrue Religion?

The TRUE religion is practiced by the terrorists and Fundamentalists.

Why are they called FUNDAMENTALISTS?

Because they get as close to what the Prophet said and they follow it as closely as possible.

Fundamentals.

Old School.

The MODERATE Muslims practice a lesser interpretation of Islam.

We, America non-Muslims, smile on Islam and Muslims only because we assume all Muslims will follow the FALSE Islam.

We EXPECT all Muslims to follow the lesser interpretation. The FALSE interpretation.


But what about what THEY think and feel and believe?

By expecting all Muslims to be the moderate kind of Muslims aren't we IMPOSING our religious vision on them???

Aren't we violating the Muslim's 1st Amendment rights?

Is it Unfair to Make Muslims Follow an Untrue Religion?

I have no problem with their beliefs until they start killing people who don't believe the same thing. That is when they violate other people's rights, and when I get to react with whatever force I feel needed to defend those rights.

Violence, killing, violating other people's rights - those are not First Amendment issues.

So, basically, you are saying its okay to talk, plan, discuss, recruit, proselytize, and foment for the violent or the non-violent overthrow of America just as long as the perps are careful enough not to get caught or else be a man and die for martyrdom.

Yeah, and that's not a viable option in my book.

 

[Mojo2]

.
Don't worry about Muslims' 1st Amendment rights, they've fixed it for us:

"Malaysia's top court on Monday upheld a government ban forbidding non-Muslims from using "Allah" to refer to God, rejecting an appeal by the Roman Catholic Church that argued that the ban failed to consider the rights of minorities in the mostly Muslim nation."

Malaysia's top court forbids non-Muslims from using 'Allah' - IBNLive

Now we know how we should express ourselves. Thank you "somebody up there".


.

You sure?

You really want to give up YOUR First Amendment rights?

Or, are you saying we should pick and choose which Americans get First Amendment protection and which ones don't?

That is exactly what the RW is saying when they try to stop marriage equality, equal pay for equal work for all Americans, etc.

Before you start taking rights away from some Americans, think hard about what rights you're willing to give up.

How to prevent the Muslims from taking over (using stealth/terrorism and our own laws and emotional tendencies against us) without violating the Constitution or the bounds of PC.

My oh my. It looks like it's just the thing for the team who are most adept at lying, fabricating the truth, spreading lies, rumors and innuendo. For parsing the truth and pandering to any and everyone.

Yes, we just MIGHT have to hope the cunning Liberals in Congress and the Senate will figure out some way of saving us from the threat of Islamic conquest and in so doing, perhaps, save us from ourselves.

A PC solution to stop Islamic encroachment.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

.
Don't worry about Muslims' 1st Amendment rights, they've fixed it for us:

"Malaysia's top court on Monday upheld a government ban forbidding non-Muslims from using "Allah" to refer to God, rejecting an appeal by the Roman Catholic Church that argued that the ban failed to consider the rights of minorities in the mostly Muslim nation."

Malaysia's top court forbids non-Muslims from using 'Allah' - IBNLive

Now we know how we should express ourselves. Thank you "somebody up there".


.

You sure?

You really want to give up YOUR First Amendment rights?

Or, are you saying we should pick and choose which Americans get First Amendment protection and which ones don't?

That is exactly what the RW is saying when they try to stop marriage equality, equal pay for equal work for all Americans, etc.

Before you start taking rights away from some Americans, think hard about what rights you're willing to give up.

How to prevent the Muslims from taking over (using stealth/terrorism and our own laws and emotional tendencies against us) without violating the Constitution or the bounds of PC.

My oh my. It looks like it's just the thing for the team who are most adept at lying, fabricating the truth, spreading lies, rumors and innuendo. For parsing the truth and pandering to any and everyone.

Yes, we just MIGHT have to hope the cunning Liberals in Congress and the Senate will figure out some way of saving us from the threat of Islamic conquest and in so doing, perhaps, save us from ourselves.

A PC solution to stop Islamic encroachment.

 

[Mojo2]

You sure?

You really want to give up YOUR First Amendment rights?

Or, are you saying we should pick and choose which Americans get First Amendment protection and which ones don't?

That is exactly what the RW is saying when they try to stop marriage equality, equal pay for equal work for all Americans, etc.

Before you start taking rights away from some Americans, think hard about what rights you're willing to give up.

How to prevent the Muslims from taking over (using stealth/terrorism and our own laws and emotional tendencies against us) without violating the Constitution or the bounds of PC.

My oh my. It looks like it's just the thing for the team who are most adept at lying, fabricating the truth, spreading lies, rumors and innuendo. For parsing the truth and pandering to any and everyone.

Yes, we just MIGHT have to hope the cunning Liberals in Congress and the Senate will figure out some way of saving us from the threat of Islamic conquest and in so doing, perhaps, save us from ourselves.

A PC solution to stop Islamic encroachment.

I can see a couple of points which might be yuk-worthy.

Which one(s) struck your fancy?

The bolded text?

You are not very well informed if you doubt the intent of islam is to create a single global Caliphate.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

How to prevent the Muslims from taking over (using stealth/terrorism and our own laws and emotional tendencies against us) without violating the Constitution or the bounds of PC.

My oh my. It looks like it's just the thing for the team who are most adept at lying, fabricating the truth, spreading lies, rumors and innuendo. For parsing the truth and pandering to any and everyone.

Yes, we just MIGHT have to hope the cunning Liberals in Congress and the Senate will figure out some way of saving us from the threat of Islamic conquest and in so doing, perhaps, save us from ourselves.

A PC solution to stop Islamic encroachment.

I can see a couple of points which might be yuk-worthy.

Which one(s) struck your fancy?

The bolded text?

You are not very well informed if you doubt the intent of islam is to create a single global Caliphate.

I think it's pretty safe to say that I'm a lot more "well informed" about Islam than you are.

But by all means, continue to live in fear of "Islamic conquest" if it makes you feel better.

 

[Mojo2]

I can see a couple of points which might be yuk-worthy.

Which one(s) struck your fancy?

The bolded text?

You are not very well informed if you doubt the intent of islam is to create a single global Caliphate.

I think it's pretty safe to say that I'm a lot more "well informed" about Islam than you are.

But by all means, continue to live in fear of "Islamic conquest" if it makes you feel better.

Claiming ignorance is your better defense, I think.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

I can see a couple of points which might be yuk-worthy.

Which one(s) struck your fancy?

The bolded text?

You are not very well informed if you doubt the intent of islam is to create a single global Caliphate.

I think it's pretty safe to say that I'm a lot more "well informed" about Islam than you are.

But by all means, continue to live in fear of "Islamic conquest" if it makes you feel better.

Claiming ignorance is your better defense, I think.

Is that where you've gotten "informed"?

Poorly-made youtube videos?

Color me not the slightest bit shocked.

 

[SAYIT]

How do you know what "true" Islam is?

Are fundamentalist Christians the only "true" Christians?

Well, the fundamentalists MAY follow the TRUE religion or the moderates may be the ones who are following the true religion.

But, American law seems to APPROVE of peaceful Islam but frowns on the Islam which is obviously antagonistic to our laws and way of life and customs.

And in answer to your question, the person or people who abide by the written word of the Koran should be given the benefit of being the true followers and those who fail to follow the written word of the Koran should not be considered a true follower.

I'm guessing you're being facetious but your premise is silly. The 1st Amendment right of anyone to express their beliefs ends where it infringes upon another's rights.

 

[Mojo2]

I think it's pretty safe to say that I'm a lot more "well informed" about Islam than you are.

But by all means, continue to live in fear of "Islamic conquest" if it makes you feel better.

Claiming ignorance is your better defense, I think.

Is that where you've gotten "informed"?

Poorly-made youtube videos?

Color me not the slightest bit shocked.

There you go reaching for the race card.

Here are some more interesting facts you probably aren't yet aware of.

According to WND, Obama has been wearing this ring since his days at Harvard Law School….

As a student at Harvard Law School, then-bachelor Barack Obama’s practice of wearing a gold band on his wedding-ring finger puzzled his colleagues.

Now, newly published photographs of Obama from the 1980s show that the ring Obama wore on his wedding-ring finger as an unmarried student is the same ring Michelle Robinson put on his finger at the couple’s wedding ceremony in 1992.

Moreover, according to Arabic-language and Islamic experts, the ring Obama has been wearing for more than 30 years is adorned with the first part of the Islamic declaration of faith, the Shahada: “There is no god except Allah.”
The WND story does a great job of breaking down this whole mystery. If you have not read that entire article yet, I encourage you to do so right here.

So why would Barack Obama (who is supposedly a “Christian”) be wearing a ring that expresses devotion to Islam all these years?

Could it just be an innocent mistake?

Once someone points out to him what the ring really says will he take it off?

Or does Barack Obama really do have an affinity for Islam?

After all, he certainly has said a whole bunch of nice things about Islam over the years. I documented many of these in my previous article entitled “10 Quotes By Barack Obama About Islam Contrasted With 10 Quotes By Barack Obama About Christianity“.

Of course Barack Obama is free to believe whatever he wants. If he wants to be a Freemason, a Muslim, a Hindu or something else that is his choice.

But what the American people deserve is honesty. In November they are electing someone to lead the entire nation. Is it too much to expect the candidates to be open and honest about their pasts and about what they truly believe?

And don’t think that I am giving Romney a pass either. If anyone out there has any information about weird stuff that he is carrying around I will be glad to do an article about that as well.

» Obama?s Lucky Charms: A Ring That Says ?There Is No God Except Allah? Alex Jones' Infowars: There's a war on for your mind!

But then I don't want to derail my own thread!

LOL

 

[theDoctorisIn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=He-ukB9n9oQ

Claiming ignorance is your better defense, I think.

Is that where you've gotten "informed"?

Poorly-made youtube videos?

Color me not the slightest bit shocked.

There you go reaching for the race card.

Here are some more interesting facts you probably aren't yet aware of.

According to WND, Obama has been wearing this ring since his days at Harvard Law School….

As a student at Harvard Law School, then-bachelor Barack Obama’s practice of wearing a gold band on his wedding-ring finger puzzled his colleagues.

Now, newly published photographs of Obama from the 1980s show that the ring Obama wore on his wedding-ring finger as an unmarried student is the same ring Michelle Robinson put on his finger at the couple’s wedding ceremony in 1992.

Moreover, according to Arabic-language and Islamic experts, the ring Obama has been wearing for more than 30 years is adorned with the first part of the Islamic declaration of faith, the Shahada: “There is no god except Allah.”
The WND story does a great job of breaking down this whole mystery. If you have not read that entire article yet, I encourage you to do so right here.

So why would Barack Obama (who is supposedly a “Christian”) be wearing a ring that expresses devotion to Islam all these years?

Could it just be an innocent mistake?

Once someone points out to him what the ring really says will he take it off?

Or does Barack Obama really do have an affinity for Islam?

After all, he certainly has said a whole bunch of nice things about Islam over the years. I documented many of these in my previous article entitled “10 Quotes By Barack Obama About Islam Contrasted With 10 Quotes By Barack Obama About Christianity“.

Of course Barack Obama is free to believe whatever he wants. If he wants to be a Freemason, a Muslim, a Hindu or something else that is his choice.

But what the American people deserve is honesty. In November they are electing someone to lead the entire nation. Is it too much to expect the candidates to be open and honest about their pasts and about what they truly believe?

And don’t think that I am giving Romney a pass either. If anyone out there has any information about weird stuff that he is carrying around I will be glad to do an article about that as well.

» Obama?s Lucky Charms: A Ring That Says ?There Is No God Except Allah? Alex Jones' Infowars: There's a war on for your mind!

But then I don't want to derail my own thread!

LOL

Huh?

How exactly did I "reach for the race card"? I haven't mentioned a word about race.

As for your Alex Jones nonsense: snopes.com: Obama's Wedding Ring

 

[SAYIT]

.
Don't worry about Muslims' 1st Amendment rights, they've fixed it for us:

"Malaysia's top court on Monday upheld a government ban forbidding non-Muslims from using "Allah" to refer to God, rejecting an appeal by the Roman Catholic Church that argued that the ban failed to consider the rights of minorities in the mostly Muslim nation."

Malaysia's top court forbids non-Muslims from using 'Allah' - IBNLive

Now we know how we should express ourselves. Thank you "somebody up there". .

The intolerance, injustice, tyranny and oppression of other countries isn't really at issue on this thread.

 

[Mojo2]

How do you know what "true" Islam is?

Are fundamentalist Christians the only "true" Christians?

Well, the fundamentalists MAY follow the TRUE religion or the moderates may be the ones who are following the true religion.

But, American law seems to APPROVE of peaceful Islam but frowns on the Islam which is obviously antagonistic to our laws and way of life and customs.

And in answer to your question, the person or people who abide by the written word of the Koran should be given the benefit of being the true followers and those who fail to follow the written word of the Koran should not be considered a true follower.

I'm guessing you're being facetious but your premise is silly. The 1st Amendment right of anyone to express their beliefs ends where it infringes upon another's rights.

For anyone to try to pretend there's nothing wrong or worrisome about Foreigners coming here and increasing their numbers here in the USA to serve the acknowledged goal of their leadership is the subversion of our Government, our form of government and our way of life and our subjection and our standing still and allowing it to happen without raising a finger to stop it, well that is the height of silliness.

 

[SAYIT]

Read and memorize the first 5 words of the First Amendment.

Pay especially close attention to the word "congress".

Whatcha think?

Oh yeah Luddly, it says it right there doesn't it? The right for religious people to murder themselves and kill as many as they can while doing it.

Even when the 1st Amendment was written, it did not give religious rights to Satanists back then who killed.

Yes, actually it did give First Amendment rights to any and all religions, including satanism.

In post #5, Mojo says, "To my mind..." His mind, your mind, my mind doesn't matter. What matters is the SCOTUS.

Read the first five words of the First Amendment:

"Congress shall make no law ..."

The OP asks "Aren't we violating ALL Muslim's 1st Amendment rights?"

(I suspect he meant to write "... all AMERICAN Muslim's ... " but let's ignore that.)

How are we "violating" anyone's First Amendment rights? EXACTLY when and where did "Congress make a law" that violates anyone's First Amendment rights?

THAT is what I'm talking about.

Every frikken day, some RW starts whining about the First Amendment but they never bother to understand it.

But MOJO isn't the RW, Loony Nutty.

 

[SAYIT]

I have no problem with their beliefs until they start killing people who don't believe the same thing. That is when they violate other people's rights, and when I get to react with whatever force I feel needed to defend those rights.

Violence, killing, violating other people's rights - those are not First Amendment issues.

So, basically, you are saying its okay to talk, plan, discuss, recruit, proselytize, and foment for the violent or the non-violent overthrow of America just as long as the perps are careful enough not to get caught or else be a man and die for martyrdom.

Yeah, and that's not a viable option in my book.

If I didn't know the subject was violent Islamism I would think you were referring to some of the "Christian" Identity, skinhead, neo-Nazi or Patriot Militia Movements.

 

[Mojo2]

Is that where you've gotten "informed"?

Poorly-made youtube videos?

Color me not the slightest bit shocked.

There you go reaching for the race card.

Here are some more interesting facts you probably aren't yet aware of.

According to WND, Obama has been wearing this ring since his days at Harvard Law School….

As a student at Harvard Law School, then-bachelor Barack Obama’s practice of wearing a gold band on his wedding-ring finger puzzled his colleagues.

Now, newly published photographs of Obama from the 1980s show that the ring Obama wore on his wedding-ring finger as an unmarried student is the same ring Michelle Robinson put on his finger at the couple’s wedding ceremony in 1992.

Moreover, according to Arabic-language and Islamic experts, the ring Obama has been wearing for more than 30 years is adorned with the first part of the Islamic declaration of faith, the Shahada: “There is no god except Allah.”
The WND story does a great job of breaking down this whole mystery. If you have not read that entire article yet, I encourage you to do so right here.

So why would Barack Obama (who is supposedly a “Christian”) be wearing a ring that expresses devotion to Islam all these years?

Could it just be an innocent mistake?

Once someone points out to him what the ring really says will he take it off?

Or does Barack Obama really do have an affinity for Islam?

After all, he certainly has said a whole bunch of nice things about Islam over the years. I documented many of these in my previous article entitled “10 Quotes By Barack Obama About Islam Contrasted With 10 Quotes By Barack Obama About Christianity“.

Of course Barack Obama is free to believe whatever he wants. If he wants to be a Freemason, a Muslim, a Hindu or something else that is his choice.

But what the American people deserve is honesty. In November they are electing someone to lead the entire nation. Is it too much to expect the candidates to be open and honest about their pasts and about what they truly believe?

And don’t think that I am giving Romney a pass either. If anyone out there has any information about weird stuff that he is carrying around I will be glad to do an article about that as well.

» Obama?s Lucky Charms: A Ring That Says ?There Is No God Except Allah? Alex Jones' Infowars: There's a war on for your mind!

But then I don't want to derail my own thread!

LOL

Huh?

How exactly did I "reach for the race card"? I haven't mentioned a word about race.

As for your Alex Jones nonsense: snopes.com: Obama's Wedding Ring

They told me Muslims haven't much of a sense of humor.

Color me not the slightest bit shocked.

You mentioned the word "color' and that prompted my quip about the race card. I guess there wasn't much humor to work with there in the first place.

And just as you, who for all we know, could be an apologist for Islam and have made your way into the hierarchy of this forum, so must we presume that other peaceful Muslims have made their way into the offices of Snopes just as they have made their way into the WH and the State Dept. and the Pentagon.