Are Old Movies Really Better

[iamwhatiseem]

I don't know, I mean in the past 5 years - I would say hell yes. But hopefully it looks just maybe the insanity of Hollywood choosing messaging and woke as priority #1 - is finally ending.
So perhaps we can get back to making movies again.

 

[Flopper]

Yep, proper diction was a thing back in the day.

I can watch a old movie on TCM and not have a bit of trouble understanding what they say.

Anything past the mid-60s and it's turn on the subtitles time.

Most movie audiences in 30s and 40s, grew up watching silent movies. When sound came to the movies, audiences were very interesting in what actors had to say because the story was told in dialogue and the story was very important. Silent screen stars took diction lessons to learn how to delivery lines. This is why so many movie star in the 30's came from the theater. They knew how to delivery lines clearly and use vocal techniques such as tone, pace, and volume that would enhanced their character or contributed to the story.

Today, in many movies, the actors lines are far less important than the action, the sex, the music, and the spectacle created by CGI.

 

[OhPleaseJustQuit]

At the beginning of the 1930s the movies were not very good.
The acting and directing and production was poor quality.
But by the end of the 1930s the movie production and quality was magnificent.
Some of the greatest movies were made in the late 30s.
Each of the decades had their own style.
I do searches for movies by the year or by the decade.

.

"Casablanca" 1942 -- incredible actors, set decor and costuming, music and humor.

 

[Blaster]

My favorite Western was Shane.

 

[JLW]

The trouble with newer films, and this applies to television, is that nothing is subtle anymore. It is all in your face. No innuendo, Nothing left to the imagination. One does not need to be so explicit in actions and words. I know it sounds prudish. It probably is.

 

[Flopper]

Maybe, but probably not. Of all the films made in the past ..... say ..... 20 years what percent of them are "good"? Not much, huh. But do the same during the 1950s. Not much, huh. You (we) remember the good films but can't even name 80% of the films made under any given period. There are many reasons why the majority of modern films are rubbish but there are a lot of reasons why the majority old films were too.

Most movie regardless of when they were made are not that good simply because making a good movie is hard.

When I say good, I mean an interesting story with a script and good acting that engages the audience and makes the movie memorable.

 

[Flopper]

The trouble with newer films, and this applies to television, is that nothing is subtle anymore. It is all in your face. No innuendo, Nothing left to the imagination. One does not need to be so explicit in actions and words. I know it sounds prudish. It probably is.

Unless the movie is in the hands of a great director a more subtle movie is most likely to be
considered a boring movie today. It really takes a lot of skill to build a story and memorable characters when the audience has little patience with a slowly developing plot and characters.

 

[toobfreak]

I find that movies made in the last 25 years are generally not worth watching,

That is just about when I stopped going to the movie theater.

The best older films are not only more entertaining, they’re more meaningful. Classic films, with a particular peak in the 1930s and '40s, placed a strong emphasis on storytelling.

Very true. Like you, I've watched and followed old movies along with the growth of Hollywood.

1. IMO, probably the most epic film ever made was actually 'Metropolis,' and that was make in the late 20s (silent film, too!)
2. Hollywood evolved very quickly in the 1930s.
3. Movie makers generally pick the best, most fresh ideas first. Today, Hollywood is plum out of ideas and everything is a remake of an old idea.
4. Old movies had no special effects, no computer CAD, they generally didn't even have color in the 30s, 40s, and much of the 50s, so, all they had was great acting and great scripts--- there was nothing else other than a good story to draw audiences to the theater.
5. Today, good actors are gone. The great actors of old starved, scratched and clawed to make it. They knew hard times. Today, most actors are children of great actors, up and coming yuppies--- they have never had to scratch and claw for anything, They have no acting skill (much of the passion of great old actors came out of The Depression and WWII), and they hide bad films, bad actors and bad scrips behind special effects now--- today, the actors and script are just a footing for all of the dazzling special effects. Frankly, I'm sick and tired of visual graphics--- used judiciously, they can ADD to a good movie, not MAKE it.
6. By the 60s, they added color and big budgets, and between then and the 90s, the 70s and 80s had the best combination of cinematic skill, writing, new ideas, the budget, and the technology now to bring new experiences never before seen and formerly impossible to do to the screen. This brought us stuff like Star Wars, Terminator, Indiana Jones, Blade, Close Encounters, and a hundred other epic movies.
7. By the time the 90s came, Hollywood was running out of ideas. Since then, films are mostly about exploiting the idea of an old film that was a big hit to hope to squeeze more money out of it, and just exploring new ideas and technology in computer-aided effects.

I can see a time in the not too distant future where the whole movie/Hollywood thing will be a bust.

Let's face it: reality-TV sucks. But it is dirt cheap to produce.

TV is following suit. Gone are the days of Voyage To The Bottom Of The Sea, Star Trek, Beverly Hillbillies, or Batman. Today, we are lucky if every 5-10 years, they come out with a new great hit like Taxi, Cheers, Seinfeld, or The Big Bang Theory.

 

[OhPleaseJustQuit]

That is just about when I stopped going to the movie theater.


Very true. Like you, I've watched and followed old movies along with the growth of Hollywood.

1. IMO, probably the most epic film ever made was actually 'Metropolis,' and that was make in the late 20s (silent film, too!)
2. Hollywood evolved very quickly in the 1930s.
3. Movie makers generally pick the best, most fresh ideas first. Today, Hollywood is plum out of ideas and everything is a remake of an old idea.
4. Old movies had no special effects, no computer CAD, they generally didn't even have color in the 30s, 40s, and much of the 50s, so, all they had was great acting and great scripts--- there was nothing else other than a good story to draw audiences to the theater.
5. Today, good actors are gone. The great actors of old starved, scratched and clawed to make it. They knew hard times. Today, most actors are children of great actors, up and coming yuppies--- they have never had to scratch and claw for anything, They have no acting skill (much of the passion of great old actors came out of The Depression), and they hide bad films, bad actors and bad scrips behind special effects now--- today, the actors and script are just a footing for all of the dazzling special effects. Frankly, I'm sick and tired of visual graphics--- used judiciously, they can ADD to a good movie, not MAKE it.
6. By the 60s, they added color and big budgets, and between then and the 90s, the 70s and 80s had the best combination of cinematic skill, writing, new ideas, the budget, and the technology now to bring new experiences never before seen and formerly impossible to do to the screen. This brought us stuff like Star Wars, Terminator, Indiana Jones, Blade, Close Encounters, and a hundred other epic movies.
7. By the time the 90s came, Hollywood was running out of ideas. Since then, films are mostly about exploiting the idea of an old film that was a big hit to hope to squeeze more money out of it, and just exploring new ideas and technology in computer-aided effects.

I can see a time in the not too distant future where the whole movie/Hollywood thing will be a bust.

Let's face it: reality-TV sucks. But it is dirt cheap to produce.

TV is following suit. Gone are the days of Voyage To The Bottom Of The Sea, Star Trek, Beverly Hillbillies, or Batman. Today, we are lucky if every 5-10 years, they come out with a new great hit like Taxi, Cheers, Seinfeld, or The Big Bang Theory.

.

All well said.


.

 

[toobfreak]

That's why they were called "screenplays". They were plays made into movies.

Actually, the screenplay refers to the shooting production order; the set up for shooting the scenes to translate the written script onto the big screen--- how the script "plays" on the screen.

 

[toobfreak]

The chances are what is being said is immaterial. As a sexy Hollywood starlet in a B movie said, "I gotta say something." The director replied, "You're doing what you are being paid to do."

In the early days, actors were on contract with studios. The question was raised how a great actress like Susan Oliver never grew to be a feature starlet! Who was she you ask? Case in point, she was one of the greatest female stars of all time.

But early in her career, she was under contract with Warner Studios and Warner cast her in some movie that was really bad and she hated it so she refused to do it and broke her contract. Mr. Warner blacklisted her for that and ruined her career in films and most of what she did after that ended up on television. BTW, Susan was in most everything on TV, even if you didn't know her name.

 

[toobfreak]

Prior to 1940, Wall Street and big business showed little interest in the movie industry. It was considered a risky investment, and the unfavorable risk-reward ratio deterred most investors. However, in the late 1930s, several key developments caught Wall Street’s attention. The release of the first full-length color feature film, followed by the massive success of The Wizard of Oz and Gone with the Wind, convinced investors that there was serious money to be made in Hollywood.

Soon as they saw big money to be made in films, they were attracted. Do not forget:

• The advent of films and television pretty much killed radio.
• The advent of television forever influenced and changed the direction of films.

 

[OhPleaseJustQuit]

In the early days, actors were on contract with studios. The question was raised how a great actress like Susan Oliver never grew to be a feature starlet! Who was she you ask? Case in point, she was one of the greatest female stars of all time.

But early in her career, she was under contract with Warner Studios and Warner cast her in some movie that was really bad and she hated it so she refused to do it and broke her contract. Mr. Warner blacklisted her for that and ruined her career in films and most of what she did after that ended up on television. BTW, Susan was in most everything on TV, even if you didn't know her name.

.

I remember her as the female prisoner on an episode of the Andy Griffith Show.

She was also the Green Girl of Star Trek

 

[toobfreak]

"Casablanca" 1942 -- incredible actors, set decor and costuming, music and humor.

Hell, in those old movies with Humphrey Bogart, Kirk Douglas, Jimmy Cagney, etc., when they weren't sitting around smoking and drinking in a club, they were fighting, slugging and shooting each other--- they could hardly shot that sort of stuff today.

Today, they have to show sensitivity toward others, tolerance of racial differences, concern for the environment, eating healthy, and a white, two blacks and an Asian in every family and office setting. They cannot use slang, they must talk ill of the country, and they certainly must advance some progressive ideas and agenda--- it is any wonder there are no good movies now!

 

[Flopper]

I think certain films are classics because they've stood the test of time.

But for every Maltese Falcon, there are ten forgettable movies that no one remembers.

I recall a while back when someone decided to do a shot-for-shot remake of Psycho.

It's a terrible movie not for any of the reasons you stated, but because it just didn't fit in the modern world.


I would also argue that the "Delivering an experience" became a goal in movies well before the modern age. When Television came out, movies had to be spectacular to compete.

So you had Cinemascope and VistaVision and a dozen other gimmicks to make the big screen more exciting than the small one.

Hollywood was still producing great movies well into the 1970's and 1980's.

I think where it all fell of was in the 1990's, when they figured CGI could make up for plot and character and practical effects.

If you like movies with great character development and a good narrative, I suggest, "Ship of Fools" released in 1965. It's directed by Stanley Kramer with an academy award winning script by Abby Mann.

It's available on Prime for $3.95 or free with adds on plex. I have links below to the trailer and also the complete movie with ads below. The Prime copy is a better quality copy as well as no ads. I would recommend the Prime copy.

Ship of Fools

Passengers on a ship traveling from Mexico to Europe in the 1930s represent society at large in that era. The crew is German, including the ship's Dr. Schumann, who falls in love with one of the passengers, La Condesa. A young American woman, Jenny, is traveling with the man she loves, David...

watch.plex.tv

 

[Flopper]

Hell, in those old movies with Humphrey Bogart, Kirk Douglas, Jimmy Cagney, etc., when they weren't sitting around smoking and drinking in a club, they were fighting, slugging and shooting each other--- they could hardly shot that sort of stuff today.

Today, they have to show sensitivity toward others, tolerance of racial differences, concern for the environment, eating healthy, and a white, two blacks and an Asian in every family and office setting. They cannot use slang, they must talk ill of the country, and they certainly must advance some progressive ideas and agenda--- it is any wonder there are no good movies now!

Social Consciousness has little to do with the quality of movies. However, it does help ticket sales.

In first half of the 20th century, Blacks were relegate to roles as servants, usually portrayed as being lazy, ignorant, superstitious, and prone to thievery and cowardice. Now they are more likely to be portrayed in a better light than other characters. What goes around comes around.

 

[lg325]

There was a strong black movie industry from the Silent films on up. With black actors in a positive and strong roles it just takes some research to find them.

 

[Seymour Flops]

The chances are what is being said is immaterial. As a sexy Hollywood starlet in a B movie said, "I gotta say something." The director replied, "You're doing what you are being paid to do."

I read somewhere that Sergio Leon would tell his actors that the diologue would be dubbed in later in multiple languages, so just say the alphabet - with feeling.

 

[Cassandro]

I own only three movies (DVDs) that I love.

Bridge on the River Kwai.
Out of Africa
Polar Expresss.

You (anyone)?

Back to the Future. I always notice new details each time I watch it, and have yet to find any flaws. I also like B&W films of the 1940s like Mrs. Minerva and It Happened on 5th Avenue.

 

[Seymour Flops]

Yes, with some exceptions, today's movies don't stack up to the previous movies.

Reservoir Dogs and Pulp Fiction told the stories with most of the action being implied. That was low-budget/high-talent at work.

I saw a foreign movie called "The Captain" on HULU that I highly recommend. German soldier deserts and happens upon a dead Gestapo Captain and staff car. He dons the uniform and does whatever he has to in order to survive.

It seems that the directors of old gave the actors time to act, and camera work to focus on them at the right moments.

The movies told better stories, it is true. But westerns for example often told the same basic story and were still great, especially for B pictures.

A film teacher I had when I was an RTF major said that all of the Bonanza episodes used one of two plots: 1) A stranger comes to the Pondarsa, or Virginia City (Nevada). There's something bad wrong with this stranger. By the end, the Cartwrights fix the stranger, by changing him or killing him. 2) The Cartwrights visit a strange town. There is something bad wrong with this town. By the end, the Cartwrights fix the town, either by changing the people or killing the villian.

Okay, fair. But . . . there was acting and directing, the best of which, is unoticed until after the movie is over. High Noon had plot #1 with elements of plot #2, but it was brilliant.