Apologies You'll Never Hear

[dilloduck]

So Jillian...do you see a difference between Lott stating what he did about Strom Thurman...and the Democratic senators who have stated that Robert Byrd has been the right man for the job at any point in his career?

As I see it...Lott was complimenting Thurman on his birthday...you may be willing to believe that his comment was racist...but as he did not specifically mention race in any way, stretch, or form...it seems a bit unfair, closeminded, attack-dog-esque, etc. to demand the man step down from his position because he MAY have said something that some MAY have interpreted as racist rather than just a guy saying - "I think this man would have made a good president..." during his birthday party...

I completely understand where you are coming from at heart, Jilli...supporting segregationism is wrong...but truthfully - do you not find it a bit ridiculous to expect someone to compliment someone by saying, "I think you've been a great senator, sir...and on your birthday I'd just like to say that aside from your views on segregationism - which you now state you no longer agree with, the way you voted on the last legislation regarding (fill in the blank) and your support of (fill in some random thing)...I think you'd be a great president." ???

Do we have to list everyone's faults when complimenting them for fear that some attack dog is going to insinuate to the media that we really AGREE with those faults because we didn't state it upfront?

I love you, husband - but I do need to say for sake of full disclosure that I don't like the way you didn't pay your credit card bill in college because you were paying your own way and didn't have any money - which resulted in you having a bad credit rating that you had to work off in the first few years of our marriage...and you once got into a fight at a bar because some guy spilled a drink on me and didn't apologize...I thought that was a bit boorish and embarassing...I feel I should tell everyone these things up front so they know that even though I love you - I DO NOT support not paying your bills OR getting into dumb fights when drunk. Good night!!!

Sorry...but I can't see the Lott debacle as anything more than the left-wing desperately throwing out the race card to destroy a republican who they felt had too much power. Note that I'm not saying that Republicans haven't done or tried to do the same thing....but to string up a man for saying that someone was a good senator and would have been a good president at his b-day party seems a bit ludicrous.

If we are to change the tone in Washington, in political debate...etc...we HAVE HAVE HAVE to accept that sometimes people say things that are inappropriate...sometimes people say things that aren't appropriate, but come across that way...and sometimes people say things that aren't inappropriate at all...but coniving, desperate losers really really want to make it out to be... (I'm not calling you that...I think you and many others are falling into the "taking it the wrong way and getting your panties all in a bunch about it" category - I respect where you are coming from - a desire to not encourage segregationists, racists, etc...but really feel that you've taken this one too far.) and just take a deep breath and get over it.

Kerry said something which sounded an awful lot like "the people in the military are stupid," to me - as a military spouse. But I thought what the media and right-wingers tried to do to him was ridiculous...give it a rest...

Hillary Clinton once joked that Ghandi was the guy who worked in the 7-11 down the street....interestingly enough, Democrats didn't demand she step down from her position or not run for president because her comment OBVIOUSLY indicated that she had racist tendencies.


We all need to chill the f*ck out about stupid statements like these - or we could just continue snipping and bickering about them....which will get us absolutely nowhere....

Well said----one has to wonder wtf is going on for American politcos to act like children. We're one step away from beating the crap out of each other in Congress like the Mexicans have been doing.

 

[glockmail]

.... We're one step away from beating the crap out of each other in Congress like the Mexicans have been doing.

I like what AHHnahld said about that: "good action!".

 

[Bonnie]

So Jillian...do you see a difference between Lott stating what he did about Strom Thurman...and the Democratic senators who have stated that Robert Byrd has been the right man for the job at any point in his career?

As I see it...Lott was complimenting Thurman on his birthday...you may be willing to believe that his comment was racist...but as he did not specifically mention race in any way, stretch, or form...it seems a bit unfair, closeminded, attack-dog-esque, etc. to demand the man step down from his position because he MAY have said something that some MAY have interpreted as racist rather than just a guy saying - "I think this man would have made a good president..." during his birthday party...

I completely understand where you are coming from at heart, Jilli...supporting segregationism is wrong...but truthfully - do you not find it a bit ridiculous to expect someone to compliment someone by saying, "I think you've been a great senator, sir...and on your birthday I'd just like to say that aside from your views on segregationism - which you now state you no longer agree with, the way you voted on the last legislation regarding (fill in the blank) and your support of (fill in some random thing)...I think you'd be a great president." ???

Do we have to list everyone's faults when complimenting them for fear that some attack dog is going to insinuate to the media that we really AGREE with those faults because we didn't state it upfront?

I love you, husband - but I do need to say for sake of full disclosure that I don't like the way you didn't pay your credit card bill in college because you were paying your own way and didn't have any money - which resulted in you having a bad credit rating that you had to work off in the first few years of our marriage...and you once got into a fight at a bar because some guy spilled a drink on me and didn't apologize...I thought that was a bit boorish and embarassing...I feel I should tell everyone these things up front so they know that even though I love you - I DO NOT support not paying your bills OR getting into dumb fights when drunk. Good night!!!

Sorry...but I can't see the Lott debacle as anything more than the left-wing desperately throwing out the race card to destroy a republican who they felt had too much power. Note that I'm not saying that Republicans haven't done or tried to do the same thing....but to string up a man for saying that someone was a good senator and would have been a good president at his b-day party seems a bit ludicrous.

If we are to change the tone in Washington, in political debate...etc...we HAVE HAVE HAVE to accept that sometimes people say things that are inappropriate...sometimes people say things that aren't appropriate, but come across that way...and sometimes people say things that aren't inappropriate at all...but coniving, desperate losers really really want to make it out to be... (I'm not calling you that...I think you and many others are falling into the "taking it the wrong way and getting your panties all in a bunch about it" category - I respect where you are coming from - a desire to not encourage segregationists, racists, etc...but really feel that you've taken this one too far.) and just take a deep breath and get over it.

Kerry said something which sounded an awful lot like "the people in the military are stupid," to me - as a military spouse. But I thought what the media and right-wingers tried to do to him was ridiculous...give it a rest...

Hillary Clinton once joked that Ghandi was the guy who worked in the 7-11 down the street....interestingly enough, Democrats didn't demand she step down from her position or not run for president because her comment OBVIOUSLY indicated that she had racist tendencies.


We all need to chill the f*ck out about stupid statements like these - or we could just continue snipping and bickering about them....which will get us absolutely nowhere....

Excellent Gem!! BTW Im still waiting to hear apologies from all the Democrats in the House and Senate that referred to Bush as Hitler,and so on.....



I won't hold my breath though

 

[Hobbit]

Well said----one has to wonder wtf is going on for American politcos to act like children. We're one step away from beating the crap out of each other in Congress like the Mexicans have been doing.

Wouldn't be the first time. A Dixiecrat caned a man on the Senate floor in the years leading up to the War Between the States.

 

[Bullypulpit]

An apology from George W. Bush <i>et al</i> for launching an illegal and unjust war of aggression, costing the lives of thousands of US troops and billions of dollars and untold numbers of civilian Iraqi casualties, would be nice. But as they can never admit a mistake, I'm not going to hold my breath.

 

[red states rule]

An apology from George W. Bush <i>et al</i> for launching an illegal and unjust war of aggression, costing the lives of thousands of US troops and billions of dollars and untold numbers of civilian Iraqi casualties, would be nice. But as they can never admit a mistake, I'm not going to hold my breath.

Does it bother you at all BP, that all of Americas enemies are happy over the Dems winning control of Congress?

You have Adolf Ahmadinejad of Iran) who has sworn to wipe Irrael off the face of the map), the fat little dog eater of North Korea (who given given an autographed Jordan basketball by Albright and in turn she took his "word" not to build nukes); you have the terrorist network al Jazeera giving glowing coverage of the Dems and are expressing their happiness over the election results

When the same terrorist bastards, who have sworn to kill as many Americans as possible, are happy witht he election results; it shiuld make every American for voted for a Dem rethink their views

 

[William Joyce]

Trent Lott didn't "compliment" Strom Thurmond. The implication of what he said was that the country would be a better place with segregation. You not get that? Well... maybe you do.

Can you make the case that America is a better place because of forced racial integration?

Can you even make the case that "integration" has been even remotely successful?

Can you explain why, if races are all equal, it's necessary to mix them up based... as the liberals say... "mere skin color"?

Can you explain how proximity of blacks to whites makes blacks better people?

Doesn't that suggest white superiority?

If it doesn't, what does it suggest?

Finally, why don't Jews support integration with Arabs?

 

[Gunny]

Trent Lott didn't "compliment" Strom Thurmond. The implication of what he said was that the country would be a better place with segregation. You not get that? Well... maybe you do.

Bull. He complimented an old man on his birthday. The "implication" you speak of was completely fabricated by you spinning lefties. GMAFB.

 

[nukeman]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Gem again.
I tried Gem!!!!!

 

[jillian]

Wouldn't be the first time. A Dixiecrat caned a man on the Senate floor in the years leading up to the War Between the States.

You think *that* was the reason for the Civil War?!?!?!

If that weren't so pathetically sad, I'd be laughing.

 

[jillian]

I don't know that Lott is a racist. For all I know he could of meant we'd be better off without FDR's welfare state by his statement. But either way he made himself look like an idiot.

I think it was pretty clear and so do all but the most ardent apologists. But we can both agree that he made himself look like an idiot.

I like Mel Gibson, he makes pretty good movies.

I used to like him, too. Braveheart was my favorite movie. Now I can't bring myself to watch it. Could you watch a movie made by someone who said Christians are the cause of all of the problems in the world?

I don't support segregation or apartheid, which is why I don't support Federal funding of Israel. Can you say the same?

Israel isn't an apartheid state. There are Arab and Christian citizens of Israel who receive all of the benefits of that citizenship.

Can you say the same about the approximately one dozen Islamic States? Objecions to Israel being a Jewish State don't carry much weight without equal criticism of those countries?

So what say you? Should we de-legalize all theocracies, too?

 

[KarlMarx]

....


We all need to chill the f*ck out about stupid statements like these - or we could just continue snipping and bickering about them....which will get us absolutely nowhere....

Gem... it's not that they believe Trent Lott or anyone else made a racist remark and furthermore, THEY DON'T EVEN CARE! It's the "make 'em look bad game"! That's all it is.

None of the "outraged" actually believe the person meant to be offensive. They realize that they're not racists. But, you see, like Scarlett O'Hara, they have to swoon in public or feign indignation. It's all for public consumption you see.

They want to show everyone just how concerned, open minded, tolerant, diverse and all around nice guys they are.

But more importantly, they have to convince the voters out there that the other side is evil, immoral, onerous, racist, homophobic, eats children for breakfast, are unkind to animals, and don't brush between meals!

Yes, they have to perform their righteously indignant liberal shtick in front of the camera and have a reporter nodding in understanding agreement.

It's all a game, a perverse type of theater. Feign indignation to undermine our enemies, make mountains out of molehills to ruin the reputations of those who are against us politically ... and whether we actually believe it or not is of no consequence.

 

[Kagom]

You think *that* was the reason for the Civil War?!?!?!

If that weren't so pathetically sad, I'd be laughing.

He didn't state that was the reason for the Civil War. However, said event made me laugh my ass off though it was a pathetic thing to do.

 

[dilloduck]

I used to like him, too. Braveheart was my favorite movie. Now I can't bring myself to watch it. Could you watch a movie made by someone who said Christians are the cause of all of the problems in the world?

You and Gump made a movie ?

 

[Bonnie]

Gem... it's not that they believe Trent Lott or anyone else made a racist remark and furthermore, THEY DON'T EVEN CARE! It's the "make 'em look bad game"! That's all it is.

None of the "outraged" actually believe the person meant to be offensive. They realize that they're not racists. But, you see, like Scarlett O'Hara, they have to swoon in public or feign indignation. It's all for public consumption you see.

They want to show everyone just how concerned, open minded, tolerant, diverse and all around nice guys they are.

But more importantly, they have to convince the voters out there that the other side is evil, immoral, onerous, racist, homophobic, eats children for breakfast, are unkind to animals, and don't brush between meals!

Yes, they have to perform their righteously indignant liberal shtick in front of the camera and have a reporter nodding in understanding agreement.

It's all a game, a perverse type of theater. Feign indignation to undermine our enemies, make mountains out of molehills to ruin the reputations of those who are against us politically ... and whether we actually believe it or not is of no consequence.

EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!

 

[red states rule]

You and Gump made a movie ?

If they did, it would star Rosie O Dummy

 

[jillian]

So Jillian...do you see a difference between Lott stating what he did about Strom Thurman...and the Democratic senators who have stated that Robert Byrd has been the right man for the job at any point in his career?

Strom Thurmond's platform when he ran was that of segregation. It was the focus of his entire campaign. Ignoring that and trying to twist Lott's statement into something else is kind of silly in my view.

As I see it...Lott was complimenting Thurman on his birthday...you may be willing to believe that his comment was racist...but as he did not specifically mention race in any way, stretch, or form...it seems a bit unfair, closeminded, attack-dog-esque, etc. to demand the man step down from his position because he MAY have said something that some MAY have interpreted as racist rather than just a guy saying - "I think this man would have made a good president..." during his birthday party...

We can certainly agree to disagree on that. But often, people say a lot that is implied if not overt. I find it really odd when people refuse to extrapolate meaning that is clearly intended.

I completely understand where you are coming from at heart, Jilli...supporting segregationism is wrong...but truthfully - do you not find it a bit ridiculous to expect someone to compliment someone by saying, "I think you've been a great senator, sir...and on your birthday I'd just like to say that aside from your views on segregationism - which you now state you no longer agree with, the way you voted on the last legislation regarding (fill in the blank) and your support of (fill in some random thing)...I think you'd be a great president." ???

You know Gem, that is where I'm coming from. All Lott had to say is "you've been a great senator", if that's what he thought. He need not have mentioned the negatives at all... but he didn't have to laud them either. But Lott said we wouldn't have had "all the problems" we've had, had Thurmond been president. When one says that about someone who ran on a segregationist platform, I think the meaning is pretty clear.

Do we have to list everyone's faults when complimenting them for fear that some attack dog is going to insinuate to the media that we really AGREE with those faults because we didn't state it upfront?

No. But again, if enough people take a statement as having a particular meaning, perhaps it makes no sense to apologize for the person who made the racist statement.

I love you, husband - but I do need to say for sake of full disclosure that I don't like the way you didn't pay your credit card bill in college because you were paying your own way and didn't have any money - which resulted in you having a bad credit rating that you had to work off in the first few years of our marriage...and you once got into a fight at a bar because some guy spilled a drink on me and didn't apologize...I thought that was a bit boorish and embarassing...I feel I should tell everyone these things up front so they know that even though I love you - I DO NOT support not paying your bills OR getting into dumb fights when drunk. Good night!!!

That gave me a giggle, but, again, it isn't what we're talking about. Like I said, all Lott had to do was say he thought Thurmond was a great senator, if that's his belief, rather than making the statement he did. After all, you wouldn't say, I love your fiscal management abilities about someone who filed bankruptcy, would you?

Sorry...but I can't see the Lott debacle as anything more than the left-wing desperately throwing out the race card to destroy a republican who they felt had too much power. Note that I'm not saying that Republicans haven't done or tried to do the same thing....but to string up a man for saying that someone was a good senator and would have been a good president at his b-day party seems a bit ludicrous.

And I see the right's defense of Lott's statements as a continued refusal to own up to anything negative about their own.

If we are to change the tone in Washington, in political debate...etc...we HAVE HAVE HAVE to accept that sometimes people say things that are inappropriate...sometimes people say things that aren't appropriate, but come across that way...and sometimes people say things that aren't inappropriate at all...but coniving, desperate losers really really want to make it out to be... (I'm not calling you that...I think you and many others are falling into the "taking it the wrong way and getting your panties all in a bunch about it" category - I respect where you are coming from - a desire to not encourage segregationists, racists, etc...but really feel that you've taken this one too far.) and just take a deep breath and get over it.

You know, I actually agree with much of what you're saying. I think the tone of debate in this country, in general, has been poisoned by what I call the Rush Limbaugh school of debate.... the Annie Coulters of the world... who call anyone who disagrees with them treasonous. Do you think the people who are defending Lott would be any less critical of a statement made by someone on the left. Or is there constantly a barrage of meanspirited threads on this board that seethe with disrespect, even hatred, over what should be simple policy differences? I think the criticism of Lott is justified; you don't. I respect where you're coming from as well and always enjoy your thoughtful responses even when we aren't on the same page.

Kerry said something which sounded an awful lot like "the people in the military are stupid," to me - as a military spouse. But I thought what the media and right-wingers tried to do to him was ridiculous...give it a rest...

I agree with you 100% on that one. But I'll also be the first to say the statement was easily misconstrued and pretty stupid. I also think it proved why he was a terrible candidate for president.

Hillary Clinton once joked that Ghandi was the guy who worked in the 7-11 down the street....interestingly enough, Democrats didn't demand she step down from her position or not run for president because her comment OBVIOUSLY indicated that she had racist tendencies.

Again, a very stupid statement. On the other hand, Hillary once stood up and kissed Suha Arafat after a speech at a podium. I won't ever forget that and think I rightfully attributed it as what it was.... kissing someone who had done nothing but justify terrorism. Did Hillary say she supported Palestinian terrorists? No. But I think it's fair to say she didn't find Suha distasteful despite it. So, I apply the same standards to left and right. Something I see in few right-leaners. You are an exception to much of what I've seen in that you are able to sit back and acknowledge silliness when it occurs. I like to think I am, mostly, able to do that as well.

We all need to chill the f*ck out about stupid statements like these - or we could just continue snipping and bickering about them....which will get us absolutely nowhere....

We could probably, as a society, all benefit from less posturing and more actual discussion about policy differences and how to solve problems. The other stuff probably plays better on TV, though.

 

[dilloduck]

You know Gem, that is where I'm coming from. All Lott had to say is "you've been a great senator", if that's what he thought. He need not have mentioned the negatives at all... but he didn't have to laud them either. But Lott said we wouldn't have had "all the problems" we've had, had Thurmond been president. When one says that about someone who ran on a segregationist platform, I think the meaning is pretty clear.

Garbage---it takes those "oh so sensitive" liberals to take offense at comments made to an old politician on his birthday. " All the problems" means absolutely nothing until you plug something in there.

 

[Dr Grump]

Garbage---it takes those "oh so sensitive" liberals to take offense at comments made to an old politician on his birthday. " All the problems" means absolutely nothing until you plug something in there.

Did Lott ever explain what he meant by "problems"?

 

[dilloduck]

Did Lott ever explain what he meant by "problems"?

Not that I know of---hyperpartisans who hate anything convservative just assumed the worst.